| Essex Senior Cup 11:52 - Oct 22 with 4508 views | TheOldOakTree |
Being serious for once, should we be looking to win every game or is it just a silly cup that doesn’t matter? Are we ruining some of these kids careers by giving them the false idea that they are better than they are and heaping pressure on them when they cannot deliver?
A very strong U’s team were 3-0 down after 55 minutes against an Isthmian Premier league side. After hooking off Tovide we managed to score a single consolation goal. I guess it shows how wafer thin our squad is and why we are so susceptible when any of our key players get injured. Let’s be perfectly honest, a league club with a Cat2 academy that costs a reported £1.8 million a year should be capable of putting out a team that can comprehensively beat a side that is in the bottom half of the Isthmian Premier team, especially when they are playing at home. There are no excuses and sadly this is not a one-off, it is a true reflection of Florence Park.
In the desperate hope that we can make a few quid out of some of them, we fill the likes of Samson and Bradley's heads with notions that they are fantastic and will play at the top level, when they are probably the same level as Bonne. Motivation has always been a massively important part of any sport, but it’s a thin line between encouraging someone or causing them to despair or sulk when they cannot achieve the unrealistic heights that you have attributed to them.
Spouting constant crap about how the academy is so successful and how many young stars we’ve got, it’s not hard to see why they freeze under the pressure when they go a goal down to a pub team.
Have we ruined Samsons career? 3 months ago we hyped him so much he thought he was off to the bright lights, now he’s missing goals against Aveley. Is young Ronnie going to be allowed to develop into his full potential, or will we soon start spouting the normal bullshit so we can cash in? Cracking him up to be the next Phil Foden, filling his head with unrealistic dreams that may put too much pressure on him?
[Post edited 22 Oct 11:55]
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| Essex Senior Cup on 13:04 - Oct 22 with 4445 views | SparkfilmsTV |
The Essex Senior Cup would be on my shopping list if l had any involvement with the club.
Having seen the team we put out last night it is an absolute disgrace that they have been swept aside so easily.
I don't think Colchester United gives a xxxx about this local competition which is ( IMHO ) shameful.
As for some of those who have been through the structure at Florence Park ( and l personally know a few of them ), several years after being released they are not playing football at any level now.
A few months ago l was visited by a former Premiership footballer who had to retire early due to a serious injury and is now doing ( and enjoying ) building work.
He said he was 'brainwashed' while being in an academy from the age of eight years of age.
For the record - he appeared in European matches before he was using a digger on my property.
He told me he would be in trouble if he even got caught with a bag of crisps....maybe things have changed a little since then.
The Academies promise so much to so many but it can be devastating for some of the kids who are released and then spiral downwards to a life of crime. | | | |
| Essex Senior Cup on 13:16 - Oct 22 with 4457 views | RSCOSWORTH |
| Essex Senior Cup on 13:04 - Oct 22 by SparkfilmsTV |
The Essex Senior Cup would be on my shopping list if l had any involvement with the club.
Having seen the team we put out last night it is an absolute disgrace that they have been swept aside so easily.
I don't think Colchester United gives a xxxx about this local competition which is ( IMHO ) shameful.
As for some of those who have been through the structure at Florence Park ( and l personally know a few of them ), several years after being released they are not playing football at any level now.
A few months ago l was visited by a former Premiership footballer who had to retire early due to a serious injury and is now doing ( and enjoying ) building work.
He said he was 'brainwashed' while being in an academy from the age of eight years of age.
For the record - he appeared in European matches before he was using a digger on my property.
He told me he would be in trouble if he even got caught with a bag of crisps....maybe things have changed a little since then.
The Academies promise so much to so many but it can be devastating for some of the kids who are released and then spiral downwards to a life of crime. |
Surely the team that they put out last night shows that they do care about the competition? The fact that they got beaten is a different matter.
The documentary on the Crystal Palace academy certainly made for some interesting and sometimes painful viewing.
I think the builder you are referring to once played for Col U and was pretty decent for us during his time here as well. |  |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 13:37 - Oct 22 with 4455 views | TheOldOakTree |
There's some pretty interesting reasearch with very sobering statistics available on t'internet, but for a simple overview, if you G@@gle 'football academies failing' and read what Google AI Overview has to say, it should be concerning to anyone that cares.
