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The Countdown begins. 23:28 - Nov 10 with 399757 viewspikeypaul



https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20190329T23&p0=1336&msg=Democr

1:19 pm today was the exact mid point from when the result that the Great British public had decided to leave the EU and the time 11pm March 29th 2019 that Democracy will be delivered.

Happy days.
[Post edited 25 Jun 17:01]

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0
The Countdown begins. on 11:35 - Dec 1 with 470 viewsbluey_the_blue

The Countdown begins. on 10:21 - Dec 1 by johnlangy

They've got closed minds ecb.


Not really, more the recognition the the reality is there are consequences for not applying primacy to such rules, ie fines.

"We want you to pass this law, primacy etc. Ok, you have the choice not to do so and we really don't want to influence you to do something you don't want to but if you don't, we'll fine you..."

Not really much of a free choice there, eh?
-1
The Countdown begins. on 11:47 - Dec 1 with 461 viewsexiledclaseboy

The Countdown begins. on 11:35 - Dec 1 by bluey_the_blue

Not really, more the recognition the the reality is there are consequences for not applying primacy to such rules, ie fines.

"We want you to pass this law, primacy etc. Ok, you have the choice not to do so and we really don't want to influence you to do something you don't want to but if you don't, we'll fine you..."

Not really much of a free choice there, eh?


You lot simply don’t understand sovereignty. Parliament passed the law that allows Eu law to take primacy. Parliament passed the law that allows the Eu to fine the UK if laws are not transposed. No one Parliament can bind the next. Parliament has always been able to repeal those laws if it was Parliament’s will. Repealing those laws is exactly what Parliament has voted to do at 11pm on 29 March 2019. Parliament has remained sovereign over uk law throughout our membership of the Eu. That’s a simple statement of fact.

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2
The Countdown begins. on 12:25 - Dec 1 with 432 viewsbluey_the_blue

The Countdown begins. on 11:47 - Dec 1 by exiledclaseboy

You lot simply don’t understand sovereignty. Parliament passed the law that allows Eu law to take primacy. Parliament passed the law that allows the Eu to fine the UK if laws are not transposed. No one Parliament can bind the next. Parliament has always been able to repeal those laws if it was Parliament’s will. Repealing those laws is exactly what Parliament has voted to do at 11pm on 29 March 2019. Parliament has remained sovereign over uk law throughout our membership of the Eu. That’s a simple statement of fact.


I get and understand your points.

The reality however is that Parliament hasn't repealed hose laws. Like it or not, Eu can fine if those laws are not transposed - stupid of any Parliament to agree to that imo. If tat wasn't there you can guarantee Eu would punish in other ways.

The options have always been transpose laws, don't transpose and expect fines or quit Eu. As a consequence, staying in Eu has always meant transposing due to the negative consequences of not doing so.
-1
The Countdown begins. on 12:33 - Dec 1 with 426 viewsJango

The Countdown begins. on 11:47 - Dec 1 by exiledclaseboy

You lot simply don’t understand sovereignty. Parliament passed the law that allows Eu law to take primacy. Parliament passed the law that allows the Eu to fine the UK if laws are not transposed. No one Parliament can bind the next. Parliament has always been able to repeal those laws if it was Parliament’s will. Repealing those laws is exactly what Parliament has voted to do at 11pm on 29 March 2019. Parliament has remained sovereign over uk law throughout our membership of the Eu. That’s a simple statement of fact.


Unsovereign in all but name. Do as we say or you’ll be fined or worse still we’ll take all your voting rights away. It’s a dictatorship that’s getting worse.
[Post edited 1 Dec 12:37]
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The Countdown begins. on 12:47 - Dec 1 with 415 viewssherpajacob

The Countdown begins. on 12:25 - Dec 1 by bluey_the_blue

I get and understand your points.

The reality however is that Parliament hasn't repealed hose laws. Like it or not, Eu can fine if those laws are not transposed - stupid of any Parliament to agree to that imo. If tat wasn't there you can guarantee Eu would punish in other ways.

The options have always been transpose laws, don't transpose and expect fines or quit Eu. As a consequence, staying in Eu has always meant transposing due to the negative consequences of not doing so.


When you enter into a trade agreement, customs union or treaty as we have with the EU, there needs to be an independent mechanism to 'resolve disputes between members and give rulings where EU law is in conflict with national law. That's what the ECJ does.

If you sign up to the EU, in order to benefit from the most advanced free trade area in the world, you sign up to the ECJ. Otherwise the treaties and trade agreements fall apart.

Brexiteers see this as loss of sovereignty, but it is our choice to be bound or not.

