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VAT on school fees sounds great in principle but it is not cost neutral. A percentage of parents paying privately will be able to afford it but a fair percentage will not and will move kids back to the state sector- which does not have the capacity and then has to pay for these kids. That is why successive governments have looked at this and not done it. It is popular though with all demographics so may happen whoever gets in. If your beef with private schools is that it causes inequality then they ought to be abolished out right as this is a move that would make them even more elitist.
Precisely. What an effing stupid idea - as you say either close them completely or put up with them. No way should there be VAT on any education. The very rich will still pay the fees so all you'll end up with is more inequality than we already have. Looks like we might end up with more grammar schools so presumably that will eventually mean the end of grammar schools completely when Labour gets back in, the way things tend to go. So state education is going to have to keep improving at this rate and it's not got the resources or structure to do so.
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General Election? on 19:49 - Apr 24 with 2901 views
Putting VAT on private education to fund school meals is a policy designed to appeal to the base, but which is fundamentally pretty gormless. If I'm expected to pay £12,000 more in tax each year, I would hope it would go on something more important and life-changing than providing free meals to a small group of children (Years 3-6) whose parents can afford them anyway. Poor families get free meals as it is. Are there not higher priorities? If you want to ban private education, be honest and put it to the public (and be prepared to send undercover investigators to root out illegal tutors...)
[Post edited 24 Apr 2017 20:33]
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General Election? on 20:17 - Apr 24 with 2873 views
Just seen some remarkable opinion polls from Wales showing the Tories up there for the first time since the 19th century.
The same with old labour northern strongholds.
It appears that labour is being associated with the remain vote and punished. Ironically Corbyn is the most pro leave leader since we joined the EU and his decision to try and reach a consensus with the vastly pro remain party evidence of the very opposite to the ideological dogmatism he is accused of.
On reflection if he had have backed a real progressive and left wing Brexit labour would probably be better off. I suggest that the labour vote would still have held up in pro remain metropolitan constituencies.
As it is we are looking at 20 years of Tory rule. A continuation of the shrinking of the state will now be an unrestrained goal, with the NHS firmly in sight to be incrementally marketised.
Precisely. What an effing stupid idea - as you say either close them completely or put up with them. No way should there be VAT on any education. The very rich will still pay the fees so all you'll end up with is more inequality than we already have. Looks like we might end up with more grammar schools so presumably that will eventually mean the end of grammar schools completely when Labour gets back in, the way things tend to go. So state education is going to have to keep improving at this rate and it's not got the resources or structure to do so.
The 'party line' over grammar schools is by no means clear-cut. This is what happened when Thatcher was Education Secretary in the 1970s:
'Heath appointed that ultimate enthusiast for the grammar schools system, Margaret Thatcher, as Education Secretary. She duly announced a presumption against further shake-up and change. But what happened? Out of 3,612 proposals for comprehensives sent to Mrs Thatcher, she turned down just 326 and the proportion of children at comprehensives nearly doubled again, up from 32 per cent under Labour to 62 per cent under this thoroughly Conservative politician. As one of her biographers flatly pointed out, 'for all her strong prejudices against them . . . Margaret Thatcher approved more schemes for comprehensive schools, and the abolition of more grammar schools, than any other Secretary of State before or since.' Heath, who fought a tough campaign as Prime Minister to save his local grammar school in Bexley, blamed the desire of Tory-led authorities to save money by replacing boys-only and girls-only grammars with co-ed comprehensives.'
Andrew Marr, A History of Modern Britain (2009)
The Thatcher biography mentioned is Hugo Young's One of Us, (1989)
Air hostess clique
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General Election? on 23:01 - Apr 24 with 2702 views
Well that's more like it, concentrate on policy instead.
VAT on Independent schools, can't argue with that. Building extra council homes by borrowing against existing assets, seems a good idea. I've been running a business most of my adult life so the idea of Labour cutting business rates, i'll believe it when I see it. Labour hate small business/any business so it's highly unlikely to happen.
