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Have the government failed? 08:00 - Apr 27 with 27621 viewsRiscaJack

Can the more educated posters on this forum give me some opinions on this?

For me it looks like a complete disgrace from the start, no leadership, promises not kept, flights still coming into country from badly hit parts of world, using the excuse of "scientific advice" for not postponing the likes of Cheltenham Festival, Liverpool v Madrid, music gigs. We watched what was happening in Italy, I just can't find any excuses for them.

JENKINS OUT

2
Have the government failed? on 13:56 - May 6 with 561 viewsjack2jack

Have the government failed? on 13:08 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

Sorry but that’s just not true.

I posted on here about how empty London was weeks before lockdown. And public transport usage was a small fraction of normal way before lockdown as well.


From what ive read Londons spike in deaths, was absolutely ahead of the rest of us.
Yes services were cut, on the underground, but carriages were still rammed until the end of march into April, why? As you say in such a densely populated City, the virus would spread quicker, and yet the undergound was full, now given the rate of infection at that time, i find that unbelievable. Matt Hancock had a hissy around the 25th march asking why services were being cut, saying there was no good reason.
i still say and ill keep banging on about it, we should have vetted our borders/closed them, introduced quarantining testing etc.,put stringent measures in place, and locked down earlier. My argument is that simple, its just my opinion. Stats and graphs are really irrelevant at this time, so im not even going there, because quite frankly they are useless, maybe until this is all over.
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Have the government failed? on 14:00 - May 6 with 552 viewsNeath_Jack

Have the government failed? on 13:45 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

Every day they show the graph with the numbers. It’s been at about 5% ish since lockdown and was about 25% the week before lockdown.

There are always going to be the odd times when it looks busier. But largely it’s deserted.


I'm not disputing they are way down now, but in the weeks leading up to the lockdown and the first week after it, the tubes were packed solid. This was one of the reasons a few of the big building contractors closed their sites in London, to reduce the numbers having to use public transport. I believe most are back open again now though.

I want a mate like Flashberryjacks, who wears a Barnsley jersey with "Swans are my second team" on the back.
Poll: Would you support military action against Syria on what we know so far?

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Have the government failed? on 14:08 - May 6 with 549 viewsjack2jack

Have the government failed? on 10:38 - May 6 by Catullus

France had it's first confirmed case 27 Decenber, 4 days before China reported this to the WHO. It was in Europe before we even knew it existed so it's highly likely it was in the UK too, Heathrow is the busiest travel hub in Europe after all.


All the more reason why we, and every over country should have acted sooner, there's been gross negligence on a grand scale over this situation, the experts warned this was on its way, and everyone just sat on their hands. Dont get me wrong China have been far from truthful in all of this.
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Have the government failed? on 14:09 - May 6 with 549 viewschad

Here we go, let’s just look at population, one of the hundreds of variables that affect comparison of the figures relating to the horrific mass deaths prompted by this virus.

Also looks at the probably more reflective, additional deaths (over average norms).

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Have the government failed? on 14:24 - May 6 with 533 viewslondonlisa2001

Have the government failed? on 14:00 - May 6 by Neath_Jack

I'm not disputing they are way down now, but in the weeks leading up to the lockdown and the first week after it, the tubes were packed solid. This was one of the reasons a few of the big building contractors closed their sites in London, to reduce the numbers having to use public transport. I believe most are back open again now though.


Ok. It’s not my experience or the experience of anyone I know who lives in London including those that are having to use public transport and it’s not consistent with the official statistics either but I can’t be bothered to argue about it.

If you say the tube has been packed every day up to and after lockdown, so be it.
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Have the government failed? on 14:31 - May 6 with 524 viewsgadgetuk

Have the government failed? on 14:24 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

Ok. It’s not my experience or the experience of anyone I know who lives in London including those that are having to use public transport and it’s not consistent with the official statistics either but I can’t be bothered to argue about it.

If you say the tube has been packed every day up to and after lockdown, so be it.


He didn't say that they were still packed, he said up until and even the week after lockdown was announced public transport was still rammed, and that was correct - I saw it first hand.
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Have the government failed? on 14:40 - May 6 with 510 viewsNeath_Jack

Have the government failed? on 14:24 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

Ok. It’s not my experience or the experience of anyone I know who lives in London including those that are having to use public transport and it’s not consistent with the official statistics either but I can’t be bothered to argue about it.

If you say the tube has been packed every day up to and after lockdown, so be it.