Here's the issue, they talk about regaining sovereignty and signing trade agreements around the world, but these "new" trade agreements will require an independent arbiter to resolve disputes, in the same way the ECJ does within the EU.

Without such a dispute resolution mechanism, nobody will want to enter into trade agreements with us.

So every time we enter a new, post brexit, trade agreement we will be giving up some of the so called sovereignty we would have regained from the EU.

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3

The Countdown begins. on 13:58 - Dec 1 with 379 viewsHighjack

sovereign
/ˈsɒvrɪn/
noun
noun: sovereign; plural noun: sovereigns

1.
a supreme ruler, especially a monarch.
"the Emperor became the first Japanese sovereign to visit Britain"
synonyms: ruler, monarch, supreme ruler, Crown, crowned head, head of state, potentate, suzerain, overlord, dynast, leader; More
king, queen, emperor, empress, prince, princess, tsar, royal duke, grand duke, elector, crown prince, princeling, prince regent, mogul, baron, liege (lord), lord, emir, sheikh, sultan, maharaja, raja;
historicalatheling
2.
a former British gold coin worth one pound sterling, now only minted for commemorative purposes.

adjective
adjective: sovereign

1.
possessing supreme or ultimate power.
"in modern democracies the people's will is in theory sovereign"
synonyms: supreme, absolute, unlimited, unrestricted, unrestrained, unbounded, boundless, infinite, ultimate, total, unconditional, full, utter, paramount; More
principal, chief, dominant, predominant, ruling;
royal, regal, kingly, monarchical
"he asserted that sovereign power belonged to the people"
(of a nation or its affairs) acting or done independently and without outside interference.
"a sovereign, democratic republic"
synonyms: independent, self-governing, autonomous, self-determining, self-legislating; More
non-aligned, free
"the Allies turned the western part of Germany into a sovereign state"
archaic•literary
possessing royal power and status.
"our most sovereign lord the King"
2.
dated
very good or effective.
"a sovereign remedy for all ills"

"Possessing supreme or ultimate power"

"Non-aligned, chief, dominant, self-legislating"

"Without outside interference"

None of these apply to Parliament in the current state.

Parliament would be truly sovereign if it could demand fines and issue punishments on the EU. But they can't, it's the other way around. Because the simple fact is the EU has the supreme and ultimate power. They are chief, dominant, ruling. Not Parliament.

Unless you choose to change the official definition of the word sovereign in your own head of course.

The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
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-1
The Countdown begins. on 14:34 - Dec 1 with 365 viewsGowerjack

The Countdown begins. on 11:47 - Dec 1 by exiledclaseboy

You lot simply don’t understand sovereignty. Parliament passed the law that allows Eu law to take primacy. Parliament passed the law that allows the Eu to fine the UK if laws are not transposed. No one Parliament can bind the next. Parliament has always been able to repeal those laws if it was Parliament’s will. Repealing those laws is exactly what Parliament has voted to do at 11pm on 29 March 2019. Parliament has remained sovereign over uk law throughout our membership of the Eu. That’s a simple statement of fact.


Its not difficult to understand.

Unless your a bit fûcking thick.

Plastic since 1974
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1
The Countdown begins. on 14:37 - Dec 1 with 363 viewsA_Fans_Dad

The Countdown begins. on 12:47 - Dec 1 by sherpajacob

When you enter into a trade agreement, customs union or treaty as we have with the EU, there needs to be an independent mechanism to 'resolve disputes between members and give rulings where EU law is in conflict with national law. That's what the ECJ does.

If you sign up to the EU, in order to benefit from the most advanced free trade area in the world, you sign up to the ECJ. Otherwise the treaties and trade agreements fall apart.

Brexiteers see this as loss of sovereignty, but it is our choice to be bound or not.

Here's the issue, they talk about regaining sovereignty and signing trade agreements around the world, but these "new" trade agreements will require an independent arbiter to resolve disputes, in the same way the ECJ does within the EU.

Without such a dispute resolution mechanism, nobody will want to enter into trade agreements with us.

So every time we enter a new, post brexit, trade agreement we will be giving up some of the so called sovereignty we would have regained from the EU.


