| Terry Coles - help us get justice 12:03 - Aug 24 with 9042 views | nataliecoles |
I hope that you will remember my dads story how he was killed by a police horse at Rotherham back in May 2000, we are trying to get justice that my father deserves , the press painted him out to be a holligan that he was NOT!
A reporter Neil from Yorkshire wants to do a 9 minute piece on my dads case & the day at Swans v Rotherham in 2000. You don't necessarily have to have seen the incident but if you can paint a picture of the day, anything about the day which stands out in your mind. Anything big or small which you may think may be helpful to us , can you please contact me via the inbox with any information and help us get the justice my father deserves! |  | | |  |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 10:33 - Aug 26 with 2828 views | swanstillidai |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 10:11 - Aug 26 by Loyal |
I think it's best just to show support for Natalie and her family as they seek closure with the continued dignity they have shown. As I said without using this as ammunition for your own personal agenda. I'm not sure how many different ways there are of saying it in the current language available to us. [Post edited 26 Aug 2016 10:12]
|
Agreed, but Natalie has asked for any sort of feedback of that day.
No agenda here, mate - Just my brief thoughts of the way things were handled.
It still riles me to this day and I came away from there without a scratch. God only knows how Terrys family feel. |  | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 10:57 - Aug 26 with 2803 views | Darran |
|  |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 13:24 - Aug 26 with 2715 views | pencoedjack |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 09:36 - Aug 26 by Loyal |
Hi Natalie, I can't imagine how the loss of your father has affected you over some 16 years, like many I was there that day, it was carnage in the vicinity of the away end, for me I couldn't see how the trouble started or why the police acted in the way they did. I am pretty certain there will never be total blame, but more clarity is surely required. But what I do take from your posts is your clear dignity and non judgemental position. Many connected to other deaths have turned the whole matter to an anti system or Govt agenda, you have not and this is reflected in your original post when you stated 'killed by a police horse' You have remained pragmatic and no matter how difficult it must be calm and collected. I am sure many thousands of us on here and elsewhere wish you the very best as you look for more detail and more understanding as to why this occurred. Nobody wanted Terry to die that day, that goes without saying but you, your family and of course Terry deserve final closure.
I know you will get it and when you do I hope it ensures you find the peace you deserve.
Football ? As I have said many times it matters not, nor the participants on the pitch, it's people and supporters like Terry that have always mattered. He deserves a conclusion, call it justice or just answers, keep on Natalie and I am certain you will get it.
Take care, be strong 👠|
What a superb post ...... |  | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 13:33 - Aug 26 with 2707 views | perchrockjack |
I d simply like to echo loyal s post? | |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 23:52 - Aug 26 with 2483 views | DJack |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 09:36 - Aug 26 by Loyal |
Hi Natalie, I can't imagine how the loss of your father has affected you over some 16 years, like many I was there that day, it was carnage in the vicinity of the away end, for me I couldn't see how the trouble started or why the police acted in the way they did. I am pretty certain there will never be total blame, but more clarity is surely required. But what I do take from your posts is your clear dignity and non judgemental position. Many connected to other deaths have turned the whole matter to an anti system or Govt agenda, you have not and this is reflected in your original post when you stated 'killed by a police horse' You have remained pragmatic and no matter how difficult it must be calm and collected. I am sure many thousands of us on here and elsewhere wish you the very best as you look for more detail and more understanding as to why this occurred. Nobody wanted Terry to die that day, that goes without saying but you, your family and of course Terry deserve final closure.
I know you will get it and when you do I hope it ensures you find the peace you deserve.
Football ? As I have said many times it matters not, nor the participants on the pitch, it's people and supporters like Terry that have always mattered. He deserves a conclusion, call it justice or just answers, keep on Natalie and I am certain you will get it.
Take care, be strong 👠|
As a few others have said...great post mate.
Natalie, whatever the outcome I hope it is the truth that wins and then you can have some sort of closure. |  |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 03:35 - Aug 27 with 2450 views | Loyal |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 10:33 - Aug 26 by swanstillidai |
Agreed, but Natalie has asked for any sort of feedback of that day.
No agenda here, mate - Just my brief thoughts of the way things were handled.
It still riles me to this day and I came away from there without a scratch. God only knows how Terrys family feel. |
Appreciated, a sore and extremely sad subject all round 👠|  |
| Nolan sympathiser, clout expert, personal friend of Leigh Dineen, advocate and enforcer of porridge swallows.
The official inventor of the tit w@nk. | | Poll: | Who should be Swansea number 1 |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 09:57 - Aug 27 with 2362 views | Catullus |
Hi Natalie, me and my friends were there that day. We pased by your father 5-10 minutes after it happened. We'd all been drinking but I clearly remember seeing your dad laying on the floor (not that we knew it was him back then) and wondering what had gone on.
