| Hillsborough 18:21 - Apr 26 with 13213 views | electricblue |
Hillsborough verdict of unlawful killing is what families and friends have waited 25 yrs for...
The finger now points at the police but after just watching a report about the verdict and interviews the finger of blame also points at the FA....
Hillsborough was unfit to hold such a high profile game at the time so why did the FA deem it ok to hold such a game!....
So i my eyes dont just point the finger at the Police point it at the FA aswell...... |  |
| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| Hillsborough on 18:31 - Apr 28 with 1365 views | 442Dale |
| Hillsborough on 10:24 - Apr 28 by mingthemerciless |
Regarding the corruption. Many years ago, before the all seating stadiums I was drinking in my local on Cup Final evening. A guy came in about 10.00 who'd just been to the game ( it could have been the Utd v Southampton game in the 1970's ).
We were chatting about the game.
I said " How did you get a ticket ? " . He said " The same way I always do, in fact I've got a ticket for next years final ! "
I said " You can't have " .
He said " I have, have a look " . With that he showed me a £10 note ( probably worth about £50 or so now ).
He then said. " I just walk up to a certain turnstile, put that down and the guy lets me through ". [Post edited 28 Apr 2016 10:26]
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Sounds a lot like an admin fee... |  |
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| Hillsborough on 18:32 - Apr 28 with 1363 views | pioneer |
| Hillsborough on 16:23 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
Yep, it was all Thatcher's fault. Where've we heard that before? Police corruption was pretty evident for decades before she became prime minister.
Any excuse for Thatcher-bashing. Carry on. |
I seem to recall you often accusing other posters of misrepresenting what you say.
Well where the hell do I say it was ALL Thatcher's fault. She promised, she didn't deliver and as a result all those families have had to live through all these years fighting for the truth (that the Thatcher appointed enquiry didn't address) at great emotional, financial and physical cost.
She isn't the first politician to fail; to deliver on a promise and she wont be the last, but in this case it was at great expense and personal suffering of those families. Something she seemed to be very good at. |  | | |
| Hillsborough on 18:34 - Apr 28 with 1346 views | D_Alien |
| Hillsborough on 18:32 - Apr 28 by pioneer |
I seem to recall you often accusing other posters of misrepresenting what you say.
Well where the hell do I say it was ALL Thatcher's fault. She promised, she didn't deliver and as a result all those families have had to live through all these years fighting for the truth (that the Thatcher appointed enquiry didn't address) at great emotional, financial and physical cost.
She isn't the first politician to fail; to deliver on a promise and she wont be the last, but in this case it was at great expense and personal suffering of those families. Something she seemed to be very good at. |
Once instigated, Thatcher had absolutely no control over the methods or the outcome of the inquiry - nor should a politician ever have the means to do so.
Only yours, and others, blind hatred of Thatcher prevents you from seeing that, and leads you all to make specious arguments in that direction. |  |
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| Hillsborough on 18:39 - Apr 28 with 1317 views | CamdenDale |
| Hillsborough on 18:26 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
Cool.
I'd rather be a tit than a socialist. |
So you shall be - tit.
I mean, you earned it. Think your fellow man along to a game has a suicide fixation... then pin and reinforce your shitty views after that on a 'my dad got on his bike' stoopidity and these monkeys just deserved to die.
I give you grand tit. Better, moron. |  | | |
| Hillsborough on 18:40 - Apr 28 with 1311 views | D_Alien |
| Hillsborough on 18:39 - Apr 28 by CamdenDale |
So you shall be - tit.
I mean, you earned it. Think your fellow man along to a game has a suicide fixation... then pin and reinforce your shitty views after that on a 'my dad got on his bike' stoopidity and these monkeys just deserved to die.
I give you grand tit. Better, moron. |
Come on, you're better than that CamdenDale. | |
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| Hillsborough on 18:51 - Apr 28 with 1278 views | CamdenDale |
| Hillsborough on 18:40 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
Come on, you're better than that CamdenDale. |
Game and candle. You've proved yourself a right rotter though, how you see individual and law. Well done, it takes a lot to expose oneself when one has so little. | | | |
| Hillsborough on 18:56 - Apr 28 with 1262 views | D_Alien |
| Hillsborough on 18:51 - Apr 28 by CamdenDale |
Game and candle. You've proved yourself a right rotter though, how you see individual and law. Well done, it takes a lot to expose oneself when one has so little. |
Whatever.
At least I don't post glorifying the aggressive behaviour by fans during the 70's & 80's that led to events such as Heysel. I'll dig the quote out if you wish? | |
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| Hillsborough on 19:08 - Apr 28 with 1229 views | pioneer |
| Hillsborough on 18:34 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
Once instigated, Thatcher had absolutely no control over the methods or the outcome of the inquiry - nor should a politician ever have the means to do so.
Only yours, and others, blind hatred of Thatcher prevents you from seeing that, and leads you all to make specious arguments in that direction. |
She didn't fulfill a promise - if she didn't have the means to fulfill it then she shouldn't have made it .
