| Bad tactics tonight 21:29 - Mar 4 with 5564 views | twotimejack |
I don't get Garry's thinking tonight with these tactics, flooding the midfield whilst sacrificing a winger, with the pace Spurs have from the wings and full backs im not surprised we have been slaughtered down the flanks tonight, terrible tactics. |  |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 23:11 - Mar 4 with 1633 views | BobJack |
We scored 2 away at Spurs. Just a shame we conceded 3. |  |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 23:14 - Mar 4 with 1624 views | acejack3065 |
| Bad tactics tonight on 23:10 - Mar 4 by Bonjour |
End to end thriller? |
Yeah it was pretty back and forth for most of the game. I really enjoyed it. |  | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 23:21 - Mar 4 with 1604 views | LeonisGod |
| Bad tactics tonight on 21:32 - Mar 4 by Jackfath |
Have they not worked for the previous couple of games? |
Not really, no. Against Man U, we were getting hammered down our left by Valencia until Montero came on. And Burnley was a dirge of a match. Tayls has to work his balls off waiting for JJS or Ki to help cover, so it effectively puts him on the back foot. And even though it does allow us to overload one side and then switch the play, when we do Tayls or Naughton are on their own and have to cut back for lack of options.
It might be more effective with Oliveira running the channels and there were signs of that happening tonight. But when the striker and Siggy stay central it just leaves us lopsided and vulnerable to width and with fewer options going forward. |  | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 23:34 - Mar 4 with 1587 views | Davillin |
To this point, this thread has been pure delight.
A half-dozen or a dozen completely different analyses, criticism, or explanations, and everyone unalterably convinced he's the only one who gets it right.
p.s. Two of them did.  |  |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 00:49 - Mar 5 with 1523 views | jruss1 |
I keep reading United killed us down the flanks.
Fabianski had no saves to make in that 25/30 minute spell at the second half where they must have had 80% of the ball. In fact, I think we could have played into Sunday that weekend and they wouldn't have scored.
It looked to me as if we were happy for them to have it wide, confident we could deal with anything they created. And that's how it panned out.
But I suppose you twist it to suit an opinion.
Maybe it was wrong to go with this tonight but you can't get it right every week. GM has got it tactically right an awful lot this season, and he's still a rookie really. | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 01:48 - Mar 5 with 1500 views | JJJack |
| Bad tactics tonight on 00:49 - Mar 5 by jruss1 |
I keep reading United killed us down the flanks.
Fabianski had no saves to make in that 25/30 minute spell at the second half where they must have had 80% of the ball. In fact, I think we could have played into Sunday that weekend and they wouldn't have scored.
It looked to me as if we were happy for them to have it wide, confident we could deal with anything they created. And that's how it panned out.
But I suppose you twist it to suit an opinion.
Maybe it was wrong to go with this tonight but you can't get it right every week. GM has got it tactically right an awful lot this season, and he's still a rookie really. |
Great post! |  | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 05:24 - Mar 5 with 1462 views | icecoldjack |
| Bad tactics tonight on 22:21 - Mar 4 by acejack3065 |
It's obvious that we were worried about committing too much wide and getting ruined on the counter.
Again the tactics were adjusted at an appropriate time and it shifted the game. To say the tactics were bad is laughable. |
Disagree . Monk has said he needed to develop different things for different teams, so why set up un balanced and narrow knowing Spurs main threats were going to be wide with rose and walker, why wait so long after going 3-1 down to change it ?
I understand a class side like spurs will have a threats anywhere though, like i said previously, not bothered about this result i thought we played well in patches and we never do well away at the lane. |  | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 06:44 - Mar 5 with 1445 views | SwaneeRiver |
| Bad tactics tonight on 21:50 - Mar 4 by acejack3065 |
Absolute horse sh*t. We were on the wrong end of an end to end 5 goal thriller. I can't imagine what happened to Bafe did our boys any favours but we got the ball down and played well.
Another good performance stacked up against the context of our best premier league season ever. |
Better than being at the wrong end of a 5 goal hammering - not that we would ever be beaten like that ..... | | | |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 06:54 - Mar 5 with 1442 views | Dr_Winston |
| Bad tactics tonight on 22:40 - Mar 4 by acejack3065 |
Seriously? A clean out? I'd only want one more winger and another striker at the minute. Possibly two of each depending on sales. |
We badly need a top ten standard LB too. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 06:58 - Mar 5 with 1436 views | SwaneeRiver |
| Bad tactics tonight on 06:54 - Mar 5 by Dr_Winston |
We badly need a top ten standard LB too. |
It amazes me how many slagged of Ben and screamed for us to sell him and reinstate Taylor.
