| Tonight’s Fans Forum 19:53 - Feb 9 with 24201 views | DaleyBrent |
UnfortunatelY unable to attend tonight but really keen to here some of the key takeaways if those present wouldn’t mind summarising below:
Thanks in advance! UTD |  | | |  |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 18:05 - Feb 10 with 3367 views | judd |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 17:55 - Feb 10 by Ninco |
I realise that the night was about Dale, but did they mention the meeting they had with Hornets and the council? I know there was a statement, but it doesn't really tell us anything and Hornets are also keeping quiet.
One thing that puzzles me is that Hornets have taken on a firm of groundsmen, which is strange as they rent COA which has a groundsman. |
No. That's another problem with the roaming mic. |  |
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 18:48 - Feb 10 with 3190 views | pioneer |
I was unable to attend so these reports are much appreciated.
Based on these reports I think we have to recognise the one group that are not able to express their views are the players. The manager continues to undermine them, in some cases individually it seems if the reports are true. Following his appointment there was a short upturn in performances and results but then things quickly deteriorated. I think that was when he claimed that 12 year olds he watched were performing better. If that is how he aims to motivate the team then we are in big trouble.
We then show an upturn in form at the start of the year and he changes the team which goes on a losing run. In the case of the goalkeeping change, based on the reports of the meeting his justification was the keepers poor performance in December! So his improved form, and the teams improved performances and results in January, were not relevant?
I think its clear from the reports of the meeting that all is not well among the playing staff. I am beginning to believe, with the benefit of hindsight, that he was not the right man for the job.
I dont know about others but I am tired of his agonisingly long repetitive answers to the questions he is asked in pre and post match interviews. |  | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 18:58 - Feb 10 with 3144 views | rich_dale |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 18:48 - Feb 10 by pioneer |
I was unable to attend so these reports are much appreciated.
Based on these reports I think we have to recognise the one group that are not able to express their views are the players. The manager continues to undermine them, in some cases individually it seems if the reports are true. Following his appointment there was a short upturn in performances and results but then things quickly deteriorated. I think that was when he claimed that 12 year olds he watched were performing better. If that is how he aims to motivate the team then we are in big trouble.
We then show an upturn in form at the start of the year and he changes the team which goes on a losing run. In the case of the goalkeeping change, based on the reports of the meeting his justification was the keepers poor performance in December! So his improved form, and the teams improved performances and results in January, were not relevant?
I think its clear from the reports of the meeting that all is not well among the playing staff. I am beginning to believe, with the benefit of hindsight, that he was not the right man for the job.
I dont know about others but I am tired of his agonisingly long repetitive answers to the questions he is asked in pre and post match interviews. |
I've always felt a bit uneasy about Bentley's 'us and them' language in interviews to describe the coaching staff and players. He often says things like 'we've been telling them to do x' or 'we prepare them before a match, then it's up to them to deliver on the pitch'. It really jarred the first time I heard it as most managers would just use a collective 'we' to refer to all the coaching and playing staff. Feels unhealthy and creates division rather than galvanising everyone together. I wouldn't like to hear it if I was a player, I'd feel a bit like I was being told off by the teacher. | | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:03 - Feb 10 with 3122 views | judd |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 18:58 - Feb 10 by rich_dale |
I've always felt a bit uneasy about Bentley's 'us and them' language in interviews to describe the coaching staff and players. He often says things like 'we've been telling them to do x' or 'we prepare them before a match, then it's up to them to deliver on the pitch'. It really jarred the first time I heard it as most managers would just use a collective 'we' to refer to all the coaching and playing staff. Feels unhealthy and creates division rather than galvanising everyone together. I wouldn't like to hear it if I was a player, I'd feel a bit like I was being told off by the teacher. |
I was a bit disappointed with the constant reference to data and stats and comparing what Premier league teams do when defending corners.
The only stat and data that matters is our league position, and analysing spread sheets will not win us games. | |
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:15 - Feb 10 with 3057 views | 442Dale |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:03 - Feb 10 by judd |
I was a bit disappointed with the constant reference to data and stats and comparing what Premier league teams do when defending corners.
The only stat and data that matters is our league position, and analysing spread sheets will not win us games. |
The answer about leaving someone up at corners focused way too much on the defensive aspect when the person who asked the question was obviously looking at it from an attacking perspective.
