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The Countdown begins. 23:28 - Nov 10 with 331336 viewspikeypaul



https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20190329T23&p0=1336&msg=Democr

1:19 pm today was the exact mid point from when the result that the Great British public had decided to leave the EU and the time 11pm March 29th 2019 that Democracy will be delivered.

Happy days.
[Post edited 25 Jun 17:01]

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The Countdown begins. on 11:10 - Sep 14 with 1151 viewswobbly

The Countdown begins. on 10:10 - Sep 14 by sherpajacob

many of us remember the "up yours delors"

its why right wing brexiteers want to cherry pick the 4 freedoms.

Freedom for their capital, goods and services but not for the labour force that works for them.


The EU have cherry picked those 4 freedoms for years. There isn’t, wasn’t and never has been free movement of capital in established EU member countries like The Netherlands, Spain and Italy. But people seem to forget that.
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The Countdown begins. on 14:23 - Sep 14 with 1087 viewsCatullus

The Countdown begins. on 11:05 - Sep 14 by Jango

Load of bitter remainer nonsense. If you seriously think leaving the EU means we’ll then lose all of our rights then you are barking mad.


This is how remainers work, they're not barking mad just brainwashed. They think anything casting the EU in a bad light or Brexit in a good light is fake news spread by "knowledgeless-idiots" but that anything predicting doom and gloom is 100% nailed on.
Haven't they grasped yet that people put COULD into a prediction because it might not happen and when it comes to remain the probability for not happening rises with every prediction they get wrong.
When I voted leave I did so in the belief that Brexit COULD be better for this country, I can't be sure (of course there were other reasons) but it was how I felt. Remainers (some, not all) come across as some kind of modern Scrooge who's just seen the ghost of Christmas future and are scared witless by what it showed them......for Jacob Marley of course see Carney, Hammond is the ghost in this case.

"Remainer Ghost of the Future, I fear you more than any spectre I have seen. But as I know your purpose is to do me good, and as I hope to live to be another man from what I was, I am prepared to bear you company, and do it with a thankful heart. Will you not speak to me and stop brexit?"

Just my opinion, but WTF do I know anyway?
Blog: In, Out, in, out........

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The Countdown begins. on 19:27 - Sep 14 with 1019 viewspeenemunde

The Countdown begins. on 11:05 - Sep 14 by Jango

Load of bitter remainer nonsense. If you seriously think leaving the EU means we’ll then lose all of our rights then you are barking mad.


The problem is most remoaners need someone to wipe their own arses for them.
Remoaner is a metaphor for incapable.

Day after day, they persist with project fear.....only problem is no one is listening to the thick tw@ts......🤣
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The Countdown begins. on 22:40 - Sep 14 with 963 viewspikeypaul

Project fear has become water off a ducks back.

No fecker takes any notice of it anymore.

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The Countdown begins. on 08:24 - Sep 15 with 909 viewspikeypaul

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The Countdown begins. on 08:09 - Sep 16 with 864 viewsBatterseajack

And brexiteers are incapable of thinking for themselves, favour charismatic political figures and lap up vacuous slogans and bluster.
[Post edited 16 Sep 9:41]
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The Countdown begins. on 09:05 - Sep 16 with 852 viewsJango

The Countdown begins. on 08:09 - Sep 16 by Batterseajack

And brexiteers are incapable of thinking for themselves, favour charismatic political figures and lap up vacuous slogans and bluster.
[Post edited 16 Sep 9:41]


Bit rich coming from someone who posts random ramainer tweets about 20 times a week.
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The Countdown begins. on 10:44 - Sep 16 with 822 viewsCatullus

The Countdown begins. on 08:09 - Sep 16 by Batterseajack

And brexiteers are incapable of thinking for themselves, favour charismatic political figures and lap up vacuous slogans and bluster.
[Post edited 16 Sep 9:41]


Which political figure do I favour? I reckon the leave supporting politicians are just as soulless, boring and hopeless as any remainer. Boris apart maybe but he's mad as a box of frogs. Is JRM charismatic these days then?
Is there actually a charismatic politician to be had on any side? As for bluster....Osborne and Carney, enough said.

