| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? 23:10 - Aug 25 with 20546 views | Lblock |
So Benny the Super Yoof coach has deigned that the club will religiously play 4-3-2-1 or 4-3-3
Clearly this system can work if your full backs are quality and the midfield 3 work like Trojans plus have pace and physique.
Now sometimes you'll come up against spirited well drilled sides who may play 3-5-2 and work their nads off. A team like maybe Carlisle.
So if your midfielders and front three include:
A lazy fooker like JET
The total plank who is WC rotating with the aforementioned JET and running into players like a bluebottle on a double glazed window
An immobile poor player like Oscar Goeburn
A raw and rash player like Doughty
A right footed striker Reece-Cox playing left of the 2 / 3
....then I'm sorry but you're going to be in trouble
I don't blame the players except JET, all the rest did actually try (although Doughty allowed their player to completely lose him for the second).
It's embarrassing that our players, no matter age or experience, could not make Benny the Super Yoof Coach's system work but like I say I don't blame them, the man in the straight jacket set them up and they're not suited to it.
He doggedly refused to acknowledge that Polter was being eaten up by Carlisles three and when he did win aimless punts he was isolated. On re-starts Carlisles 3 simply stretched our front 3 out, sucked Polter in by a player dropping into each full back position and then our midfielders got caught betwixt and between leaving Carlisles 5 man midfield to dominate and move play up or choose to use the flanks where our fullbacks had no protection at all.
Benny only unfolded his arms to replace line for like subs and I could not believe he left John Thomas on -- Furlong looked awful as he had nothing in front of him helping
(Note - I acknowledge John got the goal via a keeper error and did actually run at Carlisle 4 of 5 times but the man is a liability defensively and is deceptively slow). I'd of matched Carlisle up (embarrassing but needed) and maybe actually taken the game to them a bit more. The players don't look like they believe in Benny or his ideas, that or they are confused. I do also wonder if the word I heard tonight that Benny has developed a very aloof manner since appointed has any weight -- it would explain a lot about the man.
Okay we lost again to a lower league team in the cup. I'm somewhat used to that. I'm more concerned at yet another brace conceded and how Benny's stubborn inflexible approach and, to coin his phrase "game management" will play out to December.
Once Austin and Phillips go we have a big issue. If I was Bungle and is just banked c£23mill for those two I'd need convincing that targets to replace them are more Chery than JET. Not sure I'd let our novices loose with anymore change in their pockets, but what to do?!?!?
Three year contracts are a wonderful thing aren't they?
I hear all the usual guff about time needed, that fcukin "gel" word and all that; but I've seen nothing from Benny to convince me he's the man to steady this peddlo or find still waters. He has shown me ineptitude, stubbornness, a bit of an old boys favour approach and also is so negative in persona it's unreal
Buckle up you bitches, this could get bumpy
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| Cherish and enjoy life.... this ain't no dress rehearsal |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 09:39 - Aug 27 with 1404 views | PinnerPaul |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 16:51 - Aug 26 by Northernr |
Don't think some of the essays on here are slightly over the top? I mean we lost 2-0 to Port Vale the year we won the league under Warnock. Seems an odd stick to beat Ramsey with - all our managers, successful and otherwise, have bombed in that competition every year in very similar style, apart from Dowie actually.
And, as said previously, deathly quiet on here after Wolves last week. It really feels like some people are eagerly waiting for each defeat so they can kick off, and each win is met with a grudging "well the Wolves keeper was sht" or "Rotherham are crap". Every set back is met with an absolute outpouring, multiple threads, huge posts. Each win gets relatively very little response.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
My final point on this one.
L Block, who started this, said he would be back in Nov to give us his updated thoughts on CR "unless I'm tempted back by a particularly bad performance"
That rather sums it up - he will only post if we do something particularly bad, not of course if we happen to exceed his expectations and do rather well! |  | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:03 - Aug 27 with 1355 views | LadbrokeR |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 06:33 - Aug 27 by Blue_Castello |
Well I have no ITK knowledge but when you say the quality of the other forwards is down to Ramsey I would hazard a guess that Ferdinand is far more in control of transfers than Ramsey.
