Forum | Lumley cost us again by welwynranger

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Lumley cost us again 21:58 - Nov 22 with 9891 views

I am sick of it game after game. Why can't he just clear it as far away as possible. How many points has it cost us so far.

Lumley cost us again on 12:09 - Nov 23 with 1987 views

BazzaInTheLoft

Lumley cost us again on 12:01 - Nov 23 by paulparker
Sorry but he has been poor for well over a year We need to get rid of him if we get the chance, he is 25 and not going to improve anytime soon A decent goalkeeper should save you 10 points a season not cost you 10 points He couldn’t sense danger if a bunson burner was lit under his feet he puts the defence on edge

That covers his whole playing career with us essentially. Are you sure that’s fair?

Lumley cost us again on 12:14 - Nov 23 with 1971 views

Dorse

We need a sacrifice. The gods demand blood. Lumley is clearly the prettiest of the squad. He should be pleased to be an offering. What's the problem? Get the Wicker Man built and we're good.

'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!'

Lumley cost us again on 12:16 - Nov 23 with 1965 views

paulparker

Lumley cost us again on 12:09 - Nov 23 by BazzaInTheLoft
That covers his whole playing career with us essentially. Are you sure that’s fair?

I want the lad to succeed but he isn’t up to it and is costing us points, he has had enough games and chances to prove himself but he isn’t good enough

And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles Brian Moore

Lumley cost us again on 12:21 - Nov 23 with 1960 views

BazzaInTheLoft

Lumley cost us again on 12:16 - Nov 23 by paulparker
I want the lad to succeed but he isn’t up to it and is costing us points, he has had enough games and chances to prove himself but he isn’t good enough

I agree he shouldn’t be playing, but I put it down to a bad patch in his career rather than a ability deficit.

Lumley cost us again on 13:17 - Nov 23 with 1885 views

Ned_Kennedys

Lumley cost us again on 11:08 - Nov 23 by superhoopdownunder
I don't know the answer to our goalkeeper situation - but have little or no confidence in either Lumley or Kelly Lumley concedes on average 2.5 goals per game Kelly 3.5 goals per game I think Lumley is a better shot stopper Kelly marginally better with the ball at his feet

Lumley makes loads more errors overall than Kelly, a lot of which have directly led to goals.

Lumley cost us again on 13:20 - Nov 23 with 1902 views

Benny_the_Ball

I must say I'm growing a little weary of MW's insistence that the blame lies elsewhere. Whilst I understand the need to protect the squad in public, it's pretty obvious that individual mistakes are costing us matches. If that's down to the tactics then MW should tweak it to suit the players he currently has at his disposal. When QPR buy better players that are comfortable with playing through the lines he can then revert to a more expansive philosophy.

Warnock employed a slightly more pragmatic approach in our championship winning season but the football was no less enjoyable to watch.

Lumley cost us again on 14:15 - Nov 23 with 1824 views

BazzaInTheLoft

Lumley cost us again on 13:20 - Nov 23 by Benny_the_Ball

I’ve copied in the post match interview for you here Benny, because I cannot find a single utterance throughout where MW puts the blame on anybody. I’m not sure you’ll ever find a manger that will self flagellate to a Camera.

https://www.qpr.co.uk/videos/interviews/warburton-reacts-to-fulham-defeat/

We need to be careful with what we say, because we really can’t afford another manager change. Not saying this is what people are calling for, but I’ve detected some grumblings.

I still maintain this is the most exciting QPR side I’ve watched for a long time, fck ups aside this has been a great season.

[Post edited 23 Nov 2019 14:34]

Lumley cost us again on 14:37 - Nov 23 with 1783 views

BazzaInTheLoft

Lumley cost us again on 12:14 - Nov 23 by Dorse
We need a sacrifice. The gods demand blood. Lumley is clearly the prettiest of the squad. He should be pleased to be an offering. What's the problem? Get the Wicker Man built and we're good.

My missus thought Lumley was Green the other day and asked if he had been through a illness ðŸ˜†

Lumley cost us again on 14:38 - Nov 23 with 1782 views

Antti_Heinola

Lumley cost us again on 13:20 - Nov 23 by Benny_the_Ball

You cannot compare it to Warnock, Benny, come on. It's easy to be pragmatic when you have the money and talent he had. Not saying he didn't do a brilliant job, he did, but if you literally picked up Faurlin and Derry from that team and dropped them into this we'd be 2nd or 3rd in the league with no change to our system or tactics.

Bare bones.

