Please log in or register. Registered visitors get fewer ads.
Forum index | Previous Thread | Next thread
Corona Virus 22:39 - Mar 7 with 223480 viewsSgorioFruit

Sorry for new thread,
But how bad do you lot reckon it’s going to get here in the UK?
I just been watching the news. Looking nasty in Italy.

My methods are not favoured by some but by god i speak the truth.
Poll: What Happened Today???

2
Corona Virus on 13:31 - Apr 21 with 1034 viewsOldjack

Corona Virus on 13:24 - Apr 21 by karnataka

WTF is going on? This is WTF has been going on for a while:-

Notes on 2 interviews about a month ago re: PPE

24 March 2020: BBC journalist Victoria Derbyshire speaks to the director of a UK company that makes protective equipment who says it is exporting all over the world but hasn’t had orders from the UK Government. “We actually offered our services [to the UK Government] when this first happened and unfortunately our services wasn’t taken up, but the rest of the world did take it up”, the director notes.


25 March 2020: BBC Newsnight interviews Andrew Raynor, CEO of a ventilator manufacturer. “You got in touch with the Government as soon as they put out the call for help a few weeks ago. What happened then?” asks journalist Emily Maitlis. “Nothing quite honestly”, the CEO replies.
[Post edited 21 Apr 13:26]


I remember seeing that interview and thought to myself WTF. Apparently the orders from Turkey for PPE were only made yesterday ,someone has been telling massive porkies here
[Post edited 21 Apr 13:51]

Prosser the Tosser dwells on Phil's bum hole like a rusty old hemorrhoid ,fact You Greedy Bastards Get Out Of OUR Club!

0
Corona Virus on 13:52 - Apr 21 with 1004 viewschad

Corona Virus on 14:39 - Apr 19 by Scotia

The most concerning part for me was our planned response to a pandemic wasn't put in to place despite the scientific advice. This cost lives.

I have no political affiliation but if that is being discussed at Cobra then the PM should be there, whether he usually would be or not. Certainly not playing a tory party donor at tennis in Chequers as is reported.


I think they would say they were following scientific advice, although I would not necessarily support that advice personally and I take your point about our (actually considered excellent) pandemic preparedness falling behind as a victim of all the wrangling on our EU departure.

However I think things like suggesting we sold our stockpile to China, when this seems definitely not to have been the case, detracts from the many important very real concerns that need to be addressed.

You also imply he was playing a Tory party donor at tennis when he should have been at a Cobra meeting. The views on whether PMs routinely chair/attend COBRA meetings covered in my previous post, but where was it reported about the tennis match? All I could see was the old story about the tennis match being thrown in but I did not pick up anything about it being when he should have been attending a COBRA meeting.
0
Corona Virus on 13:55 - Apr 21 with 997 viewsA_Fans_Dad

Corona Virus on 13:52 - Apr 21 by chad

I think they would say they were following scientific advice, although I would not necessarily support that advice personally and I take your point about our (actually considered excellent) pandemic preparedness falling behind as a victim of all the wrangling on our EU departure.

However I think things like suggesting we sold our stockpile to China, when this seems definitely not to have been the case, detracts from the many important very real concerns that need to be addressed.

You also imply he was playing a Tory party donor at tennis when he should have been at a Cobra meeting. The views on whether PMs routinely chair/attend COBRA meetings covered in my previous post, but where was it reported about the tennis match? All I could see was the old story about the tennis match being thrown in but I did not pick up anything about it being when he should have been attending a COBRA meeting.


As you say Boris did follow the advice of the scientific experts, just not the right ones.
1
Corona Virus on 14:01 - Apr 21 with 985 viewschad

Corona Virus on 13:24 - Apr 21 by karnataka

WTF is going on? This is WTF has been going on for a while:-

Notes on 2 interviews about a month ago re: PPE

24 March 2020: BBC journalist Victoria Derbyshire speaks to the director of a UK company that makes protective equipment who says it is exporting all over the world but hasn’t had orders from the UK Government. “We actually offered our services [to the UK Government] when this first happened and unfortunately our services wasn’t taken up, but the rest of the world did take it up”, the director notes.


