| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? 09:15 - May 3 with 2092 views | sevenhoop |
I am genuinely thrilled for Leicester at this astonishing achievement. I never thought I would see the like again, now that football has (or had) become a closed shop.
for some reason I woke up wistfully thinking about 1976, our trip to Norwich, 3 wins and we win the title and those bastards took great pride in denying us. I have hated them ever since and we always seem to perform awfully up there.
Also have disliked Jimmy Armfield since then (on BBC radio, probably Radio 2) - he gave us no credit for what we were achieving and wanted Liverpool to win, thought they deserved to win, even though their resources were a million times more than ours. |  | | |  |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 11:02 - May 3 with 2033 views | DWQPR |
Liverpool didn't deserve to win that title, it was all put in their favour by the FA agreeing to delay their final game as they were competing in the UEFA Cup Final (which happened to be a two leg affair then). Their game against Wolves meant that they knew exactly what they needed to do and equally Wolves by then also knew that whatever the result they were already relegated. Even today with such bias towards the bigger clubs the FA would never ever dream of staggering the final games of the season, especially one which would effect both the top and bottom of the league. An absolutely shocking decision and one which in effect handed Liverpool the title. Had Rangers been champions we would have competed in the European Cup that season and at that time it was universally acknowledged that this was an easier competition to win that the UEFA cup as there was one less round, and generally that seasons champions around Europe invariably were competing in the UEFA Cup, as clubs rarely won their respective leagues year in year out. Not saying we would have won the European Cup as Liverpool did, but given our excellent showing in the UEFA Cup that following season I reckon we would have come close.
Have also despised Norwich since that fateful day in April 1976, was there that day a week before my tenth birthday and will never forget the p1ss taking by Norwich supporters as they listened to the radio and heard Liverpool giving Stoke a good pasting. |  |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 11:40 - May 3 with 1991 views | CamberleyR |
The UEFA cup final 2nd leg and 1st leg were three weeks apart as well. Liverpool could have quite easily played their final match on the 24th, then the first leg of the UEFA cup the following Wednesday which wouldn't have been unusual to them playing Saturday-Wednesday when playing European football. But no, the good old football league who were notorious back then for not helping the England team out with fixture postponements, gave them a nice nine day break between their penultimate league game and the UEFA 1st leg, then another nice six day gap between that and playing Wolves. Bastards.
Wolves' fate by the way wasn't quite sealed by the time they played Liverpool. They could have still stayed up had they beaten Liverpool that night and Birmingham who were also playing the same night and who were fourth bottom didn't manage to get a point at home which they did. |  |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 13:31 - May 3 with 1941 views | sevenhoop |
I'd forgotten all that detail chaps - makes me feel even worse! | | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 19:01 - May 3 with 1849 views | terryb |
A few things on this.
1) I have always been under the impression that the Liverpool game was not played on the same day as us due to a Wales international game taking place. Toshack & Jones (at the very least) would have been missing. I think Leeds also tried to have our game postponed but failed as they were only mising Yorath.
2) It was quite common in those days that the final matches were not all on the same day. Didn't derby win both of their championships after they had finished their season?
Certainly in '72 they won in while on a club trip abroad. On the same night as the Frank Sibley testimonial against City, Leeds lost at Wolves when a point would have made double winners. With Leeds losing, Liverpool would have been champions if they had won at Arsenal (0-0).
3) I blame Manchester City more than Norwich. On the Easter Monday, City allowed Liverpool to roll all over them & the uncontested (3-0?) win at Maine Road changed all the dynamics of the goal average. This was not the first time that matches between those two clubs had an air of pre-arrangement about them.
4) Wembley stadium had offered to host a possible play off to determine the Champions. Until the Liverpool win at City it was more than possible that that all criteria could have ended level. | | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 09:19 - May 4 with 1671 views | francisbowles |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 19:01 - May 3 by terryb |
A few things on this.
1) I have always been under the impression that the Liverpool game was not played on the same day as us due to a Wales international game taking place. Toshack & Jones (at the very least) would have been missing. I think Leeds also tried to have our game postponed but failed as they were only mising Yorath.
2) It was quite common in those days that the final matches were not all on the same day. Didn't derby win both of their championships after they had finished their season?
Certainly in '72 they won in while on a club trip abroad. On the same night as the Frank Sibley testimonial against City, Leeds lost at Wolves when a point would have made double winners. With Leeds losing, Liverpool would have been champions if they had won at Arsenal (0-0).
