| EU Referendum Petition on 10:01 - Jun 26 with 2045 views | D_Alien |
| EU Referendum Petition on 09:28 - Jun 26 by EllGazzell |
Yes, I am East. |
Czech Republic, I believe.
Anyroads, enjoy the spectacle, because you'll witness history being made over the weeks, months and years to come. Britain has been on the frontline of history since oh... around the time the Romans invaded.
We are the lucky ones, the ones who live here. What happens now will form the questions on the modern history syllabus in the year 2100.
Anyone wanting a quiet life can leave, but if, like me, you enjoy living on the front line you'll stay and fight for what you believe in. That used to be a literal front line, in a trench. The European Project was designed to prevent that type of event from ever happening again. The countries who instigated the conflicts were invariable France or Germany - hence their deep desire for the EU to succeed. Unfortunately, their mentality isn't ours. We just ended up having to sort their mess out (with the aid of the Yanks, Russians, Commonwealth etc.)
This time round, in the aftermath of the global financial crash, those of us with sufficient perspective (can't blame the young for not having that) can see the project has failed, and we'll be buggered if we're hanging around to sort their mess out this time round. We'll always be European due to simple geography, but as others have said, in years to come we'll see we got out of the EU in the nick of time. Of course, our exit will hasten the end.
We lead, not follow. Enjoy following from afar.
[Post edited 26 Jun 2016 10:04]
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| EU Referendum Petition on 10:10 - Jun 26 with 2023 views | ColDale |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:01 - Jun 26 by D_Alien |
Czech Republic, I believe.
Anyroads, enjoy the spectacle, because you'll witness history being made over the weeks, months and years to come. Britain has been on the frontline of history since oh... around the time the Romans invaded.
We are the lucky ones, the ones who live here. What happens now will form the questions on the modern history syllabus in the year 2100.
Anyone wanting a quiet life can leave, but if, like me, you enjoy living on the front line you'll stay and fight for what you believe in. That used to be a literal front line, in a trench. The European Project was designed to prevent that type of event from ever happening again. The countries who instigated the conflicts were invariable France or Germany - hence their deep desire for the EU to succeed. Unfortunately, their mentality isn't ours. We just ended up having to sort their mess out (with the aid of the Yanks, Russians, Commonwealth etc.)
This time round, in the aftermath of the global financial crash, those of us with sufficient perspective (can't blame the young for not having that) can see the project has failed, and we'll be buggered if we're hanging around to sort their mess out this time round. We'll always be European due to simple geography, but as others have said, in years to come we'll see we got out of the EU in the nick of time. Of course, our exit will hasten the end.
We lead, not follow. Enjoy following from afar.
[Post edited 26 Jun 2016 10:04]
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As a remainder, I suspect that it will be viewed as getting out at the nick of time but our exit will spark its demise. There's three or four big hitters in the EU of which we are one. Once France inevitably follows, it'll be a case of the last one out. Financially, will there be as much pressure on the likes of Greece to repay its debts with the EU reduced in size? Will be much easier to default when the EU evolves into just Germany and a handful of irrelevant friends. No winners out of this. |  | | |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:11 - Jun 26 with 2019 views | 1mark1 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 08:21 - Jun 26 by mingthemerciless |
You may get to vote in private but you don't vote in a secret ballot. Your voting slip can be easily cross referenced with the electoral role. The " Security Services" have monitored the votes for certain parties in the past and may still be doing so now. |
It is a fact that a person's vote can be traced. There is supposed to be only extraordinary circumstances that that can happen, but there is strong belief that this has happened, just like the now proven blacklisted building workers, who have recently won millions in compensation. Also the recent revelations about spying on the likes of Caroline Lucas, and others in LP, GP, and other groups including Trade Unions. |  |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 10:12 - Jun 26 with 2013 views | since58 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 09:51 - Jun 26 by EllGazzell |
Hehehe, you're funny. |
yes but your a clown. |  | | |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:14 - Jun 26 with 2005 views | anotherbiffo |
I don't think the public were misinformed - all people had to do was search on the internet, it's all there.