Ramsey is a coach reporting to a Director of football and he is tying to get results with the resources made available. It would appear that the Management also decided NOT to risk any of the first team players on the Carling Cup and it's now been proved that most of our back up players are not ready for first team action.
That's where we are in the rebuilding its a MASSiVE work in progress and now that we are working within the restrictions of FFP people need to lower their expectations. [Post edited 27 Aug 2015 6:35]
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Really are we all supposed to accept that it's Carlisle at home. I am lived. Yes it's a big rebuilding job and your point is well made the transfers are probably more down to Les than CR but i wouldn't imagine that Les doesn't get players that Ramsay doesn't fancy. On a final note i am not ITK. | | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:12 - Aug 27 with 1334 views | paulparker |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 09:29 - Aug 27 by simmo |
This is also the same cup competition that has already seen;
Brentford dicked at home by Oxford
Hull taken to penalties by Accrington
Blackburn beaten by Shrewsbury
Huddersfield beaten at home by Notts Co
Luton beating Bristol City and then taking Stoke to penalties
Millwall losing to Barnet
Walsall beating Nottingham Forest - at Forest
Port Vale beating Burnley
Bolton losing at home to Burton
That doesn't include the last few days either, multiple teams in the premiership being taken to extra time including Palace at home, Villa at home, Everton last night - all too lower league teams, some of which 3 divisions below. It's not as if losing in this competition at this stage of the season is an anomaly. Especially when you're playing so many youngsters and rotating a team at the beginning of a 50+ game season.
The reaction and outpouring, especially after such a great week in the league, is bordering on spoilt and shows that Ramsey is on a hiding to nothing with some fans, despie being a key part of a change within QPR that we were all screaming out for. |
Sorry Simmo i dont think the outpouring over the defeat to the mighty Carlisle has been that bad, so are we not allowed to say anything after being dumped out the cup, do we keep schtum
Ramsey will take the plaudits for beating 2 teams in the week so he has to take the stick for losing to a lower league side , the team, the tactics, the subs are all down to him are they not ?
he got it wrong , this is a forum and fans have every right to voice there concerns,
we all know this is work in progress at QPR , i think 90% of this MB have accepted that and tbf most of us dont care about the Prem
but that doesnt mean all of us have to accept that Ramsey is the best man for the job either , infact i think he is out of his depth
when i go the team gets my support , i want to be proved wrong about ramsey but when he picks a midfield of Goeburn, Doherty & Hoilett, weakens our already shot defence and takes the cup half ars ed then he does himself no favours |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:13 - Aug 27 with 1332 views | Lblock |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 09:39 - Aug 27 by PinnerPaul |
My final point on this one.
L Block, who started this, said he would be back in Nov to give us his updated thoughts on CR "unless I'm tempted back by a particularly bad performance"
That rather sums it up - he will only post if we do something particularly bad, not of course if we happen to exceed his expectations and do rather well! |
Dont be a c0ck mate - read what I said and try and accept sarcasm for what it is.
I typed "(apart from any woeful surrenders that see me drunk and in reaching distance of a keyboard)"
I notice in every single response not one person has justified Ramsey's tactics and failure to react to Carlisle's set up dominating us.
Ah sod it.
I'm off for a quiet lunch with Son of Gregory | |
| Cherish and enjoy life.... this ain't no dress rehearsal |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:18 - Aug 27 with 1320 views | ElHoop |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 09:29 - Aug 27 by simmo |
This is also the same cup competition that has already seen;
Brentford dicked at home by Oxford
Hull taken to penalties by Accrington
Blackburn beaten by Shrewsbury
Huddersfield beaten at home by Notts Co
Luton beating Bristol City and then taking Stoke to penalties
Millwall losing to Barnet
Walsall beating Nottingham Forest - at Forest
Port Vale beating Burnley
Bolton losing at home to Burton
That doesn't include the last few days either, multiple teams in the premiership being taken to extra time including Palace at home, Villa at home, Everton last night - all too lower league teams, some of which 3 divisions below. It's not as if losing in this competition at this stage of the season is an anomaly. Especially when you're playing so many youngsters and rotating a team at the beginning of a 50+ game season.