Lumley cost us again on 15:05 - Nov 23 with 1743 views

Boston

Lumley’s mistake is that he isn’t supplying the match ball. When we go ahead he can then pick it up, say “it’s mine” and go home....with his jumper.

[Post edited 23 Nov 2019 15:06]

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Lumley cost us again on 15:07 - Nov 23 with 1737 views

PunteR

Lumley cost us again on 14:38 - Nov 23 by Antti_Heinola
You cannot compare it to Warnock, Benny, come on. It's easy to be pragmatic when you have the money and talent he had. Not saying he didn't do a brilliant job, he did, but if you literally picked up Faurlin and Derry from that team and dropped them into this we'd be 2nd or 3rd in the league with no change to our system or tactics.

I think you need more than just Faurlin and Derry dropped into this team for us to be 2nd or 3rd. Man for man that team was far better. Probably the weakest links in that team were arguably Gorks and Connolly but with Derry and Faurlin in front of them they got away with it.

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Lumley cost us again on 15:10 - Nov 23 with 1735 views

Benny_the_Ball

Lumley cost us again on 14:15 - Nov 23 by BazzaInTheLoft

[Post edited 23 Nov 2019 14:34]

"We've given soft goals away all season but mistakes are not just the obvious ones you see. It's also us being loose in front of goal and not taking our chances. It's not about one player - our keeper's made some great saves."

It's not just this interview but previous ones as well where MW defends individual mistakes by emphasising that the fault for goals conceded lies away from our defence and goalkeepers. When I asked him at the fans forum about the lack of clean sheets, MW pointed to mistakes made further up field in a passage of play where ultimately the Leeds player didn't even score!

The fact is we're in late November and QPR are the only team across all 4 divisions in all competitions yet to have kept a clean sheet. And it's not just the odd goal because we've conceded 2 or more goals in 9 consecutive league games. Those are pretty damning statistics but Warburton appears unmoved. This gives me little confidence that he is seriously trying to address the problem and adds weight to the argument presented by fans of previous clubs he's managed that he does not waver from Plan A.

For balance, I should point out that I like Warburton. I championed his appointment on more than one occasion, I'm pleased that we finally managed to appoint him and I want him to stay. However that doesn't mean that we as fans should tip-toe around burning issues. Constructive criticism enables continual improvement. It is NOT tantamount to a manager out campaign and I would like to think that most fans are capable of making the distinction.

[Post edited 23 Nov 2019 15:19]

Lumley cost us again on 16:48 - Nov 23 with 1661 views

BrianMcCarthy

Lumley cost us again on 15:10 - Nov 23 by Benny_the_Ball

[Post edited 23 Nov 2019 15:19]

I think that's a very fair post, Benny.

But I'll ask you a question, and not being nasty or snide - what should he be saying in interviews that he isn't?

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Lumley cost us again on 17:09 - Nov 23 with 1639 views

Antti_Heinola

Lumley cost us again on 15:07 - Nov 23 by PunteR
I think you need more than just Faurlin and Derry dropped into this team for us to be 2nd or 3rd. Man for man that team was far better. Probably the weakest links in that team were arguably Gorks and Connolly but with Derry and Faurlin in front of them they got away with it.

it was far better - it won the league. But we're talking about the difference in three games here (at least before this weekend) and I think it's absolutely fair to say that peak Derry and Faurlin would have, for example, helped us secure the win v Boro, the win v Reading and perhaps even a point v Swansea. There's 5 points immediately, and we're 7 off third now after this weekend.
Not saying with them we would *finish* 2nd or 3rd. But we would be doing 5-7 points better imo - you made my point for me: conolly and Gorkss were probably our weakest players, although both very good, but had the luxury of those two in front of them.

Bare bones.

Lumley cost us again on 17:10 - Nov 23 with 1637 views

VancouverHoop

Lumley cost us again on 15:10 - Nov 23 by Benny_the_Ball

[Post edited 23 Nov 2019 15:19]

Either the players don't understand what they're being asked to do, or are unable to deliver it, but digging out defenders in public isn't good management, it's only likely to affect their confidence further. They know they're shipping too many goals, so does Warburton. He's doing the right thing spreading responsibility around. What he, and the coaching staff, haven't been able to do yet is solve the team's defensive woes. It's on them ultimately.

Lumley cost us again on 20:57 - Nov 23 with 1513 views

derbyhoop

The clearance kick was poor but the back pass he received didn't do him any favours. The pass through to Kamara was instant and Lumley git a hand to the effort.

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Lumley cost us again on 11:52 - Nov 25 with 1337 views

Dorse

Lumley cost us again on 16:48 - Nov 23 by BrianMcCarthy
I think that's a very fair post, Benny. But I'll ask you a question, and not being nasty or snide - what should he be saying in interviews that he isn't?

