Please log in or register. Registered visitors get fewer ads.
Forum index | Previous Thread | Next thread
Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland 18:56 - Dec 13 with 3171 viewstrampie


Leanne asks is this what Wales wants ?

She then gets a reply what would be best for our future.


Wales first and last [and best] colony of the Empire.

Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
Poll: UK European Union membership referendum poll

-1
Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 09:47 - Dec 14 with 846 viewstrampie

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-42848685

Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
Poll: UK European Union membership referendum poll

-1
Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 10:17 - Dec 14 with 832 viewsLeonWasGod

Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 20:54 - Dec 13 by AguycalledJack

Can somebody explain to me how wales would survive economically as an independent nation?


Same as every other country, we'd make money or borrow it.

The only country that generates as much as it spends is East Timor

0
Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 12:29 - Dec 14 with 807 viewsHighjack

Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 21:34 - Dec 13 by lifelong

Who are ‘they’?


Mary the punk and Lofty.
[Post edited 14 Dec 2018 12:30]

The creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.
Poll: Should Dippy Drakeford do us all a massive favour and just bog off?

1
Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 14:21 - Dec 14 with 775 viewsJosey_Wales37

https://www.mixcloud.com/RadioBeca/radio-yes-cymru-english-hour-awr-saesneg-1811
0
Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 17:43 - Dec 16 with 706 viewsjohnlangy

Map of Brexit Britain and Ireland on 05:56 - Dec 14 by AguycalledJack

I understand that but it doesn’t answer my original question though.

Let’s say wales votes for independence which will mean no more funding from Westminster. The Eu have from what I am aware told the Scots that even if they break away from the uk there is no automatic right to join the EU. As such, it can be presumed that the same will apply to Wales. I’m just interested in where and how people think Wales will survive economically as an independent nation? Where’s the money going to come from?
[Post edited 14 Dec 2018 6:01]


Many people ask the same question and i've explained it as I understand it many times but i'll happily do it again.

We've been fed the stories many times by the UK press about Wales being a financial basket case. They've regularly quoted two numbers, Welsh Revenue and Welsh expenditure and many people take those two numbers and say, because there's a big gap between the two, that Wales can't afford Independence. Just two numbers ! It should be blindingly obvious that it takes more than two numbers to explain the entire Welsh financial situation.

So, here's my take on it. The last two numbers quoted were £38 billion Welsh Expenditure and £24 billion Welsh revenue. A huge difference.

Firstly the revenue (tax) figure is meaningless unless it includes ALL Welsh taxes. The majority of the major companies with a presence in Wales have their HQ in England and most of them declare their VAT and Corporation Tax as one figure where the HQ is based. So Tesco, for example, declare it at their HQ in Hertfordshire. So the VAT on their £60 billion UK sales is registered in England. Their sales in Wales would be about £3 billion just simply taking 5% (Welsh share of the population). Not all their sales are VAT chargeable but you can see that that would be a huge number. The same applies to Corp Tax. Another huge number. But they're not counted as Welsh taxes.

Multiply that by all the companies with a Welsh presence but declaring in the same way and you end up with billions. I can only guess at the amount because I doubt if Tesco would bother about johnlangy ringing up and asking how much the figures are. But you get my drift hopefully. So my guess is £5/6 billion.

Then Welsh Expenditure. Most people, when you ask them what Welsh Expenditure means, say it's money spent in Wales. Wrong. The bulk of it is but there's another huge amount that's not. When the UK government decides to go ahead with a project that they deem to be for the benefit of the whole of the UK they allocate a part of the cost to the nations and regions based on population. So, Wales gets 5%. The trouble is that the vast majority of those projects happen in England and most of THEM happen in London and the South East of England. Crossrail for London has, so far, cost Wales £1 billion or so (cost rising). HS2, by the time it's complete will have cost Wales about £5 billion. Heathrow expansion and Crossrail 2 will cost a combined £3 billion or so. If they go ahead with Trident that'll cost us £6 billion. The key point about all these huge spends is that they provide virtually no benefit to Wales whatsoever even though it's adding billions each year to the 'Welsh Expenditure' figure.

It's worth making a local point here by saying there was no £1 billion of Welsh Expenditure for the Swansea Bay Tidal Lagoon (a project that would have given a large boost to the poorest region in NW Europe, West Wales) but there's billions Welsh Expenditure to invest in the richest region in Europe.

I'll make another point now that this is not a Wales v England point. The same applies to the rest of the UK so it's actually the rest of the UK versus London and the SE of England.

So, again, i'll have to make up numbers for reasons i've explained but they're reasonable I believe. If you add £5/6 billion to the Welsh Revenue figure you come to about £30 billion. And if you take a few billion of the Welsh Expenditure figure (if Wales was Independent none of those sums would be spent) then you come down to a gap of about £5 billion.

Another further £2.3 billion of spend is allocated to Wales as our 5% share of the cost of the UK army. If Wales was Independent we would spend an amount on defence perhaps proportionate to Ireland. That would be £300 million.

So we're down to £3 billion. And almost every country in the World, including England runs a financial deficit. No one says England couldn't be Independent.

So, essentially, the answer to your question is that Westminster doesn't fund Wales, we do. By paying tax.

I've seen so many posts from presumably Welsh people who appear to relish stating that Wales needs to be funded by Westminster. If you were to meet an English person and got talking about Welsh Independence and that person said that Wales couldn't afford it, that we need to be subsidised by Westminster (effectively Wales needs subsidising by English taxpayers - he'd be talking about himself) wouldn't you like to be able to say to that person, now hold on butt, it's not quite as simple as that.
-1
About Us Contact Us Terms & Conditions Privacy Cookies Advertising
© FansNetwork 2024