The reaction and outpouring, especially after such a great week in the league, is bordering on spoilt and shows that Ramsey is on a hiding to nothing with some fans, despie being a key part of a change within QPR that we were all screaming out for. |
Looking at those dicked or nearly dicked teams:
Brentford - FL Cup 4th round 2010/11, FL Trophy final 2010/11
Hull - FA Cup runners up 2014
Blackburn - FA Cup Quarter Final 2015 etc.
Huddersfield - pretty average
Stoke - FA Cup Final 2011
Millwall - pretty average
Forest - 5th Round FA Cup 2014
Burnley - League Cup semi-final 2009
Bolton - FA Cup semi-final 2011
Everton were definitely trying last night. If they'd lost, it would have been a big upset, but they won.
OK some of those teams haven't exactly set the world alight in cups lately either, but most of them have shown far more intent to progress, and their fans have had a good day out in the cup since the old King died.
Here's our record:
http://www.queensparkrangers-mad.co.uk/cup_history/queens_park_rangers/index.sht |  | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:25 - Aug 27 with 1313 views | PunteR |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:12 - Aug 27 by paulparker |
Sorry Simmo i dont think the outpouring over the defeat to the mighty Carlisle has been that bad, so are we not allowed to say anything after being dumped out the cup, do we keep schtum
Ramsey will take the plaudits for beating 2 teams in the week so he has to take the stick for losing to a lower league side , the team, the tactics, the subs are all down to him are they not ?
he got it wrong , this is a forum and fans have every right to voice there concerns,
we all know this is work in progress at QPR , i think 90% of this MB have accepted that and tbf most of us dont care about the Prem
but that doesnt mean all of us have to accept that Ramsey is the best man for the job either , infact i think he is out of his depth
when i go the team gets my support , i want to be proved wrong about ramsey but when he picks a midfield of Goeburn, Doherty & Hoilett, weakens our already shot defence and takes the cup half ars ed then he does himself no favours |
I would rather see Hoillet and Gobern get games against Carlisle then Huddersfield away this weekend. |  |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:28 - Aug 27 with 1311 views | adhoc_qpr |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:12 - Aug 27 by paulparker |
Sorry Simmo i dont think the outpouring over the defeat to the mighty Carlisle has been that bad, so are we not allowed to say anything after being dumped out the cup, do we keep schtum
Ramsey will take the plaudits for beating 2 teams in the week so he has to take the stick for losing to a lower league side , the team, the tactics, the subs are all down to him are they not ?
he got it wrong , this is a forum and fans have every right to voice there concerns,
we all know this is work in progress at QPR , i think 90% of this MB have accepted that and tbf most of us dont care about the Prem
but that doesnt mean all of us have to accept that Ramsey is the best man for the job either , infact i think he is out of his depth
when i go the team gets my support , i want to be proved wrong about ramsey but when he picks a midfield of Goeburn, Doherty & Hoilett, weakens our already shot defence and takes the cup half ars ed then he does himself no favours |
The trouble is that one group of fans are willing to forgive Ramsey for his mistakes in the short term and don't accept any (often valid) criticism of him because it's a long term project ('Arry's squad last year, tight budget and unsettled pre-season this year). Moaning, spoilt, blah blah.
The other group are convinced they have seen enough and he's not the right man for the job and are just waiting for the inevitable. Hence they seize on all the mistakes he's making as further evidence.
Not much middle ground there! | | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:29 - Aug 27 with 1293 views | JonDoeman |
A clean sheet would be nice Chris ! |  |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:36 - Aug 27 with 1291 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:12 - Aug 27 by paulparker |
Sorry Simmo i dont think the outpouring over the defeat to the mighty Carlisle has been that bad, so are we not allowed to say anything after being dumped out the cup, do we keep schtum
Ramsey will take the plaudits for beating 2 teams in the week so he has to take the stick for losing to a lower league side , the team, the tactics, the subs are all down to him are they not ?
he got it wrong , this is a forum and fans have every right to voice there concerns,
we all know this is work in progress at QPR , i think 90% of this MB have accepted that and tbf most of us dont care about the Prem
but that doesnt mean all of us have to accept that Ramsey is the best man for the job either , infact i think he is out of his depth
when i go the team gets my support , i want to be proved wrong about ramsey but when he picks a midfield of Goeburn, Doherty & Hoilett, weakens our already shot defence and takes the cup half ars ed then he does himself no favours |
Are we not allowed to argue against your views then? To point out where you're wrong? To moan ourselves about the hand-wringing and over-the-top, disrespectful comments and wild stamping of feet after every loss?
