Please log in or register. Registered visitors get fewer ads.
Forum index | Previous Thread | Next thread
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club 11:09 - May 28 with 13297 viewsQJumpingJack

https://www.swanstrust.co.uk/2018/05/28/where-do-we-go-from-here-managing-the-cl

which includes:

Who is the right man to lead this review and make the necessary decisions? A few years ago that would have been an easy question to answer. If we look at this dispassionately, Huw Jenkins’ record for a long time was as good as anyone in the game. Sadly his track record in recent years is pretty much the polar opposite. Due to the continued failings in recruitment, both player and managerial, the Supporters Trust has called for the removal of Huw Jenkins as Chairman and as such we do not believe he is the right man to lead that exercise.
0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:46 - May 28 with 2452 viewsJoe_bradshaw

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 20:53 - May 28 by max936

They can't decide on whether to have jam or marmalade on their toast in the morning so what fecking hope have we got.


I’m struggling between Doombar and Hobgoblin at the moment.

Planet Swans Prediction League Winner Season 2013-14. Runner up 2014_15.
Poll: How many points clear of relegation will we be on Saturday night?

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 00:02 - May 29 with 2394 viewsTNT

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:46 - May 28 by Joe_bradshaw

I’m struggling between Doombar and Hobgoblin at the moment.


Then there's 'Waddle It Be' and 'Big Willie'.

Poll: Would you make goalposts bigger?

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 16:19 - May 29 with 2277 viewsMoscowJack

I think that the Trust's statement, apart from being a bit bland and lacking much real substance, does tick a lot of boxes. It's saying what a lot of us have been thinking for a long time, even if it is stating the bleedin' obvious for most. Of course is HAS to be said as not everyone reads forums etc and it never harms to repeat the failures of those you're criticising like this anyway.

In an ideal world, the Trust would be able to approach their fellow shareholders, sit down and work out a plan, but that boat sailed a long time ago. The reason that boat sailed is the same reason our season failed last season - Huw Jenkins.

He worked wonders for many years with almost every player failure matched by a success, with a few average ones thrown in the middle. Even last August, SKY reporters and people who are paid to know these things were excited about our chances with Tammy (off the back of an excellent season at Bristol City), Bony (proven at Swansea and should thrive back "home") and Sanches (who many said was signing of the summer). Jenkins luck ran out as all three failed to varying degrees, but instead of us (as a club) being able to take it on the chin and work together to find a united solution, the club is broken and fractured into four parts.

Jenkins got the ball rolling when he told the Yanks that the Trust had no voice and to ignore them. That was obviously to make sure the deal wasn't scuppered (like Yanks v1 was) but it set the tone for what we have now.

It's very probable that the Yanks and Trust could have worked together if the relationship hadn't started in such a way, but it doesn't look like improving any time soon.

Sadly, the Trust has also been incredibly weak, to put it bluntly. I believe that there are at least 3 or 4 on the Trust who'd rather have a formal business-like relationship/partnership with the Yanks than the soft-handed @rse-licking relationship that seems to have been allowed, in order for "some" to enjoy the hospitality of the boardrooms home and away. I was at Bournemouth away watching Leroy and Leon sit just in front of me in the away end whilst Stu and Hamer sat in the Director's box. It's not illegal, but does it send the right message?

Unfortunately, for every 3 or 4 who would demand a strong position and very business-like relationship, there seems to be 4, 5 or 6 who are self-serving, too weak or not strong enough to make tough decisions.

For the club to move forward, we need to clean out the rot within the club. That, in my opinion, is Jenkins and several of the old farts within the Trust who offer next to nothing, except a valuable vote to help/back the younger and more enthusiastic brains amongst them.

I'm glad the Trust is following the legal route, but unless there's a cull of the old fart brigade (OFB), nothing will change going foward. It's the same when we're expecting Jenkins to oversea a summer of successful recruitment when it's clear to all involved that he is no longer wanted, no longer needed and no longer able to wave his magic wand in the way he once did....a long time ago!

Poll: Simple...would you want Leon in the squad right now, if he was available?

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 17:55 - May 29 with 2221 viewsSmellyplumz

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 16:19 - May 29 by MoscowJack

I think that the Trust's statement, apart from being a bit bland and lacking much real substance, does tick a lot of boxes. It's saying what a lot of us have been thinking for a long time, even if it is stating the bleedin' obvious for most. Of course is HAS to be said as not everyone reads forums etc and it never harms to repeat the failures of those you're criticising like this anyway.

In an ideal world, the Trust would be able to approach their fellow shareholders, sit down and work out a plan, but that boat sailed a long time ago. The reason that boat sailed is the same reason our season failed last season - Huw Jenkins.

He worked wonders for many years with almost every player failure matched by a success, with a few average ones thrown in the middle. Even last August, SKY reporters and people who are paid to know these things were excited about our chances with Tammy (off the back of an excellent season at Bristol City), Bony (proven at Swansea and should thrive back "home") and Sanches (who many said was signing of the summer). Jenkins luck ran out as all three failed to varying degrees, but instead of us (as a club) being able to take it on the chin and work together to find a united solution, the club is broken and fractured into four parts.

