Forum | Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations by FredManRave

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Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations 03:52 - Sep 3 with 3286 views

I'll start by claryfying that I want us to be playing in the Premier League, I think we've got a great chance of promotion and before yesterday I was going to back Ramsey as long as we never looked like getting relegated so I'll obviously continue to back him. So, I'm totally agreed with the euphoria of seeing our Prem quality players still playing for us and what that should mean, footballwise, for us at least this season.

However, I find the silence deafening from those that were pleading with the club to cut its cloth and accept, at the very least, one season in the best and most competitive league in the world and mortified at the thought of promotion back to the Premier League, hoping for sustainability with accompanying level headed/sensible plans for our short to mid term future, recognising that, more than anything, that's what we needed.

As a result of the window now being slammed shut the expectations on Chris Ramsey are absolutely huge. You only have to read almost every post on here to realise that. Despite some huge reductions it's fair to assume that we have the highest wage bill in the league. Despite all the stabilising talk from the owners I think their expectations are clear as day now.

Again, despite how this might read, personally I want us to get promoted, I'm pleased Austin, Green and Phillips are still with us but the change in attitude, outlook and expectations for this season has been turned on its head in the space of morning to night and it's going to be extremely hard to manage.

Bearing in mind the lack of caution and/or any fears being mentioned on here with our new dawn does it mean that the previous mention of hopes of stability, time in the championship, and financial prudence were not quite as heartfelt as they sounded. I think the positivity is great and the Premier League is where I want us to be but I think Ramseys job has just become a whole lot harder and the ride for most of us will get alot bumpier as a result of our "new" squad.

Just my pesos worth. Be interested to read how those who want stability and realistic expectations with the fans acting accordingly now feel about our head on charge to the Premier League with "The best squad (on paper) in the league" and "Anything outside top 6 being complete and utter failure".

[Post edited 3 Sep 2015 3:58]

	I've got the Power.
Poll:	MOM from todays Teasing at Teesside?

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 11:07 - Sep 3 with 1165 views

blacky200

I think that we have a team good enough to make a challenge for automatic promotion (especially if we keep Austin and Phillips in January). If we go up we should what West Brom did so well in their yoyo years. Keep the base of the team together after relegation and build, get promoted and add a couple of quality signings and repeat. It is probably more important to be in and around the Prem over the next couple of years than ever before with the gap in money between the two leagues becoming vast. It won't be long before the same 3 teams get promoted/relegated each year.
I hated the last few years we had in the Prem. Not because we were losing (well OK maybe a bit) but because we were saddled with too many players who did not give a toss. I think we'd see a massive improvement in attitude and work rate if this team went up.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 12:07 - Sep 3 with 1107 views

NW10Hoop

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 06:59 - Sep 3 by stevec

Yes, from some on here, the demand for mediocrity was somewhat baffling.

There just isn't this Utopia in football, whereby you bring in youth players over a designated time from some pool of as yet unspecified talent. That the big clubs then stand by on the basis that QPR are doing the right thing and therefore we must allow that to continue without plundering any individual talent they do eventually unearth. Sadly it's not 1972, things don't work like that any more.

As fun as it is in the Championship, every single clubs aim is to reach the promised land. If you don't then what is the point. Better to try and fail than not to try at all. In the end, it wasn't spending money that messed things up it was simply spending the money badly.

The plan should always be get promoted and then this time, spend the money wisely.

I've been trying to say this in much more long winded way all summer. Happy to consolidate if it's for the long term health of the club. Happier to smash it without bankrupting ourselves if possible though. Makes Saturdays far more fun.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 12:54 - Sep 3 with 1049 views

Juzzie

I don't think anyone is demanding, or wanting, mediocrity. I think it's about having realistic expectations considering the situation.

Sure, I too would like us to be in the PL if we could maintain a season-on-season situation like Swansea, Southampton etc. However, in order to do this (and I don't even think they can) needs a much better set up than we currently have.

We tried throwing money at it and that didn't work and we are now in so much debt (albeit it to the owners rather than 'doing a Pompey' that people love to incorrectly throw at us) because we cocked it up so many times.

So, now it seems we are going down the more prudent route, which people wanted, but that takes time. Now, right at the beginning of the prudent era, people are wanting an immediate return PL football. It's too much too soon.

I think all people want is a bit of stability, try and sort out the accounts and go from there.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 12:59 - Sep 3 with 1031 views

Hunterhoop

I don't see what's complex about this or why it's a choice.

Put very simply, I want us to go up, but on the sole condition that we do NOT spend any money if/when we reach the Prem unless it is replacing a player we have sold on for a profit.

I want the QPR team to care for the club and the players that get us into the Prem to be rewarded and not be full of money grabbing pr*cks, led by mouthy sh*ts like Barton, who didn't know the name of our ground before they signed, let alone give a sh*t about the club.