It’s especially tiresome to hear about the stats around what might or might not work when setting up to defend corners. It’s obvious numbers don’t come into it. We are simply rubbish at it.
Edit: oh and “due diligence”. That phrase needs banning. [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 19:16]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:18 - Feb 10 with 3010 views | kel |
I’m pretty uncomfortable with some posts on this thread. Some of them smack of self interest rather than genuine concern for the club. I’d love to be wrong but time will tell. |  | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:28 - Feb 10 with 2952 views | nordenblue |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 13:14 - Feb 10 by DaleFan7 |
It's a joke if this is what some of the player's attitude is but it certainly explains certain omissions from the squad.
If I turned up for work, didn't put the effort in, couldn't be arsed on certain days and performed poorly on a regular basis, I'd be well out of the door. |
You're comparing the general publics work ethic to some pampered,spoon fed self engrossed work shy tossers though..... miles apart [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 21:12]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:36 - Feb 10 with 2926 views | EllDale |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 17:55 - Feb 10 by Ninco |
I realise that the night was about Dale, but did they mention the meeting they had with Hornets and the council? I know there was a statement, but it doesn't really tell us anything and Hornets are also keeping quiet.
One thing that puzzles me is that Hornets have taken on a firm of groundsmen, which is strange as they rent COA which has a groundsman. |
Presumably Hornets will need someone to take care of the pitch at Balderstone.
It makes sense to outsource cutting the grass and marking out rather than employing someone directly. [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 19:37]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:48 - Feb 10 with 2833 views | James1980 |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 18:48 - Feb 10 by pioneer |
I was unable to attend so these reports are much appreciated.
Based on these reports I think we have to recognise the one group that are not able to express their views are the players. The manager continues to undermine them, in some cases individually it seems if the reports are true. Following his appointment there was a short upturn in performances and results but then things quickly deteriorated. I think that was when he claimed that 12 year olds he watched were performing better. If that is how he aims to motivate the team then we are in big trouble.
We then show an upturn in form at the start of the year and he changes the team which goes on a losing run. In the case of the goalkeeping change, based on the reports of the meeting his justification was the keepers poor performance in December! So his improved form, and the teams improved performances and results in January, were not relevant?
I think its clear from the reports of the meeting that all is not well among the playing staff. I am beginning to believe, with the benefit of hindsight, that he was not the right man for the job.
I dont know about others but I am tired of his agonisingly long repetitive answers to the questions he is asked in pre and post match interviews. |
Perhaps in hindsight we should have chosen from the best of those who apply for the job as first team manager rather than approaching those that could well say no. I'm sorry but being nth choice has undermined Bentley it can't be great for his own confidence and by the sounds of it the squad don't all entirely respect him. It is such a shame because he seems like a decent fella especially his whole ethos of wanting to improve the community spirit of the club. | |
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:49 - Feb 10 with 2820 views | D_Alien |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:15 - Feb 10 by 442Dale |
The answer about leaving someone up at corners focused way too much on the defensive aspect when the person who asked the question was obviously looking at it from an attacking perspective.
It’s especially tiresome to hear about the stats around what might or might not work when setting up to defend corners. It’s obvious numbers don’t come into it. We are simply rubbish at it.
Edit: oh and “due diligence”. That phrase needs banning. [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 19:16]
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Yes. If one player remains upfield, almost invariably the opposition will leave two back as cover
The way it was described last night seemed to indicate the manager wasn't sure this would happen, and that if the opposition just left our upfield player on his own they'd then have an overload in our penalty box. I've never seen this happen in 60 years of watching football
I'm absolutely certain that leaving someone like Kelly upfield would lead to absolutely zero consequences, except as a 'potential' nuisance should the ball get cleared
He then spoke about the second phase, and our lack of defending it. A player upfield would automatically become the first line of defence at the second phase, instead of giving the opposition free rein to deliver into the box again
[Post edited 10 Feb 2023 19:52]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:51 - Feb 10 with 2816 views | Trev |
I would urge caution and take the words of the manager of the lowest ranked team in the entire Football League with a large pinch of salt.
Perhaps he needs to do a better job of motivating his, admittedly limited, players. Maybe it takes more than shouting and demanding hard work to be a successful football manager in 2023.
As ever, the truth is probably in between the two sides of the story. Shame we're only hearing one. | | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:55 - Feb 10 with 2783 views | 442Dale |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:18 - Feb 10 by kel |
I’m pretty uncomfortable with some posts on this thread. Some of them smack of self interest rather than genuine concern for the club. I’d love to be wrong but time will tell. |
Hope the one about kits didn’t come across like that!