Jenkins got the ball rolling when he told the Yanks that the Trust had no voice and to ignore them. That was obviously to make sure the deal wasn't scuppered (like Yanks v1 was) but it set the tone for what we have now.

It's very probable that the Yanks and Trust could have worked together if the relationship hadn't started in such a way, but it doesn't look like improving any time soon.

Sadly, the Trust has also been incredibly weak, to put it bluntly. I believe that there are at least 3 or 4 on the Trust who'd rather have a formal business-like relationship/partnership with the Yanks than the soft-handed @rse-licking relationship that seems to have been allowed, in order for "some" to enjoy the hospitality of the boardrooms home and away. I was at Bournemouth away watching Leroy and Leon sit just in front of me in the away end whilst Stu and Hamer sat in the Director's box. It's not illegal, but does it send the right message?

Unfortunately, for every 3 or 4 who would demand a strong position and very business-like relationship, there seems to be 4, 5 or 6 who are self-serving, too weak or not strong enough to make tough decisions.

For the club to move forward, we need to clean out the rot within the club. That, in my opinion, is Jenkins and several of the old farts within the Trust who offer next to nothing, except a valuable vote to help/back the younger and more enthusiastic brains amongst them.

I'm glad the Trust is following the legal route, but unless there's a cull of the old fart brigade (OFB), nothing will change going foward. It's the same when we're expecting Jenkins to oversea a summer of successful recruitment when it's clear to all involved that he is no longer wanted, no longer needed and no longer able to wave his magic wand in the way he once did....a long time ago!


And your bum chum mm can clear off and all.... Right nick.

""Although I cannot promise or predict the future, I can guarantee one thing - the current board of directors will always fight, as we have done over the last 12 years, to work together as one with the Supporters Trust to make 100% sure that Swansea City football club remains the number one priority in all our thoughts and in every decision we make."
Poll: Huw Jenkins

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 20:19 - May 29 with 2173 viewsShaky

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 16:19 - May 29 by MoscowJack

I think that the Trust's statement, apart from being a bit bland and lacking much real substance, does tick a lot of boxes. It's saying what a lot of us have been thinking for a long time, even if it is stating the bleedin' obvious for most. Of course is HAS to be said as not everyone reads forums etc and it never harms to repeat the failures of those you're criticising like this anyway.

In an ideal world, the Trust would be able to approach their fellow shareholders, sit down and work out a plan, but that boat sailed a long time ago. The reason that boat sailed is the same reason our season failed last season - Huw Jenkins.

He worked wonders for many years with almost every player failure matched by a success, with a few average ones thrown in the middle. Even last August, SKY reporters and people who are paid to know these things were excited about our chances with Tammy (off the back of an excellent season at Bristol City), Bony (proven at Swansea and should thrive back "home") and Sanches (who many said was signing of the summer). Jenkins luck ran out as all three failed to varying degrees, but instead of us (as a club) being able to take it on the chin and work together to find a united solution, the club is broken and fractured into four parts.

Jenkins got the ball rolling when he told the Yanks that the Trust had no voice and to ignore them. That was obviously to make sure the deal wasn't scuppered (like Yanks v1 was) but it set the tone for what we have now.

It's very probable that the Yanks and Trust could have worked together if the relationship hadn't started in such a way, but it doesn't look like improving any time soon.

Sadly, the Trust has also been incredibly weak, to put it bluntly. I believe that there are at least 3 or 4 on the Trust who'd rather have a formal business-like relationship/partnership with the Yanks than the soft-handed @rse-licking relationship that seems to have been allowed, in order for "some" to enjoy the hospitality of the boardrooms home and away. I was at Bournemouth away watching Leroy and Leon sit just in front of me in the away end whilst Stu and Hamer sat in the Director's box. It's not illegal, but does it send the right message?

Unfortunately, for every 3 or 4 who would demand a strong position and very business-like relationship, there seems to be 4, 5 or 6 who are self-serving, too weak or not strong enough to make tough decisions.

For the club to move forward, we need to clean out the rot within the club. That, in my opinion, is Jenkins and several of the old farts within the Trust who offer next to nothing, except a valuable vote to help/back the younger and more enthusiastic brains amongst them.

I'm glad the Trust is following the legal route, but unless there's a cull of the old fart brigade (OFB), nothing will change going foward. It's the same when we're expecting Jenkins to oversea a summer of successful recruitment when it's clear to all involved that he is no longer wanted, no longer needed and no longer able to wave his magic wand in the way he once did....a long time ago!


Under the circumstances I don't believe Jenkins should stay a second longer than necessary.

But as a general matter if the choice is between the right plan and unsatisfactory people versus unknown plans and people I would chose the former every time.

Does the club have the right plan? That question can only be answered by asking tough questions and/or making demands of somebody significantly more involved in that process than Leigh Dineen.

Misology -- It's a bitch
Poll: Greatest PS Troll Hunter of all time

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 20:49 - May 29 with 2153 viewsJinxy

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 20:19 - May 29 by Shaky

Under the circumstances I don't believe Jenkins should stay a second longer than necessary.

But as a general matter if the choice is between the right plan and unsatisfactory people versus unknown plans and people I would chose the former every time.