Just my opinion, but WTF do I know anyway?
Blog: In, Out, in, out........

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The Countdown begins. on 10:56 - Sep 16 with 815 viewspikeypaul

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Not long now lads.

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The Countdown begins. on 13:14 - Sep 16 with 786 viewsKilkennyjack


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The Countdown begins. on 19:36 - Sep 16 with 734 viewsCatullus

The Countdown begins. on 13:14 - Sep 16 by Kilkennyjack



Michael Bloomberg, 11th richest man in the world and CEO of Bloomberg L.P., a global financial services, mass media, and software company......so he won't have any business interests in the EU or UK that might be affected then

Just my opinion, but WTF do I know anyway?
Blog: In, Out, in, out........

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The Countdown begins. on 00:56 - Sep 17 with 697 viewsDJack

The Countdown begins. on 19:36 - Sep 16 by Catullus

Michael Bloomberg, 11th richest man in the world and CEO of Bloomberg L.P., a global financial services, mass media, and software company......so he won't have any business interests in the EU or UK that might be affected then


...or perhaps he understands the growth you get in the EU

It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan

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The Countdown begins. on 07:00 - Sep 17 with 667 viewsKilkennyjack

The Countdown begins. on 19:36 - Sep 16 by Catullus

Michael Bloomberg, 11th richest man in the world and CEO of Bloomberg L.P., a global financial services, mass media, and software company......so he won't have any business interests in the EU or UK that might be affected then


Oh right, he is not an expert or well informed or anything then ?

My mate Keith down the pub says hes wrong see.
Yes thats right - Keith who fits carpets, thats the fella.... ffs !!
[Post edited 17 Sep 7:01]

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The Countdown begins. on 07:09 - Sep 17 with 659 viewsShaky

Deal or no deal? May’s moment of truth on Brexit
EU leaders believe an agreement is possible but worry it will not be ratified in the UK
By Alex Barker in Brussels and George Parker in London

FT, 17 Sep 2018 2 hours ago

The British have long proved past masters at misreading Angela Merkel. But this time, as reports of the German chancellor’s comments filtered through, even in London there was stunned disbelief. Did Ms Merkel really want to celebrate Brexit?

The exchange had come on a balmy July day in Berlin, with Theresa May sat in the chancellor’s airy, whitewashed office. Brexit talks were stuck. Britain’s cabinet was close to self-combustion. But Ms Merkel wanted to raise something else: it was time, she said, to start thinking of a “celebratory” moment that would mark the Brexit deal.

Soon enough it became clear that Ms Merkel’s intentions had been lost in translation: the zelebrieren she had in mind was a solemn commemoration, more akin to a Lutheran church service than independence jamboree.

Yet her remarks were telling. Britain’s exit talks, two years on from the referendum, are entering a new, decisive phase. Leaders are lifting their sights to the finish line. The Brussels compromise machine is primed. All sides see a deal within reach, possibly just eight weeks away. “It’s clear,” says one EU diplomat, “we’re in the endspiel [endgame]”.

A gathering of EU leaders in Salzburg this week will be the first step of what is envisaged as a three-summit jig to a historic UK-EU agreement. Negotiators have even begun considering the choreography of the final act, a denouement expected to be a special summit in mid-November.

This would be the night where leaders around Europe’s top table take a more hands-on role. Mrs May would still be kept apart from the 27 other leaders, based in Britain’s delegation room four floors above, with little but a picture of the Queen for comfort.

Up the lifts would shuttle delegations including Donald Tusk and Jean-Claude Juncker, the presidents of the European Council and Commission. Should one night prove insufficient, there are rumblings about summits in December or even January. But the push for November is strong; Mark Rutte, the Dutch premier, is telling colleagues he wants everyone locked away “until it’s done”.

Deal complete, Mrs May would finally be invited to rejoin the EU’s 27 remaining leaders for that solemn zelebrieren, mixed with smiles, exhaustion and relief. “You have to hope we can be in the same room at the very end,” says one senior EU official handling Brexit.

But even as the stage is set for the end of this Brexit divorce saga, some are growing increasingly alarmed at how unready the conditions appear. Talks on the toughest issues — notably the Irish border— are virtually static, with both sides dug in. Joint drafting of a blueprint for future relations has barely begun, and there are fundamental differences over the prime minister’s Chequers plan for a free movement area for goods.

