| Trump 09:43 - Oct 27 with 114402 views | Hooparoo |
An Australian professor of Data Analytics from Griffith University who predicted Trump’s first win, the Australian Federal Election(when all the polls said the opposite) and Brexit has called it - Trump will be re-elected for another 4 years. You heard it here first. |  |
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| Trump on 11:42 - Nov 6 with 1641 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Trump on 11:29 - Nov 6 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Yeah it is.
‘If Sanders had run against Trump he would’ve been annihilated’
Can I asked what this is based on and what centrism actually is policy wise? What does it offer people?
Biden’s election pitch of ‘not being Trump’ doesn’t seem like a tangible benefit to working class people to me. I don’t see how it gets uninsured people into full and decent healthcare, reduces home repossession, or cleans poisonous water in Detroit. [Post edited 6 Nov 2020 11:36]
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I think that Biden's policies on health and welfare will be right-wing. His record on crime and punishment is awful. His record on violence overseas shameful.
It shows just how bad Trump is that Biden is welcomed as his replacement.
But after three days and nights of watching CNN and MSNBC I can't see for the life of me how Sanders would have won. The U.S. seems to want right-wing policies and right-wing politicians and wants to believe that they're actually centrist.
Edit - That's not to say that Sanders should move to the centre or even that the British Labour Party should. You stick to your principles and you get better at convincing people that you are right. Any election won by selling your principles is worthless.
[Post edited 6 Nov 2020 11:44]
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| Trump on 11:44 - Nov 6 with 1629 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Trump on 11:35 - Nov 6 by wood_hoop |
Thursday, 6 May 2021, date of next local elections in the UK, will be interesting to see if Starmer can put across to the electorate just how much he has rid the LP of Corbynsm.
Not a GE but maybe a litmus test for where the LP is heading, after Johnson's fiasco so far of dealing with things it shouldn't be too hard to win back some support from the 'red wall' districts, notably that when the latest lockdown kicked in, back to 80% furlough rate but northern cities only offered 67% a few weeks ago, nothing to do with Tory heartlands being kicked in the balls as well now by the virus.
Maybe centrist to you Bazz but if LP dosn't move away from Corbynites then the wilderness is where they will stay. |
I think Starmer will do well, but like Biden just for the virtue of not being the incumbent buffoon. I don’t think the Red wall or Scotland will be back though.
Labour have moved away from Corbynism. It’s dead. Literally 100 -200k Corbyn joiners have left the party in the last 7 months.
Not being Corbyn can only be milked for so long before people start to ask ‘well what are Labour for?’ so far it’s been for supporting the Tories on Covid to the detriment of 60k deaths, ignoring the NEU, and supporting bills that allows UK military personal and security services to commit crimes in the name of the state and be immune from prosecution. [Post edited 6 Nov 2020 11:48]
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| Trump on 11:47 - Nov 6 with 1617 views | GaryT |
| Trump on 11:40 - Nov 6 by traininvain |
It’s based on watching the disastrous Corbyn experiment over here and actually listening to what Brexit and Trump voters have to say.
Nearly 70m people voted for Trump and many of them like his policies on tax etc. They can’t all be labelled racists.
I’m amazed that people still think the answer to Trump and Brexit is to move further to the left. |
That's why I thought Biden wasn't a bad choice. He's not that far left so people who identify as Republican and not Trump supporters could temporarily switch sides to rid them of their parasite. Hard to say what would have happened with Sanders or Warren, would they have got even more of the young/left vote than turned out to oust Trump? We'll never know. |  | | |
| Trump on 11:47 - Nov 6 with 1610 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Trump on 11:42 - Nov 6 by BrianMcCarthy |
I think that Biden's policies on health and welfare will be right-wing. His record on crime and punishment is awful. His record on violence overseas shameful.
It shows just how bad Trump is that Biden is welcomed as his replacement.
But after three days and nights of watching CNN and MSNBC I can't see for the life of me how Sanders would have won. The U.S. seems to want right-wing policies and right-wing politicians and wants to believe that they're actually centrist.
Edit - That's not to say that Sanders should move to the centre or even that the British Labour Party should. You stick to your principles and you get better at convincing people that you are right. Any election won by selling your principles is worthless.
