| Mid table mediocrity 19:52 - Jan 14 with 4291 views | dickythorpe |
Of our 10 wins this season how many of them involve sides that sit above us at this present time? |  | | |  |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:26 - Jan 16 with 805 views | jack247 |
It’s because there is a far greater disparity in this league than most of us expected. The top few sides are just on a different level to us at the moment. There’s quite a few mediocre teams further down, most we have seen off fairly comfortably. We had a couple of awful results where we should have had the game sewn up by half time, Rotherham, Ipswich, that aside, we’re pretty much where we should be. Not strong enough to seriously challenge the best, nowhere near the worst. |  | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:29 - Jan 16 with 795 views | sainthelens |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:24 - Jan 16 by dickythorpe |
I await some threads started by you eventually. [Post edited 16 Jan 2019 7:25]
|
Nothing personal Dicky. |  | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:41 - Jan 16 with 788 views | 34dfgdf54 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:20 - Jan 16 by jasper_T |
Woods might be stuck on the bench by now, or be keeping Grimes (who is outperforming him by virtually every metric) out of the team on reputation. Worth £7m do you think? We should be pretty happy with how that one has worked out imo.
Cheap backup/a prospect to play ahead of Fulton would have been (and still would be) welcome, but Woods wasn't that. |
No one knows how Woods would have done here.
I personally think he would have made a big difference to us. Stoke are struggling in a big way, and he's been one of the few shining lights they have had.
Not taking nothing away from Grimes though, the way he's come on under Potter has been terrific, fair play to him. |  | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:53 - Jan 16 with 775 views | jack247 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:20 - Jan 16 by jasper_T |
Woods might be stuck on the bench by now, or be keeping Grimes (who is outperforming him by virtually every metric) out of the team on reputation. Worth £7m do you think? We should be pretty happy with how that one has worked out imo.
Cheap backup/a prospect to play ahead of Fulton would have been (and still would be) welcome, but Woods wasn't that. |
Woods relatively struggling at Stoke under Rowett doesn’t mean he’d have struggled here under Potter. He was Potters top target and as far as I know was excellent at Brentford.
He may well have been keeping Fer out of the team, sitting deep with Grimes playing further forward and whether Fer is here next season could have been a non issue.
We couldn’t afford it, that much is pretty clear now. We shouldn’t have been strung along as fans and the management team certainly shouldn’t have been strung along. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:01 - Jan 16 with 769 views | 34dfgdf54 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:53 - Jan 16 by jack247 |
Woods relatively struggling at Stoke under Rowett doesn’t mean he’d have struggled here under Potter. He was Potters top target and as far as I know was excellent at Brentford.
He may well have been keeping Fer out of the team, sitting deep with Grimes playing further forward and whether Fer is here next season could have been a non issue.
We couldn’t afford it, that much is pretty clear now. We shouldn’t have been strung along as fans and the management team certainly shouldn’t have been strung along. |
Good post and better worded than mine as per usual.
I wouldn't say Woods is stuggling at Stoke though, not according to their fans anyway. The team and club are struggling but he's performing well on the whole.
The problem is, he was never in our price range, so it's a pretty pointless discussion in fairness. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:05 - Jan 16 with 759 views | Loyal |
| Mid table mediocrity on 19:15 - Jan 15 by thornabyswan |
Yes we lost to Rotherham Ipswich and Hull as well won those 3 we would have been 9 points better off.
But I would imagine most teams pick up more points off the bottom sides than the top ones.
That's why the top sides are top and the bottom sides are struggling.
Don't need Stephen Hawkins to work that one out. [Post edited 15 Jan 2019 19:19]
|
Stephen Hawkins is Roger Brace mate, no good going to him for answers. |  |
| Nolan sympathiser, clout expert, personal friend of Leigh Dineen, advocate and enforcer of porridge swallows.
The official inventor of the tit w@nk. | | Poll: | Who should be Swansea number 1 |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:23 - Jan 16 with 744 views | jack247 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:01 - Jan 16 by 34dfgdf54 |
Good post and better worded than mine as per usual.
I wouldn't say Woods is stuggling at Stoke though, not according to their fans anyway. The team and club are struggling but he's performing well on the whole.