25 March 2020: BBC Newsnight interviews Andrew Raynor, CEO of a ventilator manufacturer. “You got in touch with the Government as soon as they put out the call for help a few weeks ago. What happened then?” asks journalist Emily Maitlis. “Nothing quite honestly”, the CEO replies.
[Post edited 21 Apr 13:26]


This must be taken up, there is obviously a world shortage and all the other stuff re lockdown and payments etc. To be dealt with. But we simply must organise our national resources, even if some take a little time to get up and running. This virus is not going anywhere soon. Although the usage is so massive that some stocks possibly don’t even touch the sides, but surely every little helps.
0
Corona Virus on 14:07 - Apr 21 with 969 viewsJackSomething

Corona Virus on 13:52 - Apr 21 by chad

I think they would say they were following scientific advice, although I would not necessarily support that advice personally and I take your point about our (actually considered excellent) pandemic preparedness falling behind as a victim of all the wrangling on our EU departure.

However I think things like suggesting we sold our stockpile to China, when this seems definitely not to have been the case, detracts from the many important very real concerns that need to be addressed.

You also imply he was playing a Tory party donor at tennis when he should have been at a Cobra meeting. The views on whether PMs routinely chair/attend COBRA meetings covered in my previous post, but where was it reported about the tennis match? All I could see was the old story about the tennis match being thrown in but I did not pick up anything about it being when he should have been attending a COBRA meeting.


Out of curiosity, where do you get the info that our pandemic preparedness was considered excellent from?

I did a quick search and all I can find of substance is that in 2016 we ran a national pandemic flu exercise and it concluded that we were woefully short of ventilators and that government planning did not change after this exercise.

The government's roadmaps for dealing with a pandemic also refer to stockpiles of PPE for NHS staff, but presumably they didn't stick to those plans given the current issues the NHS is facing.

Apologies if this has been dealt with somewhere in the previous 139 pages.

You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help.

0
Corona Virus on 14:56 - Apr 21 with 910 viewsScotia

Corona Virus on 13:52 - Apr 21 by chad

I think they would say they were following scientific advice, although I would not necessarily support that advice personally and I take your point about our (actually considered excellent) pandemic preparedness falling behind as a victim of all the wrangling on our EU departure.

However I think things like suggesting we sold our stockpile to China, when this seems definitely not to have been the case, detracts from the many important very real concerns that need to be addressed.

You also imply he was playing a Tory party donor at tennis when he should have been at a Cobra meeting. The views on whether PMs routinely chair/attend COBRA meetings covered in my previous post, but where was it reported about the tennis match? All I could see was the old story about the tennis match being thrown in but I did not pick up anything about it being when he should have been attending a COBRA meeting.


The article says we sold part of our PPE stockpile to China. I have no issue with that neccessarily it could be that at the time their need was greater, but we now find ourselves in a situation where we have very limited supplies of PPE so there was obvioulsy no contingency plan to replace that which was sold.

As I've said I really think a concerted effort by the government could overcome this, if a UK domestic appliance firm can make a ventilator and a British child with a 3D printer can make a visor then I'm sure there are plenty of firms who could have manufactured the rest. They don't seem to have been approached. The same could be said for testing equipment.

I did misread the Tennis match scenario, he wasn't playing a Tory Party donor at the time of the COBRA meeting, the previous night he had attended the Tory winter ball where a donor had paid £60k to play tennis with him. The meeting was the next morning, he was in London but perhaps he needed a lie in?

Anyway - it's a bit of a moot point, by that time he had missed five of these meetings. The seriousness of the situation was highlighted at the first one - hence the others being arranged. I could understand him missing the first but not the next four.
0

Corona Virus on 16:48 - Apr 21 with 843 viewsPegojack

Sir Simon McDonald, senior foreign office civil servant, confirmed today when answering questions in front of a parliamentary select committee, that the government took a political decision not to take part in the EU project to source ventilators.
This directly contradicts a statement from Michael Gove that the government missed the deadline to participate because of a mix up in e-mail communications. He said this in front of the whole nation on a BBC Breakfast news report a couple of weeks ago.
This proves two things. 1) Gove is a lying Tory cúnt (who knew?) and 2) it is a very good thing that parliament is back and holding these despicable, incompetent shysters to account.
[Post edited 21 Apr 16:54]
3
Corona Virus on 17:06 - Apr 21 with 824 viewsCatullus

Corona Virus on 13:55 - Apr 21 by A_Fans_Dad

As you say Boris did follow the advice of the scientific experts, just not the right ones.