Instead of making the rich, richer, the FA, EFL and Premiership need to wake up and address the issue, before more lives are ruined.
As for Colchester, I genuinely feel sad for the main man, having bought into the flawed concept and invested so heavily, that level of commitment desereves a better outcome.
....but for anyone with an anylitical mind, the statistics have always spoken volumes. Some of the Cat1 academies are so strong they will hoover up allmost all the best talent and with such a tiny percentage of students actually ending up as professionals, the whole setup is seriously flawed. [Post edited 22 Oct 15:34]
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| Essex Senior Cup on 13:44 - Oct 22 with 4429 views | SparkfilmsTV |
| Essex Senior Cup on 13:16 - Oct 22 by RSCOSWORTH |
Surely the team that they put out last night shows that they do care about the competition? The fact that they got beaten is a different matter.
The documentary on the Crystal Palace academy certainly made for some interesting and sometimes painful viewing.
I think the builder you are referring to once played for Col U and was pretty decent for us during his time here as well. |
The player l referred to was never involved with Colchester United.
He was at a London based Premiership Academy and explained to me in some detail the loneliness of being loaned out across the North West of England at Championship and First Division level around five times.
One of his fellow builders is an accomplished musician and l really enjoyed their company as the works progressed.
They both currently reside in Croydon.
It was really good to see them both excelling at a trade and reasserting a life pattern.
I supplied music, coffee and the odd bag of crisps. | | | |
| Essex Senior Cup on 13:51 - Oct 22 with 4439 views | RSCOSWORTH |
| Essex Senior Cup on 13:44 - Oct 22 by SparkfilmsTV |
The player l referred to was never involved with Colchester United.
He was at a London based Premiership Academy and explained to me in some detail the loneliness of being loaned out across the North West of England at Championship and First Division level around five times.
One of his fellow builders is an accomplished musician and l really enjoyed their company as the works progressed.
They both currently reside in Croydon.
It was really good to see them both excelling at a trade and reasserting a life pattern.
I supplied music, coffee and the odd bag of crisps. |
Thought you were referring to Matt Briggs, obviously not. And it seems he's moved on from building work to be a personal trainer. | |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 14:28 - Oct 22 with 4425 views | noah4x4 |
I didn’t go to the game, so cannot comment on the performance. However, isn’t the parallel the Vertu Trophy where Premier League under 21s teams often fail to compete with Division One/Two teams?
This wasn’t ever first team v first team. It’s men versus boys in a competition that means all to Aveley and little to Col U. More worrying is the form of Tovide. |  | | |
| Essex Senior Cup on 15:31 - Oct 22 with 4411 views | TheOldOakTree |
| Essex Senior Cup on 14:28 - Oct 22 by noah4x4 |
I didn’t go to the game, so cannot comment on the performance. However, isn’t the parallel the Vertu Trophy where Premier League under 21s teams often fail to compete with Division One/Two teams?
This wasn’t ever first team v first team. It’s men versus boys in a competition that means all to Aveley and little to Col U. More worrying is the form of Tovide. |
Good point about the Vertu comparison. Although, I think Aveley are in the bottom half of the 7th tier, so I assume many of their players would be part-time, as opposed to full time athletes?
We put out a side that was half U21s and half 1st team reserves, so on paper there should have been more than enough experience and quality.
As hattricks are in fashion at the moment, you would have hoped ST would have filled his boots, and it sounds like we had enough chances but it wasn't to be. I'm more convinced than ever that a loan away from the U's would do him good.
There were positives, Kiaon Lisbie continued the family tradition by tucking away a cross from Gordon and even better news, I believe Milton Oni played for nearly an hour.
Going back to the question of modern academies, the Elite Player Performance Plan has been around for about 13 years and it’s aim was to produce a greater number of higher-quality homegrown players in England. Looking at the Premier League, would you say it was working? Is the EFL better as a result of the academies? Is it worth the damage it does to so many young people?
Hundreds and hundreds of nine year olds signing for big clubs all believing they are going to be stars. Most with pushy parents, all of them under pressure to perform, many damaging or wearing out their bodies, diets, constant analysis, all most all of them cast aside as failures before they are 18 and all of it to feed the greed of modern day football.