There are none so blind as those who do not see. | | | |
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| Hillsborough on 19:16 - Apr 28 with 1215 views | D_Alien |
| Hillsborough on 19:08 - Apr 28 by pioneer |
She didn't fulfill a promise - if she didn't have the means to fulfill it then she shouldn't have made it .
There are none so blind as those who do not see. |
She promised to instigate the inquiry with the intention of getting at all the facts.
The Taylor Report - though largely responsible for the much greater safety at football grounds we benefit from today - failed to get through the lies that the police put in front of it.
There you go, Thatcher's fault again. Just keep it coming. | |
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| Hillsborough on 19:19 - Apr 28 with 1198 views | CamdenDale |
| Hillsborough on 18:56 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
Whatever.
At least I don't post glorifying the aggressive behaviour by fans during the 70's & 80's that led to events such as Heysel. I'll dig the quote out if you wish? |
Dig 'em out and roll 'em around.
I didn't 'glorify', more your social comment really. If you wanna escalate that to what happened at H'boro as inevitable, then we're back where we started from. By the way 70s, nor 80s, has an apostrophe. The 70s or 80s what? | | | |
| Hillsborough on 19:32 - Apr 28 with 1158 views | D_Alien |
| Hillsborough on 19:19 - Apr 28 by CamdenDale |
Dig 'em out and roll 'em around.
I didn't 'glorify', more your social comment really. If you wanna escalate that to what happened at H'boro as inevitable, then we're back where we started from. By the way 70s, nor 80s, has an apostrophe. The 70s or 80s what? |
Where we started from (today) was trying to pin some kind of blame for the events at Hillsborough and subsequent cover up by SYPF on Thatcher.
I'll just take my seat on Saturday in the knowledge that the report she commissioned means I almost certainly won't have to witness the aggression of drunken fans trying to kick the shit out of each other, and anyone who got in their way, as witnessed week in week out during the 70's and 80's.
btw - "wanna" ? Wanna what?
[Post edited 28 Apr 2016 19:33]
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| Hillsborough on 19:48 - Apr 28 with 1111 views | CamdenDale |
| Hillsborough on 19:32 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
Where we started from (today) was trying to pin some kind of blame for the events at Hillsborough and subsequent cover up by SYPF on Thatcher.
I'll just take my seat on Saturday in the knowledge that the report she commissioned means I almost certainly won't have to witness the aggression of drunken fans trying to kick the shit out of each other, and anyone who got in their way, as witnessed week in week out during the 70's and 80's.
btw - "wanna" ? Wanna what?
[Post edited 28 Apr 2016 19:33]
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Good grief Charlie Brown. You know, ding? wake up ding? Never mind D_Alien. Sleep like a king. | | | |
| Hillsborough on 19:58 - Apr 28 with 1087 views | pioneer |
| Hillsborough on 19:16 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
She promised to instigate the inquiry with the intention of getting at all the facts.
The Taylor Report - though largely responsible for the much greater safety at football grounds we benefit from today - failed to get through the lies that the police put in front of it.
There you go, Thatcher's fault again. Just keep it coming. |
Now you are changing history - she promised the families at the meeting with them in No 10 there would be no cover up. There was a cover up. Anything you (a) don't understand in that or (b) you don't believe as fact?
The families were concerned that the inquiry would be a whitewash for the establishment - she promised them it would not be.
What more can be said to get you to understand she, as well as many others, failed them and unlike many of the others, she is no longer around to be held accountable.
Is there a particular language you would like me to type this in? Would you understand it better if it was in Ojibwi? Swahili maybe? Can I offer simple diagrams? Thatcher makes promise...Thatcher breaks promise. Come on now - try harder.......its not that difficult. | | | |
| Hillsborough on 20:05 - Apr 28 with 1070 views | CamdenDale |
| Hillsborough on 19:58 - Apr 28 by pioneer |
Now you are changing history - she promised the families at the meeting with them in No 10 there would be no cover up. There was a cover up. Anything you (a) don't understand in that or (b) you don't believe as fact?
The families were concerned that the inquiry would be a whitewash for the establishment - she promised them it would not be.
What more can be said to get you to understand she, as well as many others, failed them and unlike many of the others, she is no longer around to be held accountable.
Is there a particular language you would like me to type this in? Would you understand it better if it was in Ojibwi? Swahili maybe? Can I offer simple diagrams? Thatcher makes promise...Thatcher breaks promise. Come on now - try harder.......its not that difficult. |
Thank you Mr Pioneer. | | | |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 20:12 - Apr 28 with 1055 views | howy10 |
[Post edited 29 Apr 2016 0:34]
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| Hillsborough on 20:22 - Apr 28 with 1036 views | pioneer |
| Hillsborough on 20:05 - Apr 28 by CamdenDale |
Thank you Mr Pioneer. |
Don't hold your breath - he is still clutching the golden handbag waiting for the computer to reboot! | | | |
| Hillsborough on 20:23 - Apr 28 with 1036 views | nordenblue |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 20:12 - Apr 28 by howy10 |
[Post edited 29 Apr 2016 0:34]
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Get your tin hat buckled up | | | |
| Hillsborough on 20:51 - Apr 28 with 987 views | CamdenDale |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 20:12 - Apr 28 by howy10 |
[Post edited 29 Apr 2016 0:34]
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Hang on mate.
