| Ralph Hasenhuttl 08:31 - Jun 10 with 12225 views | MattFinish |
For years we've been needing a manager who sees Saints as a long term project. We finally have one in Ralph and there's people on here who want him out because we had a poor second half of the season.
What exactly do these people expect the manager to do with this squad and investment.
With an investment record only slightly better than Norwich, somehow Ralph got us to top of the league, for a time in the top 6 and a semi final.
Our bench and first team was regularly filled with inexperienced youth team players and we had no back up for crucial positions.
Yet we still competed and finished 2 points behind 12th place. There were few games where we lost and played badly. A lot of defeats could have been victories if we'd taken our chances.
Yet some people on here think a cup semi final, occupying top spot for the first time in 32 years and mid table finish wasn't good enough with this squad. Unbelievable.
Ralph needs the backing of the owner and the supporters and maybe he can build something we all want.
[Post edited 10 Jun 2021 8:32]
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 08:56 - Jun 10 with 4150 views | Ron11 |
Sometimes his tactics and team selection have been very strange, but his dedication seems genuine and unshakeable.
But yes he needs the backing of the owner and there lies the problem. |  | | |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 09:24 - Jun 10 with 4116 views | SonicBoom |
Firstly I don't want RH to go. He is the best we can get at the moment and stability is nearly always a good thing. That said Matt, there is the other side.
He's presided over not only the two worst results in our history, but the worst results in Premier League history.
I can barely think of a player that has improved under Ralph. Armstrong possibly but he is doing now what he did in Scotland. For a long time Ralph barely gave him any game time.
We seem to have one way to play which is an aggressive press and we look good. But we usually run out of steam and then we simply fall back and concede goals. Ok maybe the players aren't fit enough or good enough to do it for 90 minutes - but then surely we should have a different plan. We kept doing the same thing week in week out.
There is an obsession with ball retention meaning players look fearful of risking a forward ball to create chances.
As you say we got to a semi and lost which was fun but it's not an achievement. And yes genuine credit for being top but that was completely overshadowed by us turning into the worst team in the league from January.
I think my concern would be that Ralph doesn't seem to learn.
He picks the same players and employs the same tactics week after week.
He has had money to spend - less than some and more than others of course. But for me the jury is out. There have been great moments but equally as many awful moments. I think that if it wasn't for his engaging personality he would have been under a lot more pressure. I think Puel and Hughes would have been slated for some of the stuff Ralph has done. Not least crying over the Liverpool result FFS.
The owners bear some responsibility of course but it's too easy to say it's all their fault. I'd like to see Ralph getting the most out of what he's got and then at that point it's fair to point the finger elsewhere but I really don't think he's done that (compared with say a Potter at Brighton Next season I'd like to see more flexible tactics and substitutions that at least make sense. I'd like to see players improve and nail down regular starting places (not least the keepers).
I'd love Ralph to be a success and be here for 20 years but if we start last season like we finished the last then I fear he'll be gone by Christmas. We aint great but we should be nowhere near the bottom. |  | | |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 09:32 - Jun 10 with 4107 views | grumpy |
You make some good points,Matt.
Like Ron I have thought some of his tactics and team selection have been very strange.
I suppose you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear.
I and the majority of Saints fans like Ralph and their real frustration is with the owner.
Its been a awful time for so many reasons with the virus etc and to lose 2 games 9-0 hurts too.
The core of Saints support are very loyal, they have to be because its so frustrating to see the club and its potential wasted, season after season selling our best players and looking for cheap alternatives.
I agree,stick with Ralph and hopefully we will get new owners in the future. |  | | |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 09:36 - Jun 10 with 4096 views | DorsetIan |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 09:24 - Jun 10 by SonicBoom |
Firstly I don't want RH to go. He is the best we can get at the moment and stability is nearly always a good thing. That said Matt, there is the other side.
He's presided over not only the two worst results in our history, but the worst results in Premier League history.
