| Through the Chair 20:50 - Apr 22 with 2664 views | Myke |
Why does Holloway keep stating publicly that every time Chair plays we have lost . Like as if he boy was solely responsible for us getting beat. Must do wonders for his self-confidence. |  | | |  |
| Through the Chair on 21:02 - Apr 22 with 2614 views | Northernr |
It's an odd one isn't it. I think what Holloway is trying to communicate in his own way is he knows he's got a good player on his hands, wants to give him a chance, but doesn't quite know where and when.
On that I make him right. Chair is one of those slightly annoying modern footballers who isn't quick enough to be a winger, isn't defensively good enough to be a central midfielder, doesn't score enough or have the instincts to play up front, and so is yet another 'ten'. We seem to be producing these as a club, country and sport by the fcking boatload but, at most, a team has room for one of them - and we've got Freeman and Eze ahead of him in those stakes.
As Dave B points out when people say "pick your best starting 11" as a criticism of Holloway - what exactly is that? We could probabnly all name our best back four but ahead of that we've got Luongo, Scowen, Freeman, Wszolek, Chair, Samuel, Manning, Smyth, Sylla, Eze, and Smith who would all feature on people's lists. So it is difficult to juggle it, and a few of those - Chair, Eze in particular - are proper sort of luxury players that need to be carefully selected with adequate safeguards.
That's what I think he meant, and how I took it, rather than him saying "we lose every time I pick him". But can see how it was taken that way. Much like his team selections, he could do with just simplfying the way he speaks (bit rich coming from me). In his post match interview on the official site yesterday it's seven minutes long and there's only two questions! I think I managed about a dozen in 90 minutes when I interviewed him at the start of the season.
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| Through the Chair on 21:23 - Apr 22 with 2570 views | Myke |
| Through the Chair on 21:02 - Apr 22 by Northernr |
It's an odd one isn't it. I think what Holloway is trying to communicate in his own way is he knows he's got a good player on his hands, wants to give him a chance, but doesn't quite know where and when.
On that I make him right. Chair is one of those slightly annoying modern footballers who isn't quick enough to be a winger, isn't defensively good enough to be a central midfielder, doesn't score enough or have the instincts to play up front, and so is yet another 'ten'. We seem to be producing these as a club, country and sport by the fcking boatload but, at most, a team has room for one of them - and we've got Freeman and Eze ahead of him in those stakes.
As Dave B points out when people say "pick your best starting 11" as a criticism of Holloway - what exactly is that? We could probabnly all name our best back four but ahead of that we've got Luongo, Scowen, Freeman, Wszolek, Chair, Samuel, Manning, Smyth, Sylla, Eze, and Smith who would all feature on people's lists. So it is difficult to juggle it, and a few of those - Chair, Eze in particular - are proper sort of luxury players that need to be carefully selected with adequate safeguards.
That's what I think he meant, and how I took it, rather than him saying "we lose every time I pick him". But can see how it was taken that way. Much like his team selections, he could do with just simplfying the way he speaks (bit rich coming from me). In his post match interview on the official site yesterday it's seven minutes long and there's only two questions! I think I managed about a dozen in 90 minutes when I interviewed him at the start of the season.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Oh fair enough Clive, I take your point. I was reading it at face -value and thought he was being somewhat disingenuous to the lad. Another 'Number 10' just what we need! And so far removed from the original of the species: Marsh, Bowles even Wegerlie. Maybe we should have retired the number 10 shirt after Roy left.! | | | |
| Through the Chair on 21:30 - Apr 22 with 2546 views | Northernr |
| Through the Chair on 21:23 - Apr 22 by Myke |
Oh fair enough Clive, I take your point. I was reading it at face -value and thought he was being somewhat disingenuous to the lad. Another 'Number 10' just what we need! And so far removed from the original of the species: Marsh, Bowles even Wegerlie. Maybe we should have retired the number 10 shirt after Roy left.! |
Well no I agree it's unhelpful to point out that we always lose when he plays, but maybe the lad's a bit full of it, maybe they're trying to toughen him up, maybe I'm just making excuses for him.
I do think it's a problem in the modern game, Arsenal an absolute prime example, of breeding scores and scores of these tippy tappy, flicky tricky, players who think it's all about showboat on Soccer AM who all think they're going to play 'ten'. Arsenal have got about a dozen of them. That's why I like little Smyth - get to the byline and get a cross in, or get into the penalty box and get a shot away.
Impey's really good on this if you ever get the chance to hear him talk about it. When he was a young winger in non league his manager at Yeading told him he had to get to the byline and deliver a cross ten times (I think) a half. And that was his job, as it should be. His trial for QPR was in a reserve game at Brentford and he was gutted at full time because he'd only got there and crossed half a dozen times in the whole game. QPR signed him straight afterwards, and if they hadn't Brentford wanted to.
We don't breed proper centre backs any more, everybody wants to be a Jon Stones, and that's great, but you have to be a good team to accomodate that, and not everybody is a good team. We don't breed proper wingers, poacher strikers, goalscoring target men, ratting central midfielders any more. We just seem to create a whole load of players that struggle to fit into a team, but can do a lovely rainbow flick. By 'we' I mean football in general, not QPR.