Your views are important though, we’re going to get nowhere if we’re annoyed/pleased individually when the bigger picture remains the same or worse - the club has to be the main beneficiary. That’s partly a reason we are where we are. | |
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:58 - Feb 10 with 2756 views | 442Dale |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:49 - Feb 10 by D_Alien |
Yes. If one player remains upfield, almost invariably the opposition will leave two back as cover
The way it was described last night seemed to indicate the manager wasn't sure this would happen, and that if the opposition just left our upfield player on his own they'd then have an overload in our penalty box. I've never seen this happen in 60 years of watching football
I'm absolutely certain that leaving someone like Kelly upfield would lead to absolutely zero consequences, except as a 'potential' nuisance should the ball get cleared
He then spoke about the second phase, and our lack of defending it. A player upfield would automatically become the first line of defence at the second phase, instead of giving the opposition free rein to deliver into the box again
[Post edited 10 Feb 2023 19:52]
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It’s spectacularly simple and a tactic we all remember from a young age. Like most things in football now, it’s overthought and has moved backwards. Even if the stats say otherwise. | |
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 20:37 - Feb 10 with 2580 views | kel |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 19:55 - Feb 10 by 442Dale |
Hope the one about kits didn’t come across like that!
Your views are important though, we’re going to get nowhere if we’re annoyed/pleased individually when the bigger picture remains the same or worse - the club has to be the main beneficiary. That’s partly a reason we are where we are. |
When it comes to kits I’d trust you with my life! | | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 20:42 - Feb 10 with 2547 views | James1980 |
So we continue doing the same thing that isn't working at set pieces because it is what they do in the premier league. Well guess what we ain't in the frigging premier league and unlikely will be in most fans lifetimes (sorry for being defeatist). Why do the coaching staff feel they need to continue with these methods? Is it lack of confidence in their own abilities to come up with alternative tactics for defending set pieces. Do they think players will respect them more if they say right lads this is the way they defend set pieces in the premier league? I'm sorry but it is ridiculous. Even if they tried a different tactic and it failed at least we could see alternatives are being tried. | |
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 21:16 - Feb 10 with 2420 views | 442Dale |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 20:37 - Feb 10 by kel |
When it comes to kits I’d trust you with my life! |
Ha! Though, being transparent, as long as some fans are involved (which to the club’s credit they have done so far), it matters not if I turn up.
Well it does, so I can check for overall symmetry with the collar trim reflected on the socks.
Maybe better I stay away. | |
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 21:43 - Feb 10 with 2341 views | SaxonDale |
I find it absolutely amazing that a player we have paid a large sum on (especially for us), who has played very little league football in his career and been injured for the best part of 12 months is not absolutely desperate to get back on the pitch.
Either Bentley’s motivational skills are not up to it or Stockdale signed an absolute wrongun. |  | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 22:43 - Feb 10 with 2151 views | TalkingSutty |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 21:43 - Feb 10 by SaxonDale |
I find it absolutely amazing that a player we have paid a large sum on (especially for us), who has played very little league football in his career and been injured for the best part of 12 months is not absolutely desperate to get back on the pitch.
Either Bentley’s motivational skills are not up to it or Stockdale signed an absolute wrongun. |
I've said it all season that some of the players obviously aren't fit enough and lacked stamina, you can spot it a mile off during games.. With the season quickly coming to a conclusion that's now been confirmed by the manager, some have downed tools in training. I also questioned the suitability of the cricket club at a previous forum and was told it was fine, it seemed like a coversation that nobody wanted to have and obviously there is no comeback on answers given by those on the top table because the microphone is moved on, conveniently at times.
In fairness to professional footballers, it can't really motivate them to better themselves when there isn't even a full size pitch to train on and if recovering from ankle/ ligament injuries etc would they feel confident going full out on a below standard surface? They probably wouldn't.
It was done to save money and it's amateurish and I believe our poor performances and lack of fitness/ stamina are linked, we can't close down our opponents as a unit and we can't even build up a head of steam to try to save a game. How many late goals do we score and how often do teams comfortably play out games against us? Nearly three quarters through the season the venue is finally changed and a much more suitable training complex is found, a more professional one but it's all a bit too late now. I'm not making excuses for the players but this is their career we are talking about and if training pitches/ facilities aren't decent then it's obvious they aren't going to be fully motivated or won't want to risk injury on a sub standard facility. It must be sub standard because we've had to change with the season in full swing.