I can barely think of a player that has improved under Ralph. Armstrong possibly but he is doing now what he did in Scotland. For a long time Ralph barely gave him any game time.
We seem to have one way to play which is an aggressive press and we look good. But we usually run out of steam and then we simply fall back and concede goals. Ok maybe the players aren't fit enough or good enough to do it for 90 minutes - but then surely we should have a different plan. We kept doing the same thing week in week out.
There is an obsession with ball retention meaning players look fearful of risking a forward ball to create chances.
As you say we got to a semi and lost which was fun but it's not an achievement. And yes genuine credit for being top but that was completely overshadowed by us turning into the worst team in the league from January.
I think my concern would be that Ralph doesn't seem to learn.
He picks the same players and employs the same tactics week after week.
He has had money to spend - less than some and more than others of course. But for me the jury is out. There have been great moments but equally as many awful moments. I think that if it wasn't for his engaging personality he would have been under a lot more pressure. I think Puel and Hughes would have been slated for some of the stuff Ralph has done. Not least crying over the Liverpool result FFS.
The owners bear some responsibility of course but it's too easy to say it's all their fault. I'd like to see Ralph getting the most out of what he's got and then at that point it's fair to point the finger elsewhere but I really don't think he's done that (compared with say a Potter at Brighton Next season I'd like to see more flexible tactics and substitutions that at least make sense. I'd like to see players improve and nail down regular starting places (not least the keepers).
I'd love Ralph to be a success and be here for 20 years but if we start last season like we finished the last then I fear he'll be gone by Christmas. We aint great but we should be nowhere near the bottom. |
This.
Ralph is a likeable chap and lifted the mood and the results markedly when he took over from Hughes.
But he is no tactical genius and he has repeatedly made the same mistakes in relation to his team selections, substitutions and game management.
The team's abysmal performance in the second half of last season would have seen most manager's sacked and I think Ralph's and Gao's fortunes are now intrinsically linked.
Question: Would a new owner stick with Ralph and allow him to spend any new funds?
There's also the possibility that Ralph will walk if no new owner and no new funds are forthcoming this summer. This seems a distinct possibility at the moment. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 10:26 - Jun 10 with 4041 views | saints__fan__73 |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 09:36 - Jun 10 by DorsetIan |
This.
Ralph is a likeable chap and lifted the mood and the results markedly when he took over from Hughes.
But he is no tactical genius and he has repeatedly made the same mistakes in relation to his team selections, substitutions and game management.
The team's abysmal performance in the second half of last season would have seen most manager's sacked and I think Ralph's and Gao's fortunes are now intrinsically linked.
Question: Would a new owner stick with Ralph and allow him to spend any new funds?
There's also the possibility that Ralph will walk if no new owner and no new funds are forthcoming this summer. This seems a distinct possibility at the moment. |
Why do people still bang on about owners spending funds? Very few PL owners put their own money into the clubs, with FFP it's very difficult to do this anyway. It's as moronic as in the Lowe era where fans were demanding 'investment' seemingly oblivious to the fact we were a plc and were spending every penny we had.
The reason we are playing with a poor and understrength squad is not Chairman Gao not dipping into his pocket, it's due to a massive amount of money being wasted in the Kreuger/Reed error on the likes of Gunn, Hoedt, Lemina, Boufal, Elyounoussi, Carrillo, etc. Most of whom we are still paying the wages of to this very day.
I would imagine even Man City aren't shelling out the best part of £600k per month on the wages of their 2nd and 3rd choice keepers..... |  |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 10:56 - Jun 10 with 4002 views | DorsetIan |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 10:26 - Jun 10 by saints__fan__73 |
Why do people still bang on about owners spending funds? Very few PL owners put their own money into the clubs, with FFP it's very difficult to do this anyway. It's as moronic as in the Lowe era where fans were demanding 'investment' seemingly oblivious to the fact we were a plc and were spending every penny we had.