A strange situation now exists. I voted remain and but I accept the result as it stands. We're in a strange legal impasse as nobody expected article 50 to be put to the test and, I suspect, nobody now wants to be seen as the one who pulls the trigger. So a role reversal of sorts, the EU wanting a clean cut and Britain prolonging the agony - and ironically, prolonging the time we continue paying the deficit and prolonging our 'acquiescence' to Europe.
Of course the EU will now try to make sure that no other country calls a referendum without the usual safety net that accompanies such undertakings, and Turkey can whistle to get in because that's not going to happen. She will also take a demonstrably hard line with Britain in order to send out a strong message to other member states who may 'waver'. So in a sense we have become test-pilots in a strengthening of the EU..
Are we feeling serene?
Are we united nation?
Have we got the strong leadership required to take us forward? | | | |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:23 - Jun 26 with 1985 views | D_Alien |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:10 - Jun 26 by ColDale |
As a remainder, I suspect that it will be viewed as getting out at the nick of time but our exit will spark its demise. There's three or four big hitters in the EU of which we are one. Once France inevitably follows, it'll be a case of the last one out. Financially, will there be as much pressure on the likes of Greece to repay its debts with the EU reduced in size? Will be much easier to default when the EU evolves into just Germany and a handful of irrelevant friends. No winners out of this. |
The winners will be the citizens of first, the UK (whatever form it settles into), and the citizens of Europe.
The EU is a wasteful, tired, undemocratic, insular gravy train for the european establishment. We're so well rid, you wouldn't believe it!
I feel sorry for the younger generation, not because they've been deprived of being citizens of Europe, but because they've been mollycoddled by the elite into their safe spaces. This is a wake up call on so many levels.
[Post edited 26 Jun 2016 10:26]
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| EU Referendum Petition on 10:30 - Jun 26 with 1962 views | R17ALE |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:11 - Jun 26 by 1mark1 |
It is a fact that a person's vote can be traced. There is supposed to be only extraordinary circumstances that that can happen, but there is strong belief that this has happened, just like the now proven blacklisted building workers, who have recently won millions in compensation. Also the recent revelations about spying on the likes of Caroline Lucas, and others in LP, GP, and other groups including Trade Unions. |
Who on earth would want to spy on Caroline Lucas?
I think she's the only person who consistently has me reaching for the OFF button.
Oh. And the awful Emily Thornberry tbf. |  |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 11:26 - Jun 26 with 1890 views | anotherbiffo |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:01 - Jun 26 by D_Alien |
Czech Republic, I believe.
Anyroads, enjoy the spectacle, because you'll witness history being made over the weeks, months and years to come. Britain has been on the frontline of history since oh... around the time the Romans invaded.
We are the lucky ones, the ones who live here. What happens now will form the questions on the modern history syllabus in the year 2100.
Anyone wanting a quiet life can leave, but if, like me, you enjoy living on the front line you'll stay and fight for what you believe in. That used to be a literal front line, in a trench. The European Project was designed to prevent that type of event from ever happening again. The countries who instigated the conflicts were invariable France or Germany - hence their deep desire for the EU to succeed. Unfortunately, their mentality isn't ours. We just ended up having to sort their mess out (with the aid of the Yanks, Russians, Commonwealth etc.)
This time round, in the aftermath of the global financial crash, those of us with sufficient perspective (can't blame the young for not having that) can see the project has failed, and we'll be buggered if we're hanging around to sort their mess out this time round. We'll always be European due to simple geography, but as others have said, in years to come we'll see we got out of the EU in the nick of time. Of course, our exit will hasten the end.
We lead, not follow. Enjoy following from afar.
[Post edited 26 Jun 2016 10:04]
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I enjoyed your potted history of Europe.
Some on here may even think it's factual.