If you have experts who have different opinions, how can you be sure who is right? Bojo made the best choice he could, unless you are suggesting he really did want thousands more to die?

Hindsight is wonderful, if only we had hindsight before the event!

Just my opinion, but WTF do I know anyway?
Blog: In, Out, in, out........

0
Login to get fewer ads

Corona Virus on 17:09 - Apr 21 with 824 viewsProfessor

Corona Virus on 17:06 - Apr 21 by Catullus

If you have experts who have different opinions, how can you be sure who is right? Bojo made the best choice he could, unless you are suggesting he really did want thousands more to die?

Hindsight is wonderful, if only we had hindsight before the event!


He took the advice of behavioural scientists who said the public would not stand a lockdown. Also a 'mate' of Cummings. As far as I know all epidemiologists and infection specialist wanted controls sooner.
0
Corona Virus on 17:23 - Apr 21 with 794 viewsCatullus

Corona Virus on 17:09 - Apr 21 by Professor

He took the advice of behavioural scientists who said the public would not stand a lockdown. Also a 'mate' of Cummings. As far as I know all epidemiologists and infection specialist wanted controls sooner.


Fair enough, I stand corrected. I'm not saying Bojo was right, indeed I've joined in the criticism of some things but I don't know exactly who said what, which expert gave him which advice. The behavioural expert thing, if that is true and he took that ahead of expert medical advice then it is a major feck up.

There should be an investigation, there should be a full disclosure and there should be a new plan so if this situation happens again the things that worked and saved lives should be implemented quickly. I include in that emergency legislation for people who ignore things like social distancing, non essential travel, price gouging/profiteering, anti social behaviour (spitting at people) so that punishment can be swift and harsh.

Just my opinion, but WTF do I know anyway?
Blog: In, Out, in, out........

0
Corona Virus on 17:40 - Apr 21 with 782 viewsNortbankboy

Corona Virus on 17:23 - Apr 21 by Catullus

Fair enough, I stand corrected. I'm not saying Bojo was right, indeed I've joined in the criticism of some things but I don't know exactly who said what, which expert gave him which advice. The behavioural expert thing, if that is true and he took that ahead of expert medical advice then it is a major feck up.

There should be an investigation, there should be a full disclosure and there should be a new plan so if this situation happens again the things that worked and saved lives should be implemented quickly. I include in that emergency legislation for people who ignore things like social distancing, non essential travel, price gouging/profiteering, anti social behaviour (spitting at people) so that punishment can be swift and harsh.


Ramping up the lies
0
Corona Virus on 17:44 - Apr 21 with 766 viewschad

Corona Virus on 14:07 - Apr 21 by JackSomething

Out of curiosity, where do you get the info that our pandemic preparedness was considered excellent from?

I did a quick search and all I can find of substance is that in 2016 we ran a national pandemic flu exercise and it concluded that we were woefully short of ventilators and that government planning did not change after this exercise.

The government's roadmaps for dealing with a pandemic also refer to stockpiles of PPE for NHS staff, but presumably they didn't stick to those plans given the current issues the NHS is facing.

Apologies if this has been dealt with somewhere in the previous 139 pages.


Sorry JS if I find it I will post it I have read so much, it was just a line or two in quite a critical article so it gave me more faith in it. But I don’t think it is necessarily at odds with your information.

It was suggesting that our planning had been excellent and the planning of another country ? Who had managed well was based on ours, but ours was as you say allowed to decline, especially since the whole Brexit thing.

We obviously had a stockpile because of some NHS staff were recently expressing concern re expiry dates being changed. But that was reported as OK because the stuff had been retested hence the date change

There was also the report of us sending PPE to China in Feb to help them out, but it was fairly small amounts and we have received more in return from them. That was said to come from our stockpile, but Gove said that was not correct (although I suppose it probably made little difference where it came from).