The reason we are playing with a poor and understrength squad is not Chairman Gao not dipping into his pocket, it's due to a massive amount of money being wasted in the Kreuger/Reed error on the likes of Gunn, Hoedt, Lemina, Boufal, Elyounoussi, Carrillo, etc. Most of whom we are still paying the wages of to this very day.
I would imagine even Man City aren't shelling out the best part of £600k per month on the wages of their 2nd and 3rd choice keepers..... |
The lack of any net spend in recent years is obvious from both the stats (which others have documented on here very clearly) and from the distinct lack of activity in recent transfer windows.
Yes, we had a bad run, buying a series of duds (but Boufal shouldn't be on your list) but we are also completely fettered by having an owner who cannot provide any support to the business he owns. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 11:38 - Jun 10 with 3970 views | I_would |
I agree with most people on here. As Ralph has committed himself to Saints and got us, albeit briefly, to top spot in the league, I think he ought to stay.
There is, of course the other side of the coin where we have to accept that he hasn't improved any players and he presided over the largest losses in Premier League history (twice), the worst record of points lost from winning positions and took us from top to nearly relegation in one season. Plus, of course, failing to motivate the players at Wembley.
We also have to accept that his starting choices are a bit suspect and his sub choices (and timing of) has been a bit head scratching (according to fans and all pundits and media sources). Plus, of course, his insistance on playing Redders. But I think we should ignore all that and back Ralph to get us into the top six next season and let's hope he keeps to the same system which, I'm sure, will come right eventually. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 12:02 - Jun 10 with 3944 views | Sadoldgit |
I don’t think it is fair to say that he hasn’t improved any players. There are several who are better now than before he came, JWP being one of them!
As for the two 9 nil defeats, we slag off media commentators for bringing those up all of the time yet a number of fans do so too. Perhaps it is time to move on and put those behind us? I can think of worse matches, the Leeds game for example where we never got a kick back in the 70’s. I’m sure people can think of others. If he was a rubbish manager he would have gone by now but the club clearly have faith in him and aren’t swayed by a couple of freak results. |  | | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 12:03 - Jun 10 with 3944 views | franniesTache |
I'm a bit harsher than most, personally i wanted Ralph gone after the second 9-0 and my opinion hasn't really changed.
Other than jazz hands at the end of the game i honestly don't see what's that special about him. In his time here he's overseen,
two 9-0 defeats
our longest losing run in our history
our worst form ever in the premier league
a side that conceded 63 goals
a side that finished 15th, 9th and 12th
He's got a similar success to Dave Jones and a lot of people mistake Ings form with his ability as a manager.
I honestly believe he's been found out and can only see us struggling with him in charge, when you consider you have a manager like Nuno on the market right now i think we could easily improve on him and don't get why "likeable" forgives him a complete lack of success and some unforgivable defeats. |  | | |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 12:15 - Jun 10 with 3916 views | Bison |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 11:38 - Jun 10 by I_would |
I agree with most people on here. As Ralph has committed himself to Saints and got us, albeit briefly, to top spot in the league, I think he ought to stay.
There is, of course the other side of the coin where we have to accept that he hasn't improved any players and he presided over the largest losses in Premier League history (twice), the worst record of points lost from winning positions and took us from top to nearly relegation in one season. Plus, of course, failing to motivate the players at Wembley.
We also have to accept that his starting choices are a bit suspect and his sub choices (and timing of) has been a bit head scratching (according to fans and all pundits and media sources). Plus, of course, his insistance on playing Redders. But I think we should ignore all that and back Ralph to get us into the top six next season and let's hope he keeps to the same system which, I'm sure, will come right eventually. |
Congratulations , that wasn't too hard was it ?
You have started the healing process  |  |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 12:27 - Jun 10 with 3902 views | kernow |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 12:15 - Jun 10 by Bison |
Congratulations , that wasn't too hard was it ?