Does the club have the right plan? That question can only be answered by asking tough questions and/or making demands of somebody significantly more involved in that process than Leigh Dineen.


Yep. However, and I think you & I probably agree on this - the first step for regeneration is for the sellers to depart - a cleansing process for the whole club I think. Ideally I'd like the Americans to sell to a long term investor (who will actually put money in!), but let's take things one step at a time.

THEN we can move on, plan etc.. God I'd even help them with a plan etc. FOC - most of us would I imagine. Trouble is, I doubt they will sling their hooks, as it were.
0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:00 - May 29 with 2130 viewsFlashberryjack

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 20:49 - May 29 by Jinxy

Yep. However, and I think you & I probably agree on this - the first step for regeneration is for the sellers to depart - a cleansing process for the whole club I think. Ideally I'd like the Americans to sell to a long term investor (who will actually put money in!), but let's take things one step at a time.

THEN we can move on, plan etc.. God I'd even help them with a plan etc. FOC - most of us would I imagine. Trouble is, I doubt they will sling their hooks, as it were.


They will sling their hook only when the carcass has been stripped bare, then leave us saddled with the rent of £300,000 PA for the Stadium.

As a club we were terminally fooked from the day the sell outs sold us, and they knew it as well.

Hello
Poll: Should the Senedd be Abolished

1
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:20 - May 29 with 2103 viewslonglostjack

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 16:19 - May 29 by MoscowJack

I think that the Trust's statement, apart from being a bit bland and lacking much real substance, does tick a lot of boxes. It's saying what a lot of us have been thinking for a long time, even if it is stating the bleedin' obvious for most. Of course is HAS to be said as not everyone reads forums etc and it never harms to repeat the failures of those you're criticising like this anyway.

In an ideal world, the Trust would be able to approach their fellow shareholders, sit down and work out a plan, but that boat sailed a long time ago. The reason that boat sailed is the same reason our season failed last season - Huw Jenkins.

He worked wonders for many years with almost every player failure matched by a success, with a few average ones thrown in the middle. Even last August, SKY reporters and people who are paid to know these things were excited about our chances with Tammy (off the back of an excellent season at Bristol City), Bony (proven at Swansea and should thrive back "home") and Sanches (who many said was signing of the summer). Jenkins luck ran out as all three failed to varying degrees, but instead of us (as a club) being able to take it on the chin and work together to find a united solution, the club is broken and fractured into four parts.

Jenkins got the ball rolling when he told the Yanks that the Trust had no voice and to ignore them. That was obviously to make sure the deal wasn't scuppered (like Yanks v1 was) but it set the tone for what we have now.

It's very probable that the Yanks and Trust could have worked together if the relationship hadn't started in such a way, but it doesn't look like improving any time soon.

Sadly, the Trust has also been incredibly weak, to put it bluntly. I believe that there are at least 3 or 4 on the Trust who'd rather have a formal business-like relationship/partnership with the Yanks than the soft-handed @rse-licking relationship that seems to have been allowed, in order for "some" to enjoy the hospitality of the boardrooms home and away. I was at Bournemouth away watching Leroy and Leon sit just in front of me in the away end whilst Stu and Hamer sat in the Director's box. It's not illegal, but does it send the right message?

Unfortunately, for every 3 or 4 who would demand a strong position and very business-like relationship, there seems to be 4, 5 or 6 who are self-serving, too weak or not strong enough to make tough decisions.

For the club to move forward, we need to clean out the rot within the club. That, in my opinion, is Jenkins and several of the old farts within the Trust who offer next to nothing, except a valuable vote to help/back the younger and more enthusiastic brains amongst them.

I'm glad the Trust is following the legal route, but unless there's a cull of the old fart brigade (OFB), nothing will change going foward. It's the same when we're expecting Jenkins to oversea a summer of successful recruitment when it's clear to all involved that he is no longer wanted, no longer needed and no longer able to wave his magic wand in the way he once did....a long time ago!


No mention of MM? Why is he different? It’s been pointed out on here that you’re friends - fair enough. But he went behind the Trust’s back. At the very least he could have kicked up a fuss instead of flying under the radar and cashing in. I think it’s a bit disingenuous to hide behind the fact that your friendship precludes you from asking him about his role.
[Post edited 29 May 2018 21:42]

Poll: Alcohol in the lockdown

0
Login to get fewer ads

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:35 - May 29 with 2083 viewsShaky

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 20:49 - May 29 by Jinxy

Yep. However, and I think you & I probably agree on this - the first step for regeneration is for the sellers to depart - a cleansing process for the whole club I think. Ideally I'd like the Americans to sell to a long term investor (who will actually put money in!), but let's take things one step at a time.

THEN we can move on, plan etc.. God I'd even help them with a plan etc. FOC - most of us would I imagine. Trouble is, I doubt they will sling their hooks, as it were.


The problem with framing the issues in that way is that nobody other than Kaplan realistically has any control over whether they clear off or not.

Similarly they also have sole control over whether Jenkins is sacked. The Trust has already called for his departure and nothing has happened. Doing it again, just makes them look more ineffectual, if that is possible!

instead it seems to me the way forward is to depersonalise as far as possible.