[Post edited 6 Nov 2020 11:44]
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Sanders policies were hugely popular, but the perception of a socialist bogeyman might have brought him down. Even Biden was caste this way and it killed the Cuban / Venezuelan Golden exile vote in Florida.
Western politics all about perception over substance really and it’s a real shame. | | | |
| Trump on 11:48 - Nov 6 with 1604 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Trump on 11:47 - Nov 6 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Sanders policies were hugely popular, but the perception of a socialist bogeyman might have brought him down. Even Biden was caste this way and it killed the Cuban / Venezuelan Golden exile vote in Florida.
Western politics all about perception over substance really and it’s a real shame. |
I agree. | |
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| Trump on 11:56 - Nov 6 with 1563 views | traininvain |
| Trump on 11:47 - Nov 6 by GaryT |
That's why I thought Biden wasn't a bad choice. He's not that far left so people who identify as Republican and not Trump supporters could temporarily switch sides to rid them of their parasite. Hard to say what would have happened with Sanders or Warren, would they have got even more of the young/left vote than turned out to oust Trump? We'll never know. |
Agreed. I thought at the time that Biden was the best choice from the candidates and it looks like he’s on course to win the election.
Sanders would have been portrayed as a radical socialist (i’m not saying it’s a fair reflection) and I think it would’ve been a complete disaster.
Trump made it quite clear that he’d prefer to face Sanders (he kept referring to him throughout the campaign, debates etc) so make of that what you will. |  | | |
| Trump on 11:58 - Nov 6 with 1555 views | traininvain |
| Trump on 11:47 - Nov 6 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Sanders policies were hugely popular, but the perception of a socialist bogeyman might have brought him down. Even Biden was caste this way and it killed the Cuban / Venezuelan Golden exile vote in Florida.
Western politics all about perception over substance really and it’s a real shame. |
It’s a shame but it’s the reality of the situation and no point pretending otherwise. | | | |
| Trump on 11:58 - Nov 6 with 1553 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Trump on 11:40 - Nov 6 by traininvain |
It’s based on watching the disastrous Corbyn experiment over here and actually listening to what Brexit and Trump voters have to say.
Nearly 70m people voted for Trump and many of them like his policies on tax etc. They can’t all be labelled racists.
I’m amazed that people still think the answer to Trump and Brexit is to move further to the left. |
Was the Corbyn experiment disastrous? Are you sure that isn’t hyperbole? Hugely popular (if not credible) policies that attracted more Labour voters both in numbers and a percentage since 1997.
The fact it didn’t equal seats is more a criticism of our FPTP system and at the risk of sounding the Donald, a hostile media. [Post edited 6 Nov 2020 12:10]
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| Trump on 11:58 - Nov 6 with 1547 views | Northernr |
| Trump on 11:56 - Nov 6 by traininvain |
Agreed. I thought at the time that Biden was the best choice from the candidates and it looks like he’s on course to win the election.
Sanders would have been portrayed as a radical socialist (i’m not saying it’s a fair reflection) and I think it would’ve been a complete disaster.
Trump made it quite clear that he’d prefer to face Sanders (he kept referring to him throughout the campaign, debates etc) so make of that what you will. |
Also potentially about to win in places where democrats rarely do, while he lost Florida because the Latinos down there think even he's too socialist for them. |  | | |
| Trump on 12:09 - Nov 6 with 1494 views | derbyhoop |
| Trump on 11:47 - Nov 6 by GaryT |
That's why I thought Biden wasn't a bad choice. He's not that far left so people who identify as Republican and not Trump supporters could temporarily switch sides to rid them of their parasite. Hard to say what would have happened with Sanders or Warren, would they have got even more of the young/left vote than turned out to oust Trump? We'll never know. |
I didn't follow the primaries that closely but it seemed that the Democrats had a wealth of young, up and coming candidates. In a variety of races, and genders. It's hard to imagine Biden, if he wins, wanting to stand again at the age of 81. As well as Harris, there certainly won't be a shortage of Democratic wannabees.