If you offload your best players, release one of the most prolific goalscorers in the lower leagues and then further cut costs by deciding the players can all now train at the local cricket club this is what you end up with. The fact that there was a snooker table and a chef to look after the players seemed to be the selling point but it was all part of the master plan to run down the club by the previous CEO, alongside the secret BBM contract. I once asked Hill what he thought about the cricket club venue as a full time training ground because they did sometimes do some work there....not fit for purpose was his comment, nowhere in the Town is. Hill used Platt Lane at times and we have obviously now come around full circle. Once Bottomley sacked Hill how soon was the decision made to train full time at the cricket club? He very quickly downgraded the squad and also the training facilities, a man on a mission and a manager in place who wouldn't rock the boat.
I don't excuse any player not giving 100% but there must be mitigating circumstances in their defence otherwise we would still be at the cricket club. [Post edited 11 Feb 2023 0:16]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 00:24 - Feb 11 with 1938 views | 49thseason |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 22:43 - Feb 10 by TalkingSutty |
I've said it all season that some of the players obviously aren't fit enough and lacked stamina, you can spot it a mile off during games.. With the season quickly coming to a conclusion that's now been confirmed by the manager, some have downed tools in training. I also questioned the suitability of the cricket club at a previous forum and was told it was fine, it seemed like a coversation that nobody wanted to have and obviously there is no comeback on answers given by those on the top table because the microphone is moved on, conveniently at times.
In fairness to professional footballers, it can't really motivate them to better themselves when there isn't even a full size pitch to train on and if recovering from ankle/ ligament injuries etc would they feel confident going full out on a below standard surface? They probably wouldn't.
It was done to save money and it's amateurish and I believe our poor performances and lack of fitness/ stamina are linked, we can't close down our opponents as a unit and we can't even build up a head of steam to try to save a game. How many late goals do we score and how often do teams comfortably play out games against us? Nearly three quarters through the season the venue is finally changed and a much more suitable training complex is found, a more professional one but it's all a bit too late now. I'm not making excuses for the players but this is their career we are talking about and if training pitches/ facilities aren't decent then it's obvious they aren't going to be fully motivated or won't want to risk injury on a sub standard facility. It must be sub standard because we've had to change with the season in full swing.
If you offload your best players, release one of the most prolific goalscorers in the lower leagues and then further cut costs by deciding the players can all now train at the local cricket club this is what you end up with. The fact that there was a snooker table and a chef to look after the players seemed to be the selling point but it was all part of the master plan to run down the club by the previous CEO, alongside the secret BBM contract. I once asked Hill what he thought about the cricket club venue as a full time training ground because they did sometimes do some work there....not fit for purpose was his comment, nowhere in the Town is. Hill used Platt Lane at times and we have obviously now come around full circle. Once Bottomley sacked Hill how soon was the decision made to train full time at the cricket club? He very quickly downgraded the squad and also the training facilities, a man on a mission and a manager in place who wouldn't rock the boat.
I don't excuse any player not giving 100% but there must be mitigating circumstances in their defence otherwise we would still be at the cricket club. [Post edited 11 Feb 2023 0:16]
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Sutty, if the surface at Redbrook was poor it is entirely because the RAfC ground staff didnt look after it. The initial deal was simple, RAFC was to sort out the sprinkler system ( part of the £20k that Dunphy referred to) and maintain the Lacrosse Club pitches. No other costs were involved. A further deal was done to use the Sports Club Facilities like the kitchen , rooms etc I believe when BBM became Manager.
The pitches are now in a poor condition, but its not because the Lacrosse Club has been wearing them out, they have 2 pitches and 2 senior teams so each pitch is only used once a fortnight and they dont play if the pitches are flooded because they are raised, using them for football training 5 days a week has caused the problem, not Lacrosse.
If anyone is interested in Lacrosse, the North of England Flags Finals will be held at Redbrook on April 22nd and 23rd with teams from all over the North taking part in a variety of cup competitions finals. Rochdale 1st team are currently top of their division and looking likely Champions and promotion to the top division, they won their last game 23 - 0!
