| Playing out from the back 18:01 - Dec 15 with 9257 views | CanaDale |
Suicidal. On that pitch, recipe for disaster! Lillis should have never been put in that situation to clear it, should have been dealt with like three passes previous. |  | | |  |
| Playing out from the back on 18:13 - Dec 15 with 5142 views | D_Alien |
Whilst perfectly true, the players are being told they must pass the ball when their instinct may well be to hit row Z - so, who's ultimately to blame for that
Yes, we want a team that can pass and play on the deck, but i posted at the start of the match thread about it being a typical winter football match and we needed to be up for it
We weren't
Same at the other end - i was nearly chewing my own tongue at the number of times Done (in particular) had perfectly good chances to put a ball into the box but dwelt on it and lost the chance. On that surface, anything can happen (ask Lillis) but you've got to give yourself that opportunity. Are the players scared of playing the obvious ball in the conditions in case they get harangued by the manager? Looks very much like it to me
It's shite, and there's no real prospect of that changing anytime soon
[Post edited 15 Dec 2018 18:16]
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| Playing out from the back on 18:20 - Dec 15 with 5100 views | dawlishdale |
| Playing out from the back on 18:13 - Dec 15 by D_Alien |
Whilst perfectly true, the players are being told they must pass the ball when their instinct may well be to hit row Z - so, who's ultimately to blame for that
Yes, we want a team that can pass and play on the deck, but i posted at the start of the match thread about it being a typical winter football match and we needed to be up for it
We weren't
Same at the other end - i was nearly chewing my own tongue at the number of times Done (in particular) had perfectly good chances to put a ball into the box but dwelt on it and lost the chance. On that surface, anything can happen (ask Lillis) but you've got to give yourself that opportunity. Are the players scared of playing the obvious ball in the conditions in case they get harangued by the manager? Looks very much like it to me
It's shite, and there's no real prospect of that changing anytime soon
[Post edited 15 Dec 2018 18:16]
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Sadly, you are spot on. The number of times Done gets the ball in decent areas but takes one or two touches too many, losing the chance to cross is staggering.... matched only by the number of times he gets the ball on or near the half way line and chooses to stop, and play backwards.
It's so frustrating, because we know that he didn't used to play like this. It is either that he's lost the ability (in which case why play him) or that he's playing to orders (which frustrate the crowd) |  | | |
| Playing out from the back on 18:22 - Dec 15 with 5088 views | 49thseason |
Done has become a poor pub team player, his refusal to put an early cross in or even try to go outside the fullback is a huge problem . the sooner Hart comes back, the better. If the forwards knew he would put early crosses in they could attack the space between the penalty spot and six-yard line but too often he turns back and the chance to go early is lost so the forwards don't attack the space because the cross never comes early |  | | |
| Playing out from the back on 18:39 - Dec 15 with 4989 views | CanaDale |
| Playing out from the back on 18:13 - Dec 15 by D_Alien |
Whilst perfectly true, the players are being told they must pass the ball when their instinct may well be to hit row Z - so, who's ultimately to blame for that
Yes, we want a team that can pass and play on the deck, but i posted at the start of the match thread about it being a typical winter football match and we needed to be up for it
We weren't
Same at the other end - i was nearly chewing my own tongue at the number of times Done (in particular) had perfectly good chances to put a ball into the box but dwelt on it and lost the chance. On that surface, anything can happen (ask Lillis) but you've got to give yourself that opportunity. Are the players scared of playing the obvious ball in the conditions in case they get harangued by the manager? Looks very much like it to me
It's shite, and there's no real prospect of that changing anytime soon
[Post edited 15 Dec 2018 18:16]
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I'm all for playing out from the back, but there are times when it can be done, and times to just boot it! use their brains and read the situation, massively frustrating, especially after just getting back into it. Foot, shot. | | | |
| Playing out from the back on 18:40 - Dec 15 with 4984 views | NDGN82 |
| Playing out from the back on 18:22 - Dec 15 by 49thseason |