You have started the healing process |
You don't think he might have been taking the p1ss? | | | |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 13:07 - Jun 10 with 3858 views | dirk_doone |
I think you are both right, which means we have had the worst of both worlds: lack of investment AND poor recruitment. Our minus net spend over the last 5 years is the worst in the Premier League but most of the money we have spent has been wasted anyway on players like Carrillo and Hoedt.
Typically a PL club our size invests a net spend of £20-30 mill per year, which over the last 5 years, means we have fallen more than £100 mill behind teams like Leicester and that has translated into results on the pitch, which have deteriorated over that period.
Once Kat deposed Cortese we began to lose the long-term ambition and then we lost the outstanding talent of our former Head of Recruitment, Paul Mitchell, which had enabled us to do well in spite of lack of investment from the owners.
Some will argue that we had a few good years but so did Bolton when they had 4 consecutive top 8 finishes and a cup final. At both clubs there has been a failure to build on that success. [Post edited 10 Jun 2021 13:14]
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 13:20 - Jun 10 with 3821 views | Kennington |
It was the second 9-nil for me. That’s the equivalent of us managing something like a workshop or conference and your team members set fire to the projector, everyone gets paper cuts from the handouts and food poisoning from the buffet. To happen once is unfortunate but to happen twice is unacceptable. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 13:21 - Jun 10 with 3820 views | saints__fan__73 |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 13:07 - Jun 10 by dirk_doone |
I think you are both right, which means we have had the worst of both worlds: lack of investment AND poor recruitment. Our minus net spend over the last 5 years is the worst in the Premier League but most of the money we have spent has been wasted anyway on players like Carrillo and Hoedt.
Typically a PL club our size invests a net spend of £20-30 mill per year, which over the last 5 years, means we have fallen more than £100 mill behind teams like Leicester and that has translated into results on the pitch, which have deteriorated over that period.
Once Kat deposed Cortese we began to lose the long-term ambition and then we lost the outstanding talent of our former Head of Recruitment, Paul Mitchell, which had enabled us to do well in spite of lack of investment from the owners.
Some will argue that we had a few good years but so did Bolton when they had 4 consecutive top 8 finishes and a cup final. At both clubs there has been a failure to build on that success. [Post edited 10 Jun 2021 13:14]
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You are correct re: Cortese. At that time we had ambition and a plan - that all went when he was ousted (and never replaced).
Now, if you break into the Chairman's office - open his desk drawer and bring out the folder which says 'Southampton FC - Long term business plan' - inside is just a single piece of paper with the words "don't get relegated"......, | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 14:28 - Jun 10 with 3754 views | Bison |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 12:27 - Jun 10 by kernow |
You don't think he might have been taking the p1ss? |
Of course as his last comments proved but its his first post I have ever seen that didnt mention his nemesis so maybe , just maybe he has concluded that the current team with he who shall not be named not in it is actually worse then with him in it. [Post edited 10 Jun 2021 14:29]
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 14:43 - Jun 10 with 3729 views | I_would |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 14:28 - Jun 10 by Bison |
Of course as his last comments proved but its his first post I have ever seen that didnt mention his nemesis so maybe , just maybe he has concluded that the current team with he who shall not be named not in it is actually worse then with him in it. [Post edited 10 Jun 2021 14:29]
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It's not the boy's fault, I don't dislike him at all, nothing to dislike there. If anything my nemesis at the moment would be Ralphy. He keeps picking him, keeps playing the same system with the boy at the centre, and unfortunately has been losing nearly every game as a result.
All we can hope for is a new owner, followed by a new manager, followed by a new captain, followed by a replacement midfield with skill, pace, intelligence, good positioning and the ability to get the ball forward quickly.
You lot can dream about us doing well with Ralphy at the helm and Ward at the centre of things so I can have my dreams. And my opinions. And you can have yours. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 15:01 - Jun 10 with 3718 views | saints__fan__73 |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 13:43 - Jun 10 by DorsetIan |
I can only assume you never saw Boufal play.