This season Taylor it seems can do no right.
Seems we have to have an escape goat in every position | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 08:03 - Mar 5 with 1395 views | jojaca |
Every game we go into these days, I expect the opposition to have double the attempts on on goal than us. We also surrender possession to easily and there is no real flow or rhythm to our game apart from the odd 5 minutes when we reacting to conceding goals. But points make prizes, so we cant really argue with the tactics. I'm old fashion and been drilled that attack is best form of defense. If Montero is fully fit he has to start games, he is the only player consistently beating defenders. Dyer and Routledge have both frustrated me this season and maybe we could give Gorre a chance. |  |
| Even when you know, you never know? |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 09:10 - Mar 5 with 1314 views | Nookiejack |
We seemed to match them first half. Start of second half Spurs were dominant.
A little bit unlucky for their 2nd goal - with Ash's tackle on Eriksen falling straight in the path of Mason.
Ref unfortunately played a very good advantage for their 3rd goal -which proved decisive. Townsend also hit it with his right foot - unusual for him.
Spurs could have then easily gone on to win the game 4-1 or 5-1. Credit our team though for coming back at the end.
Anyway a very enjoyable game - much better than all the previous defensive performances at the Lane - when I can't recall us landing 'one punch' on them. Great save by Lloris at the end.
Spurs supporters were also very respectful with regards to Gomis fainting. | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 09:50 - Mar 5 with 1290 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
| Bad tactics tonight on 22:00 - Mar 4 by icecoldjack |
Jeff made a mug of the tactical selection tonight in fairness, stopped Walker dead in his tracks which was something we needed to do from the start.
Im not a football expert but even i know that spurs were gonna hurt us out wide with walker and rose, especially with our selection.
We just invited them on and that was a massive mistake.
Overall im not too bothered about the result though, many other managers of ours have been un done at the lane , monk just joins the list .
We played well in patches why the fook monk takes off Shelvey while 3-1 down ive no idea, why he waited until the 73 rd minute to balance the formation with jeff coming on ive no idea.
All a bit meh but in fairness it tends to go that way when we play up there so hey ho and onto the next one.
We need to sort out a world class full back or two for the summer. It;s such a key position and i feel its time to upgrade in that department.
I think i would have played Rangel,Dyer/routs and montero tonight, its not rocket science how Spurs play but i get the feeling Monk wants to play the Star players and find a system to fit all of them, which aint always possible IMO. |
I have to whole heartedly agree with that . |  |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 10:47 - Mar 5 with 1255 views | icecoldjack |
| Bad tactics tonight on 06:58 - Mar 5 by SwaneeRiver |
It amazes me how many slagged of Ben and screamed for us to sell him and reinstate Taylor.
This season Taylor it seems can do no right.
Seems we have to have an escape goat in every position |
What ive always said about ben is that he is great going forward but easily beaten defensively, of the two id put taylor above him as the more defensive minded, what ben had a problem with was getting beat on the turn and being slack at the far post, something which he will just get better at with time and experience,
.
He was sleeping for gylfis goal last night and that was a classic example of where ben lacks, though he is still young and will learn.
I have supported taylor and been patient with him since his horrific injury but on reflection its looking like he aint the same player and is perhaps struggling a bit with how we now play, not having the comfort of a defensive minded winger is maybe exposing him at times.
I think we need to buy a top quality full back to upgrade taylor, he has done ok but i think the way monk is going we need a player who can defend and attack with equal efficiancy , this costs money though !
Both players have strengths and weakness though taylor seems to be struggling. A little bit for me. | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 12:55 - Mar 5 with 1196 views | libertine |
retrospect is a great thing to have,
we didn't have enough width to congested in midfield,
2nd goal
Taylor needs to improve
looked like the same goal as last week.
