| The voice of Doom or just realistic? 10:38 - Feb 8 with 7097 views | RangersDave |
You know, the more i watch Rangers, our players, and performances over this season, the more i have come to the conclusion......... we aint good enough to go up.
Let me elaborate. At this time, i believe that going up this season will be a hiding session each week unless we invest in a few players and change our style of play.
The 'attractive' pass it around in neat triangles and push wont cut it in the prem, as they will close us down and regain possesion so fast you would think they were devils in disguise. Our style of play is all very 'good' in the Championship, but lordy, in the Prem where 1 player can cost almost 4 times our entire team.
Now here's the rub. Yes going up will help us financially, and dropping back down the same season will give us a parachure payment or 3 helping no end. But whats the point? Do we want to be whipping boys next season, or a bigger threat in the EFL next?
Remember that a step up is a step up in recruitment, wages, ground safety etc, and i'm not sure we are ready for it........yet.
I say yet, as i feel that we have some way to go in consistent performance, and fall flat against teams like Peterborough, when we should be winning these at a canter.
Winning is infectious and improves everything, so to lose a cup match only to find we could have gotten a nice earner the next round is galling in this respect. It would also given us some idea on whether Rangers can perform or roll over. I suspect the latter.
After all, unless we spend (and i dont mean daftly with big bucks here), then its quite doubtful we wont survive the 'heady' heights each week...... been there , done that, same ending!
But quite rightly the purse strings will be kept tight, and there we have the conundrum, faced by all teams that go up. Speculate to accumulate. Trouble is you cannot accumulate a Saudi Princes play money that easily.
I have to say, i have loved this season, but i have hated the 'cup runs' as i see no value in losing or putting out a second string team (or a few second string players) who dont know how the rest of the team operate week in ,week out.
I think we shouldnt get our hopes up too much, and just enjoy each week as it comes, and see where we are at seasons end. If we go up? well, as stated above, we will probably come straight down, however if we stay here as uber competitive in the championship, and build for 2-3 more years then see if we can make that leap under MW.
The problem though, is staying where we are. players will come, players will go (especially if we do well each season) and maybe we will stagnate.
A plodding , pondering post, and i hope you guys can understand my fears, in my ramblings, and i'd love to hear your thoughts...... promotion? staying a large fish in this pond?
Best
Dave |  |
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| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:06 - Feb 8 with 4058 views | kernowhoop |
Interesting thoughts, Dave. Bearing in mind that the cllub is run so much better these days, I would think that the Board, Lee Hoos, Les Ferdinand and Mark Warburton have given at least some thought to how we would deal with life in the Premier League if it happens. Somewhere at the club there will be a plan, however sketchy, to address this.
My other thought is 'How could we stop ourselves going up, assuming we wanted to?  |  | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:13 - Feb 8 with 4017 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Expensive players don't mean good players. See Burnley, Southampton, Leeds, Brentford, Watford, Brighton, Wolves.
Granted, Burnley are bottom, but what a ride they've had and will be favourites next year for promotion for sure.
All those seeing great stints in the top league just by the virtue of not being big spenders like Newcastle or Everton.
I'd rather see the premiership windfall spent on facilities than expensive cat kicking no marks even if it means guaranteed relegation. It's about long term planning not survival at all costs.
Chin up, and like you say, take each match as it comes. What else are you gonna do? Support Chelsea? nah. [Post edited 8 Feb 2022 11:14]
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| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:15 - Feb 8 with 3994 views | daveB |
I'm just enjoying the ride, whether we are good enough or ready to go up doesn't really matter at the moment. If we manage to get promoted we'll need improvements to be made next season but the money from promotion could transform this club if used properly this time.
There is no guarantee that we'll be top 6 again next season if we don't go up and this league is no fun when your 16th as we have found for the previous 5/6 seasons so I hope we grab this opportunity and worry about next season in the summer. |  | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:23 - Feb 8 with 3937 views | PinnerPaul |
Excellent OP.
