| Corona Virus 22:39 - Mar 7 with 431629 views | SgorioFruit |
Sorry for new thread,
But how bad do you lot reckon it’s going to get here in the UK?
I just been watching the news. Looking nasty in Italy. |  |
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| Corona Virus on 08:01 - Mar 17 with 1646 views | ladyjack |
Why do you think they are mad ?, is there not any merit in it ?, not saying it would stick for one second because I doubt it would, but are they mad Highjack for thinking or suggesting that if we go down the herd deliberately infecting people route ? or not adequately protecting health workers and the like. [Post edited 17 Mar 2020 9:37]
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| Corona Virus on 09:14 - Mar 17 with 1544 views | Best_loser |
If Boris does what business wants and makes it illegal to open, so they can claim insurance
Would insurance companies really have the funds to cover it, would be a collosal amount of money |  | | |
| Corona Virus on 09:54 - Mar 17 with 1507 views | LeonWasGod |
| Corona Virus on 20:59 - Mar 16 by PozuelosSideys |
Im comparing the ratio of basic mortality against population count based on the UK's projected potential scenario of 260,000 deaths based on a link Jasper put up:
Its on ere somewhere:
The spread of this is all over China as per this link. It was mainly restricted to Wuhan in the same way you can argue its focused on London in the UK at the moment of lockdown. China has huge swathes of non population geography too unlike the UK, but huuuuuge cities all over the place.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/world/coronavirus-maps.html#asia
Anyway, not really disagreeing as there are a million and one holes you could pick in the basic numbers, but i think the ratio outut of 6m deaths based on the UK scenario will turn out wildly inaccurate. Time will tell. |
Hope so! |  | | |
| Corona Virus on 10:17 - Mar 17 with 1465 views | Catullus |
| Corona Virus on 09:14 - Mar 17 by Best_loser |
If Boris does what business wants and makes it illegal to open, so they can claim insurance
Would insurance companies really have the funds to cover it, would be a collosal amount of money |
Money shouldn't be a consideration, not anywhere near. We need to do whatever it takes to beat this and then clean up afterwards.
As I said elsewhere, what this proves is how broken our economic system is and how many problems money causes. |  |
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| Corona Virus on 10:23 - Mar 17 with 1459 views | LeonWasGod |
| Corona Virus on 10:17 - Mar 17 by Catullus |
Money shouldn't be a consideration, not anywhere near. We need to do whatever it takes to beat this and then clean up afterwards.
As I said elsewhere, what this proves is how broken our economic system is and how many problems money causes. |
Norway, Denmark, France... and others, all putting solid rescue packages in place from suspending business rates and taxes, guaranteeing salaries for workers including self-employed, supporting businesses with providing salary contributions to all businesses. And loads of other measures. The kinds of things you need to do to lift the financial burdens on people so they can make decisions for solely health reasons.
We've spent hours trying to get my diabetic, self-employed sister in law to stop work as a peripatetic across schools. But she says she can't afford to. Obviously we'll help where we can, but there will be plenty of people who can't get help.
Boris wants to push this out to us and not take any responsibility (as usual). Same way he's pushed decisions out at every stage so far. It's awfully weak leadership. I'm alright jack, each to their own. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 10:26 - Mar 17 with 1456 views | ladyjack |
Talk that the Irish have developed a Coronavirus virus testing kit that will give the results in 15 minutes, their scientists studied the Chinese situation.
Aussies and Germans and Irish bods all making strides, keep the good work up boys and girls. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 10:36 - Mar 17 with 1435 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Corona Virus on 07:26 - Mar 17 by Kilkennyjack |
See its good to challenge the government line when it was bleedin obvious they had got it very wrong. |
Thanks for that.
Do you think that Lisa and her little acolytes on here are now prepared to admit that they were wrong to put their faith in Boris and his "experts".
Those so called exoerts are typicl of ivory tower boffins, divorced from reality, no empathy and sod all common sense.
Or will she repeat ad infinitum that she wasn't sure if they were right or not while backing them up and shooting us down in flames. | | | |
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| Corona Virus on 10:57 - Mar 17 with 1400 views | ladyjack |
| Corona Virus on 10:17 - Mar 17 by Catullus |
Money shouldn't be a consideration, not anywhere near. We need to do whatever it takes to beat this and then clean up afterwards.