Serious as these obstacles appear, they are the easier part of Mrs May’s Brexit ordeal: the real problem is selling the exit package to her seething Eurosceptic MPs. “It is very simple. This is not a negotiation between EU and UK,” says Pascal Lamy, the former EU commissioner and director of the World Trade Organization. “What has to be negotiated has been negotiated. This is a negotiation within London between Remainers and Brexiters.”

The trick at the final summit, he adds, will be orchestrating a fight in Brussels to solve a problem in London. “If you need messages saying: oh, we’ve really had our arms twisted, it’s terrible, that is easy. Juncker can do that extremely well, full of pain and suffering,” he says. “You need [Italian writer Luigi] Pirandello to do the choreography for this.”

Yet even as the stage is set for this finale, there is no hiding the concern. Mr Lamy and several senior EU negotiators put the odds of a deal falling apart at 50 per cent, with almost all the risk of failure stemming from the ratification process in the UK’s House of Commons.

Sir Ivan Rogers, Britain’s former EU ambassador, has warned that markets are underpricing the risk of “sleepwalking into a major crisis”. It is not for want of a deal, he says, “but precisely because each side misreads each other’s real incentives and political constraints”.

One central participant in the negotiation admits that the risk of a serious miscalculation is very real: “The pieces are falling into place and that is why everybody feels so nervous”. The political jigsaw, in other words, just may not fit.

With some obvious relish, senior officials in Berlin, Paris and Brussels have stressed for months that Brexit is not even in the top 20 priorities for their leaders. That, at least, is set to change in Salzburg.

No formal conclusions will emerge from the lunch discussion between the 27 leaders. Nor will there be a big re-evaluation of the EU position. But this will be the moment the assembled leaders are “brought into the file” that will dominate the EU agenda for the next few months.

Once briefed by Michel Barnier, the EU’s chief negotiator, three broad questions loom. One is tactical: should they make clear there will be a special summit in November? France worries that this would relieve pressure on London and let it stall negotiations until the summit.

The second is more political: the Irish border. How should the EU reinforce its support for Dublin, while also “de-dramatising” its proposal to avoid a hard border on the island of Ireland. This “backstop” plan, keeping Northern Ireland within the EU’s customs union and single market for goods, is intended to apply “unless and until” a better alternative is found.

Finally there will be the issue of negotiating strategy, and the form of the non-binding “political declaration” on future relations. At issue is how detailed and clear the statement need be, especially on customs and a “single rule book” for goods — the parts of Mrs May’s Chequers plan that are seen in Europeas unviable. Should EU leaders push to level up the arrangements to a full-blown customs union, level down to a Canada-style free trade agreement or just leave the issue unresolved until after Brexit?

On this France and Germany once stood for clarity above all, so populists across Europe would have an unambiguous lesson in what leaving the EU entails. Ms Merkel, though, is now more minded to say only what is needed to help a withdrawal agreement pass the UK parliament. “The Germans have shifted,” says one EU diplomat in touch with Berlin. But senior French officials still insist that “it can’t be too vague”.

Any conclusions are expected to be reflected in a final piece of guidance to Mr Barnier, formally adopted at a summit in October, which would help him “do the deal”, in the words of one senior EU diplomat. “It all depends on what the Brits think they can sell back home,” the diplomat adds.

The public messages from Salzburg will be encouraging, ambitious but unspecific for Mrs May, calibrated to bolster her without giving ground. For the EU knows that before final judgment on what is “sellable”, they must await the outcome of the Labour and Conservative party conferences in Britain at the end of this month.

Seen from European capitals, Mrs May is in thrall to a hardcore of 50-70 Eurosceptic Tory MPs. Boris Johnson, the former foreign secretary, has created an impression of chaos with his lurid newspaper columns, vowing to “chuck Chequers” and suggesting that Mrs May has “strapped a suicide vest” to Britain.

Far from convincing them she has a grip over an unruly party, Mrs May’s allies fear the impression of Tory conference chaos could persuade the EU side to delay taking decisions until “things settle down a bit”. Their experience with the party’s Eurosceptics, however, suggests such a moment will never come.