The problem is, he was never in our price range, so it's a pretty pointless discussion in fairness. |
Agreed. That should have been made clear to Potter from the outset. He may then have even been able to source the cheaper player Jasper was referring to. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:56 - Jan 16 with 724 views | jasper_T |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:23 - Jan 16 by jack247 |
Agreed. That should have been made clear to Potter from the outset. He may then have even been able to source the cheaper player Jasper was referring to. |
Do you think Potter wasn't aware when he was offered the job that our budget dependent on player sales? We did have other options on the board. Riedewald turned down a loan. Plus some rando free agent that supposedly failed a medical. Again, not shedding too many tears over missing them.
For all Stoke are "struggling" they're only two points (and 7 goals) worse off than we are. They're struggling more in terms of weight of expectation rather than by straightforward comparison with us this season. They keep about as much of the ball as we do (52% avg vs. 53%), create similar numbers of chances (11.5 shots per game vs 12.5) etc. It's not like he'd be playing in a completely different environment here.
Woods makes less tackles & interceptions per game than both our starting midfielders, while also providing fewer key passes and being dispossessed just as often. To his credit he edges the pass completion % over Grimes and given that he's playing considerably more long balls that's pretty impressive, but they don't appear to be the incisive sort that are leading to chances on goal (see some of Fer's passing recently).
As the defensive mid we've been looking for he doesn't seem to offer anything defensively that we don't already have. I'm willing to bet he'd get a lot of the same "small, lightweight, sideways passing..." criticisms that have dogged so many of our players, including Grimes who is far and away the more successful tackler of the pair this season. | | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| Mid table mediocrity on 12:11 - Jan 16 with 675 views | jack247 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:56 - Jan 16 by jasper_T |
Do you think Potter wasn't aware when he was offered the job that our budget dependent on player sales? We did have other options on the board. Riedewald turned down a loan. Plus some rando free agent that supposedly failed a medical. Again, not shedding too many tears over missing them.
For all Stoke are "struggling" they're only two points (and 7 goals) worse off than we are. They're struggling more in terms of weight of expectation rather than by straightforward comparison with us this season. They keep about as much of the ball as we do (52% avg vs. 53%), create similar numbers of chances (11.5 shots per game vs 12.5) etc. It's not like he'd be playing in a completely different environment here.
Woods makes less tackles & interceptions per game than both our starting midfielders, while also providing fewer key passes and being dispossessed just as often. To his credit he edges the pass completion % over Grimes and given that he's playing considerably more long balls that's pretty impressive, but they don't appear to be the incisive sort that are leading to chances on goal (see some of Fer's passing recently).
As the defensive mid we've been looking for he doesn't seem to offer anything defensively that we don't already have. I'm willing to bet he'd get a lot of the same "small, lightweight, sideways passing..." criticisms that have dogged so many of our players, including Grimes who is far and away the more successful tackler of the pair this season. |
No. I think that was achingly obvious.
Having lost more or less the entire first team, as well as others, he probably expected to be able to sign his main target on deadline day. I can’t remember if it was Kaplan or Levein who admitted to disappointing him.
Stoke are struggling as they have players like Butland, Allen, Afobe and (I think) were favourites at the start of the season. It’s relative. I wasn’t suggesting they were in danger of going down. Most of us would have taken a mid table finish, I doubt many of their fans would have. They may improve under Jones. Comparing Woods’ stats under a sacked manager in an underperforming team doesn’t necessarily give a better indication than him being one of Brentfords best players last season. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 13:21 - Jan 16 with 651 views | jasper_T |
| Mid table mediocrity on 12:11 - Jan 16 by jack247 |
No. I think that was achingly obvious.
Having lost more or less the entire first team, as well as others, he probably expected to be able to sign his main target on deadline day. I can’t remember if it was Kaplan or Levein who admitted to disappointing him.
Stoke are struggling as they have players like Butland, Allen, Afobe and (I think) were favourites at the start of the season. It’s relative. I wasn’t suggesting they were in danger of going down. Most of us would have taken a mid table finish, I doubt many of their fans would have. They may improve under Jones. Comparing Woods’ stats under a sacked manager in an underperforming team doesn’t necessarily give a better indication than him being one of Brentfords best players last season. |
I just don't see how you can give Woods the benefit of the doubt for playing in a struggling team when Grimes and Fer are playing in a team "struggling" by very nearly the same practical measure. Inconsistency a fact of life for both teams.