Done has become a poor pub team player, his refusal to put an early cross in or even try to go outside the fullback is a huge problem . the sooner Hart comes back, the better. If the forwards knew he would put early crosses in they could attack the space between the penalty spot and six-yard line but too often he turns back and the chance to go early is lost so the forwards don't attack the space because the cross never comes early |
To be fair to Done he should be up front not at left full back | | | |
| Playing out from the back on 18:44 - Dec 15 with 4961 views | CanaDale |
| Playing out from the back on 18:22 - Dec 15 by 49thseason |
Done has become a poor pub team player, his refusal to put an early cross in or even try to go outside the fullback is a huge problem . the sooner Hart comes back, the better. If the forwards knew he would put early crosses in they could attack the space between the penalty spot and six-yard line but too often he turns back and the chance to go early is lost so the forwards don't attack the space because the cross never comes early |
I'm guessing that Done is under instructions not to get too far forward, I don't think it is his personal choice. | | | |
| Playing out from the back on 18:53 - Dec 15 with 4903 views | KenBoon |
That was dull and awful today. It’s somewhat fitting that we lost playing a pointless pass backwards when there were at least two better and much safer passes forward. Perkins 100% at fault. Pass back on target, with the keeper 2 yards off his line and needing to take it first time, on a pitch that was cutting up. Perkins is old enough to know better. They were utterly awful, which makes losing to them even worse. The fundamental problems aren’t an individual mistake or a crap pitch (yet) it is that we have so much of the ball today but did pretty much nothing with it. |  | | |
| Playing out from the back on 18:58 - Dec 15 with 4868 views | 442Dale |
| Playing out from the back on 18:53 - Dec 15 by KenBoon |
That was dull and awful today. It’s somewhat fitting that we lost playing a pointless pass backwards when there were at least two better and much safer passes forward. Perkins 100% at fault. Pass back on target, with the keeper 2 yards off his line and needing to take it first time, on a pitch that was cutting up. Perkins is old enough to know better. They were utterly awful, which makes losing to them even worse. The fundamental problems aren’t an individual mistake or a crap pitch (yet) it is that we have so much of the ball today but did pretty much nothing with it. |
It definitely wasn’t Perkins fault because the manager said so. |  |
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| Playing out from the back on 19:06 - Dec 15 with 4811 views | dawlishdale |
| Playing out from the back on 18:58 - Dec 15 by 442Dale |
It definitely wasn’t Perkins fault because the manager said so. |
And furthermore, Hill goes on to blame Josh Lillis.
I'd say 50% Perkins' fault
25% Lillis' fault
25% Hills fault | | | |
| Playing out from the back on 19:10 - Dec 15 with 4793 views | 49thseason |
| Playing out from the back on 18:40 - Dec 15 by NDGN82 |
To be fair to Done he should be up front not at left full back |
If he really is a forward, you might assume he would be even more aware of the value of an early cross. Like so many in this squad, he is L2 at best and he has to forage down the left because Inman, despite scoring a goal today is as much use as a wet Wednesday. The whole thing is a shambles. Is Hart still injured? Is Dooley injured? Is Ntlhe injured? Is Clough injured? How long does Hill intend to keep Morley out of the side? We have won 3 home games so far this season, we won 6 last season, so no improvement there, no change in the system but weekly changes in the personnel. This is the epitome of stupidity.. doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome. Meanwhile, the crowds dwindle, the diehards get stroppier and Hills interviews become increasingly smug and self-satisfied. No doubt there will be some outgoings in January to make way for more 5 feet six inches tall midfielders who like to pass the ball backwards because you can't have too many of those.....apparently, unless of course there is a 40 year old looking for a game or two. | | | |
| Playing out from the back on 19:20 - Dec 15 with 4730 views | ChaffRAFC |
Having seen the replay of the goal, it's not even remotely Perkins' fault. This is a league one football match, his pass back to the keeper absolutely HAS to be dealt with. Perkins doesn't hit it too hard, he doesn't hit it off line towards Lillis, he's plays it back inch perfect and it has to be dealt with. There's a definitely bobble but under no circumstances can Perkins be blamed for that. Had it been from the penalty spot then maybe but it wasn't.