Our team has improved a lot since taylor had his accident, maybe hes never come back maybe he was never that good |  | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 13:07 - Mar 5 with 1188 views | libertine |
bringing Montero on was game changing maybe we should have done that earlier | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 13:09 - Mar 5 with 1187 views | AnotherJohn |
It wasn't the worst display, but our performance level did dip alarmingly in the second half. The way we came back towards the end made me wonder if we could have got a result with better tactics. | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 13:28 - Mar 5 with 1165 views | Bloodyhills |
Overall I am happy with what Monk's doing and yes he makes mistakes but he seems to learn and as long as he continues to learn then things will be OK. | |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 13:30 - Mar 5 with 1162 views | libertine |
| Bad tactics tonight on 13:09 - Mar 5 by AnotherJohn |
It wasn't the worst display, but our performance level did dip alarmingly in the second half. The way we came back towards the end made me wonder if we could have got a result with better tactics. |
totally agree | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 14:28 - Mar 5 with 1130 views | Oldjack |
As soon as they went 3 -1 up Monks should have made the changes , Jeff was ripping them apart when he eventually came on |  |
| Prosser the Tosser dwells on Phil's bum hole like a rusty old hemorrhoid ,fact
You Greedy Bastards Get Out Of OUR Club!
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| Bad tactics tonight on 16:05 - Mar 5 with 1078 views | Davillin |
| Bad tactics tonight on 22:00 - Mar 4 by twotimejack |
So we didn't create more chances and looked more threatening when montero came on? The tactics have worked wonders the last two games, I just don't think he should have used the same tactics against Spurs pace that's all. |
In my opinion, the tactics "worked wonders" against Man. United for two reasons: (1) Monk got it right, and (2) van Gaal lived up to his reputation as being stubborn and arrogant, assuming that his £300 M would beat us no matter what we did.
However, the tactics did NOT work against Burnley. We squeaked by 1-0 because Burnly is not up to the Premier League [I mean no disrespect to their players, who did play hard]. The goal was satisfying, but it did result from a mad goal-line scramble which always includes a bit of luck.
The tactics did not work against Tottenham because they were simply dead wrong for that opponent. We took the tactics "a bridge too far." [Actually, the Burnley game was that "a bridge too far."]
I can't read Monk's mind, but it seemed to me that he wanted the tactics to "work" a third time by making them the new "Plan A." In my opinion, not reverting to the original "Plan A" with two speed merchants on the wings [from Montero, Routledge, Barrow, or Dyer], and going back to "Swansea Style" will continue to bring sad results.
Regarding the change from Shelvey to Montero. I've said all I plan to say about Shelvey except that he has not been dismissed on a red card since the last one, and does seem to have learned that he plays a position in a football "team." The rest of my opinions about him remain.
However, it is beyond my ability to read Monk's mind about why he continues to play Shelvey. "Potential" does not win football games -- not even "bags of potential." "Having a shot in him" and being "able to change a game" do not either. Nor does "hope" that he'll score a third goal for the season.
On the other hand, I cannot explain how anyone did not see that Montero's arrival did change the game, either -- instantly, dramatically, in the attack and the defence.
I can''t read Monk's mind on why Montero doesn't start, or even get more time on the pitch. His "potential" is being wasted by keeping him on the bench.
Another part of the equation is that putting Montero on, with Routledge on the other wing, brought back -- however fleetingly [17 minutes] -- the "Swansea style" and almost got the Swans a draw. I can only imagine what might have been with Montero on for at least the second half, and regret that he wasn't. | |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 16:22 - Mar 5 with 1065 views | Davillin |
Here's an interesting report from Tottenham, URL below. First, however, two quotes:
"Narrow Swansea
"The Swans played with an extremely interesting set up.
"Without the ball, they moved in to a 4-3-3 formation, content to engage as play entered the middle third. Gylfi Sigurdsson pushed on as a false nine, splitting the other two forwards. Jack Cork, Ki and Jonjo Shelvey formed a second bank of three behind.
"When we moved possession through this front three, Sigurdsson would then drop and track Ryan Mason as the formation went to a 4-3-1-2.
spurs-3-2-swansea-4-3-1-2-formation
"It was this 4-3-1-2 formation that they would then try and attack out of, but in the defensive phase it was extremely narrow and designed to congest the centre. The space was thus naturally out on the flanks, with all three of our goals coming from the left.
"Spurs attack the right back
"There were just seven minutes on the clock when we took the lead. We’d looked in the keys to Spurs vs Swansea at how they are vulnerable in the full back zones and that was the case on our opener.
"With Swansea set up so narrow, Christian Eriksen moved the ball out of central midfield to Danny Rose who was in space on the left wing.
spurs-3-2-swansea-rose-cross
"These long switches of the ball were a feature of our play all evening. It was being moved quickly out from the centre, but also from long balls played from side to side. This had the effect of shifting and pulling Swansea’s three central midfielders, a task they never quite got to grips with.