Not sure if GOP has any obvious candidates for 2024.. |  |
| Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop |
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| Trump on 12:09 - Nov 6 with 1490 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Trump on 11:58 - Nov 6 by Northernr |
Also potentially about to win in places where democrats rarely do, while he lost Florida because the Latinos down there think even he's too socialist for them. |
A bit like Scotland and the North / Midlands in reverse over here, the trend towards the Democrats has been increasing over decades.
Texas for example has been slowly turning blue for ages, and I suspect will be a Democrat state whoever stands in 2028.
It’s all about it demographic changes and a terrible electoral system. | | | |
| Trump on 12:11 - Nov 6 with 1483 views | Konk |
| Trump on 12:09 - Nov 6 by derbyhoop |
I didn't follow the primaries that closely but it seemed that the Democrats had a wealth of young, up and coming candidates. In a variety of races, and genders. It's hard to imagine Biden, if he wins, wanting to stand again at the age of 81. As well as Harris, there certainly won't be a shortage of Democratic wannabees.
Not sure if GOP has any obvious candidates for 2024.. |
Trump, Tom Cotton, Josh Hawley, Rubio, Cruz...Trump Jr? |  |
| Fulham FC: It's the taking part that counts |
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| Trump on 12:13 - Nov 6 with 1471 views | kensalriser |
| Trump on 11:58 - Nov 6 by Northernr |
Also potentially about to win in places where democrats rarely do, while he lost Florida because the Latinos down there think even he's too socialist for them. |
Florida was subject to a barrage of Spanish language disinformation by the Trump campaign aimed specifically at Cuban Americans rather than 'Latinos', which are a broad and disparate community there. The Cuban diaspora in Florida is founded on emigrants who fled the Cuban revolution (ie everyone with money and political/business ties to the US), so they are perhaps understandably paranoid of anything remotely left wing. Not that Biden is remotely left wing. |  |
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| Trump on 12:15 - Nov 6 with 1463 views | wood_hoop |
Biden now in front (just) in Georgie, seems to be a reverse of Florida, where Hispanic,Black voters have come out in force for Biden, by mail a good portion of the vote, no wonder Trump is spitting the dummy, if a red state reversal could help Biden get the keys of the White House must be really painful and he knew it was on the cards months ago even with his strong base support. |  | | |
| Trump on 12:15 - Nov 6 with 1460 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Trump on 12:13 - Nov 6 by kensalriser |
Florida was subject to a barrage of Spanish language disinformation by the Trump campaign aimed specifically at Cuban Americans rather than 'Latinos', which are a broad and disparate community there. The Cuban diaspora in Florida is founded on emigrants who fled the Cuban revolution (ie everyone with money and political/business ties to the US), so they are perhaps understandably paranoid of anything remotely left wing. Not that Biden is remotely left wing. |
or ‘Gusanos’ as the are known on the island. | | | |
| Trump on 12:18 - Nov 6 with 1433 views | CamberleyR |
| Trump on 09:58 - Nov 6 by terryb |
It was said on one station yesterday that White House officials were sugesting that Trump stands again in 2024 to correct his loss by cheating & fraud!
I hadn't realised till last night that Detroit & Philadelphia were the worst places on the planet for election fraud & as enenies of democrarcy. |
As they said on CNN this morning though, it's strange that Georgia which is very tight and these days is about as Republican as they come (Governor, State senators, Attorney General etc) isn't crying foul. |  |
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| Trump on 12:21 - Nov 6 with 1406 views | traininvain |
| Trump on 11:58 - Nov 6 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Was the Corbyn experiment disastrous? Are you sure that isn’t hyperbole? Hugely popular (if not credible) policies that attracted more Labour voters both in numbers and a percentage since 1997.
The fact it didn’t equal seats is more a criticism of our FPTP system and at the risk of sounding the Donald, a hostile media. [Post edited 6 Nov 2020 12:10]
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We’re not going to agree here but yes I do feel the Corbyn experiment was a disaster as he was never electable (FPTP is not a valid excuse) and many of us said as much the day he became Labour leader.