It the shear numbers that are the problem, not just young players, but the enourmous numbers of coaches and back room staff. The quality all gets watered down because there are too many facilities all trying to produce elite players, when there is only so much real talent.
Take an academy like the U's. If it finds says two very young players that might make it, the academy has to take on at least another what ? 25 kids of the same age to create teams that the two decent prospects can play in. So thats 23 kids excited that they've signed for a professional club, all full of promise, all believing they can make it when in reality they'll most likely never be good enough, all working flat out to achieve what is for them unrealistic goals.
It’s not just the kids, many parents make massive sacrifices in time and money, under the false impression that their kid is truly talented, when many of them are just there to make up the numbers.
[Post edited 22 Oct 16:21]
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| Essex Senior Cup on 09:03 - Oct 23 with 4310 views | bwildered |
Pub team ? Aveley play in Isthiam Premier League, one step up at present from Maldon & Tiptree.
Yes the Essex Senior Cup is not high on the U’s priorities, and the team is usually made up of fringe, recovering and U21 players getting a game, so a settled side is almost nonexistent.
Every junior these days are told to follow the dreams, being a footballer is no different from previous decades and professions . Those who do not make the grade have more opportunity now than before in interim jobs at clubs than ever before. Many these days leave the game completely after failing to get full time contracts after being in the academy system, but clubs have encouraged them in a education and not to rely just on pitch careers.
Remember PL stating the youths were only good enough to clean his Maserati, (except one), and many decades ago a mate of mine went to day release at Chelmsford institute with U’s apprentices . [Post edited 23 Oct 9:05]
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| Essex Senior Cup on 11:45 - Oct 23 with 4279 views | TheOldOakTree |
It’s just as well the world is full of people with different opinions, each keeping the other in check and hopefully ensuring that society steers a path away from extremes. I fully accept that kids should have dreams and have the chance to reach them. Most of us don’t have the ability to reach our aspirations and disappointment has always been a part of life that’s best learnt early on. For every person that wins there has to be many losers. There’s nothing wrong with being competitive at a young age, encouraging the best, giving them the opportunity, but where is the line here? For you it hasn’t been reached, for me, we passed it years ago.
You say that being a footballer is no different from previous decades, I would strongly disagree. A long, long time ago, football was a sport played for fun, I appreciate that changed many decades ago, but the game today, like much of the world, is just a cesspit of greed that is getting rapidly worse. There is only one thing that is important today, and that is making as much money as possible and it doesn’t matter what damage is done along the way. That won’t change unless someone questions it.
IMHO, the whole system of elite academies has taken things to the extreme, to the point that it is now perverse and those too close cannot see it. We are taking about young children, not young adults. The pressure created by academies must be far, far greater, far more intense that the systems we had 20 years ago. Constantly setting targets, constant analysis, all at a young age. Some clubs now have pre academies for some as young as six. Do you really need to start training kids 6 years old to become a professional footballer?
It is all too extreme, all too intense. Overuse injuries at such a young age, mental and emotional strain from such unnecessarily high pressure. Kids burnt out and fed up with the game at such a young age. Social problems because of isolation from non-athlete peers and a narrow social life and all of this when 98% are going to fail. In my opinion, 9-year-old kids should be playing football for fun.
Suicide rates in children have increased by 50% in the last ten years. I’m not suggesting for one moment that football is to blame for this at all, but the world has become a very difficult place for children. It’s not like it was for us, we were allowed to be children, and football turning up the dial another notch isn’t going to help kids today.
And let’s be perfectly honest, why are we doing all this? Is it for the benefit of the children? Or is it for the benefit of the football industry that has been out of control for some time?
If the above isn’t enough to make us stop and think, the bit that does it for me is the compensation system, where another academy can offer parents a place for their kids to jump to another academy. i.e. a Cat 1 and take a kid from a Cat2. There are rates of compensation for under 9-year-olds, under 10 etc.
To anyone that cannot see beyond football, that must look perfectly fine. The original club should be paid for the money they have spent. To anyone that’s taken the blinkers off and taken two steps back, money is changing hands in what is effectively a trade in children, so that the second football club may ultimately gain from this child, either by having a decent player or by selling them. I have reservations about this, I appreciate that many people won’t.