That means for example setting a strategic imperative to recruit a technical director/DoF or whatever the title will be, and then giving him responsibility for managing the squad. It shouldn't be hard to make the case this has been a catastrophic failure in recent years.

And setting hard financial targets for the club. That doesn't mean flexibility can not be countenanced, but by establishing financial targets you unavoidably get in to the nitty-gritty of business decisions and create a real discussion as to their nature.

If they insist on keeping Jenkins under those circumstances that will remain their choice, but at least he can't do any more real damage, and there would be a clear potential path out of the mire.

Misology -- It's a bitch
Poll: Greatest PS Troll Hunter of all time

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:59 - May 29 with 2026 viewsJinxy

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:35 - May 29 by Shaky

The problem with framing the issues in that way is that nobody other than Kaplan realistically has any control over whether they clear off or not.

Similarly they also have sole control over whether Jenkins is sacked. The Trust has already called for his departure and nothing has happened. Doing it again, just makes them look more ineffectual, if that is possible!

instead it seems to me the way forward is to depersonalise as far as possible.

That means for example setting a strategic imperative to recruit a technical director/DoF or whatever the title will be, and then giving him responsibility for managing the squad. It shouldn't be hard to make the case this has been a catastrophic failure in recent years.

And setting hard financial targets for the club. That doesn't mean flexibility can not be countenanced, but by establishing financial targets you unavoidably get in to the nitty-gritty of business decisions and create a real discussion as to their nature.

If they insist on keeping Jenkins under those circumstances that will remain their choice, but at least he can't do any more real damage, and there would be a clear potential path out of the mire.


This is where the Trust needs to be far more assertive, by outlining the depth of feeling against HJ and co. As I say, demand deadlines. There is a toxicity about the club - "our own" were the architects of our demise ultimately (this is the bit that hurts most for me), and they need to be exited stage left for us to realistically move on.

I know what you're saying from a practical sense, but in the same way a marquee signing can galvanise a club, a marquee sacking can regenerate one! I think it would be a clever and catalytic move by the Americans, and would in some way bring them closer to the fans/club - and even Trust! As I said though, I don't think they value or will do that, because either they don't get it (unlikely), or simply don't care and are more focused on the numbers and a "fast buck" (more likely).
0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 09:40 - May 30 with 1913 viewsShaky

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:59 - May 29 by Jinxy

This is where the Trust needs to be far more assertive, by outlining the depth of feeling against HJ and co. As I say, demand deadlines. There is a toxicity about the club - "our own" were the architects of our demise ultimately (this is the bit that hurts most for me), and they need to be exited stage left for us to realistically move on.

I know what you're saying from a practical sense, but in the same way a marquee signing can galvanise a club, a marquee sacking can regenerate one! I think it would be a clever and catalytic move by the Americans, and would in some way bring them closer to the fans/club - and even Trust! As I said though, I don't think they value or will do that, because either they don't get it (unlikely), or simply don't care and are more focused on the numbers and a "fast buck" (more likely).


As regards sacking Jenkins I don't think it is so much a clever move as a bleedin' obvious one, cos he has publicly and spectacularly failed.

How on earth can they not hold him accountable?

7 managers through the Swansea City managerial revolving door in the past 2 and a bit years strongly indicates fundamental problems must have existed elsewhere.

If there is one thing US style private equity investors are good at it is aligning management incentives with shareholder interests, and on that basis he should have been kicked out of the door after the final whistle against Stoke. Genuinely.

And I must say i find the likely reason for that quite troubling; like you I suspect Steve, Jase, and Oprah have all lost interest. They signed up for the glamour of the Prem, not the pedestrian competitiveness of the Championship.

Whether or not that is the case, I believe by moving the discussion on towards actual business decisions like organisational structure and financial targets you are not only forcing them to engage, but also doing it in way that is hard to ignore as they are obviously key to the club's success.

It involves shaping the agenda, rather than constantly reacting to events in a pinball like manner as the Trust has been doing as long as I have been taking an interest.

Engage with the membership and preferably with the entire fanbase and conduct some intelligent opinion research to identify and quantify support for various initiatives. That could potnetially add significant value for the other shareholders, and provide information they actually want to hear and can use.

Otherwise just calling for Jenkins' head again and again produces only this; he eventually goes for one reason or another, with the Trust still a hostage to events and without any sensible input into his successor or the planning process in general.

And if Stevie-boy and Jase don't have any either, then you're really in the shit.

Misology -- It's a bitch
Poll: Greatest PS Troll Hunter of all time

-1
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 09:46 - May 30 with 1904 viewsmoonie

Some excellent comments here especially from pozuelo .

To me, we re on dire straights and I'm not sure our owners have an idea what to do.

New manager should already be in situ working towards binned the crap and replacing appropriately.

It's a vacuum at the moment and it's very worrying as it seems everyone has left the office of such a large business ,which it is
0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:05 - May 30 with 1883 viewsJinxy

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 09:40 - May 30 by Shaky

As regards sacking Jenkins I don't think it is so much a clever move as a bleedin' obvious one, cos he has publicly and spectacularly failed.

How on earth can they not hold him accountable?

7 managers through the Swansea City managerial revolving door in the past 2 and a bit years strongly indicates fundamental problems must have existed elsewhere.