This post has been edited by an administrator |  |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Playing out from the back on 19:37 - Dec 15 with 4642 views | 442Dale |
| Playing out from the back on 19:20 - Dec 15 by ChaffRAFC |
Having seen the replay of the goal, it's not even remotely Perkins' fault. This is a league one football match, his pass back to the keeper absolutely HAS to be dealt with. Perkins doesn't hit it too hard, he doesn't hit it off line towards Lillis, he's plays it back inch perfect and it has to be dealt with. There's a definitely bobble but under no circumstances can Perkins be blamed for that. Had it been from the penalty spot then maybe but it wasn't.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Yep, having seen it the only thing Perkins could have done differently is allow MJW to take the ball after the pub league play leading up to that. After he passes back Lillis has to get something on it even if it’s a sliced clearance after the bobble.
Further point of interest which supports posts in the past about Lillis and confidence being his biggest drawback, he was visibly nervous after the goal with any balls played back to him. This despite the fact he’s usually perfectly fine in those situations. | |
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| Playing out from the back on 19:50 - Dec 15 with 4579 views | KenBoon |
| Playing out from the back on 19:20 - Dec 15 by ChaffRAFC |
Having seen the replay of the goal, it's not even remotely Perkins' fault. This is a league one football match, his pass back to the keeper absolutely HAS to be dealt with. Perkins doesn't hit it too hard, he doesn't hit it off line towards Lillis, he's plays it back inch perfect and it has to be dealt with. There's a definitely bobble but under no circumstances can Perkins be blamed for that. Had it been from the penalty spot then maybe but it wasn't.
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You’re not supposed to make back passes on target because stuff like that happens. Perkins picked the wrong pass. With the bobble I’m not sure what the keeper is supposed to do. There’s no space behind him to rescue the ball. It’s a freak but should never have happened because the pass was too risky. | | | |
| Playing out from the back on 19:55 - Dec 15 with 4546 views | ChaffRAFC |
| Playing out from the back on 19:50 - Dec 15 by KenBoon |
You’re not supposed to make back passes on target because stuff like that happens. Perkins picked the wrong pass. With the bobble I’m not sure what the keeper is supposed to do. There’s no space behind him to rescue the ball. It’s a freak but should never have happened because the pass was too risky. |
Disagree, if that's too risky a back pass then every back pass is risky and nobody would do it. Lillis even has time to take a touch if need be. The bobble doesn't help but it's a regulation back pass that shouldn't have posed any threat. It's not the wrong pass, it's the only pass on and it's one that anybody else would have made as well. | |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:00 - Dec 15 with 4526 views | ChaffRAFC |
And added to that, I think the harsh treatment of Lillis by Hill this season also has an effect on people's viewing of this, they want to leap to his defence. For example, I think people would be screaming for Norman to be dropped had it been him instead of Lillis that's happened to today. | |
| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:06 - Dec 15 with 4497 views | 442Dale |
| Playing out from the back on 20:00 - Dec 15 by ChaffRAFC |
And added to that, I think the harsh treatment of Lillis by Hill this season also has an effect on people's viewing of this, they want to leap to his defence. For example, I think people would be screaming for Norman to be dropped had it been him instead of Lillis that's happened to today. |
You're probably right, however the treatment of Lillis previously may have had some impact on the situation.
But that means we're back to chaos theory and velociraptors being hatched in a lab again. | |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:09 - Dec 15 with 4473 views | ChaffRAFC |
| Playing out from the back on 20:06 - Dec 15 by 442Dale |
You're probably right, however the treatment of Lillis previously may have had some impact on the situation.