How much of this is now about the kids dreams? Many cases it’s going to be about the parents’ dreams. Taking their young kid away from his/her friends to play football with a load of strangers, probably miles away. The parents now stressed because they have to drive miles to the new academy, the price of failure has now increased, the pressure on the kid has now increased, they’ve lost their friends, the targets have got greater, their parents’ expectations have got greater, and I ask again, why are we doing all this? What is the driving force behind it all? Is it for the benefit of the kids? Is it making football better? Is it worth it? | | | |
| Essex Senior Cup on 12:26 - Oct 23 with 4247 views | SparkfilmsTV |
| Essex Senior Cup on 11:45 - Oct 23 by TheOldOakTree |
It’s just as well the world is full of people with different opinions, each keeping the other in check and hopefully ensuring that society steers a path away from extremes. I fully accept that kids should have dreams and have the chance to reach them. Most of us don’t have the ability to reach our aspirations and disappointment has always been a part of life that’s best learnt early on. For every person that wins there has to be many losers. There’s nothing wrong with being competitive at a young age, encouraging the best, giving them the opportunity, but where is the line here? For you it hasn’t been reached, for me, we passed it years ago.
You say that being a footballer is no different from previous decades, I would strongly disagree. A long, long time ago, football was a sport played for fun, I appreciate that changed many decades ago, but the game today, like much of the world, is just a cesspit of greed that is getting rapidly worse. There is only one thing that is important today, and that is making as much money as possible and it doesn’t matter what damage is done along the way. That won’t change unless someone questions it.
IMHO, the whole system of elite academies has taken things to the extreme, to the point that it is now perverse and those too close cannot see it. We are taking about young children, not young adults. The pressure created by academies must be far, far greater, far more intense that the systems we had 20 years ago. Constantly setting targets, constant analysis, all at a young age. Some clubs now have pre academies for some as young as six. Do you really need to start training kids 6 years old to become a professional footballer?
It is all too extreme, all too intense. Overuse injuries at such a young age, mental and emotional strain from such unnecessarily high pressure. Kids burnt out and fed up with the game at such a young age. Social problems because of isolation from non-athlete peers and a narrow social life and all of this when 98% are going to fail. In my opinion, 9-year-old kids should be playing football for fun.
Suicide rates in children have increased by 50% in the last ten years. I’m not suggesting for one moment that football is to blame for this at all, but the world has become a very difficult place for children. It’s not like it was for us, we were allowed to be children, and football turning up the dial another notch isn’t going to help kids today.
And let’s be perfectly honest, why are we doing all this? Is it for the benefit of the children? Or is it for the benefit of the football industry that has been out of control for some time?
If the above isn’t enough to make us stop and think, the bit that does it for me is the compensation system, where another academy can offer parents a place for their kids to jump to another academy. i.e. a Cat 1 and take a kid from a Cat2. There are rates of compensation for under 9-year-olds, under 10 etc.
To anyone that cannot see beyond football, that must look perfectly fine. The original club should be paid for the money they have spent. To anyone that’s taken the blinkers off and taken two steps back, money is changing hands in what is effectively a trade in children, so that the second football club may ultimately gain from this child, either by having a decent player or by selling them. I have reservations about this, I appreciate that many people won’t.
How much of this is now about the kids dreams? Many cases it’s going to be about the parents’ dreams. Taking their young kid away from his/her friends to play football with a load of strangers, probably miles away. The parents now stressed because they have to drive miles to the new academy, the price of failure has now increased, the pressure on the kid has now increased, they’ve lost their friends, the targets have got greater, their parents’ expectations have got greater, and I ask again, why are we doing all this? What is the driving force behind it all? Is it for the benefit of the kids? Is it making football better? Is it worth it? |
This is a very interesting, considered and well written piece that deserves to be seen by a far wider audience. | | | |
| Essex Senior Cup on 13:38 - Oct 23 with 4246 views | bwildered |
A interesting read with a local connection - Ben Smith - Journeyman.
A young guys career through the system . | |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 14:41 - Oct 23 with 4232 views | RSCOSWORTH |
| Essex Senior Cup on 13:38 - Oct 23 by bwildered |
A interesting read with a local connection - Ben Smith - Journeyman.