I've asked my mate and between us we remember the day being fairly quiet for us, we heard rumours of fighting but hadn't seen any, we left Yates for another pub. Some home fans had mouthed off while passing, but the pub was full of Jacks and no one actually tried anything.
We left for the game, nothing happening until we got to a bridge and there was fighting. We carried on, avoiding the fighting but things were being thrown at the Swansea fans and as we turned left into that lane and saw the police, a horse I think and your Dad on the floor but the police moved us on, the ambulance was coming. There was barely enough room for it to get down the lane. We walked through the lane and had to queue for a while because I seem to remember there only being 2/3 turnstiles open but around 2-2, 500 Jacks.
It had started off to be a great day, both teams were promoted and we were playing for the Championship. It all went sour, rumours were circulating that the person on the floor had died but no one seemed to know for sure. Obviously the next day it started to come out.
Terry used to stand just to the left of us, usually by the radio gantry pillar (my mate Neil tells me) he usually came and spoke to my mate and shook his hand.
That lane wasn't wide enough to take police horses down when it was heavily crowded. It was a recipe for disaster, sadly that disaster happened to your Dad.
I hope you get justice Natalie, if you want to speak to me or Neil just say. We'll be happy to help if we can. | |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 11:19 - Aug 27 with 2334 views | perchrockjack |
Have to say thst last post is pretty damning.
Seeking justice is not playing victim before any dark. Kids think that | |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 13:13 - Aug 27 with 2262 views | TimBowen |
Hello Natalie,
I/we, as Swans fans, can only imagine how devastating a loss your dad's death was to you and your family. Not knowing your family, I've never been able to say this previously, and while obviously it's late, I'd like to offer my and my family's sincere condolences on your loss.
Recently, when the families of the 96 Liverpool fans were celebrating the verdict and being interviewed, I also thought about how, 'inappropriate actions' by police mounted officers led directly to your Dad losing his life that day. Although, that incident did not, to my knowledge/recollection, receive anything like the levels of investigation it deserved.
I say inappropriate actions 'by police mounted officers,' because they were directing/riding the horses. The horses didn't take it upon themselves, to gallop along that narrow lane at the back of 'Millmoor' that fateful day in May 2000.
I know that if I was directing/driving a car, along that lane and I'd taken a life, the very least I could expect to face, would be a manslaughter charge, or, causing death by dangerous driving. It appears, the officer(s) riding those horses that day, did not face that type of charge over their part in your dad's death.
I want to make this abundantly clear, I have no gripe against the police. This is not some politically motivated comment, I have several friends who are retired police officers and I respect the job police officers do on our behalf on a daily basis. However, the events of that day require a new and thorough investigation. And hopefully, by an impartial police authority, so hopefully some measure of closure can be provided for you and your family.
I was at the game at Millmoor that day, I remember all too well, the lane running at the back of 'our end' of the ground. I'd also been there previously, during the second leg of the 1988 play-off semi-final against Rotherham. That lane, to offer a comparison, was similar to the back lanes that divide the gardens on the Coronation Street opening credits. I vividly remember stretching my arms out and almost being able to touch both sides of the lane, such was it's narrowness. Personally, I believe it was grossly irresponsible of the officers to even attempt to ride a police horse, through the Swans fans trying to get to the turnstiles via that back lane.
I was already in the ground that day, before the incident occurred Natalie, so can't help in providing an eye witness account to help, should there be any new investigation. I wasn't even aware of it, until we were on our way home and we met up with Swans fans in one of the motorway services and they gave us the terrible news.
Even though the Swans had won the League thanks to the draw gained at Rotherham that day. I can remember it was almost like an afterthought to most Swans I knew, all everyone seemed to be talking about, was your father Natalie, Terry Coles. It was a truly tragic event, rightly, overshadowing the football success.
I'll never forget too, during the next couple of matches at the Vetch, sitting in the Centre Stand, as I always did, looking across to the gap, the crowd had respectfully made for Terry, at the place on the North Bank where he normally stood. With that area, soon being festooned with all manner of scarves and Swans memorabilia to show the fans' respect and sympathy for a fellow Swans fan.
As, you know what? It could've been any one of us that got 'run down' by that police horse in that back lane that day.
I wish you all the best Natalie with your family's intentions to re-open a new and genuine investigation into the events of that day. |  | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 14:12 - Aug 27 with 2226 views | BarrySwan |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 13:13 - Aug 27 by TimBowen |
Hello Natalie,
I/we, as Swans fans, can only imagine how devastating a loss your dad's death was to you and your family. Not knowing your family, I've never been able to say this previously, and while obviously it's late, I'd like to offer my and my family's sincere condolences on your loss.