3) I blame Manchester City more than Norwich. On the Easter Monday, City allowed Liverpool to roll all over them & the uncontested (3-0?) win at Maine Road changed all the dynamics of the goal average. This was not the first time that matches between those two clubs had an air of pre-arrangement about them.
4) Wembley stadium had offered to host a possible play off to determine the Champions. Until the Liverpool win at City it was more than possible that that all criteria could have ended level. |
Great memory with the details, Terryb.
fwiw, one more nugget, IF that Wolves v Livrrpool match had ended 0-0, 1-1, or 2-2 then the title went up north but if it had ended 3-3 or higher then we would have won the League.
Goal average in those days. You divided goals against by goals scored, or was it the other way 'round? | | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 09:35 - May 4 with 1662 views | ElHoop |
Wolves were actually ahead in that game against Liverpool. It was our fault for losing at Norwich - Liverpool managed a 1-0 win there at a similar stage of the season. |  | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 09:44 - May 4 with 1647 views | francisbowles |
We also drew 0-0 away at Sheff Utd who were bottom of the league. Any mathematicians want to permutate how the goal average might have changed if we had won 1-0 or 2-0 there? | | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 09:47 - May 4 with 1643 views | enfieldargh |
we also failed to beat a piss poor West Ham home or away and a 0-0 at bottom of the table Sheff Utd didn't help.
Yes I hate Norwich to this day as that defeat came in the final part of our great run in but still feel failure to beat rock bottom Sheffield United was more harmful than mid table Norwich
for those younger readers on here, Chelsea were in the division below and didn't gain promotion for a further two more seasons whilst Leicester finished 7th! |  |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 10:14 - May 4 with 1626 views | CamberleyR |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 19:01 - May 3 by terryb |
A few things on this.
1) I have always been under the impression that the Liverpool game was not played on the same day as us due to a Wales international game taking place. Toshack & Jones (at the very least) would have been missing. I think Leeds also tried to have our game postponed but failed as they were only mising Yorath.
2) It was quite common in those days that the final matches were not all on the same day. Didn't derby win both of their championships after they had finished their season?
Certainly in '72 they won in while on a club trip abroad. On the same night as the Frank Sibley testimonial against City, Leeds lost at Wolves when a point would have made double winners. With Leeds losing, Liverpool would have been champions if they had won at Arsenal (0-0).
3) I blame Manchester City more than Norwich. On the Easter Monday, City allowed Liverpool to roll all over them & the uncontested (3-0?) win at Maine Road changed all the dynamics of the goal average. This was not the first time that matches between those two clubs had an air of pre-arrangement about them.
4) Wembley stadium had offered to host a possible play off to determine the Champions. Until the Liverpool win at City it was more than possible that that all criteria could have ended level. |
You are spot on with that Terry. I had completely forgotten that the 1976 European Championships quarter finals 1st leg games were taking place on Saturday the 24th April with Wales playing Yugoslavia in Belgrade that weekend.
I checked the teams and only Toshack started that game although as you said Joey Jones was probably in the squad too. Seems strange to cancel a fixture though with only two players called up although Toshack was an important player for Liverpool.
It seems we were the victims of the circumstances of the time. If we wind forward 40 years, we no longer have a Euro Championships tournament that has qualifiers, quarter finals that take place towards the end of the season and a four team finals tournament. Even if an important game like those QFs were played today the top two divisions fixtures would all be cancelled as is the norm now and our final game against Leeds would have taken place the same time as Liverpool's as is the case with all the league's final fixtures nowadays. | |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 10:33 - May 4 with 1612 views | BrianMcCarthy |
Thanks for all the info, folks. Very interesting, and most of it new to me. |  |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 10:36 - May 4 with 1612 views | CamberleyR |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 09:19 - May 4 by francisbowles |
Great memory with the details, Terryb.
fwiw, one more nugget, IF that Wolves v Livrrpool match had ended 0-0, 1-1, or 2-2 then the title went up north but if it had ended 3-3 or higher then we would have won the League.
Goal average in those days. You divided goals against by goals scored, or was it the other way 'round? |
Wiki says that goal difference was adopted by FIFA at the 1970 World Cup and the football league adopted it 5 years later which would make the 75/76 season the first season it was used. Wiki obviously not the most reliable source though.