A young guys career through the system . |
Ben Smith and I were the same age group. He played for Valley Green (Witham) and I played for Colchester Villa. At under 10's Valley Green were one of the best teams in the county by under 12's nearly their whole team had been signed up by various different professional teams. Lee Boylan, who went on to have prolific goalscoring record outside of the football league, was one of them. I think Ben had the best career out of all of them. | |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 16:47 - Oct 23 with 4212 views | thrillseeker |
| Essex Senior Cup on 11:45 - Oct 23 by TheOldOakTree |
It’s just as well the world is full of people with different opinions, each keeping the other in check and hopefully ensuring that society steers a path away from extremes. I fully accept that kids should have dreams and have the chance to reach them. Most of us don’t have the ability to reach our aspirations and disappointment has always been a part of life that’s best learnt early on. For every person that wins there has to be many losers. There’s nothing wrong with being competitive at a young age, encouraging the best, giving them the opportunity, but where is the line here? For you it hasn’t been reached, for me, we passed it years ago.
You say that being a footballer is no different from previous decades, I would strongly disagree. A long, long time ago, football was a sport played for fun, I appreciate that changed many decades ago, but the game today, like much of the world, is just a cesspit of greed that is getting rapidly worse. There is only one thing that is important today, and that is making as much money as possible and it doesn’t matter what damage is done along the way. That won’t change unless someone questions it.
IMHO, the whole system of elite academies has taken things to the extreme, to the point that it is now perverse and those too close cannot see it. We are taking about young children, not young adults. The pressure created by academies must be far, far greater, far more intense that the systems we had 20 years ago. Constantly setting targets, constant analysis, all at a young age. Some clubs now have pre academies for some as young as six. Do you really need to start training kids 6 years old to become a professional footballer?
It is all too extreme, all too intense. Overuse injuries at such a young age, mental and emotional strain from such unnecessarily high pressure. Kids burnt out and fed up with the game at such a young age. Social problems because of isolation from non-athlete peers and a narrow social life and all of this when 98% are going to fail. In my opinion, 9-year-old kids should be playing football for fun.
Suicide rates in children have increased by 50% in the last ten years. I’m not suggesting for one moment that football is to blame for this at all, but the world has become a very difficult place for children. It’s not like it was for us, we were allowed to be children, and football turning up the dial another notch isn’t going to help kids today.
And let’s be perfectly honest, why are we doing all this? Is it for the benefit of the children? Or is it for the benefit of the football industry that has been out of control for some time?
If the above isn’t enough to make us stop and think, the bit that does it for me is the compensation system, where another academy can offer parents a place for their kids to jump to another academy. i.e. a Cat 1 and take a kid from a Cat2. There are rates of compensation for under 9-year-olds, under 10 etc.
To anyone that cannot see beyond football, that must look perfectly fine. The original club should be paid for the money they have spent. To anyone that’s taken the blinkers off and taken two steps back, money is changing hands in what is effectively a trade in children, so that the second football club may ultimately gain from this child, either by having a decent player or by selling them. I have reservations about this, I appreciate that many people won’t.
How much of this is now about the kids dreams? Many cases it’s going to be about the parents’ dreams. Taking their young kid away from his/her friends to play football with a load of strangers, probably miles away. The parents now stressed because they have to drive miles to the new academy, the price of failure has now increased, the pressure on the kid has now increased, they’ve lost their friends, the targets have got greater, their parents’ expectations have got greater, and I ask again, why are we doing all this? What is the driving force behind it all? Is it for the benefit of the kids? Is it making football better? Is it worth it? |
 - nice piece TOOT | | | |
| Essex Senior Cup on 18:20 - Oct 23 with 4195 views | TheOldOakTree |
| Essex Senior Cup on 16:47 - Oct 23 by thrillseeker |
- nice piece TOOT |
Young George Best would never survive the system nowadays. Being brainwashed for years by mediocre ex-footballers, with their idea of how the game should be played. Being told his stats are no good by ip@d waving plonkers, he’d have been on the drink by the time he was 15 and we’d have never seen him.
Sorry George, if you don’t follow this high protein diet and work out in the gym, you’ll never make it as a pro, if your BMI doesn’t improve you’ll be out.
George, the stats prove you should have passed sideways then, not dribbled past 6 players.
Young Lorimer, how many times do we have to tell you, don’t shoot, 75.6325891% of goals from open play are scored within the 6 yard box.