What's most noticeable about all of these things, they don't really clobber those with real wealth. Inheritance tax is only ever paid by those whose parents have one main vaulable asset, those with real wealth, multiple homes and shareholdings are able to pass off anything beyond that one main asset way before Inheritance tax kicks in.
The key to wealth distribution lays in taxing wealthy individuals total assets during life not death. When will someone on the Left grasp this?
Some interesting points and I wouldn't necessarily disagree. The key to reduce inequality is to firstly get a consensus on the fact that it is actually bad for the economy. Then we should concentrate on taxing unproductive capital rather than productive income. For that we need international cooperation, which is entirely opposite to the neo nationalism that has the political momentum currently throughout the developed world.
People that write, present and discuss politics have political views? Well stone me big nose! I thought they must all come from one of the many netural institutions in this country.
Next you'll be telling me that Jamie Carragher has a bias and affinity towards Liverpool when working for Sky.
We all know that people with opinions are presenting us the opinions. Much like the EU Ref, the vote will come down to history, romance and lack of understanding.
Bull shit baffles brains, taking our eyes and mind off the actual issues. Try not to be a sheep.
The system is far too complex to fully understand as a whole, especially for the entire population or the 65% ish that will take up their opportunity to vote.
[Post edited 25 Apr 2017 7:18]
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General Election? on 08:31 - Apr 25 with 2551 views
The 'party line' over grammar schools is by no means clear-cut. This is what happened when Thatcher was Education Secretary in the 1970s:
'Heath appointed that ultimate enthusiast for the grammar schools system, Margaret Thatcher, as Education Secretary. She duly announced a presumption against further shake-up and change. But what happened? Out of 3,612 proposals for comprehensives sent to Mrs Thatcher, she turned down just 326 and the proportion of children at comprehensives nearly doubled again, up from 32 per cent under Labour to 62 per cent under this thoroughly Conservative politician. As one of her biographers flatly pointed out, 'for all her strong prejudices against them . . . Margaret Thatcher approved more schemes for comprehensive schools, and the abolition of more grammar schools, than any other Secretary of State before or since.' Heath, who fought a tough campaign as Prime Minister to save his local grammar school in Bexley, blamed the desire of Tory-led authorities to save money by replacing boys-only and girls-only grammars with co-ed comprehensives.'
Andrew Marr, A History of Modern Britain (2009)
The Thatcher biography mentioned is Hugo Young's One of Us, (1989)
Thatcher was never known as the Grammarschoolsnatcher for some reason.
If you try to imagine what a modern education system should look like, portrayed as a football stadium, it might be something like this:
Whereas our system looks something like this (The Dell)
And all we're talking about is making one of those funny little boxes down the bottom a bit bigger or adding on 50p to the expensive seats.
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General Election? on 14:13 - Apr 25 with 2464 views
Aha, worth a try, there was a QPR Phil, he'd be about 63 / 64 if he's still around, lived with his Dad in a flat on aforementioned Llanover Rd Wembley back in the 60 / 70's. East Lane chap myself, had to think a bit about your original post after reading Kings Drive, then I recalled a cluster of small blocks surrounded by 'millionaires row' and Barn Hill up behind the town hall. Often drove up to the cut through street(?), to get out onto the Paddocks. Rambled my way around your way many a time as a nipper...on adventures.
Well I'm 67, so not far out with the age. We were on the council estate, next to the old style pre fabs, where Charlie Watts used to live, and he wasn't a bad footballer either.
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General Election? on 23:24 - Apr 26 with 2246 views
Drink every time you hear a Tory say "coalition of chaos".
Are you offering or is that an instruction to fellow posters.
Good job you didn't choose "strong and stable" or we'd be bladdered every day until June.
Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop
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General Election? on 19:46 - Apr 27 with 2021 views
Are you offering or is that an instruction to fellow posters.
Good job you didn't choose "strong and stable" or we'd be bladdered every day until June.
