| Vargas as a striker 16:32 - Mar 25 with 6624 views | nightwish |
Will we ever see Vargas play upfront as a striker alongside Charlie Austin?Pretty certain when he scored earlier in the season is the one and only time he has started upfront.We have nothing to lose by trying this pairing for a few games |  | | |  |
| Vargas as a striker on 00:54 - Mar 26 with 2036 views | loftinoz |
| Vargas as a striker on 17:23 - Mar 25 by daveB |
He played up front against Stoke at home and was rubbish, moved to the right for the next few games and looked far better so can see why he's been played there.
For me when I've seen him play for Chile he looks good in a high tempo pressing team as the main forward with good movement off him, players running past him into the box. We don't have any players that suit that way of playing.
I just think if two managers short of options up front have watched him every day for 9 months and neither of them have picked him up front then possibly there is a valid reason for him not being played there. |
Are you saying HR actually watched the training? | | | |
| Vargas as a striker on 07:31 - Mar 26 with 1979 views | daveB |
| Vargas as a striker on 00:54 - Mar 26 by loftinoz |
Are you saying HR actually watched the training? |
He watched some of it, Ramsey watches all of it and is coming to the same conclusions |  | | |
| Vargas as a striker on 08:57 - Mar 26 with 1953 views | DANRANGER |
It is about getting our best players on the pitch and surely he comes into that bracket. Play a 4-2-3-1 and Taarabt, Vargas , Phillips or even Hoilett can rotate behind Austin. Probably too late now to do this as unless it works straight away we will go back to Zamora. Vargas will have poor games but he will offer more threat than Zamora over a period of games and therefore unless he's injured he has to start all our remaining games.
All a bit too late now though so I'd go with this anyway and maybe we can enjoy a bit of decent football until the end of the season. I've accepted we are down and maybe just maybe they will surprise us. |  | | |
| Vargas as a striker on 15:02 - Mar 26 with 1898 views | JordanFoster |
| Vargas as a striker on 16:56 - Mar 25 by TheBlob |
I think the operative phrase is "back to being crap",how can one misinterpret that?
btw are you and Jordanfoster conjoined twins by any chance? |
We're not but as I've seen my name now I may as well throw my two cents in.
I like Vargas as a player, I like his tenacity, his work-rate and he clearly has ability. It's easy to say he should be playing up front when you look at his record for Chile, especially when the panto villain Bobby Zamora is playing in front of him. But the record at club level reads almost the opposite:
Gremio - 37/ 9 goals/ 1 assist
Napoli - 28 apps/ 3 goals/ 1 assist
Valencia - 25 apps/ 5 goals/ 1 assist
QPR - 19 apps/ 2 goals / 2 assists
Redknapp and now Ramsey have both decided not to give him a go up front for a sustained period and I think that's largely due to the other payers in the squad.
From the opinion of people I have spoken to who I trust in football, for all Charlie Austin's positives his game isn't the 'lone striker' role.
The stats from earlier this year back it up too. His game is all about getting in the penalty area and finishing things off. He plays off instinct (although I think his game outside the box is making improvements). To get Austin the space and time he needs, he's been partnered with Zamora, I pointed out in an earlier topic about Zamora being overlooked for his role in certain games recently. For instance the win away at Sunderland, BZ occupies both centre halves and makes the run to the front post opening up space for Fer to come in behind. The goal against Spurs he pins the defender before laying to Sandro.
So, in my opinion - before anyone tells me what a load of rubbish it is, I think you would need to play Zamora up with Vargas if you wanted to play the Chilean as a forward in the current formation.
A position I think he could thrive would be on the right side of a 3 in a 4-2-3-1 running and catching out sleeping CBs.
He could thrive there with his work rate and engine, his talent on the ball should speak for itself but playing him as a winger and expecting him to get down the touchline and whip a ball in is a little pie in the sky. Especially in a 4-4-2 where you start a lot deeper when in possession teams will likely have men back against you to defend. He takes one too many touches as it is, having him further up the field lets him hurt teams quicker.
I've seen 4-2-3-1 being mooted as the obvious answer to problems but I really don't think it is. Playing this formation and it being so fluid with the pivots in midfield and the two wide players or inside forwards your full-backs have to be proficient in defending.
Whilst Isla and Yun are extremely popular and have a plethora of assets that they bring to the team, I think you'd be exposing them in the 4-2-3-1 and it would basically mean them going alone against a winger 1-on-1 on most occasions with no real protection. I think it would be fair to say both are better going forward than they are defending. The last time I remember playing 4-2-3-1 over a sustained period was the promotion year under Warnock and although Walker came in, Orr and Hill were both very comfortable defenders.