Beckham, FFS pass it backwards, if you keep doing that, research shows that you have a 76.1256358% chance of giving possession away!!!
Stop hoofing the ball up to Drogba lads, he’ll only score and we won’t get to practice playing it out from the back.
Is this your fag end Cruyff!!!! Pack you're bags now.
Greaves, you’re not taking this serious!
I'm sorry Lineker we are going to have to let you go, you're not a child anymore, you're 10 now and you're still not putting in the effort. Our stats show that 47.3621% of the ground you cover is celebrating goals instead of tracking back. The best you can hope for is a low paid job in football media.
Stop blubbing Gascoinge, it's easy to understand. 4-4-2 switching to 4-1-2-1-2 with you at the base of the diamond was this morning. This afternoon you are third facet of the sapphire in a 3.75-1-1-£7.56+VAT formation.
Not all change is good! [Post edited 23 Oct 19:32]
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| Essex Senior Cup on 23:23 - Oct 23 with 4127 views | wessex_exile |
Superior teams (on paper) lose to inferior teams (on paper) all the time, literally every weekend. It's not a damning indictment on any academy system, it just happens. The better our academy, the better the quality of players we attract, whether on loan or home grown. The support network for these young lads can always improve, but I'm certain it's way better than it used to be for aspiring talent back in the day. |  |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 00:32 - Oct 24 with 4103 views | TheOldOakTree |
| Essex Senior Cup on 23:23 - Oct 23 by wessex_exile |
Superior teams (on paper) lose to inferior teams (on paper) all the time, literally every weekend. It's not a damning indictment on any academy system, it just happens. The better our academy, the better the quality of players we attract, whether on loan or home grown. The support network for these young lads can always improve, but I'm certain it's way better than it used to be for aspiring talent back in the day. |
I can see that good facilities would make other clubs happier to loan us players.
...and I will willingly concede that losing to Aveley in it's self is not a condemnation, but seriously.....
Watson, Danns, Garcia, Iwelumo, Cureton, arguable some of the best player we've ever had, certainly the most sucessful squad, none of them were bothered that our facilities were none existent. We didn't even have our own training ground. I'm only guessing, but I would think that money, location and length of contract are all most people would care about anything else is just a plus.
As for our academy attracting better players on permanent deals? Sadly, the opposite would seem true. Ever year we have to sell our best players to pay the bills.
This year it's even worse than normal, not only do we not have a single academy player in the starting line up, we don't have any that we can realistically sell anytime soon either. That is astonishing.
I fail to see how something that costs tens of millions but only returns hundreds of thousands, fails to provide players that can be used or sold can be considered as anything other than a total and utter disaster? It hasn't attracted players that wonderful. What point is it if it doesn't lift us up the league or make money?
I understand why we pretend it's an assett, like we pretent we are a jewel of the EFL, but reality would suggest a different story. [Post edited 24 Oct 0:41]
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| Essex Senior Cup on 00:57 - Oct 24 with 4077 views | wessex_exile |
| Essex Senior Cup on 00:32 - Oct 24 by TheOldOakTree |
I can see that good facilities would make other clubs happier to loan us players.
...and I will willingly concede that losing to Aveley in it's self is not a condemnation, but seriously.....
Watson, Danns, Garcia, Iwelumo, Cureton, arguable some of the best player we've ever had, certainly the most sucessful squad, none of them were bothered that our facilities were none existent. We didn't even have our own training ground. I'm only guessing, but I would think that money, location and length of contract are all most people would care about anything else is just a plus.
As for our academy attracting better players on permanent deals? Sadly, the opposite would seem true. Ever year we have to sell our best players to pay the bills.
This year it's even worse than normal, not only do we not have a single academy player in the starting line up, we don't have any that we can realistically sell anytime soon either. That is astonishing.
I fail to see how something that costs tens of millions but only returns hundreds of thousands, fails to provide players that can be used or sold can be considered as anything other than a total and utter disaster? It hasn't attracted players that wonderful. What point is it if it doesn't lift us up the league or make money?
