| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas 23:32 - May 26 with 1468 views | noah4x4 |
Allegedly arrested for "assault, criminal damage and affray". Pub landlady injured, another man knocked unconcious (according to the Gazette).
When my wife read this news her instant reaction was "should be suspended from playing professional football immediately and if guilty must be sacked = terrible role models". This mirrored typical female reactions to the earlier arrest and conviction of Ched Evans. Here, I am not proposing that we debate that notable case again, nor debate the relative impact of the crime on the victim of a rape compared to a victim of other forms of serious bodily harm.
But today, is a conviction for ANY serious violent crime sufficient justification to end a footballers career? At the very least, I wonder, to what extent these two might have screwed up a potential move to another club? If guilty, what are the appropriate steps? There are some inconsistent past precedents; Marlon King? Joey Barton? Lee Hughes? But has the Ched Evans case dramatically changed public opinion about the responsibilities of footballer role models (albeit that he has since been granted a retrial, but having already been driven out of a footballing career by public opinion). Let's hope they are innocent. [Post edited 26 May 2016 23:58]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 06:35 - May 27 with 1421 views | jonestones |
If they are both guilty maybe the best punishment would be to make them sign new contracts with us! |  | | |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 09:25 - May 27 with 1406 views | noah4x4 |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 06:35 - May 27 by jonestones |
If they are both guilty maybe the best punishment would be to make them sign new contracts with us! |
I wasn't thinking of that as a punishment as the law will have an appropriate remedy. But have they indeed put themselves in a position where that might be their only career option? They have been 'bailed' for so long that the outcome might not be certain by the start of the season. so will another club take the risk?
....and if they do re-sign for the U's will there then be a host of non-football fans citing them as "role- models that should not be employed" (as happened in the Ched Evans case)? One hopes that they are quickly proven innocent. It has been reported in the Gazette that a female publican was injured and a male "knocked unconscious". It wasn't rape, but will public emotions run high? | | | |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 09:40 - May 27 with 1401 views | gerry_us |
Would have been useful to the club if they had found that type of commitment to the cause during the season! |  | | |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas (n/t) on 11:22 - May 27 with 1392 views | TheOldOakTree |
[Post edited 28 Jun 2016 8:45]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 11:49 - May 27 with 1389 views | Leadbelly |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 09:25 - May 27 by noah4x4 |
I wasn't thinking of that as a punishment as the law will have an appropriate remedy. But have they indeed put themselves in a position where that might be their only career option? They have been 'bailed' for so long that the outcome might not be certain by the start of the season. so will another club take the risk?
....and if they do re-sign for the U's will there then be a host of non-football fans citing them as "role- models that should not be employed" (as happened in the Ched Evans case)? One hopes that they are quickly proven innocent. It has been reported in the Gazette that a female publican was injured and a male "knocked unconscious". It wasn't rape, but will public emotions run high? |
Noah,
Based on what I've heard the chances of their being proved innocent quickly or, indeed, at all are quite slim. Signing new contracts at Colchester may be their only option until the cases are resolved. Even if they do sign I would assume the contracts will make provision for what would happen should they be found guilty and also receive a custodial sentence.
As to the footballer's obligations as a so called role model, why do we expect young men , relatively well paid and with more free time than most, to behave any better than their peers in the "real" world? The fact is the behaviour of a lot of people, regardless of profession or whether alcohol is involved, is unacceptable to me. What those who are in a high profile position should accept, however, is that any transgression on their part is bound to attract far greater media and public attention than those of the average man or woman in the street.
And as to what should happen to those found guilty of rape...I know two victims of rape and have seen how they have been affected, in one case still affected almost 30 years after the event. For a crime where the victim receives a sentence far longer than the perpetrator I think something is badly wrong with our system so I have little sympathy for the likes of Check Evans and his ilk. | |
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 16:25 - May 27 with 1364 views | noah4x4 |
Interesting debate. So should we be intolerant of ALL offenders that might be in careers considered 'role models'? To me, Matthew 7:5 springs to mind. How close have we all come to making a stupid serious transgression when under the influence of alcohol; or during student high jinks? Until it happens once, maybe that lesson about alcohol isn't learned? So should we apply a 'two strike' rule (except for rape or murder)?
My view is that the "role model" argument is bunkum. Whether one is a footballer, a politician or street sweeper (n.b. no disrespect to the latter) "society" should demand the same standards of conduct and if you transgress, then surely the remedy is for a court of law to decide? Then once the offender has done his time; and has become a "rehabilitated offender", he should have the legitimate right to return to his former occupation, which might be professional sport.
What I think is wrong is when people that have 'served their time' and shown remorse are driven from their occupations simply by 'mob hysteria', which then means they are being punished twice. But I wonder; if the courts instead handed out proper penalties rather than a 'slap on the wrist'; and by that include the culprit pay proper compensation to the victims; then perhaps the public would have more confidence in the judicial system and criminal justice?