As I said elsewhere, what this proves is how broken our economic system is and how many problems money causes. |
This is a right wing Tory Government, what do people expect ?, only signs of change have been when their position has been totally isolated and exposed and then reacting to criticism and groups acting on their own accord. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 10:57 - Mar 17 with 1400 views | Highjack |
| Corona Virus on 08:01 - Mar 17 by ladyjack |
Why do you think they are mad ?, is there not any merit in it ?, not saying it would stick for one second because I doubt it would, but are they mad Highjack for thinking or suggesting that if we go down the herd deliberately infecting people route ? or not adequately protecting health workers and the like. [Post edited 17 Mar 2020 9:37]
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The discussion of prosecuting a prime minister for corporate manslaughter because people die of entirely natural causes is to any rational person obviously, completely and utterly mad. Firstly, Boris or the government isn’t a corporation. Secondly, people die every day in this country from cancer, heart disease, suicide, accidents, injuries etc. No individual, government or organisation could ever be held criminally responsible. It’s a nonsense.
Also they obviously aren’t “deliberately infecting people”. That’s a bonkers statement too.
And how do you “adequately protect health workers” in this case? It’s always been and always will be part of the job for health professionals that they are going to be exposed to various illnesses and ailments. It’s inevitable. They just need to follow the same advice as the rest of us.
Mad. |  |
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| Corona Virus on 11:14 - Mar 17 with 1377 views | ladyjack |
| Corona Virus on 10:57 - Mar 17 by Highjack |
The discussion of prosecuting a prime minister for corporate manslaughter because people die of entirely natural causes is to any rational person obviously, completely and utterly mad. Firstly, Boris or the government isn’t a corporation. Secondly, people die every day in this country from cancer, heart disease, suicide, accidents, injuries etc. No individual, government or organisation could ever be held criminally responsible. It’s a nonsense.
Also they obviously aren’t “deliberately infecting people”. That’s a bonkers statement too.
And how do you “adequately protect health workers” in this case? It’s always been and always will be part of the job for health professionals that they are going to be exposed to various illnesses and ailments. It’s inevitable. They just need to follow the same advice as the rest of us.
Mad. |
Duty of care Highjack. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:20 - Mar 17 with 1371 views | ploppy |
| Corona Virus on 10:57 - Mar 17 by ladyjack |
This is a right wing Tory Government, what do people expect ?, only signs of change have been when their position has been totally isolated and exposed and then reacting to criticism and groups acting on their own accord. |
It's the government that the people voted for in a general election. Could you imagine Corbyn running this? | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:24 - Mar 17 with 1354 views | ladyjack |
| Corona Virus on 11:20 - Mar 17 by ploppy |
It's the government that the people voted for in a general election. Could you imagine Corbyn running this? |
Yes it's the Government the people voted for, Corbyn would not fill me full of confidence but I think he would do a better job than Boris in this crisis, it's a pity we could not have Nicola Sturgeon in charge of us in this crisis then we might have some leadership. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:25 - Mar 17 with 1352 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Corona Virus on 10:57 - Mar 17 by Highjack |
The discussion of prosecuting a prime minister for corporate manslaughter because people die of entirely natural causes is to any rational person obviously, completely and utterly mad. Firstly, Boris or the government isn’t a corporation. Secondly, people die every day in this country from cancer, heart disease, suicide, accidents, injuries etc. No individual, government or organisation could ever be held criminally responsible. It’s a nonsense.
Also they obviously aren’t “deliberately infecting people”. That’s a bonkers statement too.
And how do you “adequately protect health workers” in this case? It’s always been and always will be part of the job for health professionals that they are going to be exposed to various illnesses and ailments. It’s inevitable. They just need to follow the same advice as the rest of us.
Mad. |
It is not “deliberately infecting people” it is “deliberately allowing people to be infected when they don't need to be”, which is exactly the herd immunity plan. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:29 - Mar 17 with 1343 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 11:20 - Mar 17 by ploppy |
It's the government that the people voted for in a general election. Could you imagine Corbyn running this? |
He may have listened to the scientific consensus -the many, not the few who supported the 'herd immunity' approach | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:32 - Mar 17 with 1334 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 10:36 - Mar 17 by A_Fans_Dad |
Thanks for that.
Do you think that Lisa and her little acolytes on here are now prepared to admit that they were wrong to put their faith in Boris and his "experts".
Those so called exoerts are typicl of ivory tower boffins, divorced from reality, no empathy and sod all common sense.