But that means we're back to chaos theory and velociraptors being hatched in a lab again. |
Well Dr Malcolm describes being a Dale fan at the moment.
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| If I hadn't seen such riches, I could live with being poor |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:20 - Dec 15 with 4398 views | TVOS1907 |
| Playing out from the back on 19:20 - Dec 15 by ChaffRAFC |
Having seen the replay of the goal, it's not even remotely Perkins' fault. This is a league one football match, his pass back to the keeper absolutely HAS to be dealt with. Perkins doesn't hit it too hard, he doesn't hit it off line towards Lillis, he's plays it back inch perfect and it has to be dealt with. There's a definitely bobble but under no circumstances can Perkins be blamed for that. Had it been from the penalty spot then maybe but it wasn't.
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The annoying thing is that the ball should never have got to Perkins in the first place. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:24 - Dec 15 with 4380 views | D_Alien |
| Playing out from the back on 20:20 - Dec 15 by TVOS1907 |
The annoying thing is that the ball should never have got to Perkins in the first place. |
Don't let the bleeding obvious distract the Perkins-bashers from their bile | |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:26 - Dec 15 with 4358 views | TVOS1907 |
| Playing out from the back on 20:24 - Dec 15 by D_Alien |
Don't let the bleeding obvious distract the Perkins-bashers from their bile |
To be honest, I'm really disappointed in his performances this season and particularly today, but he played well at Wimbledon and against Oldham, so he was in the side on merit, but it just didn't work. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:30 - Dec 15 with 4317 views | Dickydaler |
| Playing out from the back on 20:26 - Dec 15 by TVOS1907 |
To be honest, I'm really disappointed in his performances this season and particularly today, but he played well at Wimbledon and against Oldham, so he was in the side on merit, but it just didn't work. |
I didn't think he played too badly today. Up until his booking he looked much improved on his past performances, and then things stopped working for him. Hill was right to take him off. | | | |
| Playing out from the back on 20:31 - Dec 15 with 4314 views | dingdangblue |
| Playing out from the back on 20:24 - Dec 15 by D_Alien |
Don't let the bleeding obvious distract the Perkins-bashers from their bile |
I'm not a Perkins basher, and I thought he had a good game today - but even I can see that he shouldn't have passed the ball back to Lillis so close to the goal and on target and in awful conditions. There wasn't a Plymouth player near him - he was under absolutely no pressure to do what he did - it was easier to turn and run out of the box with the ball than pass it back. |  |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:32 - Dec 15 with 4309 views | dingdangblue |
| Playing out from the back on 18:39 - Dec 15 by CanaDale |
I'm all for playing out from the back, but there are times when it can be done, and times to just boot it! use their brains and read the situation, massively frustrating, especially after just getting back into it. Foot, shot. |
To be fair Lillis tried to 'just boot it'.  | |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:33 - Dec 15 with 4305 views | TVOS1907 |
| Playing out from the back on 20:30 - Dec 15 by Dickydaler |
I didn't think he played too badly today. Up until his booking he looked much improved on his past performances, and then things stopped working for him. Hill was right to take him off. |
I just felt as the game wore on, he was trying too hard to make short, simple passes that went straight to a green & white shirt. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Playing out from the back on 20:34 - Dec 15 with 4302 views | D_Alien |
| Playing out from the back on 20:26 - Dec 15 by TVOS1907 |
To be honest, I'm really disappointed in his performances this season and particularly today, but he played well at Wimbledon and against Oldham, so he was in the side on merit, but it just didn't work. |
I understand people's concerns about playing Perkins, but up until about halfway through the second half he was keeping things ticking over nicely, on the back (as you say) of a couple of displays where perhaps he was running into form. He started to tire and maybe should've been replaced after playing a free kick to one of theirs (his first poor pass)
I knew as sure as hell though, that he'd be made culpable for summat or other. He put in a decent shift today, well worth his place | |
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