I wondered why they didn’t just combine all stock as a first in first out system so it all gets rotated. But if we take Jim as one link in the chain as a porter using up to 40 complete sets of non reusable PPE per day (all patients assumed infectious) the amounts of stockpile required must be phenomenal and any logistics of linking that up to normal supply, in non pandemic times, presumably unmanageable.

They also use Just in Time for delivery of normal stocks of PPE I understand which, obviously has become a problem, with normal stocks held back from other countries.

So my understanding is they did have a stockpile but it was not kept up to intended levels and that along with ongoing supply issues and the severity of this, and seeming inability to have utilised all our own UK resources in a timely manner has left us in this situation.

Of course I am sure most countries had pandemic arrangements too but this has been exceptional with a world shortage and countries sitting on their own supplies has not helped.
Here for instance a previous Guardian headline about Spain
‘As patients lie on floors, and nurses make gowns from rubbish bags, health workers vent their fury at a government fatally slow to react’
1

Corona Virus on 17:44 - Apr 21 with 762 viewslondonlisa2001

The question from BBC and followed up will bring this crashing down I suspect.

It’s a yes or no. Have we or have we not joined the EU PPE scheme. If not, why not. If we have, was there a delay. Has any PPE been delivered as part of this scheme anywhere in the EU.

The civil service say one thing. Hancock says another.
1
Corona Virus on 17:48 - Apr 21 with 755 viewssainthelens

Corona Virus on 17:44 - Apr 21 by londonlisa2001

The question from BBC and followed up will bring this crashing down I suspect.

It’s a yes or no. Have we or have we not joined the EU PPE scheme. If not, why not. If we have, was there a delay. Has any PPE been delivered as part of this scheme anywhere in the EU.

The civil service say one thing. Hancock says another.


Ministers are consistently being let off giving definitive answers. Its sadly becoming laughable watching these cretins bullsht their way through briefings. Are any of us honestly any wiser?
1
Corona Virus on 17:52 - Apr 21 with 741 viewslondonlisa2001

Corona Virus on 17:48 - Apr 21 by sainthelens

Ministers are consistently being let off giving definitive answers. Its sadly becoming laughable watching these cretins bullsht their way through briefings. Are any of us honestly any wiser?


He just gave a definitive answer. Yes, we signed up. No, there haven’t been any deliveries.

If he’s lying, he’s done.
0
Corona Virus on 18:02 - Apr 21 with 718 viewsBytholWyn

Corona Virus on 17:52 - Apr 21 by londonlisa2001

He just gave a definitive answer. Yes, we signed up. No, there haven’t been any deliveries.

If he’s lying, he’s done.


Have there been any deliveries elsewhere in Europe? Have we lost out by being Johnny-Come-Lately's?
0
Corona Virus on 18:24 - Apr 21 with 693 viewschad

Corona Virus on 14:56 - Apr 21 by Scotia

The article says we sold part of our PPE stockpile to China. I have no issue with that neccessarily it could be that at the time their need was greater, but we now find ourselves in a situation where we have very limited supplies of PPE so there was obvioulsy no contingency plan to replace that which was sold.

As I've said I really think a concerted effort by the government could overcome this, if a UK domestic appliance firm can make a ventilator and a British child with a 3D printer can make a visor then I'm sure there are plenty of firms who could have manufactured the rest. They don't seem to have been approached. The same could be said for testing equipment.

I did misread the Tennis match scenario, he wasn't playing a Tory Party donor at the time of the COBRA meeting, the previous night he had attended the Tory winter ball where a donor had paid £60k to play tennis with him. The meeting was the next morning, he was in London but perhaps he needed a lie in?

Anyway - it's a bit of a moot point, by that time he had missed five of these meetings. The seriousness of the situation was highlighted at the first one - hence the others being arranged. I could understand him missing the first but not the next four.


It was just I thought you said we had sold our stack pile to China which suggests the lot. Apparently it was only a limited amount sent to China and we have received more back from them than we sent. Gove said it did not come from the stockpile but to be honest it does not really matter where it came from.