Or will she repeat ad infinitum that she wasn't sure if they were right or not while backing them up and shooting us down in flames. |
Firstly stop twisting what I’ve said. I’ve asked you before.
Secondly, Imperial College (one of the organisations providing modelling to the government and the reason you seem to be saying you were ‘right’) has literally said this morning that it thinks the government timing on what to do and when is ‘about right’.
People are going mad and latching on to any old piece of crap that is being pushed over social media by bots.
An example is that it’s quickly become accepted fact that Johnson has somehow used words to ‘help his mates in the insurance industry’. It’s just bollox.
Business interruption insurance firstly is highly unlikely to kick in, whatever words are used, as it won’t cover this (policies specify diseases, and don’t just have a ‘or any other thing’ clause). So whatever the words, insurance probably won’t cover it. If a business is fortunate to have a policy that is far more generous than 90% of them, the insurance should cover the business. Because the customers have been told not to use the businesses. Specifically.
As with other countries, the government will have to bail out businesses (or not - God knows what this lot will do). Macron outlined a financial package a day after announcing shut down. Johnson announced a shut down yesterday and the chancellor is making a statement today. The timing is identical. And yet people are saying Macron is wonderful and Johnson is sh*t.
I think Johnson is sh*t in all sorts of ways, but this relentless misinformation and hysteria is, in my view, dangerous to us all. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:32 - Mar 17 with 1333 views | Catullus |
| Corona Virus on 11:24 - Mar 17 by ladyjack |
Yes it's the Government the people voted for, Corbyn would not fill me full of confidence but I think he would do a better job than Boris in this crisis, it's a pity we could not have Nicola Sturgeon in charge of us in this crisis then we might have some leadership. |
Corbyn couldn't even take a solid position on brexit and you think he'd do a better job with this?
Corbyn would be listening to many of the same experts as Bojo. Just maybe it's not Bojo to blame as much as the experts who guided him? | |
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| Corona Virus on 11:35 - Mar 17 with 1328 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Corona Virus on 11:29 - Mar 17 by Professor |
He may have listened to the scientific consensus -the many, not the few who supported the 'herd immunity' approach |
Imperial college today have said they think he’s right on the timing and they’ve been providing the information and changing it constantly.
Do you disagree with their view? | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:48 - Mar 17 with 1299 views | BryanSwan |
Well this is only going to get worse, the toss up between going to work and being paid or staying home unpaid and being unable to pay bills is causing huge problems. | |
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| Corona Virus on 11:49 - Mar 17 with 1296 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 11:35 - Mar 17 by londonlisa2001 |
Imperial college today have said they think he’s right on the timing and they’ve been providing the information and changing it constantly.
Do you disagree with their view? |
Neil Ferguson is an excellent epidemiologist and was excellent on R4. The Imperial/LSHTM report is a great piece of science and clearly communicated. I do feel he is being somewhat diplomatic. The consensus (from scientific Twitter) is we should have done this last week or sooner, which I agree with. We are, as he said, ahead of the game compared to Spain and Italy and may yet need the measures seen in France. Of course, we should also be testing at the level of Germany-they are picking up mild and asymptomatic positives and have what looks like a much more realistic mortality rate of below 1%. There is capacity and volunteers to deliver this through academic labs. I have most of the kit needed and could take on hundreds of samples (we have PCR robot) and more if I had automated RNA extraction (ran out of money) each day-it would be a repurpose as we use it for gene expression not pathogen detection. We are going to be on shutdown until autumn anyway by the looks of it.
The change has probably saved 200,000 lives. We will get tens of thousands dying still though. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:54 - Mar 17 with 1284 views | Catullus |
| Corona Virus on 11:35 - Mar 17 by londonlisa2001 |
Imperial college today have said they think he’s right on the timing and they’ve been providing the information and changing it constantly.
Do you disagree with their view? |
Apart from Professor, is anyone else on here genuinely an expert in this field?
Lisa isn't putting her faith in Boris, she doesn't know any more than the rest of us but as far as I've seen she's posted the truth, not social media BS or unqualified medical opinions. She has posted her opinions too which is all most of us are doing. Some are posting the hysterical social media BS and obvious political points scoring nonsense as if it's gospel.
PS, does anyone want to accuse me of being a Lisa accolyte? That would be quute funny really.