In no area will this be more important than the Irish border — the final, most difficult issue outstanding in Britain’s withdrawal treaty. “It’s all about Northern Ireland,” says one senior British official, noting Mrs May’s outright rejection of anything splitting the UK economy along the Irish Sea.

“Nobody is complacent and it’s not going to be easy, but it can be fixed,” the official says. “The real problem we have is persuading the EU side that the prime minister is a credible negotiator.”

Both sides expect the ultimate compromise over Ireland to come at the final summit. And both sides are absolutely confident the other will back down. The main battleground: how the backstop plan for Northern Ireland is linked to future UK-EU arrangements.

From the British perspective, the deal could be unlocked if Brussels agreed that the Irish backstop provisions include a UK-wide customs element — removing the need for UK-EU customs checks pending negotiation of a final trade agreement.

In those circumstances, Britain would make concessions to Brussels accepting that much of Northern Ireland’s economy would be treated as part of the EU’s single market. This would remove the need for separate standards checks on goods crossing the Irish border.

The prime minister’s team believe such a deal could be brokered, provided the EU gave assurances to Mrs May — and to the Northern Ireland Unionist politicians who prop up her government — that the backstop would never be needed. A future trade deal, in other words, that would be ambitious enough to make it redundant.
Mr Barnier is ready to offer such blandishments, but only in the non-binding political declaration that accompanies a binding withdrawal treaty. Britain is seeking much more solid, legal guarantees, as a minimum on the UK-wide customs arrangement. “We can’t live on promises,” says one UK official.

In calls with other European leaders, Mrs May has also been adamant that any declaration on the future would need to be detailed and clear, paving the way for a goods arrangement that offers as much free movement as Chequers.

Officials on both sides of the Channel doubt such noble goals will last when deadlines loom and leaders can choose obfuscation over purity. “The Brits will have to go through the process and discover it is in their best interests not to go into detail,” says one senior EU official handling Brexit. “But they are not there yet. We will need to give them some time.”

Such an outcome would leave the UK, on exit day, with little but a vague guide to its future relationship with its biggest trading partner. “But what else do they expect?” asks the official. “The dynamic of the negotiation will change 35 times before we reach the final deal on the future. That’s the brutal reality of things.”

Although it may be Mrs May’s fallback plan, such a fudge may also be one of her strongest cards in Westminster since Brexiters would still have all to play for after Brexit. “The real debate over the future relationship is still to come and in many respects will only start after exit,” says Stephen Adams, a former EU trade official now at Global Counsel. “Many Brexiters are likely to end up betting on this fact.”

Crunch time: Number 10 confident of support at home for a deal

The Conservative party conference, starting on September 30, will be watched in Europe for signs that Theresa May has a grip on her party and the authority to deliver Brexit.

Instead, they are more likely to see Tory activists queueing around the block to cheer their Eurosceptic heroes — including Old Etonians Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg — as they denounce Mrs May and her Chequers compromise plan.

In spite of the ominous political backdrop, there is an air of confidence among Mrs May’s team in Downing Street that the prime minister is on course not only to secure a deal in Brussels, but to push it through the House of Commons.

Mrs May believes she can win approval for the legally binding withdrawal treaty — covering issues including a £39bn exit bill and Northern Ireland — while deferring tricky talks on a future trade deal until after Britain leaves the EU.

Tory Eurosceptics insist that they will oppose any “blind Brexit” deal, but Mrs May is already starting to put the squeeze on her critics.

The first stage is already under way: persuasion. Gavin Barwell, Mrs May’s chief of staff, and Robbie Gibb, her pro-Brexit head of communications, last week held three dinners with Eurosceptic MPs, urging them to support the Chequers compromise.

The second stage will be more menacing. Mrs May will tell Tory MPs that unless they support her final Brexit deal, the result will be political chaos and the possibility of a general election, with the risk of letting in a leftwing Labour government.