Anyway, you cheered me up - I'm off to proudly play my Elgar collection. | | | |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 12:42 - Jun 26 with 1822 views | 1mark1 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 10:23 - Jun 26 by D_Alien |
The winners will be the citizens of first, the UK (whatever form it settles into), and the citizens of Europe.
The EU is a wasteful, tired, undemocratic, insular gravy train for the european establishment. We're so well rid, you wouldn't believe it!
I feel sorry for the younger generation, not because they've been deprived of being citizens of Europe, but because they've been mollycoddled by the elite into their safe spaces. This is a wake up call on so many levels.
[Post edited 26 Jun 2016 10:26]
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I hardly think that young people have it that easy. They face the biggest ever barriers to University, more than ever can't get on the housing ladder. When they leave University they face debts of over £50000 , just for three years, with less guarantees than ever they can use their degrees . | |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 12:50 - Jun 26 with 1817 views | TalkingSutty |
| EU Referendum Petition on 12:42 - Jun 26 by 1mark1 |
I hardly think that young people have it that easy. They face the biggest ever barriers to University, more than ever can't get on the housing ladder. When they leave University they face debts of over £50000 , just for three years, with less guarantees than ever they can use their degrees . |
Only 38% of people aged 24 or under even bothered to go and vote, so its a bit rich to now start bleating how the older voters have sold them down the river. |  | | |
| EU Referendum Petition on 13:04 - Jun 26 with 1800 views | 1mark1 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 12:50 - Jun 26 by TalkingSutty |
Only 38% of people aged 24 or under even bothered to go and vote, so its a bit rich to now start bleating how the older voters have sold them down the river. |
Please can you point me to where that info is, am trying to find it.
Edit, found the figures. Bloody stupid, that people moan about results after having a chance to influence those results but not taking that chance. If that age group had voted in similar numbers as older people, remain would probably have won.
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2016/06/how-did-different-demograp [Post edited 26 Jun 2016 13:19]
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| EU Referendum Petition on 13:25 - Jun 26 with 1773 views | tony_roch975 |
Totally opposed to 2nd Referendum - just neverendum till you get your way. I believe in Parliamentary democracy of mandate & recall not referendums - if this one was such a good idea we should have them on every issue & get rid of Parliament. Hope this will finally lead to honest political parties - Brexiteers in Tory Party should join with UKIP for 'pure' right-wing policies, anti-Corbyn Labour MPs should join with Tory Cameroons & LibDems for centreist policies & Corbynistas, Greens etc left should form new socialist Party. And we need PR so every vote counts (undemocratic that UKIP's 4 million votes gets only 1 MP). | |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 13:36 - Jun 26 with 1761 views | 1mark1 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 13:25 - Jun 26 by tony_roch975 |
Totally opposed to 2nd Referendum - just neverendum till you get your way. I believe in Parliamentary democracy of mandate & recall not referendums - if this one was such a good idea we should have them on every issue & get rid of Parliament. Hope this will finally lead to honest political parties - Brexiteers in Tory Party should join with UKIP for 'pure' right-wing policies, anti-Corbyn Labour MPs should join with Tory Cameroons & LibDems for centreist policies & Corbynistas, Greens etc left should form new socialist Party. And we need PR so every vote counts (undemocratic that UKIP's 4 million votes gets only 1 MP). |
Agree with most of that, except regarding Greens. People who believe in environmental, social etc policies should join with us in the Greens. There's enough so called socialist parties. | |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 13:58 - Jun 26 with 1732 views | 1mark1 |
Regarding PR, I like the additional member system they have in Scotland, in which they still have constituent MPs, voted by first pas the post, but then parties get allocated seats based on share of vote.
Basically we could have about 325 elected in constituencies that would be twice the size of what they are now, so Rochdale would be basically Rochdale MBC. Then we would have 300 elected as additional members, based on the areas currently used for EU elections. These same areas can elect a second chamber to replace the House of Lords, voted by PR.