But you have repeatedly said that you haven't been out since before the lockdown, so you haven't been experiencing travel on the underground? It's not what I am saying, it's what is being reported, with photographs, hard to dispute those surely?

The first link on google, is for two days after the lockdown? Maybe they are making it up.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/tubes-packed-london-underground-travel-wa

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8191261/Key-worker-tweets-photo-Tube-pa

I want a mate like Flashberryjacks, who wears a Barnsley jersey with "Swans are my second team" on the back.
Poll: Would you support military action against Syria on what we know so far?

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Have the government failed? on 15:50 - May 6 with 462 viewslondonlisa2001

Have the government failed? on 14:40 - May 6 by Neath_Jack

But you have repeatedly said that you haven't been out since before the lockdown, so you haven't been experiencing travel on the underground? It's not what I am saying, it's what is being reported, with photographs, hard to dispute those surely?

The first link on google, is for two days after the lockdown? Maybe they are making it up.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/tubes-packed-london-underground-travel-wa

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8191261/Key-worker-tweets-photo-Tube-pa


Yeah, because I haven’t been able to speak with any of my friends at all since lockdown...

I said on here that London was very quiet well before the lockdown when, by definition, I was out and about.

I also have friends who are essential workers. NHS, teachers, shop workers, construction and, funnily enough, a tube driver on the Piccadilly line. They have used the tube pretty much every working day since this started.

As I said, there is the odd carriage where it’s busy (ish) in rush hour. There’s bound to be, but the network is running at 5% or so in terms of numbers of people. They put it on a graph and show us, every day at 5pm.

Photos are relatively easy to come by to show anything you want.

The thing is, it’s easy for you or others to criticise people using the tube. But if you’re a doctor and have to get to Guys, or St Mary’s, or Chelsea & Westminster or wherever, and you don’t live near there what do you suggest these people do to get to work? People don’t have cars here in the same way as they do in Swansea. Plus you can’t park anywhere. Everyone uses public transport all the time.

Easy to criticise if you’re the Daily Mail sitting at home. Easy to criticise from somewhere else in the country.

It’s amazing how much emptier carriages would have been according to the Mail if the Mayor wasn’t a Muslim that they hate.
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Have the government failed? on 16:25 - May 6 with 441 viewsA_Fans_Dad

Have the government failed? on 15:50 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

Yeah, because I haven’t been able to speak with any of my friends at all since lockdown...

I said on here that London was very quiet well before the lockdown when, by definition, I was out and about.

I also have friends who are essential workers. NHS, teachers, shop workers, construction and, funnily enough, a tube driver on the Piccadilly line. They have used the tube pretty much every working day since this started.

As I said, there is the odd carriage where it’s busy (ish) in rush hour. There’s bound to be, but the network is running at 5% or so in terms of numbers of people. They put it on a graph and show us, every day at 5pm.

Photos are relatively easy to come by to show anything you want.

The thing is, it’s easy for you or others to criticise people using the tube. But if you’re a doctor and have to get to Guys, or St Mary’s, or Chelsea & Westminster or wherever, and you don’t live near there what do you suggest these people do to get to work? People don’t have cars here in the same way as they do in Swansea. Plus you can’t park anywhere. Everyone uses public transport all the time.

Easy to criticise if you’re the Daily Mail sitting at home. Easy to criticise from somewhere else in the country.

It’s amazing how much emptier carriages would have been according to the Mail if the Mayor wasn’t a Muslim that they hate.


What about when it is the Health workers who are complaining it is too crowded?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8216653/Commuters-cram-Tube-carriages-L

So Khan was told by the government to increase the number of carriages for rush hour and it is the Mail hating Khan for reporting it.
Right.
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Have the government failed? on 16:26 - May 6 with 440 viewsKilkennyjack

Have the government failed? on 13:47 - May 6 by NotLoyal

He could have flown over his nationalist allies.


I guess its what the Brexit types would call ‘the will of the people’ ...

Talking is far better than not talking mind .... even Churchill would agree ...

‘Beware of the risen people’ ........🍀🇮🇪 💚 Dim byd grêt am brydain 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿🇪🇺

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Have the government failed? on 16:30 - May 6 with 433 viewslondonlisa2001

Have the government failed? on 16:25 - May 6 by A_Fans_Dad

What about when it is the Health workers who are complaining it is too crowded?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8216653/Commuters-cram-Tube-carriages-L

So Khan was told by the government to increase the number of carriages for rush hour and it is the Mail hating Khan for reporting it.
Right.