“They will have to explain themselves to their local parties and explain why they have brought the government down and handed the country over to a Marxist,” says one May lieutenant. “I hope their principles are strong enough.”

https://www.ft.com/content/33c38718-b7fe-11e8-bbc3-ccd7de085ffe

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The Countdown begins. on 08:58 - Sep 17 with 643 viewspikeypaul

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The Countdown begins. on 09:16 - Sep 17 with 639 viewsCatullus

The Countdown begins. on 07:00 - Sep 17 by Kilkennyjack

Oh right, he is not an expert or well informed or anything then ?

My mate Keith down the pub says hes wrong see.
Yes thats right - Keith who fits carpets, thats the fella.... ffs !!
[Post edited 17 Sep 7:01]


Being an expert is kind of irrelevant if your opinion is totally biased. Bloomberg isn't European nor British, his opinion is probably based purely on his business needs. Theresa May is an Expert as is David Davis and many others but you regularly discount and denigrate their opinions.
As with any argument, people believe the expert that backs up their opinion. I'll probably have to keep repeating myself but the only way we will know for sure if Brexit is good or bad is with hindsight and, the only way to know if remain would have been better is to remain.
However, the dealine is looming, a deal is looking slightly more likely. Assuming a deal happens and is ratified by Parliament you can wait 10 years then either gloat or apologise!

Just my opinion, but WTF do I know anyway?
Blog: In, Out, in, out........

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The Countdown begins. on 11:29 - Sep 17 with 609 viewsBatterseajack

The Countdown begins. on 09:16 - Sep 17 by Catullus

Being an expert is kind of irrelevant if your opinion is totally biased. Bloomberg isn't European nor British, his opinion is probably based purely on his business needs. Theresa May is an Expert as is David Davis and many others but you regularly discount and denigrate their opinions.
As with any argument, people believe the expert that backs up their opinion. I'll probably have to keep repeating myself but the only way we will know for sure if Brexit is good or bad is with hindsight and, the only way to know if remain would have been better is to remain.
However, the dealine is looming, a deal is looking slightly more likely. Assuming a deal happens and is ratified by Parliament you can wait 10 years then either gloat or apologise!


"ll probably have to keep repeating myself but the only way we will know for sure if Brexit is good or bad is with hindsight and, the only way to know if remain would have been better is to remain."

Just about the stupidest thing to say ever. Whats the point in forecasting anything? Whats the point in having a strategy? Whats the point in having a plan?

When you accept another job, do you care to review the new salary, holiday hours, working hours and company Ts&Cs? Do you ask yourself before accepting if you'll be in anyway better off than before?

The Government have made forecasts (as it does so every year when setting budgets) on how much borrowing would increase for each Brexit scenario. They don't see any scenario where it decreases because there is no reason to assume that it would when all is considered. Its out there if you care to look. Or you could just dismiss it out of hand as the Government (voted to deliver brexit) being somehow biased towards remain.
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The Countdown begins. on 12:03 - Sep 17 with 593 viewsHighjack

The Countdown begins. on 11:29 - Sep 17 by Batterseajack

"ll probably have to keep repeating myself but the only way we will know for sure if Brexit is good or bad is with hindsight and, the only way to know if remain would have been better is to remain."

Just about the stupidest thing to say ever. Whats the point in forecasting anything? Whats the point in having a strategy? Whats the point in having a plan?

When you accept another job, do you care to review the new salary, holiday hours, working hours and company Ts&Cs? Do you ask yourself before accepting if you'll be in anyway better off than before?

The Government have made forecasts (as it does so every year when setting budgets) on how much borrowing would increase for each Brexit scenario. They don't see any scenario where it decreases because there is no reason to assume that it would when all is considered. Its out there if you care to look. Or you could just dismiss it out of hand as the Government (voted to deliver brexit) being somehow biased towards remain.


When you take another job do you keep working for your old boss and pay him (or her or them or xi) for the privilege?

The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
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The Countdown begins. on 12:22 - Sep 17 with 589 viewsBatterseajack

The Countdown begins. on 12:03 - Sep 17 by Highjack

When you take another job do you keep working for your old boss and pay him (or her or them or xi) for the privilege?


No, but you work your notice period and pay into any staff funds until the day you leave.

But this settlement fees have been done to death, is it really that hard to understand. It wouldn't be reasonable to leave half way through a mobile phone contract without paying a financial settlement? Or leave the round before its your turn?