If there is one thing US style private equity investors are good at it is aligning management incentives with shareholder interests, and on that basis he should have been kicked out of the door after the final whistle against Stoke. Genuinely.

And I must say i find the likely reason for that quite troubling; like you I suspect Steve, Jase, and Oprah have all lost interest. They signed up for the glamour of the Prem, not the pedestrian competitiveness of the Championship.

Whether or not that is the case, I believe by moving the discussion on towards actual business decisions like organisational structure and financial targets you are not only forcing them to engage, but also doing it in way that is hard to ignore as they are obviously key to the club's success.

It involves shaping the agenda, rather than constantly reacting to events in a pinball like manner as the Trust has been doing as long as I have been taking an interest.

Engage with the membership and preferably with the entire fanbase and conduct some intelligent opinion research to identify and quantify support for various initiatives. That could potnetially add significant value for the other shareholders, and provide information they actually want to hear and can use.

Otherwise just calling for Jenkins' head again and again produces only this; he eventually goes for one reason or another, with the Trust still a hostage to events and without any sensible input into his successor or the planning process in general.

And if Stevie-boy and Jase don't have any either, then you're really in the shit.


Yep. My point is though that the springboard for any "plan" (we can dream eh), starts slightly before stripping out the old regime (sellers) from the organisation - that change should be managed carefully of course, otherwise down the league we will slip . For me, there's no way any real change, harmony or growth can start with them still at the club. The feeling is too strong, and in actual fact their presence probably adversely affects the relationship between the Trust (i.e. fan base) and the owners.

Surely by now the owners have sussed them out, the nepotism at the club, poor recruitment, financial mismanagement etc. etc.. I've worked with enough yanks to know the only thing they're really interested in is converting dimes to dollars. The fact that they must have sussed that, and haven't (thus far anyway) acted, makes me suspicious to say the least. Sorry to be so negative, but I'm fine with the championship for a few years as long as we restore the club (all aspects) to something that we can again be so proud of. Right now, we are deservedly a laughing stock. Now where's that rope...!
0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:11 - May 30 with 1876 viewsPrivate_Partz

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 09:40 - May 30 by Shaky

As regards sacking Jenkins I don't think it is so much a clever move as a bleedin' obvious one, cos he has publicly and spectacularly failed.

How on earth can they not hold him accountable?

7 managers through the Swansea City managerial revolving door in the past 2 and a bit years strongly indicates fundamental problems must have existed elsewhere.

If there is one thing US style private equity investors are good at it is aligning management incentives with shareholder interests, and on that basis he should have been kicked out of the door after the final whistle against Stoke. Genuinely.

And I must say i find the likely reason for that quite troubling; like you I suspect Steve, Jase, and Oprah have all lost interest. They signed up for the glamour of the Prem, not the pedestrian competitiveness of the Championship.

Whether or not that is the case, I believe by moving the discussion on towards actual business decisions like organisational structure and financial targets you are not only forcing them to engage, but also doing it in way that is hard to ignore as they are obviously key to the club's success.

It involves shaping the agenda, rather than constantly reacting to events in a pinball like manner as the Trust has been doing as long as I have been taking an interest.

Engage with the membership and preferably with the entire fanbase and conduct some intelligent opinion research to identify and quantify support for various initiatives. That could potnetially add significant value for the other shareholders, and provide information they actually want to hear and can use.

Otherwise just calling for Jenkins' head again and again produces only this; he eventually goes for one reason or another, with the Trust still a hostage to events and without any sensible input into his successor or the planning process in general.

And if Stevie-boy and Jase don't have any either, then you're really in the shit.


I agree with virtually all of that. Change must happen with Jenkins out the door for being the spectacular failure that he has over the last 3 years.
Concerned posters like me are then asked ' who do you think should replace him?' 'Don't know?' 'Stick with Jenkins then as it is better the devil you know.
Trouble is The Devil and his ego will take us spiralling downs through the leagues.
My response is that supporters like us are not necessarily the best qualified to advise on structure and personnel. I have offered opinions on how I see the way forward and get shot down in flames for it.
Yes let the Trust garner views from the fans but also involve some football people who know the game inside out. I am thinking Tosh Snr, Curt, Leon, Flyn etc. Possibly even Brenda and the Waiter. I am sure they would stick their four penneth in as they have no axe to grind in the Championship.
Their findings could then be put before the Yanks as a way forward and to potentially get some lolly into their Hedge Fund by making a succsfull club a more valuable sellable entity.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 10:13]

You have mission in life to hold out your hand, To help the other guy out, Help your fellow man. Stan Ridgway

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:14 - May 30 with 1866 viewsShaky

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:11 - May 30 by Private_Partz

I agree with virtually all of that. Change must happen with Jenkins out the door for being the spectacular failure that he has over the last 3 years.
Concerned posters like me are then asked ' who do you think should replace him?' 'Don't know?' 'Stick with Jenkins then as it is better the devil you know.
Trouble is The Devil and his ego will take us spiralling downs through the leagues.
My response is that supporters like us are not necessarily the best qualified to advise on structure and personnel. I have offered opinions on how I see the way forward and get shot down in flames for it.
Yes let the Trust garner views from the fans but also involve some football people who know the game inside out. I am thinking Tosh Snr, Curt, Leon, Flyn etc. Possibly even Brenda and the Waiter. I am sure they would stick their four penneth in as they have no axe to grind in the Championship.
Their findings could then be put before the Yanks as a way forward and to potentially get some lolly into their Hedge Fund by making a succsfull club a more valuable sellable entity.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 10:13]


Bingo.