It works both ways. If you don't want anyone to argue back, don't post. |  |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 10:41 - Aug 27 with 1279 views | LadbrokeR |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 06:33 - Aug 27 by Blue_Castello |
Well I have no ITK knowledge but when you say the quality of the other forwards is down to Ramsey I would hazard a guess that Ferdinand is far more in control of transfers than Ramsey.
Ramsey is a coach reporting to a Director of football and he is tying to get results with the resources made available. It would appear that the Management also decided NOT to risk any of the first team players on the Carling Cup and it's now been proved that most of our back up players are not ready for first team action.
That's where we are in the rebuilding its a MASSiVE work in progress and now that we are working within the restrictions of FFP people need to lower their expectations. [Post edited 27 Aug 2015 6:35]
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:43 - Aug 27 with 1277 views | ElHoop |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:36 - Aug 27 by Antti_Heinola |
Are we not allowed to argue against your views then? To point out where you're wrong? To moan ourselves about the hand-wringing and over-the-top, disrespectful comments and wild stamping of feet after every loss?
It works both ways. If you don't want anyone to argue back, don't post. |
The difference is Auntie, that the likes of you are tending to veer towards complaining about people on the forum, whereas the people complaining about the Carlisle result are mostly complaining about actual things that happened to the Queen Park Rangers Football Club.
There's a difference. | | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:47 - Aug 27 with 1269 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:43 - Aug 27 by ElHoop |
The difference is Auntie, that the likes of you are tending to veer towards complaining about people on the forum, whereas the people complaining about the Carlisle result are mostly complaining about actual things that happened to the Queen Park Rangers Football Club.
There's a difference. |
Nonsense.
I may complain about a view, but always explain reasons behind it. As do people like Simmo, Clive etc. | |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:51 - Aug 27 with 1253 views | WilloW4 |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:47 - Aug 27 by Antti_Heinola |
Nonsense.
I may complain about a view, but always explain reasons behind it. As do people like Simmo, Clive etc. |
As do people who just agree with you every time you mean. |  | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:52 - Aug 27 with 1250 views | ElHoop |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:51 - Aug 27 by WilloW4 |
As do people who just agree with you every time you mean. |
I think that we are wasting our time trying to explain this one Willow.
It's not there. | | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:55 - Aug 27 with 1245 views | paulparker |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:36 - Aug 27 by Antti_Heinola |
Are we not allowed to argue against your views then? To point out where you're wrong? To moan ourselves about the hand-wringing and over-the-top, disrespectful comments and wild stamping of feet after every loss?
It works both ways. If you don't want anyone to argue back, don't post. |
by all means , its called a discussion,
but show me where anyone who has been over the top ,show me where i have been disrespectful, show me the stamping of feet
you cant because no one has ,
people have come back with why losing to carlisle shouldnt be just swept under the carpet ,
im ok with people coming back at me , show me where i havent on this thread | |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:55 - Aug 27 with 1241 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:51 - Aug 27 by WilloW4 |
As do people who just agree with you every time you mean. |
Don't really understand your point, there. The other guy said I was just complaining about posters, not focusing on the team. I said that was untrue and pointed out that people who disagree with the Ramsey-bashing put plenty of thought into comments on the team/club as well. It's irrelevant to this discussion whether they agree with me or not. | |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:59 - Aug 27 with 1223 views | ElHoop |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:55 - Aug 27 by Antti_Heinola |
Don't really understand your point, there. The other guy said I was just complaining about posters, not focusing on the team. I said that was untrue and pointed out that people who disagree with the Ramsey-bashing put plenty of thought into comments on the team/club as well. It's irrelevant to this discussion whether they agree with me or not. |
This Ramsey bashing is something of a myth though. Most of what I've read is perfectly fair criticism of the selection/tactics/strategy/cup record arising from the Carlisle result. I don't think that too many people are blaming Ramsey for all of this, although he isn't blameless in his own right.