Of course, it is unaccepable for those convicted of (say) sexual offences to return to teaching or other community roles. But for a single act of (not premeditated) stupidy under the influence of drink; then I feel that we should be more benevolent; provided that the culprit shows genuine remorse and THEN demonstrates what being a 'role model' truly means by actively advocating "don't follow my example - learn from my mistakes". Gilbey and Edwards perhaps have the best opportunity to show what being a role model means even if they might have failed before. They are not inherently bad people, just stupid enough to have drunk to excess; which they will probably regret for the rest of their lives. [Post edited 27 May 2016 16:36]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas (n/t) on 18:33 - May 27 with 1345 views | TheOldOakTree |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 16:25 - May 27 by noah4x4 |
Interesting debate. So should we be intolerant of ALL offenders that might be in careers considered 'role models'? To me, Matthew 7:5 springs to mind. How close have we all come to making a stupid serious transgression when under the influence of alcohol; or during student high jinks? Until it happens once, maybe that lesson about alcohol isn't learned? So should we apply a 'two strike' rule (except for rape or murder)?
My view is that the "role model" argument is bunkum. Whether one is a footballer, a politician or street sweeper (n.b. no disrespect to the latter) "society" should demand the same standards of conduct and if you transgress, then surely the remedy is for a court of law to decide? Then once the offender has done his time; and has become a "rehabilitated offender", he should have the legitimate right to return to his former occupation, which might be professional sport.
What I think is wrong is when people that have 'served their time' and shown remorse are driven from their occupations simply by 'mob hysteria', which then means they are being punished twice. But I wonder; if the courts instead handed out proper penalties rather than a 'slap on the wrist'; and by that include the culprit pay proper compensation to the victims; then perhaps the public would have more confidence in the judicial system and criminal justice?
Of course, it is unaccepable for those convicted of (say) sexual offences to return to teaching or other community roles. But for a single act of (not premeditated) stupidy under the influence of drink; then I feel that we should be more benevolent; provided that the culprit shows genuine remorse and THEN demonstrates what being a 'role model' truly means by actively advocating "don't follow my example - learn from my mistakes". Gilbey and Edwards perhaps have the best opportunity to show what being a role model means even if they might have failed before. They are not inherently bad people, just stupid enough to have drunk to excess; which they will probably regret for the rest of their lives. [Post edited 27 May 2016 16:36]
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[Post edited 28 Jun 2016 8:45]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas (n/t) on 18:57 - May 27 with 1338 views | TheOldOakTree |
[Post edited 28 Jun 2016 8:46]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 12:25 - May 28 with 1293 views | bwildered |
A very recent article in the Standard -
Drunken man in town hits victim and kicks him in the head six times . No he was not a professional footballer, just a man from the armed forces , is he a role model ? |  |
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 21:18 - May 28 with 1262 views | noah4x4 |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 12:25 - May 28 by bwildered |
A very recent article in the Standard -
Drunken man in town hits victim and kicks him in the head six times . No he was not a professional footballer, just a man from the armed forces , is he a role model ? |
I bet the Army thinks so. | | | |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 08:52 - May 29 with 1241 views | bwildered |
Perhaps it's time for the guilty to have a alternative to community service, what ever that entails.
Chain gang along Ave Remberance or the stocks in town . | |
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 09:43 - May 29 with 1237 views | Leadbelly |
Breaking rocks in the hot sun. | |
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas (n/t) on 19:15 - May 29 with 1189 views | TheOldOakTree |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 09:43 - May 29 by Leadbelly |
Breaking rocks in the hot sun. |
[Post edited 28 Jun 2016 8:47]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 19:46 - May 29 with 1185 views | Fruitbat |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 09:43 - May 29 by Leadbelly |
Breaking rocks in the hot sun. |
I doubt veryy much that messers gilbey and edwards could claim that they needed money but had none. |  | | |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 20:26 - May 29 with 1177 views | Leadbelly |
Should they stay or should they go? | |
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 08:06 - May 30 with 1159 views | noah4x4 |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 20:26 - May 29 by Leadbelly |
Should they stay or should they go? |
If there is the prospect of a conviction then surely any future employer will need to consider the current sentencing guidelines to confirm a footballer's likely future availability?
See http://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/. The Gazette mentions charges of "Affray"; "Assault" and "Criminal Damage". Much depends on the classification of the specific incident, but all of these have the potential for a custodial sentence. Hence, will they still have the option to 'Go'. Maybe the more tangible question is should they 'stay'?
I say "Yes" provided that they show appropriate remorse and future leadership. We have all been stupid in our youth. Most of us have been drunk on at least one occasion (e.g. before we learned better); but most of us got lucky and usually our mates took over responsibility for our conduct; hence the 'demon drink' didn't put us in a bad place from where there was no return. If guilty, these lads deserve the punishment that the law will determine. But for a first offence, they should not be punished twice; hence it should not be career ending. I say 'DON'T sack them (e.g. offer them new contracts). But the fact they are out of contract makes the decision easy if there is doubt. [Post edited 30 May 2016 8:08]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas (n/t) on 10:32 - May 30 with 1146 views | TheOldOakTree |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 20:26 - May 29 by Leadbelly |
Should they stay or should they go? |
[Post edited 28 Jun 2016 8:48]
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| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 10:48 - May 30 with 1132 views | Fruitbat |
| Edwards and Gilbey arrested in town centre fracas on 20:26 - May 29 by Leadbelly |
Should they stay or should they go? |
If they go there will be trouble but, on the other hand, if they stay it will be double. | | | |
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