Just for comparison, Liverpool's final goal average (goals scored divided by goals conceded) was 2.1290 (66F 31A), ours was 2.0303 (67F 33A). If GA still was being used then we would have had to beat Sheff Utd 4-0 to win the title on GA. This was one reason why goal difference was introduced as goal average seemed to favour teams that didn't concede many but also didn't score a great deal either. | |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 10:45 - May 4 with 1604 views | francisbowles |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 10:36 - May 4 by CamberleyR |
Wiki says that goal difference was adopted by FIFA at the 1970 World Cup and the football league adopted it 5 years later which would make the 75/76 season the first season it was used. Wiki obviously not the most reliable source though.
Just for comparison, Liverpool's final goal average (goals scored divided by goals conceded) was 2.1290 (66F 31A), ours was 2.0303 (67F 33A). If GA still was being used then we would have had to beat Sheff Utd 4-0 to win the title on GA. This was one reason why goal difference was introduced as goal average seemed to favour teams that didn't concede many but also didn't score a great deal either. |
Thanks Camberley, we still should have done that though!
Wiki wrong on one point though, it was definitely still goal average that season but I do have a vague recollection that it may have been the last one before the change. Apart from anything else, goal difference has to be simpler as you don't need a calculator or log tables to work it out. | | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 11:49 - May 4 with 1574 views | terryb |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 10:36 - May 4 by CamberleyR |
Wiki says that goal difference was adopted by FIFA at the 1970 World Cup and the football league adopted it 5 years later which would make the 75/76 season the first season it was used. Wiki obviously not the most reliable source though.
Just for comparison, Liverpool's final goal average (goals scored divided by goals conceded) was 2.1290 (66F 31A), ours was 2.0303 (67F 33A). If GA still was being used then we would have had to beat Sheff Utd 4-0 to win the title on GA. This was one reason why goal difference was introduced as goal average seemed to favour teams that didn't concede many but also didn't score a great deal either. |
Thanks for that Camberley. It was definitely average that counted that season.
Without working it out, my memory (never reliable for recent times) tells me that if we had lost 1-0 at Norwich, any score draw at Wolves - Liverpool would have had us as champions!
Like others, I believe the draw at (to be relegated) Sheffield United was the critical result. Mind you, 13wins, 1 draw & 1 defeat from the last 15 games was quite a good record!
To those that blamed Wolves for not beating Liverpool (there are some), they should remember that Wolves were also relegated that season. They had to win that night & hope Birmingham(?) didn't to stay up. As Birtmingham won the result at Wolves mattered not to them.*
It was the norm in those days for league fixtures to be played on the same day as internationals & that you could postpone the league game if you were misssing two players. IF England had qualified for the quarter finals we wouldn't have played that Saturday either!
* Camberley. Just seen that you referred to the Birmingham match! Sorry for the duplication! [Post edited 4 May 2016 11:52]
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 12:12 - May 4 with 1546 views | qprxtc |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 09:47 - May 4 by enfieldargh |
we also failed to beat a piss poor West Ham home or away and a 0-0 at bottom of the table Sheff Utd didn't help.
Yes I hate Norwich to this day as that defeat came in the final part of our great run in but still feel failure to beat rock bottom Sheffield United was more harmful than mid table Norwich
for those younger readers on here, Chelsea were in the division below and didn't gain promotion for a further two more seasons whilst Leicester finished 7th! |
The way the fixtures were first released that season we were due to play West Ham away on Monday 26 April. It would have been our last game of the season.
Rangers decided to bring it forward after both teams were knocked out at the 3rd round of the FA Cup. The thinking was that we could grab a couple of points while our rivals were in cup action.
We lost.
If we had kept the fixture as originally planned we could have afforded one slip up on the run in and still become Champions at Upton Park.
If's and and's.... |  | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 12:28 - May 4 with 1529 views | CamberleyR |
I've just realised, today is the 40th anniversary of 'that' bloody Wolves/Liverpool game.
The only time I've ever cried over QPR. I was only 11 though.....
@qprxtc: Is that correct about the last day fixtures being first released to finish on Monday 26th? Seems odd to not finish on a Saturday seeing as the 26th wasn't even a bank holiday as that had been the previous week with Easter Monday being on the 19th. | |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 12:54 - May 4 with 1500 views | qprxtc |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 12:28 - May 4 by CamberleyR |
I've just realised, today is the 40th anniversary of 'that' bloody Wolves/Liverpool game.
The only time I've ever cried over QPR. I was only 11 though.....