Think I'm with the 2nd Dave on this one though! | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:23 - Feb 8 with 3938 views | superstan |
I don’t think we have been playing that well this season but we are managing to nick games 2-1 which could have easily gone the other way, hopefully our best is yet to come, pessimistic I think we will make the playoffs but will fall short, optimistic we could, with belief and luck make the top 2, but will really struggle in the Premiership again, but as long we turn over that SW team all will be good. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:24 - Feb 8 with 3937 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:23 - Feb 8 by superstan |
I don’t think we have been playing that well this season but we are managing to nick games 2-1 which could have easily gone the other way, hopefully our best is yet to come, pessimistic I think we will make the playoffs but will fall short, optimistic we could, with belief and luck make the top 2, but will really struggle in the Premiership again, but as long we turn over that SW team all will be good. |
We’ve not been playing well, but better than the other 22 clubs. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:25 - Feb 8 with 3933 views | dmm |
Your main thoughts are shared by many. Do we want to go up to come straight back down, as I think most of us would expect, or stay in the Championship?
The board, staff and players will all want to go up, of course. That's what they're in football for. However, many supporters have mixed feelings as I do. I see pros and cons in both scenarios, though it's clearly more fun for us in the Championship.
Could we become the classic yoyo side and build a side capable of competing in the top division through several promotions and relegations? Possibly, but it's not guaranteed.
We have a far better run club than last time we faced the prospect of promotion and can, at least, reasonably hope for a better outcome wherever we play our football next season. |  | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:26 - Feb 8 with 3922 views | dannyblue |
I much prefer competing with good football in the championship to getting relegated or even surviving in the premier league.
Having said that promotion would be tremendous for the club. It would allow us to put more power (cash and attractiveness to players) into that recruitment system that has done so well of late. The money would secure our future for the next decade. And it would valdate our long term plan and be rewards for the executors of it.
If we went up our squad building should be entirely based on something that would be sustainable (as much as anything is) in the championship. One year of seeing us get thrashed in the prem, should see us, if managed correctly, get many years of good competitive football. The only risk is suddenly thinking we are a premier league club, over extending, taking the losing to heart, and ending up with that lingering malaise. Being clear about realistic ambitions at the start helps prevent that even if it doesn't guarantee it. |  | | |
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| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:31 - Feb 8 with 3886 views | loftboy |
One season in the PL without spending too much can go a long way to clearing our debts to our owners, surely they are going to want their money back at some point? |  |
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| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:32 - Feb 8 with 3879 views | switchingcode |
If you go up be it through play offs or directly you have been good enough the next bit is the difficult one.We where good enough to get promoted last season but not sure we are good enough and definately not rich enough to stay up.Some fans say just one season in the PL will do but travelling all over the country watching your team getting smashed is no fun and there is little comfort at the time in the fact you have got all this TV money coming into your club.
There is every chance that the three clubs who came up last season could be relegated although Burnley are in the mix Newcastle have just spent over 100 mill to help them swerve this.Previous seasons have seen Fulham spend a fortune and still fail Villa 120 mill and missed relegation by a point.My thoughts are go up get the money keep hold of your decent championship players spend minimal amount on transfers more than likely you will be back in the championship the following season with a stronger squad in a great league and a good bank balance. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:33 - Feb 8 with 3880 views | saxbend |
Completely agree. We could get promoted this season. We have the potential to do it, no question. But that's not the same as being able to follow through and stay up if we do. We'd end up signing 10 more players in order to be competitive, destroy the spirit in the squad we've built over the last two and a half years, and then come back down, have to sell those additional signings and build up everything we currently love about our squad all over again. And only if we're very lucky would we still have the same manager even.