I agree about needing to better utilise our own resources and have said this a few times. The massive amounts required though may swallow these up but every little helps And someone needs to be put to properly organising this. I also agree on testing equipment but no one seems to be really getting this together in the UK.

As I reported in the other post it is not uncommon for PMs not to attend COBRA meetings even the Guardian admitted that. They did add it would be expected at a time of national emergency but At that time the risk was only low to moderate as agreed by the expert advisors and WHO did not declare a Global Pandemic until some time after the last meeting missed. Although I am glad to know, as I thought, that it was incorrect about the tennis match, as it really could have affected his serve if they had called him from the COBRA meeting ;)

Hopefully lessons learned across the globe will come out but for now the main issues seem to be PPE, treatments and testing and of course getting a vaccine (if that be achievable) ASAP and learning all we can about the slippery little sucker (not Gove or Boris) SARS CoV 2 or whatever it’s called. The number of health workers affected and the disproportionate number from ethnic minorities is very concerning and the issues with old folks homes.

For me it’s about looking into the wider use of masks and I loved the Germans using medical students to keep in touch with home cases to make sure they are not going downhill and special vehicles to go out to visit and treat if necessary.

As we hopefully start to get it under control we need to have proper tracing of cases surely there are loads of people at home that could help with that, many already vetted if that is necessary to deal with such personal info.
0
Corona Virus on 18:49 - Apr 21 with 649 viewslondonlisa2001

Corona Virus on 18:02 - Apr 21 by BytholWyn

Have there been any deliveries elsewhere in Europe? Have we lost out by being Johnny-Come-Lately's?


He said not. Again, that’s easily checked, so if he’s lying (or uninformed) he has to go.
1

Corona Virus on 19:16 - Apr 21 with 624 viewsProfessor

And to go back to lies and misinformation, it looks form the latest data that hydroxychloroquine INCREASES mortality in a trial of near 300 patients
0
Corona Virus on 19:21 - Apr 21 with 611 viewsLeonWasGod

Corona Virus on 18:49 - Apr 21 by londonlisa2001

He said not. Again, that’s easily checked, so if he’s lying (or uninformed) he has to go.


Unfortunately lying isn't a resignable (or sackable) offence any more.


(Three edits for one short sentence. Jeez.)
[Post edited 21 Apr 19:22]
0
Corona Virus on 19:24 - Apr 21 with 603 viewsexiledclaseboy

Corona Virus on 16:48 - Apr 21 by Pegojack

Sir Simon McDonald, senior foreign office civil servant, confirmed today when answering questions in front of a parliamentary select committee, that the government took a political decision not to take part in the EU project to source ventilators.
This directly contradicts a statement from Michael Gove that the government missed the deadline to participate because of a mix up in e-mail communications. He said this in front of the whole nation on a BBC Breakfast news report a couple of weeks ago.
This proves two things. 1) Gove is a lying Tory cúnt (who knew?) and 2) it is a very good thing that parliament is back and holding these despicable, incompetent shysters to account.
[Post edited 21 Apr 16:54]


It’s worth pointing out that Simon McDonald despises Johnson (and the feeling is no doubt reciprocated) with a fiery passion from their time together at the Foreign Office.

Poll: Tory leader

0
Corona Virus on 19:27 - Apr 21 with 601 viewsexiledclaseboy

Corona Virus on 19:16 - Apr 21 by Professor

And to go back to lies and misinformation, it looks form the latest data that hydroxychloroquine INCREASES mortality in a trial of near 300 patients


That can’t be right. Trump said it was a miracle drug or something.

Poll: Tory leader

0

Corona Virus on 19:28 - Apr 21 with 599 viewstheloneranger

"Last week five million surgical masks and more than a million respirators were packed on to EU-registered lorries by one UK wholesaler"

"Millions of pieces of vital personal protective equipment (PPE) are being shipped from British warehouses to Germany, Spain and Italy despite severe shortages in the UK."

"Lorries are being packed with masks, respirators and other PPE kit before heading to supply hospitals in the EU, it has emerged."