'I slit the sheet, the sheet I slit and on the slitted sheet I sit'..?

'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!'

Lumley cost us again on 12:08 - Nov 25 with 1311 views

Dando

Think the defense needs a change of shape, dont think its just Lumley.

As much as I agree that Manning has had a superb season, I would like to see Wallace come in at left back once Barbet is fit and make it more solid. Manning still has an important role in the midfield, and we have enough attacking players to still score goals imo - even with moving Manning around

Lumley cost us again on 12:42 - Nov 25 with 1250 views

californiahoop

Lumley cost us again on 08:08 - Nov 23 by Lblock

I was a big fan of Lummers but he’s certainly gone backwards..... surely Aston Villa taking his face off isn’t STILL effecting him?!

He didn’t look on it at all last night
Proof came in the first half when he needlessly rushed out to Carvelho in the right back spot and totally clotheslined him. So lucky the flag had gone up for offside as that could’ve been a red.

Possibly a case of too much too soon for Joe? He was thrust in to replace a useless keeper in Ingram and started full of gusto. I get we have to accept watching young players have dips as they develop but it’s not the place for keepers to play as he has in the Championship

Still think he’ll be a good keeper in the future

Agree with this

Lumley cost us again on 13:41 - Nov 25 with 1180 views

R_from_afar

Conceding is not just about Lumley and the defence, the rest of team have a role to play in defending too.

We would be far more solid if we had just one genuinely decent holding midfielder. Based on this season so far, I don't think we do, and being able to play *two* quality players of that type would actually be a huge boost. OK, perhaps by wanting two I am being a bit greedy!

The creativity is great, the levels of effort and spirit are excellent, but we need to be more pragmatic at times and just blast it clear. As one of you said on here, that's down to the players being willing to take responsibility in the heat of the moment and take the safe option even if it's ugly and flies in the face of the strategy.

In common with many teams, the closing down could be better. Closing down - and pressing - only works if you are close enough to stop a cross/pass/shot. Sometimes, our lot slow up at the crucial moment or hang back slightly.

Not much needs to be tweaked but if we could find a solid defensive midfielder - or make our own using some DNA from Derry and Gavin Mahon - it would really help.

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Lumley cost us again on 13:56 - Nov 25 with 1157 views

The_Seer

I don't see the problem with booting the ball into row Z once in a while. McDonald used to due it when we were London's top team.

Lumley cost us again on 14:08 - Nov 25 with 1142 views

Northernr

Lumley cost us again on 13:56 - Nov 25 by The_Seer
I don't see the problem with booting the ball into row Z once in a while. McDonald used to due it when we were London's top team.

Or so it says on Wikipedia anyway.

Lumley cost us again on 14:13 - Nov 25 with 1130 views

Esox_Lucius

The other side of this coin is that if even a quarter of the chances we created were converted into goals his error wouldn't have mattered.

The grass is always greener.

Lumley cost us again on 20:49 - Nov 25 with 1033 views

CLAREMAN1995

Caoimhin Kelleher from Liverpool is going to be available in January to any Championship team who will guarantee him playing time according to reports.Preston appear to be the only one interested at the moment maybe QPR should step in and take a shot at getting him.

Lumley cost us again on 14:08 - Nov 27 with 905 views

Benny_the_Ball

Lumley cost us again on 16:48 - Nov 23 by BrianMcCarthy
I think that's a very fair post, Benny. But I'll ask you a question, and not being nasty or snide - what should he be saying in interviews that he isn't?

Sorry for the delayed response, Brian; I've been under the weather this week and therefore off the radar.

Good question but one that is very difficult to answer succinctly other than to say it depends on the circumstances. For example, at 3 games without a clean sheet MW could reasonably defend individual mistakes as QPR were winning matches regardless. However when the run stretches to 9 games without a clean sheet and no wins in the last 5, the same argument loses credibility.

In terms of what he should say, for now MW should simply focus on reminding everyone that it's a new squad with a new manager learning new ideas in season. Occasional mistakes are part-and-parcel of the learning curve and the experience will stand the players in good stead further down the line. To be fair, he alludes to this in the Forest preview but then reverts to talking about accountability as a team.

Having said all that my original post was not so much about what MW should say but rather what he should do. The squad is currently a work in progress and some players are not naturally suited to MW's preferred style. As a result I think he should adapt his tactics slightly until such time he's built a squad that is wholly comfortable with playing through the lines.

[Post edited 27 Nov 2019 14:10]

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