No thank you. Let's take another season or two, however long we need until we go up with a squad that only needs another 5-6 signings to have a chance at a lower mid table finish. Yes we'll have to sell some of our assets while we work towards that, but as long as we sell at the right price, and only one or two per window we'll be able to reinvest and improve the squad so that it is better than it had been with the players sold. We do an Eze with each asset and we build and build window after window. Then when we're ready we win the Championship comfortably and go up feeling really good about our prospects. Patience is what we need. It's not as if being in the Premier League is especially enjoyable from a fan's point of view anyway, so why rush? |  | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:38 - Feb 8 with 3846 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Can you imagine being Lee Hoos or Les Ferdinand reading this?
I’m no fan of the Premiership but you grab it with both hands when it comes. Madness! | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:46 - Feb 8 with 3812 views | saxbend |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:38 - Feb 8 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Can you imagine being Lee Hoos or Les Ferdinand reading this?
I’m no fan of the Premiership but you grab it with both hands when it comes. Madness! |
Well yes, you do. Even if for no other reason than the integrity of the game and the entertainment of the fans we should and will try to win each game, finish as high in the table as we can and attempt to win the playoffs if we are in them. However, I will be dreading what happens the following season if we do. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:52 - Feb 8 with 3784 views | Rangersw12 |
Just enjoy the ride we've been poor for so long that you should be looking at this season as a massive positive regardless what happens
As for not consistent we've only lost 7 all season and unbeaten in the league this year | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:52 - Feb 8 with 3784 views | superhoopdownunder |
My fear is if we get promoted and things don't go well Warburton will be sacked which would be extremely unfair and lessons most certainly won't have been learnt.
I hope we are more sensible - the signs have been good - but this is the Championship not the Premier League where the news cycle is non stop and pressure (at least externally is much greater). | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:55 - Feb 8 with 3758 views | Superhoop83 |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:46 - Feb 8 by saxbend |
Well yes, you do. Even if for no other reason than the integrity of the game and the entertainment of the fans we should and will try to win each game, finish as high in the table as we can and attempt to win the playoffs if we are in them. However, I will be dreading what happens the following season if we do. |
1. There is no way this team is good enough to stay up if it gets promoted. However, there will be a chance to recruit, sensibly, if it happens and it might give us a fighting chance.
2. We have to make the most of this opportunity. It may not come around again any time soon, even though we are on a much better footing all round.
3. If we do get promoted, I will dread certain matches but even a year in the Premier League with some drubbings could do so much good for the club financially as long as we don't repeat the massive mistakes of 2011, 2012 and 2014. |  |
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| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:08 - Feb 8 with 3695 views | switchingcode |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 11:55 - Feb 8 by Superhoop83 |
1. There is no way this team is good enough to stay up if it gets promoted. However, there will be a chance to recruit, sensibly, if it happens and it might give us a fighting chance.
2. We have to make the most of this opportunity. It may not come around again any time soon, even though we are on a much better footing all round.
3. If we do get promoted, I will dread certain matches but even a year in the Premier League with some drubbings could do so much good for the club financially as long as we don't repeat the massive mistakes of 2011, 2012 and 2014. |
In answer to your third point I’m off to the Etihad tomorrow night so know what you mean | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:10 - Feb 8 with 3683 views | NW5Hoop |
I imagine we'd come straight back down. Can't believe Les and Hoos would suddenly throw money at new signings. Would imagine they see the chance for us to be a yoyo club until we've accumulated enough reserves to make a real push at staying up. Remember, Brentford have only just gone up and they had years of good buying and selling beforehand. We've had two years of good buying and sellng. From an entertainment point of view, I'd like to stay down. From a long term security point of view, I suspect we need to go up. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:13 - Feb 8 with 3669 views | ParkRoyalR |
Great post, I believe we are only short a pacy forward (no doubt why MW signed Bonne and drafted in Gray who unfortunately is not as quick as he was) and / or an injury to Willock would derail our push for top 6 as last number of games have shown his extra quality (similar to Eze) is the difference between top 6 and top 10.