I understand why we pretend it's an assett, like we pretent we are a jewel of the EFL, but reality would suggest a different story. [Post edited 24 Oct 0:41]
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What can anyone say? You are convinced the academy is a waste of money, the guy paying for it thinks otherwise. Buy him out and fund it how you’d prefer. | |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 10:00 - Oct 24 with 4030 views | TheOldOakTree |
| Essex Senior Cup on 00:57 - Oct 24 by wessex_exile |
What can anyone say? You are convinced the academy is a waste of money, the guy paying for it thinks otherwise. Buy him out and fund it how you’d prefer. |
Wow, I never thought I’d win the argument that easy, but if we’ve got to ‘you buy the club then’, I’ll take that as a win
ONLY JOKING!!!!
Just to clarify, I’m anti all academies, not just ours, IMHO the whole system, as it stands today is complete bollox.
The whole idea was to provide better and more homegrown talent, particularly for the Premier League and national team. Can anyone honestly say it’s worked? 70% of Prem squad players are foreigners, and here’s the best bit, the remaining 30 are subject to positive discrimination anyway. All 20 of the top clubs must have 8 homegrown players in their squad, so there can never be more than 70% foreigners. I don’t have figures, on the number that make the starting line ups, but I guess the figures are even worse.
Why hasn’t it made much difference? I can only imagine that it’s because there is only so much talent, if you are good enough you will make it, coaching the crap out of a kid that isn’t gifted isn’t likely to work. In fact there’s the possibility that the intensity from such a young age could put kids off.
If we win the next three world cups I’ll tuck in to humble pie.
‘You are convinced the academy is a waste of money, the guy paying for it thinks otherwise’ I’m sure he did think that at the start and as I’ve said before, I have maximum respect for his investment and commitment, if any L2 owner deserves success, it must be him. From the main mans recent spat with Jordan, I think it’s fair to say he speaks for all of us about the merits of the football pyramid.
If you read RC’s comments, it confirms my suspitions that the whole system is total bollox for a small club like ours:
https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/sport/25545809.colchester-united-robbie-cowling-b
“Aside from the community work we do, we have an EPPP Cat Two academy that cost us £1.8m a year to run”
“But the system that’s there, there’s like this vacuuming up of the talent and the way that the talent can be taken from those teams”
“I think what we’re looking for is a fairer way of getting compensated for the value we have”
A small club can find a potential star and sign them up at a young age, but as I’ve always said, a bigger club can turn up and whisk that kid away and there’s nothing the little club can do. Compensation is paid, but the amounts are very small when you compare it to the reported £1.8M a year.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elite_Player_Performance_Plan
https://www.chrisplatts.co.uk/football-academies-are-a-business-and-your-child-i
Reading between the lines, it’s not hard to see why we are where we are at Colchester.
Have we been shafted by signing up to a really shit scheme that doesn’t favour us? If that’s the case it’s a catch 22 situation, you’re stuck with it, you’ve spent so much time and money and so many peoples jobs depend upon it, you can only hope it changes, because you cannot walk away.
So, IMO, the whole system doesn’t work any better than the old way, in many cases does more harm than good, has the potential to be a disaster for small clubs, add to that the potential significant increase on mental health problems, as well as being (for some), slightly dodgy on moral grounds (when money is changing hands for the rights to 9 year olds).
Apart from that, I’m all in favour!