When pre-season started, stabilising was absolutely the right target. Now, clearly, with this squad we should be competing for the playoffs. But, i still think it's absolutely ridiculous to have fans demanding "top 2" now. It doesn't work like that and it's greedy. Let's just enjoy the ride. There is no pressure on Ramsey save that which we needlessly create.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 13:21 - Sep 3 with 987 views

TheBlob

There's something so appealing about the romantic and poetic Quixotic tilting at windmills.Madly unrealistic and impractical but it's what sets humans apart from the lower primates.
Sod it,where do I sign?

Poll:

So how was the season for you?

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 16:08 - Sep 3 with 888 views

FredManRave

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 09:51 - Sep 3 by Northernr

I presume all the downplaying and consolidation talk over the summer was with the expectation that green, phillips, austin and fer would all be going. Having kept them all that's probably now changed. They've certainly shifted a chunk of the wage bill, but not as much as they'd planned to. I just hope we haven't put ourselves in a financial position where we now have to get promoted whether we're good enough and ready or not.

I would love to know how the scenario was when the 12 million bids came in for Austin. Presumably Fernandes has the last word in deciding not to sell him whilst I would imagine that Hoos was screaming "Sell, sell, sell". Not only to get the 12million in the bank but to reduce the wages outlay and to cash in on our best asset that we could well now "lose" for nothing at the end of the season. And it may well have been the same for Phillips. Good business sense bearing in mind our financial situation?!

For me, with the quad we now have it means that the owners will be expecting promotion.Whether it's imperative, we'll have to wait and see but I'm guessing they've taken a punt on keeping the Premier League believing/hoping/praying that they'll be the main reason we get back to the Premier League.

	I've got the Power.
Poll:	MOM from todays Teasing at Teesside?

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 16:16 - Sep 3 with 884 views

FredManRave

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 09:38 - Sep 3 by simmo

Said it before, I would rather be a club that plays in front of 12,000 core support in league 1, playing attacking football with a team of players I like and can feel an affinity for, than be a West Brom or Stoke — permanently mid table without a chance of winning anything, patronising pats on the head from Ed Chamberlain when we manage to give Chelsea and Man City a game. The whole Premier League machine, coupled with Sky, is nauseating.

The recent premier league years have been the worst of my QPR supporting life, completely lost our identity, our soul, we abandoned the reasons I fell in love with QPR in the first place, there was nothing to be proud of anymore. I would rather be proud of the club I support and lose to Grimsby, Bradford and Northampton TBH.

It’s also changed our support, there’s a sense of entitlement now, like the younger generation of fans are spoilt and think we ‘deserve’ to achieve things because of the players we have and the money we’ve spent. I much preferred to be the spiky little club from Shepherds Bush, capable of an upset and dining out on maverick midfielders and cult centre backs. I know not everybody wants the same QPR as I do, and that’s perfectly understandable. I just don't see the point of being in a league you’ll never win — also, even the most passionate premier league fan has to admit that the Championship is MILES more fun!

Also, just for the record, I am loving this team as it is and although I don’t think we will beat that day at Wembley ever again in my life, I would rather achieve things with this team than the last one we took there!

I understand where you're coming from Simmo but don't you think that this/the next time round it could be different having "learnt our lessons".

Isn't the idea of settling for the Championship, to use an analogy, the same as saying to your son, "No son, you don't want to get promoted and play against the best players. They're all better than you and you'll lose more than you'll win. You just aim to stay in the second Division and be happy with that".

I realise we'll never win the Premier League, probably (!) but surely in sport it's all about playing to the best of your potential, pitting your wits against the best and having those unforgettable moments when you cause an upset. Why do non seeds even bother entering the US Open when they have 0 chance of winning, why do qualifiers/amateurs enter Open Championships, why do England play in World Cups. The challenge and the hope amongst many other things.

	I've got the Power.
Poll:	MOM from todays Teasing at Teesside?

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 16:22 - Sep 3 with 875 views

FredManRave

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 12:59 - Sep 3 by Hunterhoop

Do you honestly believe that we could get promoted and then "NOT spend any money unless it is replacing player we have sold on for a profit". If you don't then you don't want us to get promoted!

And I'm surprised to read that you think "There is no pressure on Ramsey save that which we needlessly create". Again having the best squad on paper, keeping Premier League players, having the vast majority of fans expecting Promotion, having our odds drastically cut for promotion and in general (the press, fans, odds) not to mention what Fernandes must now be expecting means that Ramsey, imo, is now under a huge amount of pressure.

We'd already seen, admittedly only on here, how bad "run" can be received and now people will have the "Best squad in the League, Best Striker etc etc sticks to beat him with when promotion, or at least top 6 form is being met.

	I've got the Power.
Poll:	MOM from todays Teasing at Teesside?

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:28 - Sep 3 with 825 views

johncharles

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 06:59 - Sep 3 by stevec

Demand for mediocrity ? Did go to any games last season ? Enough mediocrity for a lifetime. I want to see the ball played to feet. I want skill and pace and above all a club spirit. The Premiership is dominated by the fear of losing

Strong and stable my arse.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:35 - Sep 3 with 817 views

Hunterhoop

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 16:22 - Sep 3 by FredManRave

You don't get it.