I'll be delighted if we are in Top 6 contention come the last game of the season, and win or lose, confident MW will further improve the squad for next season. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:21 - Feb 8 with 3632 views | charmr |
I certainly don’t wish to bear witness and see Rangers in a position where a potential managerial candidate for our next manager is either Frank fing Lampard or Wayne fing Rooney. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:24 - Feb 8 with 3621 views | robith |
I say - go up, take the money, win the hearts and minds with our cavalier attitude.
Moreover, I'm just enjoying the season. I've really enjoyed having Warburton, the sense of progress year on year, shining up some moneyball guys, youth players in the first team and going to games where something other than oblivion is riding on it with a team full of guts and no little talent. It's just nice mattering all told |  | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:28 - Feb 8 with 3588 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:21 - Feb 8 by charmr |
I certainly don’t wish to bear witness and see Rangers in a position where a potential managerial candidate for our next manager is either Frank fing Lampard or Wayne fing Rooney. |
They would be mad to sack MW IMO. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:28 - Feb 8 with 3589 views | Stainrod |
This team only cost 9.5m in transfer fees. Not sure it has a god given right to win away, even at Peterborough.
Clearly we are nowhere near good enough to survive in the Premier League. But we still have to go for it as the money would be transformative - if we don't spaff milions on players it would go a long way to building a new stadium.
Its not all about the fans in the short terms. If we go up we just have to accept for the most part it will be a thoroughly miserable year - tho hopefully laced with the odd wonder moment, such as our 3-2 win over Liverpool with that last minute winner, or the away win at Chelsea.
Why should the owners continue to lose a million and a half a month simply because we don't want to see the team tanked 7-0 at the Etiiadh?
Personally hope if we did go up we would buy a couple of young fullbacks and a striker perhaps from the Championship or the reserve team of a Premier League club but on reasonable money with a relegation clause. Assuming we go down we sell some players at a profit and with the parachute payments we build again while putting most of it towards a new ground.
Am not sure waiting endlessly in the Championship we are necessarily going to get stronger year after year - the Eze money for example (it will be paid over several years) would not even have paid for the club's running costs last season. So selling Willock or Chair isn't going to provide some Great War chest to re-invest in players. Hoos has been very open that his brief is to make the club self-sustaining. | | | |
| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:36 - Feb 8 with 3553 views | Northernr |
Enjoyed the post Dave, agreed with some, not all.
It seems to me your problem, like mine, isn’t with Rangers it’s with modern football - though, like you, our attitude to cups annoys me too.
I guess you could just say LEICESTER but I think the days of Leeds getting promoted and then winning the whole thing, Ipswich/Reading going up and finishing fifth, are dead. I actually thought Brentford might go and rattle a few but they’re now descending down the league on a run of sadly typical heavy defeats. I suppose Brighton would be our ideal model?
For clubs like ours now the extent of our potential is basically get a promotion (and with some of the Champ budgets and parachutes that’s hard enough) and then finish 17th or above each season. Even to do that now it’s generally accepted that the most effective way is to bounce back and forth a few times collecting money. Once you’re there and consolidated it seems that the goal is get to 45 points and get to Mykonos, and that’s it. Get out of the cups early in case you get too many fixtures for your £100m squad to cope with.
It’s bleak. Really bleak. Horrible sport dominated by greed and money, played by horrible rich cnts, increasingly for a foreign tv audience, with British fans, and particularly match going fans, less and less of a concern.
So what I’m looking for these days is…
- match day with mates, pubs, trains. I really missed it in lockdown.
- am I enjoying watching QPR? This team, yes.
- can I support how qpr are being run, the business decisions being made, the sort of ppl they’re employing. Now, again, yes.
- are we competitive? Yes.
- am I looking forward to the next game? Yes, can’t wait.
- do we have players who excite me? Yes
The rest of it is what it is, it’s just the direction football has gone, away from clubs like ours, and people like you and me.
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| The voice of Doom or just realistic? on 12:37 - Feb 8 with 3540 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
They say a season in the Premiership is worth £200m.
That's the training ground and stadium paid for in two seasons. | | | |
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