Its another product of young players pisballing about playing non-competitive academy football and never actually mucking in and playing some proper, hard as nails, lower league stuff. | | | |
| Through the Chair on 21:43 - Apr 22 with 2512 views | CamberleyR |
| Through the Chair on 21:30 - Apr 22 by Northernr |
Well no I agree it's unhelpful to point out that we always lose when he plays, but maybe the lad's a bit full of it, maybe they're trying to toughen him up, maybe I'm just making excuses for him.
I do think it's a problem in the modern game, Arsenal an absolute prime example, of breeding scores and scores of these tippy tappy, flicky tricky, players who think it's all about showboat on Soccer AM who all think they're going to play 'ten'. Arsenal have got about a dozen of them. That's why I like little Smyth - get to the byline and get a cross in, or get into the penalty box and get a shot away.
Impey's really good on this if you ever get the chance to hear him talk about it. When he was a young winger in non league his manager at Yeading told him he had to get to the byline and deliver a cross ten times (I think) a half. And that was his job, as it should be. His trial for QPR was in a reserve game at Brentford and he was gutted at full time because he'd only got there and crossed half a dozen times in the whole game. QPR signed him straight afterwards, and if they hadn't Brentford wanted to.
We don't breed proper centre backs any more, everybody wants to be a Jon Stones, and that's great, but you have to be a good team to accomodate that, and not everybody is a good team. We don't breed proper wingers, poacher strikers, goalscoring target men, ratting central midfielders any more. We just seem to create a whole load of players that struggle to fit into a team, but can do a lovely rainbow flick. By 'we' I mean football in general, not QPR.
Its another product of young players pisballing about playing non-competitive academy football and never actually mucking in and playing some proper, hard as nails, lower league stuff. |
Wouldn't it be 10 times a game? 10 a half would be one every four and a half minutes. You'd need some stamina to do that! [Post edited 22 Apr 2018 21:43]
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| Through the Chair on 21:50 - Apr 22 with 2468 views | Roller |
Perhaps Impey could have a word with Wszolek whose reluctance to deliver even one cross a match is really starting to grate with me. |  | | |
| Through the Chair on 22:38 - Apr 22 with 2335 views | Myke |
I loved Impey as a player. Bright (and Shidopo) are both direst old-fashioned wingers too. With one of these on the left, Smyth on the right, Freeman, Luongo and Scowen in between them, with either Smith or Sylla up top, we wouldn't need a number 10. Hell, we might even score a few goals too! | | | |
| Through the Chair on 00:00 - Apr 23 with 2227 views | smegma |
| Through the Chair on 21:30 - Apr 22 by Northernr |
Well no I agree it's unhelpful to point out that we always lose when he plays, but maybe the lad's a bit full of it, maybe they're trying to toughen him up, maybe I'm just making excuses for him.
I do think it's a problem in the modern game, Arsenal an absolute prime example, of breeding scores and scores of these tippy tappy, flicky tricky, players who think it's all about showboat on Soccer AM who all think they're going to play 'ten'. Arsenal have got about a dozen of them. That's why I like little Smyth - get to the byline and get a cross in, or get into the penalty box and get a shot away.
Impey's really good on this if you ever get the chance to hear him talk about it. When he was a young winger in non league his manager at Yeading told him he had to get to the byline and deliver a cross ten times (I think) a half. And that was his job, as it should be. His trial for QPR was in a reserve game at Brentford and he was gutted at full time because he'd only got there and crossed half a dozen times in the whole game. QPR signed him straight afterwards, and if they hadn't Brentford wanted to.
We don't breed proper centre backs any more, everybody wants to be a Jon Stones, and that's great, but you have to be a good team to accomodate that, and not everybody is a good team. We don't breed proper wingers, poacher strikers, goalscoring target men, ratting central midfielders any more. We just seem to create a whole load of players that struggle to fit into a team, but can do a lovely rainbow flick. By 'we' I mean football in general, not QPR.
Its another product of young players pisballing about playing non-competitive academy football and never actually mucking in and playing some proper, hard as nails, lower league stuff. |
Good point about Impeys influence. He has been mentoring Chay Tilt at under 23 level. You notice Impey usually makes a bee line for Chay as players leave the pitch at half time. Again as they emerge for the second half they are both in deep conversation. Chay will go far if he heeds the advice. | | | |
| Through the Chair on 06:55 - Apr 23 with 2047 views | stevec |
| Through the Chair on 21:02 - Apr 22 by Northernr |
It's an odd one isn't it. I think what Holloway is trying to communicate in his own way is he knows he's got a good player on his hands, wants to give him a chance, but doesn't quite know where and when.
On that I make him right. Chair is one of those slightly annoying modern footballers who isn't quick enough to be a winger, isn't defensively good enough to be a central midfielder, doesn't score enough or have the instincts to play up front, and so is yet another 'ten'. We seem to be producing these as a club, country and sport by the fcking boatload but, at most, a team has room for one of them - and we've got Freeman and Eze ahead of him in those stakes.