"On Monday night, UK firms said they had "no choice" but to keep selling the lifesaving gear abroad because their offers of help had been repeatedly ignored by the British Government. "



"Millions of pieces of PPE being shipped from Britain to Europe despite NHS shortages"

https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/21/ppe-shipped-uk-europe-despite-severe-nhs-shortage
0
Corona Virus on 19:28 - Apr 21 with 599 viewsScotia

Corona Virus on 18:24 - Apr 21 by chad

It was just I thought you said we had sold our stack pile to China which suggests the lot. Apparently it was only a limited amount sent to China and we have received more back from them than we sent. Gove said it did not come from the stockpile but to be honest it does not really matter where it came from.

I agree about needing to better utilise our own resources and have said this a few times. The massive amounts required though may swallow these up but every little helps And someone needs to be put to properly organising this. I also agree on testing equipment but no one seems to be really getting this together in the UK.

As I reported in the other post it is not uncommon for PMs not to attend COBRA meetings even the Guardian admitted that. They did add it would be expected at a time of national emergency but At that time the risk was only low to moderate as agreed by the expert advisors and WHO did not declare a Global Pandemic until some time after the last meeting missed. Although I am glad to know, as I thought, that it was incorrect about the tennis match, as it really could have affected his serve if they had called him from the COBRA meeting ;)

Hopefully lessons learned across the globe will come out but for now the main issues seem to be PPE, treatments and testing and of course getting a vaccine (if that be achievable) ASAP and learning all we can about the slippery little sucker (not Gove or Boris) SARS CoV 2 or whatever it’s called. The number of health workers affected and the disproportionate number from ethnic minorities is very concerning and the issues with old folks homes.

For me it’s about looking into the wider use of masks and I loved the Germans using medical students to keep in touch with home cases to make sure they are not going downhill and special vehicles to go out to visit and treat if necessary.

As we hopefully start to get it under control we need to have proper tracing of cases surely there are loads of people at home that could help with that, many already vetted if that is necessary to deal with such personal info.


I'm pretty certain the expert advisors weren't in complete agreement that the risk was low to moderate. As I understand Prof Neil Ferguson's suggested a more stringent lock down straight away. In the last meeting Boris missed two usual attendees lost Skype connection before a discussion on moving the UK to a High risk situation from moderate . They have both since said that was the option they supported. Apparently remaining at "moderate" passed by one vote. To me that sounds like a national emergency - in fact it clearly was.

Throughout this escalation in seriousness of the situation he didn't attend a meeting. In fact for two of the five weeks he was on holiday. He was also invisible during the flood incident that hit the country at a similar time, he obviously had better things to do.
0
Corona Virus on 19:53 - Apr 21 with 1209 viewsPozuelosSideys

Corona Virus on 19:28 - Apr 21 by theloneranger

"Last week five million surgical masks and more than a million respirators were packed on to EU-registered lorries by one UK wholesaler"

"Millions of pieces of vital personal protective equipment (PPE) are being shipped from British warehouses to Germany, Spain and Italy despite severe shortages in the UK."

"Lorries are being packed with masks, respirators and other PPE kit before heading to supply hospitals in the EU, it has emerged."

"On Monday night, UK firms said they had "no choice" but to keep selling the lifesaving gear abroad because their offers of help had been repeatedly ignored by the British Government. "



"Millions of pieces of PPE being shipped from Britain to Europe despite NHS shortages"

https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/21/ppe-shipped-uk-europe-despite-severe-nhs-shortage


If thats the case, who is responsible for the sourcing and purchasing of such equipment in the UK? I read earlier that there has been over 8000 offers from different companies in the last couple of weeks to sort through. Many of which from shell companies set up within the last 14 days looking for funding to deliver this stuff.

If Germany is in such a good place, why do they need all this stuff, i thought they manufactured it all themselves? Can understand Italy and Spain, but the Germans?

"Michu, Britton and Williams could have won 3-0 on their own. They wouldn't have required a keeper."
Poll: Hattricks

0
About Us Contact Us Terms & Conditions Privacy Cookies Advertising
© FansNetwork 2020