I have always had an idea about a different way of having a revising second body. Don't have a standing second chamber, instead, have one that goes around the country, and in each area draw out a list of people who have expressed an interest in sitting on a committee on a particular subject. Similar to jury service, however this wouldn't be compulsory. So Rochdale Town Hall could be the venue for a committee looking at a new Bill about football governance. Football fans from the wider area, who have expressed interest in such topics, could be invited to scrutinise the Government Bill, and be able to put forward amendments, based on the knowledge they have in that subject. The other way, would be to have the elected second chamber, and why not base it somewhere else in the country, like Manchester, but for each bill they look at, the 200 elected members are joined by a number of people from a list who are interested. So you could have Dale supporters being part of the scrutiny of a Bill about football. Just an idea for expanding democracy. | |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 16:50 - Jun 26 with 1346 views | mikehunt |
I wonder, if we haven't heard a cohesive policy as to how to move this forward by Monday, whether a coalition government should be formed of all the leading Brexiteers until (at least) Article 50 has been triggered? I voted leave but it feels like a referendum was offered to shut us up; with no one believing a Leave vote would prevail. And nobody appears to have made any concrete plans as to what to do. Cameron is the complete tosser in all of this. 6 years he has had to think of what to do should Leave win and he bottles it at the death. What a jerk!
I still hope we make a go of it though.
And did anybody notice The Guardian's view of the result? I quote: "Crappy Northern towns have led us in to this mess". Make of that what you will. |  |
| The worm of time turns not for the cuckoo of circumstance. |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 17:14 - Jun 26 with 1320 views | DomDale |
| EU Referendum Petition on 07:55 - Jun 26 by R17ALE |
The left have always been really bad losers. We've had Kinnock (the old horrible one) once tell us from his high horse that we need to change the electorate.
We've had Blair (thank God there's only one) tell the Labour electorate to get a heart transplant.
We've had this on-line petition.
We've had loads of tv clips of "remainers" literally wailing woe is me in front of the cameras.
I'll tell you wet lefties something which you don't want to forget in a hurry. You don't know you're born being British. The day you were born British was the day you won first prize in the lottery of life. You can vote in private and in peace, regardless of gender or sexuality or colour. There's no uniformed bloke standing by a polling station holding a gun to ensure fair play like you see in certain African elections. You can just rock up, put your cross in a box and then rock off.
Millions have given their lives for you to have this luxury.
So accept democratic results or fook off to another country you ungrateful little shits. |
This is not and hasn't been an argument of left v right wing. Most of the socio and economically right-wingers I know , including paid members of the Conservative party, were very much pro-Remain. Whereas I know plenty of traditional labour folk who voted out. |  |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 17:30 - Jun 26 with 1298 views | robbowood |
| EU Referendum Petition on 20:39 - Jun 25 by 1mark1 |
This petition was started before the outcome was known. |
The petition is a complete and utter farce and not worth the paper it is written on
Despite Vatican City, a tiny city state, having a total population of just 800, over 39,000 residents of Vatican City appeared to have signed the petition.
People from different countries have been tweeting that they signed the petition. Mark Mennell, who is Australian and used to live in the UK, used his old postcode to sign. He said: “Anyone in the world can do it, it seems ... It’s a complete farce.”
The House of Commons petitions committee has confirmed that 77,000 signatures, which were added fraudulently, have been removed.
It was started by leave activist William Oliver Healey in May, when polls suggested remain would win
Today, Healey posted a statement on his Facebook page attempting to distance himself from the petition. He wrote: “Due to the result, the petition has been hijacked by the remain campaign. Admittedly, my actions were premature, however, my intentions were as stated above.
“There was no guarantee of a leave victory at that time. Having said that, if it had not been mine, it would have been orchestrated by someone on the remain campaign.