@qprxtc: Is that correct about the last day fixtures being first released to finish on Monday 26th? Seems odd to not finish on a Saturday seeing as the 26th wasn't even a bank holiday as that had been the previous week with Easter Monday being on the 19th. |
It is a weird one but it's listed in the Rangers programme all season up to the week after we got knocked out of the cup.
Ian Gillard also mentions it in his interview in the Loftus Road Legends book.
As far as I know, no other teams were due to play that night. All I can think that happened was that it was due to have been played on Good Friday> Back then they usually played three times over Easter but a lot of clubs decided to move the Good Friday game to ease the congestion. | | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 13:37 - May 4 with 1461 views | enfieldargh |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 12:28 - May 4 by CamberleyR |
I've just realised, today is the 40th anniversary of 'that' bloody Wolves/Liverpool game.
The only time I've ever cried over QPR. I was only 11 though.....
@qprxtc: Is that correct about the last day fixtures being first released to finish on Monday 26th? Seems odd to not finish on a Saturday seeing as the 26th wasn't even a bank holiday as that had been the previous week with Easter Monday being on the 19th. |
I took a girl out for a Chinese in Bushey high Street that night.
I had to keep popping out the car to listen to the commentary on my car radio.
Wolves were winning 1-0 with about 10 mins to go....David Fairclough...
Cant remember what the girl was like but would have had sweet and sour chicken, egg rice and spare ribs, some things never change
Never saw her again...funny that | |
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| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 14:25 - May 4 with 1419 views | eccles |
I have a few irational hatreds in football. Norwich come second only to the scum. I can still taste the disapointmane as the result from carrow road came through on the radio. Hated them ever since.
I was 11 at the time. I got over it fairly quickly though because I thought this was what supporting our lot would be like every year. I thought we'd win it next year, or the year after. Boy, was I in for a shock!
Made me think though, How many 50 year old Leicester fans will there be in 40 years time wondering back to when they were good where has all the time gone? |  | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 15:24 - May 4 with 1400 views | Tearsofrage |
The Norwich thing goes deeper and nastier. Following our rightful championship win under Warnock in 2011, I had a New Year up in Norwich - quite like the place for beer and the festivities. Draped over several pubs were the professionally produced banners "Norwich Championship Winners 2010-2011". Thus perpetuating the lie that in a season when Taraabt was unplayable and we were practically unbeatable, our League winning status was the result of a Faurlin fiddle and Naarch were the true champions. Blood still boils! |  | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 16:17 - May 4 with 1361 views | terryb |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 15:24 - May 4 by Tearsofrage |
The Norwich thing goes deeper and nastier. Following our rightful championship win under Warnock in 2011, I had a New Year up in Norwich - quite like the place for beer and the festivities. Draped over several pubs were the professionally produced banners "Norwich Championship Winners 2010-2011". Thus perpetuating the lie that in a season when Taraabt was unplayable and we were practically unbeatable, our League winning status was the result of a Faurlin fiddle and Naarch were the true champions. Blood still boils! |
It's quite a funny thing, but we do seem to have a bit of a hate relationship with both East Anglian clubs!
They both certainly dislike us & living in Ipswich, I feel that way to both of them!
Before out last game last season, I was at the C&S with a Norfolk based Rangers man. It was quite funny how he wanted Ipswich to win the play off match, while I wanted Norwich to win! | | | |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 22:31 - May 4 with 1301 views | CiderwithRsie |
| fantastic for Leicester, am i allowed time to reflect on my dislike of Norwich? on 10:36 - May 4 by CamberleyR |
Wiki says that goal difference was adopted by FIFA at the 1970 World Cup and the football league adopted it 5 years later which would make the 75/76 season the first season it was used. Wiki obviously not the most reliable source though.
Just for comparison, Liverpool's final goal average (goals scored divided by goals conceded) was 2.1290 (66F 31A), ours was 2.0303 (67F 33A). If GA still was being used then we would have had to beat Sheff Utd 4-0 to win the title on GA. This was one reason why goal difference was introduced as goal average seemed to favour teams that didn't concede many but also didn't score a great deal either. |
"Wiki obviously not the most reliable source though."
Too right.
I happened to be looking up Bob Paisley's wikipedia entry last night and was left spitting feathers at the statement that he faced challenges from various clubs in various years, including Tommy Docherty's Manchester United in 1975-6. Nomination of us whatsoever.
All the more reason to hope neither bloody club gets into Europe this season. | | | |
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