"As Rose received the ball, Kyle Naughton was caught in-field and was extremely slow and cautious to go out and engage. Naughton doesn’t have the same pace as Rose and maybe he’d been lit up by him a few times in training and so was nervous to get too tight. Whatever the reason was, Naughton gave far too much room for Rose to whip in an excellent cross.
"With three players getting up in to the box in support, the ball in was perfect for Nacer Chadli. The Belgian cushioned it back across goal, out of the reach of a diving Fabianski and in to the far corner.
Swansea between the lines
"With us 1-0 up and looking rampant, the unfortunate incident with Bafetimbi Gomis collapsing at the restart paused the game. The speed with which the medical crews were on was outstanding and fortunately Gomis was fine, tweeting so after the match.
"There was naturally a lull in the game afterwards and Swansea came back in to the match by doing two things.
"The first was looking to spring Wayne Routledge to run in-behind our defence. The former Spurs winger was deployed as a wide forward with Shelvey and Sigurdsson looking to release him beyond our high defensive line."
and
"Montero vs Walker
"The game looked done and dusted and Mauricio Pochettino rung the changes, even giving Ben Davies a nice cameo against his former club. However, Gary Monk hadn’t given up on the game and sent on Jefferson Montero, as he sought to use the winger’s pace.
"Montero is one the quickest around and he gave Kyle Walker some real problems as he tried to isolate himself 1v1 against our right back. He was an instant influence on the game and provided Swansea’s second to get the score back to 3-2. Walker had been pulled away from the rest of the back four and wasn’t aided by his team mates. Mousa Dembele was slow to offer help and Ryan Mason unable to get back on the cover quickly enough.
spurs-3-2-swansea-montero-cross
"Montero jinked and blazed his way towards the by-line, before swinging over a deep cross that was expertly volleyed home by Gylfi Sigurdsson.
"Swansea were back in the match and made the remaining five minutes extremely uncomfortable. Montero was at the heart of it as he forced a corner that invited pressure. He then got himself matched up 1v1 against Walker again, with his quick feet allowing him to put in another cross. Federico Fernandez headed down and towards the corner of the net, but Hugo Lloris sprung like a cat to push the ball around the post, and Swansea’s hopes went with it."
So you decide how accurate all that is.
Link:
http://www.spursfanatic.com/spurs-result/spurs-3-2-swansea-right-backs-under-att | |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 17:05 - Mar 5 with 1037 views | football2301 |
| Bad tactics tonight on 16:05 - Mar 5 by Davillin |
In my opinion, the tactics "worked wonders" against Man. United for two reasons: (1) Monk got it right, and (2) van Gaal lived up to his reputation as being stubborn and arrogant, assuming that his £300 M would beat us no matter what we did.
However, the tactics did NOT work against Burnley. We squeaked by 1-0 because Burnly is not up to the Premier League [I mean no disrespect to their players, who did play hard]. The goal was satisfying, but it did result from a mad goal-line scramble which always includes a bit of luck.
The tactics did not work against Tottenham because they were simply dead wrong for that opponent. We took the tactics "a bridge too far." [Actually, the Burnley game was that "a bridge too far."]
I can't read Monk's mind, but it seemed to me that he wanted the tactics to "work" a third time by making them the new "Plan A." In my opinion, not reverting to the original "Plan A" with two speed merchants on the wings [from Montero, Routledge, Barrow, or Dyer], and going back to "Swansea Style" will continue to bring sad results.
Regarding the change from Shelvey to Montero. I've said all I plan to say about Shelvey except that he has not been dismissed on a red card since the last one, and does seem to have learned that he plays a position in a football "team." The rest of my opinions about him remain.
However, it is beyond my ability to read Monk's mind about why he continues to play Shelvey. "Potential" does not win football games -- not even "bags of potential." "Having a shot in him" and being "able to change a game" do not either. Nor does "hope" that he'll score a third goal for the season.
On the other hand, I cannot explain how anyone did not see that Montero's arrival did change the game, either -- instantly, dramatically, in the attack and the defence.
I can''t read Monk's mind on why Montero doesn't start, or even get more time on the pitch. His "potential" is being wasted by keeping him on the bench.