Yes, I'd rather we did what I propose if we get promoted than spend lots and lots to "upskill" the squad in a desperate attempt to preserve our status as a Premier League side, financially crippling the club in the process. I'd rather not go down that route (again) and get relegated instead....if indeed that was the outcome. I'm not convinced it would be!

Secondly, I'm not saying people won't put pressure on Ramsey. I'm saying it's pressure these people needlessly create. Why "must we go up" this year? To employ some hyperbole here, even if we had Liverpool's team why "must we go up"? Why must we exist in the league above. Plenty of clubs don't. We've proven we can run ourselves financially poorly in each league. We know we're a club that is highly highly unlikely to ever win the Premier League. What's the problem if we stay in this league next year? We just need to cut our cloth accordingly. TF et al won't bail, because, to do so, would mean writing off vast sums. THEY may well put pressure on Ferdinand for us to get promoted, but not Ramsey. He's just the Head Coach. Ramsey isn't responsible for the finances in any shape.

And even if TF is putting pressure on Les and Les puts it on Ramsey....what can TF do? Walk away? And write off £250m? Really? Even if he asked the club to pay it all back, we can't. He'd get nothing? TF needs us to for long haul in my view....or they've already considered that £250m sunk costs.

To be honest, I get the argument about financial pressure, but I just don't think it's as pressing as this season and I do believe it's on Ferdinand more than Ramsey.

But from a "playing" perspective, the only pressure on Ramsey comes from fans and I think it is needlessly created. From a purely football perspective, we do not "need" to be in the Prem. It's wholly unnecessary in fact. Ergo, any pressure the fans place on Ramsey is needless. Let him do his job of coaching the team and let's enjoy becoming the club we want to be again.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:45 - Sep 3 with 799 views

TheBlob

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:35 - Sep 3 by Hunterhoop

Where does this figure of £250m come from?

[Post edited 3 Sep 2015 17:49]

Poll:

So how was the season for you?

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:53 - Sep 3 with 786 views

Hunterhoop

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:45 - Sep 3 by TheBlob
Where does this figure of £250m come from? [Post edited 3 Sep 2015 17:49]

£180m or whatever is was in the last accounts after the "gifts" they swallowed, plus this current financial year on top, to give a real time estimate of how deep in they are. We definitely ran at another loss last year, I'd say. It's a conservative view of how bad it is for them, I admit.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:56 - Sep 3 with 785 views

TheBlob

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:53 - Sep 3 by Hunterhoop
£180m or whatever is was in the last accounts after the "gifts" they swallowed, plus this current financial year on top, to give a real time estimate of how deep in they are. We definitely ran at another loss last year, I'd say. It's a conservative view of how bad it is for them, I admit.

And how much of that has come/will come from TF's own pocket?

Poll:

So how was the season for you?

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 18:21 - Sep 3 with 761 views

PunteR

I'll take premiership football if I knew we had a club that can compete for years to come without it crippling the club financially. But we haven't.
We have a good championship level squad of players,we have a good championship level manager.
I like being a big fish in a small pond.
If we get promoted it will because we deserve it,the fans,players ,coaches even TF. But I hope we keep our new philosophy of trying to live within our means,not paying big contracts to mediocre players and try to get the best out of our players playing attacking football.
If we get promoted this season we need to keep Ramsey and the players that got us up. We can still keep stability and get relegated/promoted for the next couple of years.
Its still early days. My expectations this season hasn't really changed. I don't think we will get relegated. Top half finish.

[Post edited 3 Sep 2015 18:33]

Occasional providers of half decent House music.

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 20:31 - Sep 3 with 696 views

Hunterhoop

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 17:56 - Sep 3 by TheBlob
And how much of that has come/will come from TF's own pocket?

Oh, nothing, I imagine. For TF read "the consortium he represents".

How much of their money comes from their own pockets vs loans they've taken out, is secondary. As far as QPR ltd are concerned it's a loan from the consortium. If the consortium's loans (if that's what they are) are called in, they have more assets outside to borrow against to repay. And I imagine, if they did take out a loan to prop up the club, they'll have done so against their good names, businesses, assets, etc, and got some pretty favourable terms.

I also think, compared to some of their other business ventures we're relatively small fry, for now.

And, if they do eventually ask QPR to repay the loans they made to the club...we can't pay. Effectively, they've loaned to a sub prime entity. It'll be them that's up the shitter. Our assets, without a new ground, aren't worth much. Sure, we'd get stripped, but we'd survive. They probably wouldn't.

That's my limited take on it at the moment.

And I'm also determined to enjoy this season after the recent years of awfulness, so I'll continue with my interpretation for a little while, I think! :)

Stabilise Schmabilise, We've Got Greater Expectations on 20:54 - Sep 3 with 665 views

derbyhoop

There's little point in playing in the Championship unless you aspire to getting promoted. Worry about the season long struggle, the altered match days and the unadulterated greed if/when we get back there.

I echo Clive's view that the club and the owners would have expected sizeable sums from Austin, Phillips, Green, Fer and, despite the reducing wage bill the only way it can possibly be sustainable is with PL income.

Great Expectations, now. But we will still need patience.

Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all oneâ€™s lifetime. (Mark Twain) Find me on twitter @derbyhoop

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