The fact that he was given more than one election gave the Tories pretty much free reign and part of the reason we have such a weak govt today. | | | |
| Trump on 12:32 - Nov 6 with 1355 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Trump on 12:21 - Nov 6 by traininvain |
We’re not going to agree here but yes I do feel the Corbyn experiment was a disaster as he was never electable (FPTP is not a valid excuse) and many of us said as much the day he became Labour leader.
The fact that he was given more than one election gave the Tories pretty much free reign and part of the reason we have such a weak govt today. |
There is are lot of cliches here.
I find it difficult to believe that you wrote him off in good faith on the day he became leader. You would have to be a political geek on a stratospheric level to know anything about him prior to 2015 as he had never been anything over than a obscure backbencher.
Labour members elected him anyway, so blame them if anyone.
On him being at fault for the current government, why wasn’t it Browns fault in 2010 or Milliband’a fault in 2015 when Labour performed worse with voters?
Anyway, this is a Trump thread not a Corbyn one and I can feel Clive’s anxiety levels going up! Happy to discuss in private if you want 👠| | | |
| Trump on 12:34 - Nov 6 with 1343 views | MrSheen |
| Trump on 12:13 - Nov 6 by kensalriser |
Florida was subject to a barrage of Spanish language disinformation by the Trump campaign aimed specifically at Cuban Americans rather than 'Latinos', which are a broad and disparate community there. The Cuban diaspora in Florida is founded on emigrants who fled the Cuban revolution (ie everyone with money and political/business ties to the US), so they are perhaps understandably paranoid of anything remotely left wing. Not that Biden is remotely left wing. |
Not just Cubans in Florida, there's also this lot with more recent experience of 21st Century Socialism.
https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/article244934282.html
Not many Cubans in South Texas either.
https://www.texastribune.org/2020/11/04/joe-biden-texas-border-democrats/
Vanessa Guerra, a 30-year-old geologist who lives in Penitas, voted for Biden, but said she would have liked to see more outreach from the party.
“Over here, there are a lot of folks that think being a Democrat is the same as being socialist,” she said. “There should have been a campaign making sure people know that they are not socialists. People from Latin America have had socialist leaders, and they are afraid of that happening again.” |  | | |
| Trump on 12:35 - Nov 6 with 1344 views | robith |
| Trump on 11:47 - Nov 6 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Sanders policies were hugely popular, but the perception of a socialist bogeyman might have brought him down. Even Biden was caste this way and it killed the Cuban / Venezuelan Golden exile vote in Florida.
Western politics all about perception over substance really and it’s a real shame. |
Yet those same Florida voters on the same ballot voted to increase the minimum wage to $15.
I think Sanders would've won in 2016 cos he had the policies to appeal to those left behind in the rust belt, and also would've been an outsider neutering Trump. Also worth saying Sanders is much more hawkish on defence than say Corbyn, so it's much more difficult to paint him as some kinda of America hating crank
This year, well after 4 years of Trump riling people up I would've been surprised if Bernie made it to polling day alive.
Thank god it wasn't Warren though. Trump would've chewed her up and spat her out [Post edited 6 Nov 2020 12:37]
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| Trump on 12:44 - Nov 6 with 1314 views | robith |
| Trump on 11:58 - Nov 6 by Northernr |
Also potentially about to win in places where democrats rarely do, while he lost Florida because the Latinos down there think even he's too socialist for them. |
In fairness the Latin community in Florida are often Cuban and Venezuelan emigres, so they're fairly right wing.
But Biden has done pretty badly with them across the country as him and Barry absolutely loved deporting Latin Americans and they haven't really forgiven him for that | | | |
| Trump on 12:50 - Nov 6 with 1282 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Mexico, the largest net source of immigrants to the US, voted in a Socialist government last year. | | | |
| Trump on 12:54 - Nov 6 with 1262 views | PinnerPaul |
Latest Paddy Power
Biden 1/20
Trump 9/1 |  | | |
| Trump on 13:01 - Nov 6 with 1237 views | SydneyRs |
That Australian professor - he's wrong.
You can get 12s on Trump now if you fancy it lol.
The figurehead of a very ugly and sad trend in politics over the last 5 years or so about to fall, you bloody love to see it.
Some decency still exists out there. | | | |
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