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Brexit Argument Over on 21:46 - May 18 by derbyhoop
All relevant points.
And as for the EU being unelected. The major decisions are taken you by the Council of Ministers, which includes Cameron (elected), Merkel (elected), Hollande (elected) and the elected heads of 25 other countries. The elected national governments appoint EU Commissioners, like we appoint senior civil servants. Any laws proposed by commissioners are subject to scrutiny by the elected European Parliament and, finally, the elected Westminster Parliament. It's not perfect but it's every bit as good as a system where 35% of the popular vote gives you almost unlimited power; where 1 party gets 4m votes and 1 MP, while another gets 3.5m votes and 56 MPs..
Tell me how I vote out a commissioner ?, or what election it was that Merkel was on the ballot for me to vote for .
We had a vote to change our electoral system and voted not to ...thats democracy .
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Brexit Argument Over on 22:50 - May 18 with 1870 views
Brexit Argument Over on 19:05 - May 18 by johncharles
Win or lose. Out or remain. If we vote to leave they'll double shaft us just for hell of it.
They wont be able to though. The tories are tearing themselves apart, when Hezza gets wheeled out like a Soviet Overlord not disimilar to Brezhnev, the tories are finished.
There is a General Strike planned for the 7th July. The Tories wont get past it. It will bring them down. A different Government will be elected, in or out.
And those City boys are going to have to grab their ankles.
The EU is finished, as are the Tories. The SNP vote will melt. Boris is pond life already and a change like we cannot comprehend is on the way. It is very interesting watching from a distance, I think the UK will be far better for it. Orgreave enquiry is only the beginning.
Am amazed no-one is complaining about the Turks like they were the Romanians a couple of years ago. If you think the UK is immune from 70 million Turks think again, not even Putin has dared take them on. When we bomb people they become refugees. Simples. Guess what? Us is about to start bombing Libya again to gain control of the oil under the guise of an IS threat. Wouldn't they bomb Brussells first? Sooner we bin the US the sooner we can consider the EU again, which has potential, but not now, not for a decade at least. US needs binning first.
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Brexit Argument Over on 22:50 - May 18 with 1864 views
your've got Jeremy clarkson and Emma thompson. id ratherhave Pol pot and joesf fritzel.
still, its good to see the left side with Cameron , Osborne and Jeremy hunt over the referendum.
They say that As a Human Being, Love is the one thing we're capable of perceiving that transcends dimensions of time and space.Its Some artifact of a higher dimension that we can't consciously perceive.Yet as a right winger I would happily cross the universe to give Cameron the 5mm tread of my Red or Dead Chukka Boots Down the side of his Adso of melt Face. Work that one out.
crazy, man.
[Post edited 18 May 2016 22:51]
"...The monkey is never dead, Dealer. The monkey never dies. When you kick him off, he just hides in a corner, waiting his turn."
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Brexit Argument Over on 23:46 - May 18 with 1820 views
You're in trouble when socialists run out of other peoples' money.
I find it amazing that so many people are falling over themselves to grasp a chalice patently overflowing with poison.If this mess gets the approval then you've got nobody to blame but yourselves,and I don't want to hear anybody from that camp moaning about how shit life has become.
You're joking no? With google corporation tax at 3% with free health care for employees via an un-dunded NHS off the back of zero hours contracts>? Whose' money exactly are we talking about? Subsidised train companies? Google? Barclays? They dont just thrive at our expense but with a substantial cost that cannot be afforded anymore. They are welcome to fck off and HQ in Brussels 8 days a week.
I genuinely refuse to believe you bought that shit hook line and sinker.
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Brexit Argument Over on 23:49 - May 18 with 1819 views
Brexit Argument Over on 21:04 - May 18 by essextaxiboy
We will only take what we need , Hairdressers , Midwives , Builders if we need builders .
We wont take people who come on a 9.95 flight with Ryanair and then punt themselves around , probably get exploited by employers and keep wages down.