Sure, no one managed to get the most out of him but he was class, I'm glad I got the chance to see him play, and I was gutted when he left.
Lumping him in with Carillo and Hoedt is ridiculous.
Dirk has nailed it above on the spending side. Long terms underinvestment, gaps in the squad being left unfilled to the point where now we are struggling to fill the gaps we already have and with Bertrand going and possibly Danny, JWP and Vestergaard too, we have a mountain to climb and no crampons...or rope. |
Are you quite mad? How can you say an attacking player who plays for 4 seasons and get 3 league goals is a success??
We could have stuck Simms in there an he literally couldn't have got a worse return than that but with no £13m transfer fee and a quarter of the wages....
He was every bit as bad a buy as Hoedt. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 15:32 - Jun 10 with 3689 views | DorsetIan |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 15:01 - Jun 10 by saints__fan__73 |
Are you quite mad? How can you say an attacking player who plays for 4 seasons and get 3 league goals is a success??
We could have stuck Simms in there an he literally couldn't have got a worse return than that but with no £13m transfer fee and a quarter of the wages....
He was every bit as bad a buy as Hoedt. |
Different benchmarks I suppose. You don't get to see class like Boufal very often. I'm glad he signed and stayed for 4 years. Worth every penny and a shame no one could get the best out of him. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 16:38 - Jun 10 with 3632 views | I_would |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 13:43 - Jun 10 by DorsetIan |
I can only assume you never saw Boufal play.
Sure, no one managed to get the most out of him but he was class, I'm glad I got the chance to see him play, and I was gutted when he left.
Lumping him in with Carillo and Hoedt is ridiculous.
Dirk has nailed it above on the spending side. Long terms underinvestment, gaps in the squad being left unfilled to the point where now we are struggling to fill the gaps we already have and with Bertrand going and possibly Danny, JWP and Vestergaard too, we have a mountain to climb and no crampons...or rope. |
Boufal was indeed a pleasure to watch on the ball and I seem to remember Redmond being inspired by training with him and wanted to form a creative partnership. It was a classic case at the time of recent managers benching talented non-favourites and not giving them enough time to develop or a chance to prove themselves. (Lemina, Elyounoussi, Targett, Reed etc etc.) We seem to prefer to pay them well for playing with other teams. | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 17:50 - Jun 10 with 3567 views | Sadoldgit |
Such a shame about Boufal. So much promised but delivered so little. He hasn’t set the world alight since moving on either. Ely has done well in the less demanding Scottish league but really doesn’t seem suited physically to the EPL. Target needed to play and he wasn’t good enough at the time to replace Bertrand and we needed the money to strengthened elsewhere. Reed wasn’t good enough to start every game given the competition for places at the time so it made sense to move him on too. Given the players we have at the moment would he start every game without others being injured? I doubt it. Lemina and Reed have been relegated which tells you something. Lemina’s attitude we know all about and his ego is unlikely to allow him to sit on our bench which he would do mostly (without long term injuries). [Post edited 10 Jun 2021 17:55]
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 18:49 - Jun 10 with 3506 views | DellHero_Would |
That’s the thing though Wizz. When our generation retired It was the dawn of the baby Bentley mob...Rick was a throwback.
I watched some video clips on insta thing the other day posted by some of our players. Not mentioning names, but they think their some sort of gangsta rapper type more so than a professional footballer... | |
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| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 20:05 - Jun 10 with 3427 views | Bicester_North |
| Ralph Hasenhuttl on 16:38 - Jun 10 by I_would |
Boufal was indeed a pleasure to watch on the ball and I seem to remember Redmond being inspired by training with him and wanted to form a creative partnership. It was a classic case at the time of recent managers benching talented non-favourites and not giving them enough time to develop or a chance to prove themselves. (Lemina, Elyounoussi, Targett, Reed etc etc.) We seem to prefer to pay them well for playing with other teams. |
How do you remember this inspiration from Redmond?
Was it you he told about this creative partnership he wanted to form? | |
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