As Dave B points out when people say "pick your best starting 11" as a criticism of Holloway - what exactly is that? We could probabnly all name our best back four but ahead of that we've got Luongo, Scowen, Freeman, Wszolek, Chair, Samuel, Manning, Smyth, Sylla, Eze, and Smith who would all feature on people's lists. So it is difficult to juggle it, and a few of those - Chair, Eze in particular - are proper sort of luxury players that need to be carefully selected with adequate safeguards.
That's what I think he meant, and how I took it, rather than him saying "we lose every time I pick him". But can see how it was taken that way. Much like his team selections, he could do with just simplfying the way he speaks (bit rich coming from me). In his post match interview on the official site yesterday it's seven minutes long and there's only two questions! I think I managed about a dozen in 90 minutes when I interviewed him at the start of the season.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Totally agree, sick to death of watching players for years and still having no idea where their best position is.
Seems to me this disease crept into the game when one up front became fashionable. True number 10’s were fowards, Stan, Goddard, Stainrod and so on.
As long as there’s five man midfields this problem isn’t going to go away. They’re never going to change the rules but would like to see an area in oppos half between half way line and 30 yards from goal where you have to have at least the two most advanced players in that area at any one time. Would see the death of three at the back and maybe spread the game out to some extent.
Maybe an age thing but most games pass me by these days whereas I can recall memorable games more easily from the past. |  | | |
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| Through the Chair on 07:07 - Apr 23 with 2026 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| Through the Chair on 21:43 - Apr 22 by CamberleyR |
Wouldn't it be 10 times a game? 10 a half would be one every four and a half minutes. You'd need some stamina to do that! [Post edited 22 Apr 2018 21:43]
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As it would be for Smith to get his noggins in to the box, on to something and then out again 40 times a game! He’d need a defibrillator at some stage during the second half. |  |
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| Through the Chair on 08:23 - Apr 23 with 1884 views | smegma |
You could argue we lose every time Ingram plays. | | | |
| Through the Chair on 08:57 - Apr 23 with 1840 views | simmo |
I think the problem with players being in-between lots of positions is about flexibility. Players now are told/taught that they have to be tactially flexible and able to play more than one position. When you think about it, it's right (although I am not a fan), because with so many managers coming and going, if you're at a club for 3 years you're likely to play for 2-3 managers in that time, each with their own ideas on how to play and what they need from you.
What if you're an out and out winger but the new manager plays wing backs or inverted wingers? What if you're a poaching number 9 but the new gaffer plays 1 up top? I guess it's about making sure that if the ground beneath your feet changes, you can fit into something new and keep your place. |  |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| Through the Chair on 12:23 - Apr 23 with 1702 views | WatfordR |
| Through the Chair on 08:57 - Apr 23 by simmo |
I think the problem with players being in-between lots of positions is about flexibility. Players now are told/taught that they have to be tactially flexible and able to play more than one position. When you think about it, it's right (although I am not a fan), because with so many managers coming and going, if you're at a club for 3 years you're likely to play for 2-3 managers in that time, each with their own ideas on how to play and what they need from you.
What if you're an out and out winger but the new manager plays wing backs or inverted wingers? What if you're a poaching number 9 but the new gaffer plays 1 up top? I guess it's about making sure that if the ground beneath your feet changes, you can fit into something new and keep your place. |
Personally I think it's far more to do with the vast majority of head coaches/managers in this country being either unable or unwilling to coach their teams to be offensive effectively. I'm quite certain most of them would be happy to play without a goal scoring striker upfront as long as the front man is prepared to run around closing down the opposition defenders. Then take their chances from set pieces.
Regarding our lot, does anyone really feel that there is much pattern to our play when in possession? By which I mean, is it obvious from the second the goalie has the ball in his hands that we have a default plan as to what we are going to do to initiate an attack? Does it look as though full backs immediately pull wide to receive the ball, does it look as though the midfielders are moving into positions to support or create space, does it look like the forwards are anticipating where they need to be to make the most of lay offs from the target man? Or does it all look like players simply "making it up" as we go along? How often do we create chances from opening up the opposition?
Compare that to the emphasis that is put on defending; everyone knows where they should be, who they should be picking up, what their role is. Olly talks about number 10s losing us games because they don't trackback, but that surely isn't where the emphasis on their game needs to be.
I don't attend many games these due to work commitments, but got to the Reading game a few weeks back. For all our attempts on goal (27 I seem to remember), there really weren't many that constituted clear cut chances created from within 12 yards, maybe Washington just after they scored, and of course the penalty. Eze came on and immediately looked a different class with the ball at his feet, but he was collecting it from WAY too deep. Once Smyth and Washington went off, Smith was isolated up front, no one really looking to feed off bits and pieces around him. Why? I just didn't see any evidence of players really working to a plan.
I suspect the problem is that it's always going to be easier to coach players to defend effectively than to attack effectively - because numbers in defence always outweigh numbers in attack , and it's perceived as a better percentage play by managers. But to be honest, I just think it's a bit lazy and a bit of a cop out. |  | | |
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