Anyhow if you don't get it you don't get it and that's all there is to it. | | | |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:04 - Aug 27 with 1212 views | paulparker |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 10:47 - Aug 27 by Antti_Heinola |
Nonsense.
I may complain about a view, but always explain reasons behind it. As do people like Simmo, Clive etc. |
so the posters you have just mentioned are the only ones who explain there views,
really ??
i suggest you read the whole thread and not the stuff you just agree with
other posters including myself have explained our point of view in a civil way
because you dont agree with those views , and read what you want to read you trot out the usual
talk about knee jerk | |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:06 - Aug 27 with 1204 views | PunteR |
Is this an argument about an argument about an argument? | |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:07 - Aug 27 with 1202 views | ElHoop |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:06 - Aug 27 by PunteR |
Is this an argument about an argument about an argument? |
you want some? | | | |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 11:27 - Aug 27 with 1163 views | PunteR |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:07 - Aug 27 by ElHoop |
you want some? |
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| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:28 - Aug 27 with 1161 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:04 - Aug 27 by paulparker |
so the posters you have just mentioned are the only ones who explain there views,
really ??
i suggest you read the whole thread and not the stuff you just agree with
other posters including myself have explained our point of view in a civil way
because you dont agree with those views , and read what you want to read you trot out the usual
talk about knee jerk |
Paul, that's not what I meant mate. You try reading a bit more.
I think plenty of people have explained their criticisms very well. I was responding to a comment that people who are being a little more circumspect aren't looking at the team, or aren't making any criticisms, which they are and do.
Some of the more negative posters, however, resort to childish insults and go way over the top. That's it. There are plenty of good points made about mistakes made Tue night and this season that I completely agree with. [Post edited 27 Aug 2015 11:29]
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:44 - Aug 27 with 1133 views | paulparker |
| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:28 - Aug 27 by Antti_Heinola |
Paul, that's not what I meant mate. You try reading a bit more.
I think plenty of people have explained their criticisms very well. I was responding to a comment that people who are being a little more circumspect aren't looking at the team, or aren't making any criticisms, which they are and do.
Some of the more negative posters, however, resort to childish insults and go way over the top. That's it. There are plenty of good points made about mistakes made Tue night and this season that I completely agree with. [Post edited 27 Aug 2015 11:29]
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Antti i get some posters can go OTT with the criticism about Ramsey but then some posters who clearly wear QPR rose tinted specs on everything Rangers then dish out some pretty silly stuff as well
if we were all in a pub chatting over a pint then tuesdays debacle would probably be an hour conversation , hence the 6 pages here
if we all met up in the pub after a win you would more than likely have a half hour conversation and say a good win and move onto another topic
personally i dont dislike Ramsey, like i did Arry, Hughes, Harford, Houston i just think he is out of his depth and the wrong choice in a long line of wrong choices the club has made
yes we have to cut our cloth, play a few youngsters and more than likely spend a few seasons in the championship , i get that, i just dont agree with the way Ramsey goes about things
as ive said on previous threads if im wrong il eat humble pie big time | |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:52 - Aug 27 with 1109 views | Discodroids |
Quite impressive running total of down arrows for my old compardre l block !!
If only these Ramsey Jim jones drones could sustain themselves on The Baroque Banquet of Self Righteous progressives high minded morality . Posting down arrows, before Striding off with the grim determination and purpose of a cold war East German 400 meter runner to Walthamstow village for celebratory Latte Made of Yak harry monk and a lech walesa cinnamon twirl. |  |
| "...The monkey is never dead, Dealer. The monkey never dies. When you kick him off, he just hides in a corner, waiting his turn." |
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| Chris Ramsey - Clueless? Stubborn? Or both? on 11:55 - Aug 27 with 1104 views | Pommyhoop |
Chris Ramsey - Genius? Visionary ? Or both?
Possible title for a thread next time CR gets a win?
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