A points and visa system like in OZ will mean we take what we need
if we put in a points system then yes that would work but not heard that is something we plan to do if we come out. Employers will always want to hire the cheapest staff possible and that usually comes from abroad
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Brexit Argument Over on 00:04 - May 19 with 1810 views
if we put in a points system then yes that would work but not heard that is something we plan to do if we come out. Employers will always want to hire the cheapest staff possible and that usually comes from abroad
If wages increase as they are suggesting (if leave EU) it will just encourage companies to move to Europe or outsource services abroad. So our government would probably keep immigration levels similar to suppress wage inflation to maintain employment levels.
Brexit Argument Over on 23:46 - May 18 by Brightonhoop
You're joking no? With google corporation tax at 3% with free health care for employees via an un-dunded NHS off the back of zero hours contracts>? Whose' money exactly are we talking about? Subsidised train companies? Google? Barclays? They dont just thrive at our expense but with a substantial cost that cannot be afforded anymore. They are welcome to fck off and HQ in Brussels 8 days a week.
I genuinely refuse to believe you bought that shit hook line and sinker.
How silly of me,of course socialist governments don't overspend and bankrupt and then others have to pick up the pieces.Portugal is a veritable paradise of thrift.What was I thinking.
Brexit Argument Over on 21:15 - May 18 by essextaxiboy
So you reckon that a teacher with a class of 100% English speaking pupils has just the same job as one with a dozen different languages and no English at all ? Really ?
I didnt mention violence at all ?
Whats Murdoch got to do with a failed President lecturing us .?
I picked up a missionary from a flight from San Diego yesterday and she said she thought the USA would take years to recover . When we want advice from a dud I think we could just ask .
Really !!!! A missionary from San Diego !!!!!!!
That's argument over then, shame you didn't ask them if we should leave the EU that would have ended that argument as well!
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Brexit Argument Over on 12:55 - May 19 with 1620 views
That's argument over then, shame you didn't ask them if we should leave the EU that would have ended that argument as well!
She is a US citizen , and probably a bit more forgiving than most .It was just a first hand assessment of the bloke who has been threatening us . I didnt ask her about the referendum because ......its none of her business .
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Brexit Argument Over on 13:08 - May 19 with 1585 views
Brexit Argument Over on 13:02 - May 19 by essextaxiboy
She is a US citizen , and probably a bit more forgiving than most .It was just a first hand assessment of the bloke who has been threatening us . I didnt ask her about the referendum because ......its none of her business .
and my point was it was a sample of one. If you had picked up the next American in the queue they might have had a completely different opinion.
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Brexit Argument Over on 13:21 - May 19 with 1568 views
Brexit Argument Over on 12:58 - May 19 by essextaxiboy
Vote for anyone but the Torys ..if enough feel like you they will be bystanders for 5 years .
The are a couple of points here
Point one is you do vote (or at least can) in the elections that puts EU MP's into the EU parliament. Merkel isn't a EU commissioner any more than Cameron is so no one can vote for or against her in an EU context.
Point two is I can vote for my local MP only, in the same way I can vote for my local EuroMP only, I have no control over who gets to be an EC commissioner any more that I get to chose who gets to be a Minister in the Cabinet, they are both chosen by the sitting PM.
Final point although you say I can vote for a different party than Cameron and so have some say on PM, our political system is organised on a personal vote basis not a party vote basis (which is why there is no form of proportional representation). I tend to vote that way, by choosing someone I think might just represent my constituency, or who promotes view I agree with.
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Brexit Argument Over on 13:26 - May 19 with 1559 views
Brexit Argument Over on 20:50 - May 18 by essextaxiboy
Dylan . with the greatest of respect your whole post is wide of the mark . Even the Remainers could pull it apart ,
It is a 2 year process to leave so nothing happens "immediately ". Then WTO rules would kick in . By then we will have some trade agreements in place and dozens more in progress many with markets the EU does have deals in place with .
The EU market has not grown since 2006 , other markets are more attractive to us
If you think anyone in the world could replace the City of London financial centre you are mistaken, financiers deal through us for much more reasons than being in the EU , Canary Wharf alone is bigger than the whole of the Frankfurt financial district.
We have fantastic entrepreneurs here , the best Universitys , the best trained armed forces . We may be tiny on the map , look at the numbers
Are you still in America? , if so again with respect you are not qualified to talk about the immigration issue , when your kids are in a class trying to learn with classmates who speak a dozen different languages you may have an idea.