You'd also have to look at the midfielders at the minute and against whilst I am a big fan of Barton and Sandro, do they have the attributes technically and physically to play in the two holding roles? It's a lot of ground to cover and you need legs in there.
Also good to remember that international football, especially that in South America is a million miles away in styles to the Premier League. [Post edited 26 Mar 2015 17:21]
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| Vargas as a striker on 15:56 - Mar 26 with 1880 views | Discodroids |
| Vargas as a striker on 15:02 - Mar 26 by JordanFoster |
We're not but as I've seen my name now I may as well throw my two cents in.
I like Vargas as a player, I like his tenacity, his work-rate and he clearly has ability. It's easy to say he should be playing up front when you look at his record for Chile, especially when the panto villain Bobby Zamora is playing in front of him. But the record at club level reads almost the opposite:
Gremio - 37/ 9 goals/ 1 assist
Napoli - 28 apps/ 3 goals/ 1 assist
Valencia - 25 apps/ 5 goals/ 1 assist
QPR - 19 apps/ 2 goals / 2 assists
Redknapp and now Ramsey have both decided not to give him a go up front for a sustained period and I think that's largely due to the other payers in the squad.
From the opinion of people I have spoken to who I trust in football, for all Charlie Austin's positives his game isn't the 'lone striker' role.
The stats from earlier this year back it up too. His game is all about getting in the penalty area and finishing things off. He plays off instinct (although I think his game outside the box is making improvements). To get Austin the space and time he needs, he's been partnered with Zamora, I pointed out in an earlier topic about Zamora being overlooked for his role in certain games recently. For instance the win away at Sunderland, BZ occupies both centre halves and makes the run to the front post opening up space for Fer to come in behind. The goal against Spurs he pins the defender before laying to Sandro.
So, in my opinion - before anyone tells me what a load of rubbish it is, I think you would need to play Zamora up with Vargas if you wanted to play the Chilean as a forward in the current formation.
A position I think he could thrive would be on the right side of a 3 in a 4-2-3-1 running and catching out sleeping CBs.
He could thrive there with his work rate and engine, his talent on the ball should speak for itself but playing him as a winger and expecting him to get down the touchline and whip a ball in is a little pie in the sky. Especially in a 4-4-2 where you start a lot deeper when in possession teams will likely have men back against you to defend. He takes one too many touches as it is, having him further up the field lets him hurt teams quicker.
I've seen 4-2-3-1 being mooted as the obvious answer to problems but I really don't think it is. Playing this formation and it being so fluid with the pivots in midfield and the two wide players or inside forwards your full-backs have to be proficient in defending.
Whilst Isla and Yun are extremely popular and have a plethora of assets that they bring to the team, I think you'd be exposing them in the 4-2-3-1 and it would basically mean them going alone against a winger 1-on-1 on most occasions with no real protection. I think it would be fair to say both are better going forward than they are defending. The last time I remember playing 4-2-3-1 over a sustained period was the promotion year under Warnock and although Walker came in, Orr and Hill were both very comfortable defenders.
You'd also have to look at the midfielders at the minute and against whilst I am a big fan of Barton and Sandro, do they have the attributes technically and physically to play in the two holding roles? It's a lot of ground to cover and you need legs in there.
Also good to remember that international football, especially that in South America is a million miles away in styles to the Premier League. [Post edited 26 Mar 2015 17:21]
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your a cracking addition to the board jordan and im glad youre on these hallowed pages , but greyfriars bobby should be hollowed out and used as some form of avant garde wood wind instrument by reeves and mortimers 'mulligan and o'hare' on their seminal long player 'pancake day'.
in fact , im convinced a peruvian pan pipe could beat wor bobbys record of 3 goals in 43 games.
if we wanted to pay some one 10, 15, or 20 grand a week to be 'nuisance value' , i would have gladly taken on the role for £50 notes a week by putting itching powder in the oppositions dressing rooms socks [Post edited 26 Mar 2015 15:58]
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| "...The monkey is never dead, Dealer. The monkey never dies. When you kick him off, he just hides in a corner, waiting his turn." |
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| Vargas as a striker on 16:40 - Mar 26 with 1854 views | Discodroids |
| Vargas as a striker on 16:34 - Mar 26 by JordanFoster |
Thanks for the kind words, as for the rest of it that went straight over my head! Reeves and mortimer? I'm only 20! |
20!!
your've made an old man feel ancient.
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| "...The monkey is never dead, Dealer. The monkey never dies. When you kick him off, he just hides in a corner, waiting his turn." |
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| Vargas as a striker on 17:17 - Mar 26 with 1845 views | BklynRanger |
Other than his outrageous use of 'muted' instead of 'mooted' I wholeheartedly agree with Foster's analysis of The Little Boy Vargas.