Recently, when the families of the 96 Liverpool fans were celebrating the verdict and being interviewed, I also thought about how, 'inappropriate actions' by police mounted officers led directly to your Dad losing his life that day. Although, that incident did not, to my knowledge/recollection, receive anything like the levels of investigation it deserved.
I say inappropriate actions 'by police mounted officers,' because they were directing/riding the horses. The horses didn't take it upon themselves, to gallop along that narrow lane at the back of 'Millmoor' that fateful day in May 2000.
I know that if I was directing/driving a car, along that lane and I'd taken a life, the very least I could expect to face, would be a manslaughter charge, or, causing death by dangerous driving. It appears, the officer(s) riding those horses that day, did not face that type of charge over their part in your dad's death.
I want to make this abundantly clear, I have no gripe against the police. This is not some politically motivated comment, I have several friends who are retired police officers and I respect the job police officers do on our behalf on a daily basis. However, the events of that day require a new and thorough investigation. And hopefully, by an impartial police authority, so hopefully some measure of closure can be provided for you and your family.
I was at the game at Millmoor that day, I remember all too well, the lane running at the back of 'our end' of the ground. I'd also been there previously, during the second leg of the 1988 play-off semi-final against Rotherham. That lane, to offer a comparison, was similar to the back lanes that divide the gardens on the Coronation Street opening credits. I vividly remember stretching my arms out and almost being able to touch both sides of the lane, such was it's narrowness. Personally, I believe it was grossly irresponsible of the officers to even attempt to ride a police horse, through the Swans fans trying to get to the turnstiles via that back lane.
I was already in the ground that day, before the incident occurred Natalie, so can't help in providing an eye witness account to help, should there be any new investigation. I wasn't even aware of it, until we were on our way home and we met up with Swans fans in one of the motorway services and they gave us the terrible news.
Even though the Swans had won the League thanks to the draw gained at Rotherham that day. I can remember it was almost like an afterthought to most Swans I knew, all everyone seemed to be talking about, was your father Natalie, Terry Coles. It was a truly tragic event, rightly, overshadowing the football success.
I'll never forget too, during the next couple of matches at the Vetch, sitting in the Centre Stand, as I always did, looking across to the gap, the crowd had respectfully made for Terry, at the place on the North Bank where he normally stood. With that area, soon being festooned with all manner of scarves and Swans memorabilia to show the fans' respect and sympathy for a fellow Swans fan.
As, you know what? It could've been any one of us that got 'run down' by that police horse in that back lane that day.
I wish you all the best Natalie with your family's intentions to re-open a new and genuine investigation into the events of that day. |
I know that this does not help Natalie's appeal for witnesses.
However, has any journalist ever considered the responsibility of Rotherham Football club and South Yorkshire police as to the obvious danger of that lane down the side of the ground that led to the away end.
I say this because the one and only reason that I didn't go to the game that day despite my mate ringing me up to see if I would go up with him was because i had been to the ground several years previously and was horrified at how potentially dangerous that lane was. I was there whilst hooliganism was still rife and my thoughts were "that this lane is a death trap if anything kicks off between rival supporters"
So if I had come to that conclusion from my previous one experience and refused to go to the game purely based on that judgement despite desperately wanting to go how come the local police hadn't.
When I heard the terrible news that my assessment had been proved tragically correct I was devastated but also angry that if I could predict the danger there how come Rotherham and more importantly the police who are responsible for crowd safety and policed the ground at every home game hadn't come to the same conclusion and taken measures to ensure that nothing like this could happen?
Surely journalists and and an enquiry need to also focus on which senior officers and Rotherham club officials had allowed this 'deathtrap' of a lane to remain in use without measures to make it safe? | | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 12:49 - Aug 28 with 2035 views | BytholWyn |
I'm afraid I don't have much to use to add, given that I didn't attend that day. However, I had been on that away terrace on previous occasions, so I can support the view that the long narrow brickwall lined alleyway that lead to the away end was totally unsafe, in general, let alone in the context of police horses riding down it.
I lived in Sheffield at the time and remember a Sheffield United fan posting a letter in the Sheffield Star following the tragic events of that day, voicing his concerns about the management of fans by South Yorkshire police of away fans. If I remember correctly he recounted a local derby with United where the away fans were blocked part way down the narrow alleyway after exiting the terrace at the end of the match (presumably to allow the home fans to disperse) - resulting in a dangerous bottleneck crush to develop that could easily have had a fatal outcome. It paints a picture of incompetence and inadequate risk evaluation on the part of South Yorkshire police.
What bugs me is the thought that had South Yorkshire police conducted a proper review of their procedures (or better still had allowed an independent review) following on from the Hillsborough disaster in 1989 - rather than trying to blame the Liverpool fans - then they might have come to realise the intrinsic danger to the public in their crowd control procedures. I don't want to trivialise the difficulties presented to the police in dealing with hooliganism, such a curse at the time, but it's hard to see what fit for purpose evaluation of risk could have concluded that it was a safe practice to send police horses down a narrow crowded alleyway.