Misology -- It's a bitch
Poll: Greatest PS Troll Hunter of all time

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:21 - May 30 with 1854 viewsMoscowJack

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 21:20 - May 29 by longlostjack

No mention of MM? Why is he different? It’s been pointed out on here that you’re friends - fair enough. But he went behind the Trust’s back. At the very least he could have kicked up a fuss instead of flying under the radar and cashing in. I think it’s a bit disingenuous to hide behind the fact that your friendship precludes you from asking him about his role.
[Post edited 29 May 2018 21:42]


longlostjack,

I've answered this on here so many times. People believe it or don't believe it but I'm not going to go over and over and over every single time.

In short - HJ & LD lead the Yanks v2 talks and I 100% believe that most of the rest of the board did not know terms were signed at the time that they were (in the previous December). MM & BK were leading talks with Chinese group/s at the time so the "announcement" came as a bit of a shock. Whether you want to believe that or not is simply your choice, but it is exactly as I believe it happened as I was around quite a lot at the time so spoke to many people involved from all sides. I even set up a meeting between the Trust and MM to try and broker some peace, with the hope of them teaming up to block the deal (which they could have done with BK's vote too). Unfortunately, I don't think either party went into the meeting either positively or with an open mind, if I'm honest.

Poll: Simple...would you want Leon in the squad right now, if he was available?

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:37 - May 30 with 1823 viewsE20Jack

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 20:19 - May 29 by Shaky

Under the circumstances I don't believe Jenkins should stay a second longer than necessary.

But as a general matter if the choice is between the right plan and unsatisfactory people versus unknown plans and people I would chose the former every time.

Does the club have the right plan? That question can only be answered by asking tough questions and/or making demands of somebody significantly more involved in that process than Leigh Dineen.


So as usual, Shaky has now cottoned on several months later.

You now seem to be saying you believe Jenkins should stay unless there is a suitable succession plan... you know, the same thing me and the Res have been saying for the last 6 months and you have been crying about and telling everyone we are being paid to suggest such a thing.

You are funny I must say. But welcome anyway, you are catching up a lot quicker these days, measuring it in months now which is an improvement.

Poll: 6 point deduction and sellouts lose all their cash?

-1
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:40 - May 30 with 1816 viewsMoscowJack

I agree with those who say that it's not up to us, the fans, to know who's the best person to replace Jenkins.

That's up to the owners and Pearlman, in my opinion. They need to go out to some of the better agents and do their due diligence (a word not well-known within our club) but the main thing that needs to be considered is, what would the new DoF do exactly?

Will he have a recruitment team under him? Will he do all negotiations re. contracts and signings? Will he oversee the academy and U23s?

Either way, these are some of the questions that the Trust NEED to be asking about Jenkins and a potential replacement. For example, do the Yanks have a plan B in case Jenkins resigns (as if!) or is pushed? In fairness, they might have asked that but don't want to share such sensitive material, but we know so little about what the Trust is doing because they seem to be hiding behind the 'wall of silence' they promised once they announced the mediation.

Poll: Simple...would you want Leon in the squad right now, if he was available?

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:48 - May 30 with 1794 viewsQJumpingJack

On recent performance, the owners have no plan B - there are no signs of any mitigation plans.
0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:54 - May 30 with 1788 viewsE20Jack

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:40 - May 30 by MoscowJack

I agree with those who say that it's not up to us, the fans, to know who's the best person to replace Jenkins.

That's up to the owners and Pearlman, in my opinion. They need to go out to some of the better agents and do their due diligence (a word not well-known within our club) but the main thing that needs to be considered is, what would the new DoF do exactly?

Will he have a recruitment team under him? Will he do all negotiations re. contracts and signings? Will he oversee the academy and U23s?

Either way, these are some of the questions that the Trust NEED to be asking about Jenkins and a potential replacement. For example, do the Yanks have a plan B in case Jenkins resigns (as if!) or is pushed? In fairness, they might have asked that but don't want to share such sensitive material, but we know so little about what the Trust is doing because they seem to be hiding behind the 'wall of silence' they promised once they announced the mediation.


Of course it is up to them, but could you tell me anyone they have appointed to their other sports clubs that have done any better? History suggests it won’t end well.

What’s clear is that decisions like this should absolutely be with fan input but it is a weak trust and an even weaker membership that have done all they can to blunt any voice they had, and even voted to get rid of it all together for a few useless quid.

Ask as many questions as you like regarding the running of the club. Have as many reviews as you like. What do you honestly think that is going to achieve? Far too many thinking much too short term, if a fight had an end goal and an achievable and desirable target then these questions and reviews would have purpose. But it doesn’t, it is a continuous fight and a futile one.