The Club has an American coaching juniors and playing, and England international players who have chances of playing in the next Olympics which will present Lacrosse as a new sport. |  | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 01:44 - Feb 11 with 1885 views | TalkingSutty |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 00:24 - Feb 11 by 49thseason |
Sutty, if the surface at Redbrook was poor it is entirely because the RAfC ground staff didnt look after it. The initial deal was simple, RAFC was to sort out the sprinkler system ( part of the £20k that Dunphy referred to) and maintain the Lacrosse Club pitches. No other costs were involved. A further deal was done to use the Sports Club Facilities like the kitchen , rooms etc I believe when BBM became Manager.
The pitches are now in a poor condition, but its not because the Lacrosse Club has been wearing them out, they have 2 pitches and 2 senior teams so each pitch is only used once a fortnight and they dont play if the pitches are flooded because they are raised, using them for football training 5 days a week has caused the problem, not Lacrosse.
If anyone is interested in Lacrosse, the North of England Flags Finals will be held at Redbrook on April 22nd and 23rd with teams from all over the North taking part in a variety of cup competitions finals. Rochdale 1st team are currently top of their division and looking likely Champions and promotion to the top division, they won their last game 23 - 0!
The Club has an American coaching juniors and playing, and England international players who have chances of playing in the next Olympics which will present Lacrosse as a new sport. |
I never suggested that the Lacrosse or Cricket club are responsible for the facility not being up to scratch for a professional football club to train. From what I have been told the sports club have always been very accommodating. Our groundstaff over the years have had a constant battle to maintain the one pitch we have at the COA, that's been a ongoing issue for years. To expect them to also maintain training pitches up to a top standard for day to day use was always something that would have been a issue I think. Hill didn't think the facility was up to standard or and neither does Bentley, they are probably very good for Lacrosse though. I don't care what anybody says, if a new player turns up for training and there isn't even a full size training pitch at the venue that can't be right. [Post edited 11 Feb 2023 1:49]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 08:47 - Feb 11 with 1610 views | D_Alien |
One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is the claim that had Dale not received add-ons from the sale of Scott Hogan to Aston Villa in early 2018 then "we'd have gone out of existence"
This was just before the Spurs cup tie and the expenditure on the pitch
To claim we'd have literally folded - i don't exaggerate, others can confirm - is quite something. We apparently received c.£900k as part of the Hogan deal, but again, the lack of transparency at the time is - if true - astounding
One would have thought this should stand as an example to all future Boards at RAFC [Post edited 11 Feb 2023 8:54]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 09:03 - Feb 11 with 1535 views | 442Dale |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 08:47 - Feb 11 by D_Alien |
One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is the claim that had Dale not received add-ons from the sale of Scott Hogan to Aston Villa in early 2018 then "we'd have gone out of existence"
This was just before the Spurs cup tie and the expenditure on the pitch
To claim we'd have literally folded - i don't exaggerate, others can confirm - is quite something. We apparently received c.£900k as part of the Hogan deal, but again, the lack of transparency at the time is - if true - astounding
One would have thought this should stand as an example to all future Boards at RAFC [Post edited 11 Feb 2023 8:54]
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I posted about it in page 1. It doesn’t add up:
Scott Hogan was sold to Aston Villa at the end of the January 2017 transfer window.
Edit: see page 1 for the links - they didn’t copy and paste!
A week earlier we signed Joe Bunney to a new deal and also signed Jack Redshaw on loan.
Link page 1
Even earlier in January we have Conrad Logan a new deal:
Link page 1
Do wish people would stop reflecting on the past to somehow justify the now and the future.
Edit edit: none of the above a direct reply to you DAlien! [Post edited 11 Feb 2023 9:10]
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| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 09:44 - Feb 11 with 1384 views | HullDale |
I understood the comment about that transfer saving the club as meaning the 3 installments over 3 years covered our operating losses over those years.
Getting it in instalments was probably better for us than one lump sum. |  | | |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 09:50 - Feb 11 with 1348 views | judd |
| Tonight’s Fans Forum on 09:44 - Feb 11 by HullDale |
I understood the comment about that transfer saving the club as meaning the 3 installments over 3 years covered our operating losses over those years.
Getting it in instalments was probably better for us than one lump sum. |
Said to be £750k per year for 3 years.
It helped cash flow. Cash is not profit. Profit is not cash.
It helped paint a good historic picture in the context of player sales and their importance to the club. | |
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