Another part of the equation is that putting Montero on, with Routledge on the other wing, brought back -- however fleetingly [17 minutes] -- the "Swansea style" and almost got the Swans a draw. I can only imagine what might have been with Montero on for at least the second half, and regret that he wasn't. |
so you honestly think that jjs should of been subbed last night ? | | | |
| Bad tactics tonight on 19:03 - Mar 5 with 1000 views | twotimejack |
| Bad tactics tonight on 16:22 - Mar 5 by Davillin |
Here's an interesting report from Tottenham, URL below. First, however, two quotes:
"Narrow Swansea
"The Swans played with an extremely interesting set up.
"Without the ball, they moved in to a 4-3-3 formation, content to engage as play entered the middle third. Gylfi Sigurdsson pushed on as a false nine, splitting the other two forwards. Jack Cork, Ki and Jonjo Shelvey formed a second bank of three behind.
"When we moved possession through this front three, Sigurdsson would then drop and track Ryan Mason as the formation went to a 4-3-1-2.
spurs-3-2-swansea-4-3-1-2-formation
"It was this 4-3-1-2 formation that they would then try and attack out of, but in the defensive phase it was extremely narrow and designed to congest the centre. The space was thus naturally out on the flanks, with all three of our goals coming from the left.
"Spurs attack the right back
"There were just seven minutes on the clock when we took the lead. We’d looked in the keys to Spurs vs Swansea at how they are vulnerable in the full back zones and that was the case on our opener.
"With Swansea set up so narrow, Christian Eriksen moved the ball out of central midfield to Danny Rose who was in space on the left wing.
spurs-3-2-swansea-rose-cross
"These long switches of the ball were a feature of our play all evening. It was being moved quickly out from the centre, but also from long balls played from side to side. This had the effect of shifting and pulling Swansea’s three central midfielders, a task they never quite got to grips with.
"As Rose received the ball, Kyle Naughton was caught in-field and was extremely slow and cautious to go out and engage. Naughton doesn’t have the same pace as Rose and maybe he’d been lit up by him a few times in training and so was nervous to get too tight. Whatever the reason was, Naughton gave far too much room for Rose to whip in an excellent cross.
"With three players getting up in to the box in support, the ball in was perfect for Nacer Chadli. The Belgian cushioned it back across goal, out of the reach of a diving Fabianski and in to the far corner.
Swansea between the lines
"With us 1-0 up and looking rampant, the unfortunate incident with Bafetimbi Gomis collapsing at the restart paused the game. The speed with which the medical crews were on was outstanding and fortunately Gomis was fine, tweeting so after the match.
"There was naturally a lull in the game afterwards and Swansea came back in to the match by doing two things.
"The first was looking to spring Wayne Routledge to run in-behind our defence. The former Spurs winger was deployed as a wide forward with Shelvey and Sigurdsson looking to release him beyond our high defensive line."
and
"Montero vs Walker
"The game looked done and dusted and Mauricio Pochettino rung the changes, even giving Ben Davies a nice cameo against his former club. However, Gary Monk hadn’t given up on the game and sent on Jefferson Montero, as he sought to use the winger’s pace.
"Montero is one the quickest around and he gave Kyle Walker some real problems as he tried to isolate himself 1v1 against our right back. He was an instant influence on the game and provided Swansea’s second to get the score back to 3-2. Walker had been pulled away from the rest of the back four and wasn’t aided by his team mates. Mousa Dembele was slow to offer help and Ryan Mason unable to get back on the cover quickly enough.
spurs-3-2-swansea-montero-cross
"Montero jinked and blazed his way towards the by-line, before swinging over a deep cross that was expertly volleyed home by Gylfi Sigurdsson.
"Swansea were back in the match and made the remaining five minutes extremely uncomfortable. Montero was at the heart of it as he forced a corner that invited pressure. He then got himself matched up 1v1 against Walker again, with his quick feet allowing him to put in another cross. Federico Fernandez headed down and towards the corner of the net, but Hugo Lloris sprung like a cat to push the ball around the post, and Swansea’s hopes went with it."
So you decide how accurate all that is.
Link:
http://www.spursfanatic.com/spurs-result/spurs-3-2-swansea-right-backs-under-att |
Just wait for the "how come the tactics have worked fine in the last two games" mob. | |
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| Bad tactics tonight on 19:06 - Mar 5 with 995 views | twotimejack |
| Bad tactics tonight on 17:05 - Mar 5 by football2301 |
so you honestly think that jjs should of been subbed last night ? |
Either him, ki or siggy Shouldn't have started in the 1st place. | |
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