Woods' stats for Brentford were better than what he's showing now (mostly creatively; key passes & a few assists) but still just over one tackle per game (Grimes makes 2.7), twice as many errors controlling the ball as Grimes makes, and even more long balls attempted. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:04 - Jan 16 with 636 views | _ |
| Mid table mediocrity on 08:23 - Jan 16 by jack247 |
Agreed. That should have been made clear to Potter from the outset. He may then have even been able to source the cheaper player Jasper was referring to. |
We had a mini crisis on our hands, it's not so easy to forecast when making absolutely necessary quickfire decisions involving football players and their futures. |  |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:08 - Jan 16 with 633 views | karnataka |
| Mid table mediocrity on 00:03 - Jan 15 by Treforys_Jack |
If we'd beaten more teams above us we'd be higher shocker. |
If we'd beaten more teams below us, there would be fewer teams above us for us to not have to beat |  | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:09 - Jan 16 with 632 views | _ |
| Mid table mediocrity on 12:11 - Jan 16 by jack247 |
No. I think that was achingly obvious.
Having lost more or less the entire first team, as well as others, he probably expected to be able to sign his main target on deadline day. I can’t remember if it was Kaplan or Levein who admitted to disappointing him.
Stoke are struggling as they have players like Butland, Allen, Afobe and (I think) were favourites at the start of the season. It’s relative. I wasn’t suggesting they were in danger of going down. Most of us would have taken a mid table finish, I doubt many of their fans would have. They may improve under Jones. Comparing Woods’ stats under a sacked manager in an underperforming team doesn’t necessarily give a better indication than him being one of Brentfords best players last season. |
Brentford were also mediocre last season. And the season before that as well. That means very little.
And your first paragraph makes no sense because if he expected to get his number one target, who by all accounts was crying out for the move, then why would he begin by wasting his budget on also ran's?
This whole Woods thing as a bit mythical to say the least. He's just become a tool for the Potter apologists to use when he's under performing. | |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:10 - Jan 16 with 629 views | _ |
| Mid table mediocrity on 12:11 - Jan 16 by jack247 |
No. I think that was achingly obvious.
Having lost more or less the entire first team, as well as others, he probably expected to be able to sign his main target on deadline day. I can’t remember if it was Kaplan or Levein who admitted to disappointing him.
Stoke are struggling as they have players like Butland, Allen, Afobe and (I think) were favourites at the start of the season. It’s relative. I wasn’t suggesting they were in danger of going down. Most of us would have taken a mid table finish, I doubt many of their fans would have. They may improve under Jones. Comparing Woods’ stats under a sacked manager in an underperforming team doesn’t necessarily give a better indication than him being one of Brentfords best players last season. |
And why would they be struggling by having good players? | |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:23 - Jan 16 with 617 views | Glyn1 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:08 - Jan 16 by karnataka |
If we'd beaten more teams below us, there would be fewer teams above us for us to not have to beat |
Great post! |  |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:24 - Jan 16 with 616 views | _ |
| Mid table mediocrity on 07:41 - Jan 16 by 34dfgdf54 |
No one knows how Woods would have done here.
I personally think he would have made a big difference to us. Stoke are struggling in a big way, and he's been one of the few shining lights they have had.
Not taking nothing away from Grimes though, the way he's come on under Potter has been terrific, fair play to him. |
I think you need to apply some balance here and properly read about the impact Woods has had over the season with Stoke so far.
Hopefully this thread will shut a few up and stop mentioning the bang average, lightweight midfield player he is....
http://oatcakefanzine.proboards.com/thread/285244/ryan-woods | |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:04 - Jan 16 with 586 views | jack247 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:10 - Jan 16 by _ |
And why would they be struggling by having good players? |
They aren’t doing as well as they should be with the players they’ve got.
Man United were struggling under Mourinho, Wolves and Watford are both below them but aren’t struggling at all. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:08 - Jan 16 with 583 views | jack247 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:04 - Jan 16 by _ |
We had a mini crisis on our hands, it's not so easy to forecast when making absolutely necessary quickfire decisions involving football players and their futures. |
May get egg on my face here, but I’ll forecast we won’t be signing anyone for £6m in the foreseeable future.
If the owners thought they would get close to market value for the players we sold, close to deadline day, with the clubs finances as they were, that was painfully naive. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:19 - Jan 16 with 575 views | jack247 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:09 - Jan 16 by _ |
Brentford were also mediocre last season. And the season before that as well. That means very little.