I also cannot see any possible justification for all relevant paperwork not being disclosed by South Yorkshire police, especially in light of what the Hillsborough papers revealed. What reasonable alternative explanation coud there be for the decision not to release all relevant documents, other than there is something to hide that could lead to disciplinary action and/or litigation? [Post edited 28 Aug 2016 12:57]
|  | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 13:04 - Aug 28 with 2027 views | BytholWyn |
I've just thought of one thing Natalie that might be helpful. Have you approached those behind the Hillsborough disaster campaigning? I'm sure they would be willing to offer their assistance. There's a dedicated "Hillsborough Memorial Board" on the redandwhitekop forum. Perhaps a post there could be a useful starting point? http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=773d32j01bi745volk4tdf0d
Best of luck in your search for justice Natalie - I'd be surprised if there wasn't unsafe practice at the root of your father's untimely demise. | | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 21:57 - Aug 28 with 1900 views | Aquinas |
I've just googled Millmoor Lane and if the images i'm looking at are the correct lane, I am shocked at how narrow it is. |  | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 22:40 - Aug 28 with 1886 views | Catullus |
As I said in my post, there was barely room for the ambulance. And it was very crowded with so many Jacks being there. Taking very big horses down there has to be considered negligent. | |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 23:54 - Aug 28 with 1867 views | SS2013 |
Hi Nat ,I was there that day and used to stand by your father on the north bank in my early teens, he certainly wasn't a hooligan, just a normal man who enjoyed his football like the rest of us. |  |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 13:16 - Aug 29 with 1717 views | EasternJack |
Adding my voice to what's already been mentioned. Was there in '97 (I think) and thought the same on that narrow lane - a clear bottleneck that could barely contain the supporters, let alone police horses. |  |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 13:28 - Aug 30 with 1548 views | trampie |
Good luck in highlighting your fathers case Nat, take it all the way and don't give up, don't let the people that would rather sweep things under the carpet deter you. |  |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 00:15 - Apr 8 with 1048 views | Darran |
Congratulations on your award tonight Natalie your dad will be so proud of you. | |
| |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 00:28 - Apr 8 with 1019 views | swan65split |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 21:57 - Aug 28 by Aquinas |
I've just googled Millmoor Lane and if the images i'm looking at are the correct lane, I am shocked at how narrow it is. |
By Google Earth an average of 3.20 metres wide...... approx 10 1/2 ft.........one police horse approx 3-1/2 to ft wide.
theres a need for good solicitor representation! |  | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 07:33 - Apr 8 with 918 views | pencoedjack |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 00:15 - Apr 8 by Darran |
Congratulations on your award tonight Natalie your dad will be so proud of you. |
What award Dar ? | | | |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 12:37 - Apr 8 with 770 views | Dewi1jack |
| Terry Coles - help us get justice on 22:40 - Aug 28 by Catullus |
As I said in my post, there was barely room for the ambulance. And it was very crowded with so many Jacks being there. Taking very big horses down there has to be considered negligent. |
Taking weapons weighing around half a tonne (550ish Kgs) into any crowd is asking for trouble.
No horses should be around any crowd until they are actually required to restore the peace.
I have no problem with them being held in a truck or field close by (or served with a nice jacket potato and a sweet peppercorn sauce!)
Large animals will always be unpredictable, even properly fully trained ones. There's always a chance that something will 'spook' an animal.
And bringing an animal standing around 5 to 6 feet tall weighing in at half a tonne with metal shoes kicking out because of a crowd is just asking for trouble.
Remember a police dog at Forest taking a bite out of a 50 something disabled bloke because it could.
Pretty sure some police forces go out of their way to ensure trouble starts (GMP and Willy talking in French to them?)
We found out for sure on the way home, although the rumours that someone was in a bad way were circulating throughout the game.
Since that fateful day, I've become really sh1tscared of walking to any ground around or between horses. Mrs and daughter have had to stand either side of me before now (Leeds- horses were either side of the path from the busses to the away end).
As someone else has said "there but for the grace of God"
Whoever deployed horses down that lane knew the consequences of their action and obviously didn't give a flying.
"Only football fans aren't they? And we know they're all the lowest of the low even the women and kids"
At the very least that person should have been charged with manslaughter (reckless endangerment or is that only Scotland?)
If it was a business (and the Police are) the firm would be fined exceptionally heavily for causing an avoidable death by the HSE and Courts.
Hopefully, some day the family can get closure like the families from the Liverpool 96 did. |  |
| If you wake up breathing, thats a good start to your day and you'll make many thousands of people envious. |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