You know, my health problems put me at higher risk, my wife works at a hospital, my 11 year old son is still in school (for today anyway) but I am trying to carry on as normally as possible. I'm not being brave, I'm not being clever because in all honesty I am scared BUT I am trying my feckin hardest not to panic, rabble rouse, rumour monger or cause extra worry. It's not like anything we post on here will influence the government but it could well influence other people, help to cause the kind of mass hysteria that sees fighting in the food aisles. | |
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| Corona Virus on 11:57 - Mar 17 with 1269 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 10:36 - Mar 17 by A_Fans_Dad |
Thanks for that.
Do you think that Lisa and her little acolytes on here are now prepared to admit that they were wrong to put their faith in Boris and his "experts".
Those so called exoerts are typicl of ivory tower boffins, divorced from reality, no empathy and sod all common sense.
Or will she repeat ad infinitum that she wasn't sure if they were right or not while backing them up and shooting us down in flames. |
Most experts have been disagreeing with the policy-immunologists, medics, modellers and virologists and there has been a large amount of belittling by Trump and Boris cronies. The 'herd immunity' plan was very much at the edge of science and very risky-this is what I said here several times. I am not Lisa's acolyte and we have disagreed over this, but this is just name calling nonsense. She certainly does not need me defending her, but this is just a nasty, sly dig. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 11:58 - Mar 17 with 1267 views | ladyjack |
| Corona Virus on 11:32 - Mar 17 by Catullus |
Corbyn couldn't even take a solid position on brexit and you think he'd do a better job with this?
Corbyn would be listening to many of the same experts as Bojo. Just maybe it's not Bojo to blame as much as the experts who guided him? |
Corbyn would be more likely to introduce policies that would look after the people better, as regards advisers we have seen a plausible post above wondering if Boris listened to a minority of experts, whereas Corbyn might have listened to the majority of the experts from the get go, all speculation of course but it was odd that this country was going to go for a policy that no one else seemed to be following, it would be hard to believe that the majority of our experts went against the rest of the World, more like a minority and Boris liked the plan of the minority because of our lack of resources and ran with it until the big outcry. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 12:02 - Mar 17 with 1262 views | Professor |
| Corona Virus on 11:54 - Mar 17 by Catullus |
Apart from Professor, is anyone else on here genuinely an expert in this field?
Lisa isn't putting her faith in Boris, she doesn't know any more than the rest of us but as far as I've seen she's posted the truth, not social media BS or unqualified medical opinions. She has posted her opinions too which is all most of us are doing. Some are posting the hysterical social media BS and obvious political points scoring nonsense as if it's gospel.
PS, does anyone want to accuse me of being a Lisa accolyte? That would be quute funny really.
You know, my health problems put me at higher risk, my wife works at a hospital, my 11 year old son is still in school (for today anyway) but I am trying to carry on as normally as possible. I'm not being brave, I'm not being clever because in all honesty I am scared BUT I am trying my feckin hardest not to panic, rabble rouse, rumour monger or cause extra worry. It's not like anything we post on here will influence the government but it could well influence other people, help to cause the kind of mass hysteria that sees fighting in the food aisles. |
I am certainly no expert in comparison to the excellent virologists and epidemiologists I work with, but certainly understand the arguments and the biology better than probably 99% of people. I absolutely agree with you 100% on what you say. | | | |
| Corona Virus on 12:02 - Mar 17 with 1261 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Corona Virus on 11:49 - Mar 17 by Professor |
Neil Ferguson is an excellent epidemiologist and was excellent on R4. The Imperial/LSHTM report is a great piece of science and clearly communicated. I do feel he is being somewhat diplomatic. The consensus (from scientific Twitter) is we should have done this last week or sooner, which I agree with. We are, as he said, ahead of the game compared to Spain and Italy and may yet need the measures seen in France. Of course, we should also be testing at the level of Germany-they are picking up mild and asymptomatic positives and have what looks like a much more realistic mortality rate of below 1%. There is capacity and volunteers to deliver this through academic labs. I have most of the kit needed and could take on hundreds of samples (we have PCR robot) and more if I had automated RNA extraction (ran out of money) each day-it would be a repurpose as we use it for gene expression not pathogen detection. We are going to be on shutdown until autumn anyway by the looks of it.
The change has probably saved 200,000 lives. We will get tens of thousands dying still though. |
The possibility of anti-body test very soon really helps the understanding the population which would help all countries. |  |
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