Thanks. |  | | |
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| Vargas as a striker on 17:48 - Mar 26 with 1830 views | TheBlob |
| Vargas as a striker on 15:02 - Mar 26 by JordanFoster |
We're not but as I've seen my name now I may as well throw my two cents in.
I like Vargas as a player, I like his tenacity, his work-rate and he clearly has ability. It's easy to say he should be playing up front when you look at his record for Chile, especially when the panto villain Bobby Zamora is playing in front of him. But the record at club level reads almost the opposite:
Gremio - 37/ 9 goals/ 1 assist
Napoli - 28 apps/ 3 goals/ 1 assist
Valencia - 25 apps/ 5 goals/ 1 assist
QPR - 19 apps/ 2 goals / 2 assists
Redknapp and now Ramsey have both decided not to give him a go up front for a sustained period and I think that's largely due to the other payers in the squad.
From the opinion of people I have spoken to who I trust in football, for all Charlie Austin's positives his game isn't the 'lone striker' role.
The stats from earlier this year back it up too. His game is all about getting in the penalty area and finishing things off. He plays off instinct (although I think his game outside the box is making improvements). To get Austin the space and time he needs, he's been partnered with Zamora, I pointed out in an earlier topic about Zamora being overlooked for his role in certain games recently. For instance the win away at Sunderland, BZ occupies both centre halves and makes the run to the front post opening up space for Fer to come in behind. The goal against Spurs he pins the defender before laying to Sandro.
So, in my opinion - before anyone tells me what a load of rubbish it is, I think you would need to play Zamora up with Vargas if you wanted to play the Chilean as a forward in the current formation.
A position I think he could thrive would be on the right side of a 3 in a 4-2-3-1 running and catching out sleeping CBs.
He could thrive there with his work rate and engine, his talent on the ball should speak for itself but playing him as a winger and expecting him to get down the touchline and whip a ball in is a little pie in the sky. Especially in a 4-4-2 where you start a lot deeper when in possession teams will likely have men back against you to defend. He takes one too many touches as it is, having him further up the field lets him hurt teams quicker.
I've seen 4-2-3-1 being mooted as the obvious answer to problems but I really don't think it is. Playing this formation and it being so fluid with the pivots in midfield and the two wide players or inside forwards your full-backs have to be proficient in defending.
Whilst Isla and Yun are extremely popular and have a plethora of assets that they bring to the team, I think you'd be exposing them in the 4-2-3-1 and it would basically mean them going alone against a winger 1-on-1 on most occasions with no real protection. I think it would be fair to say both are better going forward than they are defending. The last time I remember playing 4-2-3-1 over a sustained period was the promotion year under Warnock and although Walker came in, Orr and Hill were both very comfortable defenders.
You'd also have to look at the midfielders at the minute and against whilst I am a big fan of Barton and Sandro, do they have the attributes technically and physically to play in the two holding roles? It's a lot of ground to cover and you need legs in there.
Also good to remember that international football, especially that in South America is a million miles away in styles to the Premier League. [Post edited 26 Mar 2015 17:21]
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Yes,quite agree and what I was banging on about years back when he was playing for Gremio(on loan)before he joined us.It's got to be pointed out that both Napoli and Valencia used him as a winger.The high tempo which Bielsa adopted at Chile is not that alien when you look at other south american products in the Premier and it's very much a failure of the rest to adapt to one player's style not the other way round.He does have the advantage of Sanchez playing just behind for Chile.Pace is everything.Very much a square peg is Eduardo,but without apportiioning any blame for failure to produce results on either party/parties. |  |
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| Vargas as a striker on 09:20 - Mar 27 with 1771 views | Discodroids |
vargas sticking it in the old onion bag with adel and barton basking in the impish south americans candour .
i think uncle blobs right , we should just have a laugh and i intended to get as drunk as a lord every saturday afternoon AND ride this season out in a haze of booze and BBQ hula hoops | |
| "...The monkey is never dead, Dealer. The monkey never dies. When you kick him off, he just hides in a corner, waiting his turn." |
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| Vargas as a striker on 12:02 - Mar 27 with 1751 views | spudoodles |
Any chance of him staying when we're in the Champ? to replace Austin? |  | | |
| Vargas as a striker on 12:20 - Mar 27 with 1742 views | daveB |
| Vargas as a striker on 12:02 - Mar 27 by spudoodles |
Any chance of him staying when we're in the Champ? to replace Austin? |
He's only on loan so probably not | | | |
| Vargas as a striker on 14:04 - Mar 27 with 1704 views | SimonJames |
| Vargas as a striker on 16:40 - Mar 26 by Discodroids |
20!!
your've made an old man feel ancient.
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He'll be "looking at us bras" next... |  |
| 100% of people who drink water will die. |
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