This is not Col U or RC bashing, quite the opposite. I’ve said far too much on the subject and will now wind my neck in for a while. [Post edited 24 Oct 10:07]
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| Essex Senior Cup on 10:10 - Oct 24 with 4010 views | RSCOSWORTH |
I would imagine that it's now tougher than ever for us to take a local home-grown player and take them through the process into the first team and then sell for millions. The bigger clubs seem to have ever growing academies hoovering up any young player that looks like they might have a bit of talent or potential. Look at Todd Miller, he made one appearance for us before going to Brighton where he never played and after a few loans has been tumbling down the divisions ever since. I do wonder if his career would have been different had he stayed here. As it was we got him from Dagenham at under 14 level so it wasn't like he'd been here since he was eight years old. Like you allude to in an earlier post these clubs have very little regard for these young boys/men. It's a case of chuck out a massive net with the hope of catching a big one but with no care for the little ones that are also caught in that net and ultimately thrown back. Obviously we have benefitted from the recruit many and discard nearly as many approach with players like Junior and Poku. Which was similar to how we picked up Danns, Garcia and Yeates all those years ago. Ultimately our academy doesn't work as a business model but over the years it has provided us with players that have either gone on to be regulars in the first team and/or been sold, for an undisclosed amount of course. I've always felt it's been a bit of a self indulgent project for Robbie and maybe he did it in the hope of unearthing the next Steven Gerrard or Harry Kane or maybe he just wanted to club to be somewhere that young players would want to come and see as a place to further their careers. I've never had a problem with it as long as it doesn't affect the first team budget, which I believe it doesn't, and that the first team coach/manager isn't duty bound to pick youth team players. | |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 10:23 - Oct 24 with 4009 views | RSCOSWORTH |
My view on academies is that they shouldn't exist under a certain age level, maybe 12, and that they shouldn't replace grass roots football but be an extension of it almost like representative teams. Col U should be recruiting their players to represent them from the local teams and leagues and that's it. Also I think the attitude towards them and what they're likely to achieve needs to change. Players should enjoy the academy experience and represent the club with pride and joy but have very little expectations that they'll become a professional footballer. Changes like this will never happen though as the greed and money that's at the very top level of football continues to have a negative affect on the rest of the football pyramid. | |
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| Essex Senior Cup on 16:29 - Oct 24 with 3907 views | wessex_exile |
| Essex Senior Cup on 10:00 - Oct 24 by TheOldOakTree |
Wow, I never thought I’d win the argument that easy, but if we’ve got to ‘you buy the club then’, I’ll take that as a win
ONLY JOKING!!!!
Just to clarify, I’m anti all academies, not just ours, IMHO the whole system, as it stands today is complete bollox.
The whole idea was to provide better and more homegrown talent, particularly for the Premier League and national team. Can anyone honestly say it’s worked? 70% of Prem squad players are foreigners, and here’s the best bit, the remaining 30 are subject to positive discrimination anyway. All 20 of the top clubs must have 8 homegrown players in their squad, so there can never be more than 70% foreigners. I don’t have figures, on the number that make the starting line ups, but I guess the figures are even worse.
Why hasn’t it made much difference? I can only imagine that it’s because there is only so much talent, if you are good enough you will make it, coaching the crap out of a kid that isn’t gifted isn’t likely to work. In fact there’s the possibility that the intensity from such a young age could put kids off.
If we win the next three world cups I’ll tuck in to humble pie.
‘You are convinced the academy is a waste of money, the guy paying for it thinks otherwise’ I’m sure he did think that at the start and as I’ve said before, I have maximum respect for his investment and commitment, if any L2 owner deserves success, it must be him. From the main mans recent spat with Jordan, I think it’s fair to say he speaks for all of us about the merits of the football pyramid.
If you read RC’s comments, it confirms my suspitions that the whole system is total bollox for a small club like ours:
https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/sport/25545809.colchester-united-robbie-cowling-b
“Aside from the community work we do, we have an EPPP Cat Two academy that cost us £1.8m a year to run”
“But the system that’s there, there’s like this vacuuming up of the talent and the way that the talent can be taken from those teams”
“I think what we’re looking for is a fairer way of getting compensated for the value we have”
A small club can find a potential star and sign them up at a young age, but as I’ve always said, a bigger club can turn up and whisk that kid away and there’s nothing the little club can do. Compensation is paid, but the amounts are very small when you compare it to the reported £1.8M a year.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elite_Player_Performance_Plan
https://www.chrisplatts.co.uk/football-academies-are-a-business-and-your-child-i
Reading between the lines, it’s not hard to see why we are where we are at Colchester.
Have we been shafted by signing up to a really shit scheme that doesn’t favour us? If that’s the case it’s a catch 22 situation, you’re stuck with it, you’ve spent so much time and money and so many peoples jobs depend upon it, you can only hope it changes, because you cannot walk away.
So, IMO, the whole system doesn’t work any better than the old way, in many cases does more harm than good, has the potential to be a disaster for small clubs, add to that the potential significant increase on mental health problems, as well as being (for some), slightly dodgy on moral grounds (when money is changing hands for the rights to 9 year olds).
Apart from that, I’m all in favour!
This is not Col U or RC bashing, quite the opposite. I’ve said far too much on the subject and will now wind my neck in for a while. [Post edited 24 Oct 10:07]
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Haha - I was going to bed, that was about as much of a measured response as I could muster at the time | |
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