1. Were you there?
2. Look at 1. | | | |
| Hillsborough on 20:53 - Apr 28 with 977 views | nordenblue |
| Hillsborough on 20:51 - Apr 28 by CamdenDale |
Hang on mate.
1. Were you there?
2. Look at 1. |
Do you need to be there to have witnessed actual footage of what went on,its been fairly well documented I'd say? | | | |
| Hillsborough on 21:05 - Apr 28 with 953 views | 49thseason |
I am somewhat bemused that the Thatcher-haters on here seem to want to blame her for 27 years of waiting for an outcome that was alluded to in the original Taylor Report.
Just for accuracy, Thatcher retired from office 19 months after the event. In that time, she had ordered the Taylor Report which was delivered in record time of 4-5 months and accepted its proposals, she may well have promised that there would be no cover-up based on the Reports initial finding that the South Yorkshire Police Force was to blame but it was the Crown Prosecution service that decided there wasn't enough evidence to prosecute anyone.
The first inquest opened on the 19th November 1990, 5 days after Thatcher left office.
On the 30th June 1997 the new Labour administration ordered a new scrutiny of the official papers and discovered that 164 police officers accounts had been altered BEFORE the Taylor enquiry. Tony Blair wrote on Jack Straw's suggestion for a new enquiry"What's the Point?". According to Andy Burnham, Tony Blair refused to re-open the enquiry "as a favour to Rupert Murdoch". Tony Blair was in power for 11 of the 27 years and decided to do nothing yet I don't hear any so-called "Socialists" throwing the same sort of gratuitous opprobrium at him that they so gleefully throw at Margaret Thatcher.
Some of you may find this Guardian timeline of events interesting when apportioning blame.:
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/apr/26/hillsborough-inquest-timeline-the |  | | |
| Hillsborough on 21:16 - Apr 28 with 933 views | D_Alien |
| Hillsborough on 20:05 - Apr 28 by CamdenDale |
Thank you Mr Pioneer. |
When will you Thatcher-bashers stop relying on each other's support to bolster your non-arguments?
(I've been having my tea, btw, and watching a bit of telly)
Your basher-in-chief pioneer seems to think that promising an independent judicial inquiry - in which there can by law be no political interference - is the same as promising to reveal the absolute and ultimate truth in a very murky field. How many times does it need to be pointed out that she gave her word on the inquiry and kept it.
Stop acting like a sidekick echoing your master's pronouncements.
[Post edited 28 Apr 2016 21:19]
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| Hillsborough on 21:23 - Apr 28 with 907 views | pioneer |
| Hillsborough on 21:16 - Apr 28 by D_Alien |
When will you Thatcher-bashers stop relying on each other's support to bolster your non-arguments?
(I've been having my tea, btw, and watching a bit of telly)
Your basher-in-chief pioneer seems to think that promising an independent judicial inquiry - in which there can by law be no political interference - is the same as promising to reveal the absolute and ultimate truth in a very murky field. How many times does it need to be pointed out that she gave her word on the inquiry and kept it.
Stop acting like a sidekick echoing your master's pronouncements.
[Post edited 28 Apr 2016 21:19]
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Swahili it is then! | | | |
| Hillsborough on 21:30 - Apr 28 with 892 views | 1mark1 |
| Hillsborough on 21:05 - Apr 28 by 49thseason |
I am somewhat bemused that the Thatcher-haters on here seem to want to blame her for 27 years of waiting for an outcome that was alluded to in the original Taylor Report.
Just for accuracy, Thatcher retired from office 19 months after the event. In that time, she had ordered the Taylor Report which was delivered in record time of 4-5 months and accepted its proposals, she may well have promised that there would be no cover-up based on the Reports initial finding that the South Yorkshire Police Force was to blame but it was the Crown Prosecution service that decided there wasn't enough evidence to prosecute anyone.
The first inquest opened on the 19th November 1990, 5 days after Thatcher left office.
On the 30th June 1997 the new Labour administration ordered a new scrutiny of the official papers and discovered that 164 police officers accounts had been altered BEFORE the Taylor enquiry. Tony Blair wrote on Jack Straw's suggestion for a new enquiry"What's the Point?". According to Andy Burnham, Tony Blair refused to re-open the enquiry "as a favour to Rupert Murdoch". Tony Blair was in power for 11 of the 27 years and decided to do nothing yet I don't hear any so-called "Socialists" throwing the same sort of gratuitous opprobrium at him that they so gleefully throw at Margaret Thatcher.
Some of you may find this Guardian timeline of events interesting when apportioning blame.:
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/apr/26/hillsborough-inquest-timeline-the |
Totally agree what you say regarding Blair, Hillsborough and Murdoch . Let's be clear here though, Blair isn't and never was a socialist. [Post edited 28 Apr 2016 21:45]
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| Hillsborough on 21:40 - Apr 28 with 872 views | D_Alien |
| Hillsborough on 21:23 - Apr 28 by pioneer |
Swahili it is then! |
Or whatever passes for socialist right-on patois in Camden these days. He's reading you loud and clear. | |
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