Typical remainer waffle.
I assume you have never heard of the WTO then?
You do realise that we already have far more deals and trade outside of the EU than we do with them?
You also realise that dealing with the EU it is a totally negative trade deal for the UK?
You do realise that Growth is far higher outside the EU than in it?
I have never seen so much bullshit from so many lying bastards in all my life as has been put out by the Remain Campaign, before during and after the Referendum and it is getting worse by the day.
-1
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The Countdown begins. on 14:42 - Dec 1 with 358 viewsexiledclaseboy

The Countdown begins. on 13:58 - Dec 1 by Highjack

sovereign
/ˈsɒvrɪn/
noun
noun: sovereign; plural noun: sovereigns

1.
a supreme ruler, especially a monarch.
"the Emperor became the first Japanese sovereign to visit Britain"
synonyms: ruler, monarch, supreme ruler, Crown, crowned head, head of state, potentate, suzerain, overlord, dynast, leader; More
king, queen, emperor, empress, prince, princess, tsar, royal duke, grand duke, elector, crown prince, princeling, prince regent, mogul, baron, liege (lord), lord, emir, sheikh, sultan, maharaja, raja;
historicalatheling
2.
a former British gold coin worth one pound sterling, now only minted for commemorative purposes.

adjective
adjective: sovereign

1.
possessing supreme or ultimate power.
"in modern democracies the people's will is in theory sovereign"
synonyms: supreme, absolute, unlimited, unrestricted, unrestrained, unbounded, boundless, infinite, ultimate, total, unconditional, full, utter, paramount; More
principal, chief, dominant, predominant, ruling;
royal, regal, kingly, monarchical
"he asserted that sovereign power belonged to the people"
(of a nation or its affairs) acting or done independently and without outside interference.
"a sovereign, democratic republic"
synonyms: independent, self-governing, autonomous, self-determining, self-legislating; More
non-aligned, free
"the Allies turned the western part of Germany into a sovereign state"
archaic•literary
possessing royal power and status.
"our most sovereign lord the King"
2.
dated
very good or effective.
"a sovereign remedy for all ills"

"Possessing supreme or ultimate power"

"Non-aligned, chief, dominant, self-legislating"

"Without outside interference"

None of these apply to Parliament in the current state.

Parliament would be truly sovereign if it could demand fines and issue punishments on the EU. But they can't, it's the other way around. Because the simple fact is the EU has the supreme and ultimate power. They are chief, dominant, ruling. Not Parliament.

Unless you choose to change the official definition of the word sovereign in your own head of course.


All of those apply to parliament now.

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0
The Countdown begins. on 18:30 - Dec 1 with 306 viewsexiledclaseboy

The Countdown begins. on 12:25 - Dec 1 by bluey_the_blue

I get and understand your points.

The reality however is that Parliament hasn't repealed hose laws. Like it or not, Eu can fine if those laws are not transposed - stupid of any Parliament to agree to that imo. If tat wasn't there you can guarantee Eu would punish in other ways.

The options have always been transpose laws, don't transpose and expect fines or quit Eu. As a consequence, staying in Eu has always meant transposing due to the negative consequences of not doing so.


As I said, you don’t understand sovereignty. Don’t feel bad though. Highjack copied and pasted the actual various definitions of the word further down and still can’t grasp it. It must be more difficult than I thought.

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1
The Countdown begins. on 18:42 - Dec 1 with 302 viewsBatterseajack

The Countdown begins. on 14:37 - Dec 1 by A_Fans_Dad

Typical remainer waffle.
I assume you have never heard of the WTO then?
You do realise that we already have far more deals and trade outside of the EU than we do with them?
You also realise that dealing with the EU it is a totally negative trade deal for the UK?
You do realise that Growth is far higher outside the EU than in it?
I have never seen so much bullshit from so many lying bastards in all my life as has been put out by the Remain Campaign, before during and after the Referendum and it is getting worse by the day.


Do you realise that we have over 60 special trading statuses (which are better than WTO) with countries outside of the EU through our membership with the EU? No countries trade solely on WTO.
1
The Countdown begins. on 19:19 - Dec 1 with 278 viewssherpajacob

The Countdown begins. on 14:37 - Dec 1 by A_Fans_Dad

Typical remainer waffle.
I assume you have never heard of the WTO then?
You do realise that we already have far more deals and trade outside of the EU than we do with them?
You also realise that dealing with the EU it is a totally negative trade deal for the UK?
You do realise that Growth is far higher outside the EU than in it?
I have never seen so much bullshit from so many lying bastards in all my life as has been put out by the Remain Campaign, before during and after the Referendum and it is getting worse by the day.


The answer is in your question.

If we trade under WTO rules, guess what? We are subject to WTO rules and their dispute mechanism.

Now this may come as a shock- WTO rules are not set by our Westminster parliament.

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1
The Countdown begins. on 19:28 - Dec 1 with 261 viewsDJack

The Countdown begins. on 19:19 - Dec 1 by sherpajacob

The answer is in your question.

If we trade under WTO rules, guess what? We are subject to WTO rules and their dispute mechanism.