And your first paragraph makes no sense because if he expected to get his number one target, who by all accounts was crying out for the move, then why would he begin by wasting his budget on also ran's?
This whole Woods thing as a bit mythical to say the least. He's just become a tool for the Potter apologists to use when he's under performing. |
Well I’d imagine he was under the impression he would be able to sign Woods as well as Celina and the likes of McKay and Asoro. About 15 players left the club in the summer.
They’ve admitted themselves they did their due dilligence on the player on deadline day and were surprised that Brentford weren’t prepared to take a last minute hit on a player other clubs wanted.
Woods himself isn’t the issue, leading your manager to believe he’d get his main target up until the last minute is. It’s back in focus now that Potter has come out one minute and said he will have funds in January, then changed his tune a couple of weeks later. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:21 - Jan 16 with 573 views | 34dfgdf54 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:24 - Jan 16 by _ |
I think you need to apply some balance here and properly read about the impact Woods has had over the season with Stoke so far.
Hopefully this thread will shut a few up and stop mentioning the bang average, lightweight midfield player he is....
http://oatcakefanzine.proboards.com/thread/285244/ryan-woods |
Talking about balance...
<<To be honest he's the only thing keeping our midfield from completely collapsing. Not sure what he's supposed to do to cover for 2 other centre mids who are in no man's land and 2 centre halves who have the sharpness of a sponge>>
<< Was it just that his style fitted the way Brentford played like a glove? Is he trying to play that position too much when it doesn’t really exist in the way it did at Brentford? >>
<<Exactly where he should be playing, INSTEAD of Allen and alongside Etebo as the two in the diamond. Use the Allen money to buy a pacey, tough tackling, genuine DCM>>
As I said to Jasper, no one knows how he would have performed for us. They are rounding on Clucas and Allen aswell on that forum, the whole thing is a sh*tshow. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:23 - Jan 16 with 570 views | 34dfgdf54 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 14:10 - Jan 16 by _ |
And why would they be struggling by having good players? |
Bad management.
On paper they have a stronger squad than us. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:29 - Jan 16 with 564 views | jasper_T |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:23 - Jan 16 by 34dfgdf54 |
Bad management.
On paper they have a stronger squad than us. |
5 years ago their squad would have been impressive. | | | |
| Mid table mediocrity on 16:42 - Jan 16 with 529 views | _ |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:21 - Jan 16 by 34dfgdf54 |
Talking about balance...
<<To be honest he's the only thing keeping our midfield from completely collapsing. Not sure what he's supposed to do to cover for 2 other centre mids who are in no man's land and 2 centre halves who have the sharpness of a sponge>>
<< Was it just that his style fitted the way Brentford played like a glove? Is he trying to play that position too much when it doesn’t really exist in the way it did at Brentford? >>
<<Exactly where he should be playing, INSTEAD of Allen and alongside Etebo as the two in the diamond. Use the Allen money to buy a pacey, tough tackling, genuine DCM>>
As I said to Jasper, no one knows how he would have performed for us. They are rounding on Clucas and Allen aswell on that forum, the whole thing is a sh*tshow. |
Wow you picked up the odd defence of him in a horror show of a thread.
That's not balance, that's denial | |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 16:43 - Jan 16 with 527 views | _ |
| Mid table mediocrity on 15:19 - Jan 16 by jack247 |
Well I’d imagine he was under the impression he would be able to sign Woods as well as Celina and the likes of McKay and Asoro. About 15 players left the club in the summer.
They’ve admitted themselves they did their due dilligence on the player on deadline day and were surprised that Brentford weren’t prepared to take a last minute hit on a player other clubs wanted.
Woods himself isn’t the issue, leading your manager to believe he’d get his main target up until the last minute is. It’s back in focus now that Potter has come out one minute and said he will have funds in January, then changed his tune a couple of weeks later. |
You're imagining a lot and making up the rest perhaps | |
| |
| Mid table mediocrity on 17:15 - Jan 16 with 497 views | jack247 |
| Mid table mediocrity on 16:43 - Jan 16 by _ |
You're imagining a lot and making up the rest perhaps |
That’s a very weak response by your standards. The first paragraph is pretty clearly what happened, Levein and Kaplans own comments confirm that.
Not sure what you think I’ve made up? | | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