“I believe what we need to do now for the good of the country is get behind the will of the British people, unite, issue article 50 of the Treaty of Lisbon and move forward, with the process of leaving the European Union.” | | | |
| EU Referendum Petition on 19:22 - Jun 26 with 1193 views | Dale23years |
| EU Referendum Petition on 09:51 - Jun 26 by EllGazzell |
Hehehe, you're funny. |
Only got one thing to say.............
Fu ck you u tree hugging lefties YOU LOST don't like it go to Iran see how long you last | |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 19:34 - Jun 26 with 1171 views | moth5368 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 19:22 - Jun 26 by Dale23years |
Only got one thing to say.............
Fu ck you u tree hugging lefties YOU LOST don't like it go to Iran see how long you last |
Always nice to see an intelligent well reasoned argument. I'm quite pleased you only have one thing to say. | | | |
| EU Referendum Petition on 19:36 - Jun 26 with 1168 views | 1mark1 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 19:22 - Jun 26 by Dale23years |
Only got one thing to say.............
Fu ck you u tree hugging lefties YOU LOST don't like it go to Iran see how long you last |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 19:43 - Jun 26 with 1148 views | DomDale |
| EU Referendum Petition on 19:22 - Jun 26 by Dale23years |
Only got one thing to say.............
Fu ck you u tree hugging lefties YOU LOST don't like it go to Iran see how long you last |
That's up there with the stranger things I've read on this forum - which is saying something.
Iran is not in Europe, let alone the E.U. You do know that, don't you? | |
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| EU Referendum Petition on 19:43 - Jun 26 with 1148 views | D_Alien |
| EU Referendum Petition on 12:42 - Jun 26 by 1mark1 |
I hardly think that young people have it that easy. They face the biggest ever barriers to University, more than ever can't get on the housing ladder. When they leave University they face debts of over £50000 , just for three years, with less guarantees than ever they can use their degrees . |
The numbers of young people entering universities are at a record high, so to claim that barriers are their biggest ever is a typical skewing of facts to suit an opinion.
And as this thread has demonstrated, those who've spent some of their time at uni studying "feminism/gender issues" still don't realise that using terms like "love" and "petal" are sexist - so a complete waste of their time, their money, and more importantly taxpayers money, which is still used for university funding.
And it's only in the past 30 years that young people would be expecting to get onto any kind of housing ladder. Lack of perspective in these matters isn't a surprise to me, but still disappointing.
[Post edited 26 Jun 2016 19:50]
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| EU Referendum Petition on 20:03 - Jun 26 with 1108 views | 1mark1 |
| EU Referendum Petition on 19:43 - Jun 26 by D_Alien |
The numbers of young people entering universities are at a record high, so to claim that barriers are their biggest ever is a typical skewing of facts to suit an opinion.
And as this thread has demonstrated, those who've spent some of their time at uni studying "feminism/gender issues" still don't realise that using terms like "love" and "petal" are sexist - so a complete waste of their time, their money, and more importantly taxpayers money, which is still used for university funding.
And it's only in the past 30 years that young people would be expecting to get onto any kind of housing ladder. Lack of perspective in these matters isn't a surprise to me, but still disappointing.
[Post edited 26 Jun 2016 19:50]
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Young people are going despite the barriers not because of them, I know this personally as I have one daughter who graduated last summer, and my son has just finished year one.
I accept that there may be some graduates that don't use their education to the best of the ability, however plenty of people in all walks of life fail to use the skills they have learned properly.
I also accept that to much emphasis is put on University education, and not enough on Technical colleges etc. There are jobs in my opinion that should NOT necessarily require a degree.
As far as housing is concerned, you are wrong as studies have shown. My own personal experience, is that when I was a twenty year old, I almost bought a house. The mortgage was available to me if I wanted it, but in the end I bottled it and stayed at home, for the easier and cheaper life. It meant I could carry on watching the Dale all over the country, and be on the piss every weekend and most nights. 😀Nowadays I wouldn't earn the same kind of money, as wages are lower thirty years later for equivalent semi skilled work. Also there are less homes available, due to buy to let, council house sales, and house prices have rocketed. | |
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