Now this may come as a shock- WTO rules are not set by our Westminster parliament.


But...but...were taking back control. Wibble!

It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan

0

The Countdown begins. on 19:44 - Dec 1 with 245 viewsBatterseajack

0
The Countdown begins. on 19:48 - Dec 1 with 240 viewsCatullus

The Countdown begins. on 11:47 - Dec 1 by exiledclaseboy

You lot simply don’t understand sovereignty. Parliament passed the law that allows Eu law to take primacy. Parliament passed the law that allows the Eu to fine the UK if laws are not transposed. No one Parliament can bind the next. Parliament has always been able to repeal those laws if it was Parliament’s will. Repealing those laws is exactly what Parliament has voted to do at 11pm on 29 March 2019. Parliament has remained sovereign over uk law throughout our membership of the Eu. That’s a simple statement of fact.


That is your take on it. Others would argue that the only way to take primacy back is to leave the EU. Staying in the EU is an agreement that they are in charge, it's signing over power to them.
The EU will not allow us to over rule them without enforcing a punishment on us. If we are sovereign then how can they punish us?
Our EU membership is basically a power of attorney, we agree to submit to their rules.

Just my opinion, but WTF do I know anyway?
Blog: In, Out, in, out........

0
The Countdown begins. on 19:58 - Dec 1 with 234 viewsbluey_the_blue

The Countdown begins. on 19:19 - Dec 1 by sherpajacob

The answer is in your question.

If we trade under WTO rules, guess what? We are subject to WTO rules and their dispute mechanism.

Now this may come as a shock- WTO rules are not set by our Westminster parliament.


Do you believe those WTO rules will be applied permanently or temporarily whilst deals are worked out?
0
The Countdown begins. on 20:00 - Dec 1 with 232 viewsDJack

The Countdown begins. on 19:44 - Dec 1 by Batterseajack



The irony is that we can't use it because of a rule that OUR Government INSISTED on putting in on the terms for Galileo.

It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan

1
The Countdown begins. on 20:28 - Dec 1 with 205 viewsBatterseajack

The Countdown begins. on 20:00 - Dec 1 by DJack

The irony is that we can't use it because of a rule that OUR Government INSISTED on putting in on the terms for Galileo.


🤦‍♂️

We must be a laughing stock to our neighbors
0
The Countdown begins. on 20:31 - Dec 1 with 201 viewsWarwickHunt

The Countdown begins. on 19:44 - Dec 1 by Batterseajack



Another billion down the shitter.
0

The Countdown begins. on 20:37 - Dec 1 with 196 viewsBatterseajack

Gets worse 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

0
The Countdown begins. on 20:40 - Dec 1 with 190 viewsA_Fans_Dad

The Countdown begins. on 18:42 - Dec 1 by Batterseajack

Do you realise that we have over 60 special trading statuses (which are better than WTO) with countries outside of the EU through our membership with the EU? No countries trade solely on WTO.


Yes and most of them are costing US money, because they have high tarrifs, especially on food.
Perhaps you can quote to us which are the top 20 best and worst of those deals for the UK and not the EU in general and France & Germany in particular?
Perhaps you can also tell us why we have countries queing up to make trade deals with us when we leave?
-1
The Countdown begins. on 20:42 - Dec 1 with 185 viewsDJack

The Countdown begins. on 20:37 - Dec 1 by Batterseajack

Gets worse 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️



Not so much turtles, more like clusterfúcks all the way down.

It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan

0
The Countdown begins. on 20:55 - Dec 1 with 179 viewsLeonWasGod

The Countdown begins. on 19:44 - Dec 1 by Batterseajack



She makes it sound like it’s part of the plan, but she hasn’t got a choice. She wanted to use it, but can’t. The Universities Minister resigned yesterday over this one. Will the last Minister left please turn out the lights.
1

The Countdown begins. on 21:04 - Dec 1 with 173 viewsA_Fans_Dad

But at the same time under the current deal our Youngsters, who so love the EU, can serve in it's Army.
You know that EU army the Remainers denied was coming.
Will there be Conscription, who knows?
Will the EU "Army", include our Navy & Air Force as well, who knows?
Who will ultimate control of it, who knows?
-2
The Countdown begins. on 21:07 - Dec 1 with 167 viewsBatterseajack

The Countdown begins. on 21:04 - Dec 1 by A_Fans_Dad

But at the same time under the current deal our Youngsters, who so love the EU, can serve in it's Army.
You know that EU army the Remainers denied was coming.
Will there be Conscription, who knows?
Will the EU "Army", include our Navy & Air Force as well, who knows?
Who will ultimate control of it, who knows?


Project fear
2
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