John Crace (also Redknapp's biographer) made much of this the other day:
'Strong and stable leadership. Every sentence began and ended with strong and stable leadership. That’s all the country needed. Other than a plan. "We need to have a plan," she confided. "And that’s why we have a plan." Though she wasn’t prepared to reveal what that plan was. Only that the plan was to have strong and stable leadership. With strong and stable leadership, Brexit, the economy and cuts to services would look after themselves. Because when you had strong and stable leadership it invariably turned out that your plan was the right one even when it was the wrong one. Just under 10 minutes after she had started, the Supreme Leader drew to a close.'
John Crace (also Redknapp's biographer) made much of this the other day:
'Strong and stable leadership. Every sentence began and ended with strong and stable leadership. That’s all the country needed. Other than a plan. "We need to have a plan," she confided. "And that’s why we have a plan." Though she wasn’t prepared to reveal what that plan was. Only that the plan was to have strong and stable leadership. With strong and stable leadership, Brexit, the economy and cuts to services would look after themselves. Because when you had strong and stable leadership it invariably turned out that your plan was the right one even when it was the wrong one. Just under 10 minutes after she had started, the Supreme Leader drew to a close.'
So I'm a right wing brexit supporter who thinks the Tories are doing a crap job with the NHS and education.... But....Corbyn is too left wing and not a leader, the liberals want us in the EU and UKIP are a joke. So not much of a choice.
So I'm a right wing brexit supporter who thinks the Tories are doing a crap job with the NHS and education.... But....Corbyn is too left wing and not a leader, the liberals want us in the EU and UKIP are a joke. So not much of a choice.
Interesting post Gloucs, genuinely feel for the every day Tory with such a poor choice. I think it's worth looking at the policies, Labours blow the Tories away which makes the calling of the election such a high risk game for May. Cameron thought Brexit was a stroll in the park.
All I'd say on Corbyn, is voting for personalities is for reality games on tv, or strictly, this is about the survival of the NHS as it's known, higher taxation and the end of state pensions which we've all pre-paid through NI and tax.
May has no commitment at all to anything she says as we've seen as an EU inner pre Brexit and tax on the small business people, to the 2020 election. She has no credibility and frighteningly no plan. Just sound bites and a profound lack of integrity required for a leader. And throws dinners in No 10 for Paul Dacra. A vote for her is basically a vote for getting fisted with a broken bottle.
Whatever Corbyn is or is not, his policies serve the best interests of most in the country and the recovery of the NHS through Corporate Taxes that go unpaid. There won't be an NHS under May in 5 years time. For good health or an operation you'll have to sell your house to afford it. It's been coming for 30 years and won't survive another Tory Gov, especially under May.
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General Election? on 22:37 - Apr 27 with 1902 views
General Election? on 22:25 - Apr 27 by Brightonhoop
Interesting post Gloucs, genuinely feel for the every day Tory with such a poor choice. I think it's worth looking at the policies, Labours blow the Tories away which makes the calling of the election such a high risk game for May. Cameron thought Brexit was a stroll in the park.
All I'd say on Corbyn, is voting for personalities is for reality games on tv, or strictly, this is about the survival of the NHS as it's known, higher taxation and the end of state pensions which we've all pre-paid through NI and tax.
May has no commitment at all to anything she says as we've seen as an EU inner pre Brexit and tax on the small business people, to the 2020 election. She has no credibility and frighteningly no plan. Just sound bites and a profound lack of integrity required for a leader. And throws dinners in No 10 for Paul Dacra. A vote for her is basically a vote for getting fisted with a broken bottle.
Whatever Corbyn is or is not, his policies serve the best interests of most in the country and the recovery of the NHS through Corporate Taxes that go unpaid. There won't be an NHS under May in 5 years time. For good health or an operation you'll have to sell your house to afford it. It's been coming for 30 years and won't survive another Tory Gov, especially under May.
Bang on
Just been watching BBC news and even they say that all the tories are doing is personal attacks on JC, he is talking polices and the tories only talk about Brexit and JC
I'm Labour and also wanted to come out of the EU but no way should this GE just be about Brexit or personal attacking the opposition and that's all the tories are about.
They keep saying JC is weak but look at all the crap that has been thrown at him in the last 2 years and he has stood up to it all, a man of principles and honor can you say the same for May.
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