The only realistic way this club will ever now be run for the City and for the fans is if the Trust own a meaningful stake. The only realistic way it can do that is by getting the sufficient amount of cash for their shares in order to do that in the future after we step back and allow the club to naturally decline by poor stewardship.

A poster asked earlier if this above happens, will the Trust board be making the footballing decisions. The answer is of course not. They will however have control over the purse strings and can then bring in their own DoF, a professional, and for footballing reasons based on merit.

Now isn’t that more desirable than forever being shocked that we are being owned by people wanting to profit from the club and people making decisions that are unsatisfactory? Because if you think it will change just by getting rid of Jenkins or even forcing the Americans out then that is horrendously short sighted and naive. We are on a conveyor belt, get rid of one machine operator, another comes in, get rid of the boss, another comes in. The constant is that we stay on that belt until we fall off the end.

Our energy needs to go into reforming and strengthening the fanbase not this papering over the chasms, never ending futility of lobbying for the sacking of replaceable and never ending conveyor belt operators.

As I told all these splinter groups at the time who asked me if I would like to join, stop looking for revenge and put your energy into putting yourselves into a position to take back control, because if you don’t then as we saw with Yanks mk 1 - your next fight will be yanks mk 2 and 3 and 4 and 5 so on and so forth.

I’d like to think after a year of wasted energy, resources and time that may sink in soon. But I doubt it. Revenge can be an insatiable foe, even if it costs us our club to get it.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 11:10]

Poll: 6 point deduction and sellouts lose all their cash?

1
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 11:04 - May 30 with 1774 viewscockneyswan

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:54 - May 30 by E20Jack

Of course it is up to them, but could you tell me anyone they have appointed to their other sports clubs that have done any better? History suggests it won’t end well.

What’s clear is that decisions like this should absolutely be with fan input but it is a weak trust and an even weaker membership that have done all they can to blunt any voice they had, and even voted to get rid of it all together for a few useless quid.

Ask as many questions as you like regarding the running of the club. Have as many reviews as you like. What do you honestly think that is going to achieve? Far too many thinking much too short term, if a fight had an end goal and an achievable and desirable target then these questions and reviews would have purpose. But it doesn’t, it is a continuous fight and a futile one.

The only realistic way this club will ever now be run for the City and for the fans is if the Trust own a meaningful stake. The only realistic way it can do that is by getting the sufficient amount of cash for their shares in order to do that in the future after we step back and allow the club to naturally decline by poor stewardship.

A poster asked earlier if this above happens, will the Trust board be making the footballing decisions. The answer is of course not. They will however have control over the purse strings and can then bring in their own DoF, a professional, and for footballing reasons based on merit.

Now isn’t that more desirable than forever being shocked that we are being owned by people wanting to profit from the club and people making decisions that are unsatisfactory? Because if you think it will change just by getting rid of Jenkins or even forcing the Americans out then that is horrendously short sighted and naive. We are on a conveyor belt, get rid of one machine operator, another comes in, get rid of the boss, another comes in. The constant is that we stay on that belt until we fall off the end.

Our energy needs to go into reforming and strengthening the fanbase not this papering over the chasms, never ending futility of lobbying for the sacking of replaceable and never ending conveyor belt operators.

As I told all these splinter groups at the time who asked me if I would like to join, stop looking for revenge and put your energy into putting yourselves into a position to take back control, because if you don’t then as we saw with Yanks mk 1 - your next fight will be yanks mk 2 and 3 and 4 and 5 so on and so forth.

I’d like to think after a year of wasted energy, resources and time that may sink in soon. But I doubt it. Revenge can be an insatiable foe, even if it costs us our club to get it.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 11:10]


Absolutely this 👍
1
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 12:28 - May 30 with 1715 viewsShaky

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 10:54 - May 30 by E20Jack

Of course it is up to them, but could you tell me anyone they have appointed to their other sports clubs that have done any better? History suggests it won’t end well.

What’s clear is that decisions like this should absolutely be with fan input but it is a weak trust and an even weaker membership that have done all they can to blunt any voice they had, and even voted to get rid of it all together for a few useless quid.

Ask as many questions as you like regarding the running of the club. Have as many reviews as you like. What do you honestly think that is going to achieve? Far too many thinking much too short term, if a fight had an end goal and an achievable and desirable target then these questions and reviews would have purpose. But it doesn’t, it is a continuous fight and a futile one.

The only realistic way this club will ever now be run for the City and for the fans is if the Trust own a meaningful stake. The only realistic way it can do that is by getting the sufficient amount of cash for their shares in order to do that in the future after we step back and allow the club to naturally decline by poor stewardship.

A poster asked earlier if this above happens, will the Trust board be making the footballing decisions. The answer is of course not. They will however have control over the purse strings and can then bring in their own DoF, a professional, and for footballing reasons based on merit.

Now isn’t that more desirable than forever being shocked that we are being owned by people wanting to profit from the club and people making decisions that are unsatisfactory? Because if you think it will change just by getting rid of Jenkins or even forcing the Americans out then that is horrendously short sighted and naive. We are on a conveyor belt, get rid of one machine operator, another comes in, get rid of the boss, another comes in. The constant is that we stay on that belt until we fall off the end.