I would never refer to an immigrant as " Johnny Foreigner" I would deserve pelters if I did . Have you got any more failed Presidents to send? , the last one who came boosted the out campaign2 or 3 points . I think he understands what the British people feel about being threatened now .
[Post edited 18 May 2016 20:52]
But those other attractive markets are still open to us if we are in the EU. We've recently seen Cameron in China crowing about the deals we've done there.
RFA
"Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1."
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Brexit Argument Over on 13:35 - May 19 with 1538 views
2.2 million EU Citizens now working in the uk according to brillo pad, On ONS figures released today. Double what it was 5 years ago. Does not depress wages according to Alice the geek , the aforementioned Frances o'grady .
They truly walk among us.
No mention of those ONS Figures Released today on EU immigration to the UK and the impact on low paid unskilled employment to UK Citizens, on either the BBC NEWS Chanel or radio 5 live news. Just something about some woman cricketer who managed to break the world record for throwing a cricket ball 12. 23 meters(wind assisted). Unbelievable.
The BBC, As useful as Del Trotters blow up sex doll at an Elton John and David Furnish Chem Sex party (allegedly).
[Post edited 19 May 2016 13:46]
"...The monkey is never dead, Dealer. The monkey never dies. When you kick him off, he just hides in a corner, waiting his turn."
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Brexit Argument Over on 13:36 - May 19 with 1495 views
Brexit Argument Over on 19:22 - May 18 by stumbleandfall
I'm not really for or against brexit, just despise the figures most vocal for it.
I'm prepared to spread some good EU news stories.
Portugal kept its lights on with renewable energy alone for four consecutive days last week in a clean energy milestone. Electricity consumption in the country was fully covered by solar, wind and hydro power in an extraordinary 107-hour run that lasted from 6.45am on Saturday 7 May until 5.45pm the following Wednesday, the analysis says creating zero emissions. Portugal’s clean energy surge has been spurred by the EU’s renewable targets for 2020.
Brilliant news. Cheers my heart there is hope for us yet. Strongly believe alliances such as the EU make this possible.
[Post edited 18 May 2016 19:23]
Great point. Leave and our environment will suffer, and that means our water, our beaches and our air quality.
Renewables are not just about saving our planet, they are also about removing risk, the risk of being reliant on others for your energy. Some politicians chunter on about renewables being intermittent yet you can't get much more intermittent than gas from Qatar which has to be shipped half way round the world, dodging pirates and failed or failing states as it goes.
RFA
"Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1."
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Brexit Argument Over on 13:55 - May 19 with 1460 views
Speaking of the Daily Politics Show, I saw we got a mention by Cameron.
Admittedly comparing the plight of his beloved Villa being in the same league as the poor sod chosen to do the funny seconding of the Queen's Speech and our fellow Rfosi, Philip Lee MP.
'Always In Motion' by John Honney available on amazon.co.uk
Nous sommes L’occitane Rs!
Brexit Argument Over on 13:26 - May 19 by R_from_afar
But those other attractive markets are still open to us if we are in the EU. We've recently seen Cameron in China crowing about the deals we've done there.
RFA
He hasnt done any deals , He cant . The EU speaks for us at the WTO . This was the response when he said he wanted a deal with China .
"We believe that it is premature at this stage to discuss a free trade agreement with China," Alexandre Polack, a spokesman for the EU executive, told reporters..
Lets keep China on the back burner then eh? Its not as if its a big market .
Quit the EU and we immediatly return to the WTO, then we talk to who we want ,
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Brexit Argument Over on 14:25 - May 19 with 1432 views
Brexit Argument Over on 14:13 - May 19 by essextaxiboy
He hasnt done any deals , He cant . The EU speaks for us at the WTO . This was the response when he said he wanted a deal with China .
"We believe that it is premature at this stage to discuss a free trade agreement with China," Alexandre Polack, a spokesman for the EU executive, told reporters..
Lets keep China on the back burner then eh? Its not as if its a big market .
Quit the EU and we immediatly return to the WTO, then we talk to who we want ,
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