The EU budget for a fixed term had all ready been agreed. If we were to leave, either others would have to cough up or there's a hole in the budget. Simples.
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The Countdown begins. on 12:36 - Sep 17 with 581 viewsLeonWasGod

The Countdown begins. on 12:22 - Sep 17 by Batterseajack

No, but you work your notice period and pay into any staff funds until the day you leave.

But this settlement fees have been done to death, is it really that hard to understand. It wouldn't be reasonable to leave half way through a mobile phone contract without paying a financial settlement? Or leave the round before its your turn?

The EU budget for a fixed term had all ready been agreed. If we were to leave, either others would have to cough up or there's a hole in the budget. Simples.


We've committed to these costs (liabilities), end of discussion.

That doesn't mean there isn't room for negotiation around some of the longer term liabilities of course, but the concept isn't hard to grasp. Plus if we walk away without paying what we owe we lose the transition period.
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The Countdown begins. on 12:48 - Sep 17 with 577 viewsBatterseajack

The Countdown begins. on 12:36 - Sep 17 by LeonWasGod

We've committed to these costs (liabilities), end of discussion.

That doesn't mean there isn't room for negotiation around some of the longer term liabilities of course, but the concept isn't hard to grasp. Plus if we walk away without paying what we owe we lose the transition period.


....and stand to lose the numerous deals we still require to make with the EU even in the event of a "No deal"
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The Countdown begins. on 13:32 - Sep 17 with 568 viewsJango

The Countdown begins. on 12:22 - Sep 17 by Batterseajack

No, but you work your notice period and pay into any staff funds until the day you leave.

But this settlement fees have been done to death, is it really that hard to understand. It wouldn't be reasonable to leave half way through a mobile phone contract without paying a financial settlement? Or leave the round before its your turn?

The EU budget for a fixed term had all ready been agreed. If we were to leave, either others would have to cough up or there's a hole in the budget. Simples.


It wouldn’t be reasonable to pay £100 a month for your phone bill and only get a £50 tariff either, but we do.
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The Countdown begins. on 13:38 - Sep 17 with 560 viewsLeonWasGod

The Countdown begins. on 13:32 - Sep 17 by Jango

It wouldn’t be reasonable to pay £100 a month for your phone bill and only get a £50 tariff either, but we do.


We don't though. Why is it Brexiteers ALWAYS ignore the benefits that the membership brings, they only concentrate on the costs and the negatives. E.g. an estimated £60-80bn benefit to businesses from EU trade in goods/services, ~3 million jobs liked to that trade, etc., etc.
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The Countdown begins. on 13:49 - Sep 17 with 555 viewspikeypaul

We are not legally obliged to pay anything after we leave.And if it's no deal then we will not be paying anything.

It's like deciding not to renew your season ticket but being charged for the next 4 seasons anyway since players signed when you were season ticket holder still need to be paid.Fecking laughable.

The Remoaners here are acting like they want us to pay as much as possible just to point score.

Anyway not long now lads one way or the other no deal or Mays deal we are coming out.Hopefully then the remoaners will STFU and accept reality,but I doubt it.

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[Post edited 17 Sep 14:21]

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The Countdown begins. on 14:19 - Sep 17 with 542 viewsBatterseajack

The Countdown begins. on 13:49 - Sep 17 by pikeypaul

We are not legally obliged to pay anything after we leave.And if it's no deal then we will not be paying anything.

It's like deciding not to renew your season ticket but being charged for the next 4 seasons anyway since players signed when you were season ticket holder still need to be paid.Fecking laughable.

The Remoaners here are acting like they want us to pay as much as possible just to point score.

Anyway not long now lads one way or the other no deal or Mays deal we are coming out.Hopefully then the remoaners will STFU and accept reality,but I doubt it.

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[Post edited 17 Sep 14:21]


So if we're not legally obliged to pay, why are we coughing up?

To use your analogy, it would be like leaving mid season because you didn't like the style of football, and then avoiding paying any upcoming installments even though you opted at the start of the season for a structured payment plan.

Come on guys, this isn't complicated.
[Post edited 17 Sep 14:21]
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