Our energy needs to go into reforming and strengthening the fanbase not this papering over the chasms, never ending futility of lobbying for the sacking of replaceable and never ending conveyor belt operators.

As I told all these splinter groups at the time who asked me if I would like to join, stop looking for revenge and put your energy into putting yourselves into a position to take back control, because if you don’t then as we saw with Yanks mk 1 - your next fight will be yanks mk 2 and 3 and 4 and 5 so on and so forth.

I’d like to think after a year of wasted energy, resources and time that may sink in soon. But I doubt it. Revenge can be an insatiable foe, even if it costs us our club to get it.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 11:10]


So to summarise, Dim is arguing that the only way the club can be saved is to allow it to go to hell first.

At that point the reformed and strengthened fanbase - details of which remain undisclosed - can then step in and resurrect (geddit?) the fortunes of the club.

This is the plan of the nihilistic psychopath.

Misology -- It's a bitch
Poll: Greatest PS Troll Hunter of all time

-1
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 16:06 - May 30 with 1614 viewsE20Jack

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 12:28 - May 30 by Shaky

So to summarise, Dim is arguing that the only way the club can be saved is to allow it to go to hell first.

At that point the reformed and strengthened fanbase - details of which remain undisclosed - can then step in and resurrect (geddit?) the fortunes of the club.

This is the plan of the nihilistic psychopath.


In order to summarise, it is advised you understand what is written first.

To summarise a piece of text you don’t understand is the work of a racist Danish psychopath with anger problems and a penchant for trying to lure money out of a club he doesn’t suppport. God that was specific. Wonder who that could be.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 16:09]

Poll: 6 point deduction and sellouts lose all their cash?

-1
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 16:21 - May 30 with 1597 viewsE20Jack

Now to clarify to the proper fan:-

Firstly, our path is now pre determined, we have no say in what happens to us no matter how many reviews we ask for or questions we ask. The club will be run how others want it run. So we don’t “let” the club fail at all, just like we didn’t “let” us become relegated, it is nothing to do with us.

Secondly and a very neat link - it is nothing to do with us because the Trust failed in its duties to protect its interests, voice and ultimately participation in the running and future of the club. This can also be extended to the Trust membership too. Everybody knew deep down the Trust was set up to fight for the club tooth and nail - yet the lure of staying in the Premier League proved so much so that longevity was sacrificed for the extremely short term.

Thirdly, and possibly finally, all this wasted energy and focus on removing pointless pawns in a pre determined game would be better suited to reforming the trust and strengthening the organisation that is currently on its arse. As it is through the Trust that we will ultimately get the club back as we want it and can actually put certain spanners in the works and protect this club forever rendering all these pointless side battles just that, pointless.

And as a sign off, as some fans who were never there may think of being a lowly Championship club or a mid range League 1 club as “the depths of hell”, for us real fans that have been there before know it is far from that, especially when you have a say in your own club, it means any future promotions are that much sweeter as an monies made will be ploughed back into the club. It’s a wonderful feeling knowing your local club is in good hands, so why people aren’t focussed on that is beyond me. As I said, revenge can be insatiable and blinds an awful lot of people.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 16:25]

Poll: 6 point deduction and sellouts lose all their cash?

0
Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 17:06 - May 30 with 1554 viewsShaky

Swans Trust: Where Do We Go From Here - Managing The Club on 16:21 - May 30 by E20Jack

Now to clarify to the proper fan:-

Firstly, our path is now pre determined, we have no say in what happens to us no matter how many reviews we ask for or questions we ask. The club will be run how others want it run. So we don’t “let” the club fail at all, just like we didn’t “let” us become relegated, it is nothing to do with us.

Secondly and a very neat link - it is nothing to do with us because the Trust failed in its duties to protect its interests, voice and ultimately participation in the running and future of the club. This can also be extended to the Trust membership too. Everybody knew deep down the Trust was set up to fight for the club tooth and nail - yet the lure of staying in the Premier League proved so much so that longevity was sacrificed for the extremely short term.

Thirdly, and possibly finally, all this wasted energy and focus on removing pointless pawns in a pre determined game would be better suited to reforming the trust and strengthening the organisation that is currently on its arse. As it is through the Trust that we will ultimately get the club back as we want it and can actually put certain spanners in the works and protect this club forever rendering all these pointless side battles just that, pointless.

And as a sign off, as some fans who were never there may think of being a lowly Championship club or a mid range League 1 club as “the depths of hell”, for us real fans that have been there before know it is far from that, especially when you have a say in your own club, it means any future promotions are that much sweeter as an monies made will be ploughed back into the club. It’s a wonderful feeling knowing your local club is in good hands, so why people aren’t focussed on that is beyond me. As I said, revenge can be insatiable and blinds an awful lot of people.
[Post edited 30 May 2018 16:25]


Wow.

Predetermination, fatalism, a canvass cleaning accompanied by blind faith in a utopian outcome that runs totally contrary to any practical experience.

It is a tour de force of philosophical nonsense.

Thanks for sharing!

Misology -- It's a bitch
Poll: Greatest PS Troll Hunter of all time

-1
About Us Contact Us Terms & Conditions Privacy Cookies Advertising
© FansNetwork 2024