“ As I said, there is the odd carriage where it’s busy (ish) in rush hour. There’s bound to be, but the network is running at 5% or so in terms of numbers of people. They put it on a graph and show us, every day at 5pm. ”

I refer you to my previous answer.

Moron.
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Have the government failed? on 16:40 - May 6 with 420 viewslondonlisa2001

Btw - in terms of pictures of packed out places during lockdown, the two photos below are the same queue showing you how things are being manipulated at times using different angles and lenses.



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Have the government failed? on 17:24 - May 6 with 387 viewsA_Fans_Dad

Have the government failed? on 16:30 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

“ As I said, there is the odd carriage where it’s busy (ish) in rush hour. There’s bound to be, but the network is running at 5% or so in terms of numbers of people. They put it on a graph and show us, every day at 5pm. ”

I refer you to my previous answer.

Moron.


Not the point of my post at all you moron.
It was about your attack on the Mail over Khan, when the it was the government and a health worker doing the complaining about him and the conditions.
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Have the government failed? on 17:53 - May 6 with 365 viewschad

Have the government failed? on 16:26 - May 6 by Kilkennyjack

I guess its what the Brexit types would call ‘the will of the people’ ...

Talking is far better than not talking mind .... even Churchill would agree ...


Not everyone would agree...

Accumulating evidence indicates that simply speaking can emit coronavirus-containing particles that waft through air for tens of meters, hover there, and possibly transmit SARS-CoV-2 to a person who inhales these virus-tainted aerosols.

“Based on the trend in the increase of [SARS-CoV-2] infections, and understanding the basic science of viral infection spread,” Australian and Chinese researchers write, “we strongly believe that the virus is likely to be spreading through the air”

They “plead that the international and national authorities acknowledge the reality that the virus spreads through air, and recommend that adequate control measures . . . be implemented to prevent further spread of the SARS-CoV-2 virus.”


Or to quote Ronan Keating...

You say it best, when you say nothing at all ;)
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Have the government failed? on 18:11 - May 6 with 348 viewslondonlisa2001

Have the government failed? on 17:24 - May 6 by A_Fans_Dad

Not the point of my post at all you moron.
It was about your attack on the Mail over Khan, when the it was the government and a health worker doing the complaining about him and the conditions.


Check the sources.

I don’t mean the Mail. I mean check the twitter accounts that they quote.

The health worker’s account doesn’t have that tweet in his account. It’s been removed by him by the looks of it, with him also saying to the Metro paper that they cannot use it.

The other account is a litany of complaints against companies, particularly banks, shops, the LBHF and TFL together cries to close borders and asking for beggars to be removed. Only 25 tweets and 22 followers. It’s incredible the Mail managed to find that account isn’t it. Perhaps it’s just that a random search would throw up an account with only 22 followers with such an easy to find twitter handle...
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Have the government failed? on 18:25 - May 6 with 337 viewsNeath_Jack

Have the government failed? on 15:50 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

Yeah, because I haven’t been able to speak with any of my friends at all since lockdown...

I said on here that London was very quiet well before the lockdown when, by definition, I was out and about.

I also have friends who are essential workers. NHS, teachers, shop workers, construction and, funnily enough, a tube driver on the Piccadilly line. They have used the tube pretty much every working day since this started.

As I said, there is the odd carriage where it’s busy (ish) in rush hour. There’s bound to be, but the network is running at 5% or so in terms of numbers of people. They put it on a graph and show us, every day at 5pm.

Photos are relatively easy to come by to show anything you want.

The thing is, it’s easy for you or others to criticise people using the tube. But if you’re a doctor and have to get to Guys, or St Mary’s, or Chelsea & Westminster or wherever, and you don’t live near there what do you suggest these people do to get to work? People don’t have cars here in the same way as they do in Swansea. Plus you can’t park anywhere. Everyone uses public transport all the time.

Easy to criticise if you’re the Daily Mail sitting at home. Easy to criticise from somewhere else in the country.

It’s amazing how much emptier carriages would have been according to the Mail if the Mayor wasn’t a Muslim that they hate.


Oh Lisa,you really should try and accept that you cannot be absolutely correct about every subject, all of the time.

London has done nothing different to anywhere else in the UK, some went early, most didn't same as down here. You had people sunbathing in parks after the lockdown too, same as some done down here.

Makes no difference what friends you have, or what they do for a living, it's anecdotal. The print media, social media, radio, tv, were all reporting on how crammed the tubes were, just before and after the lockdown.

I have not criticised anyone for using the tube, at any point anywhere on this board.

Why bring racism into this? The first link wasn't from the mail, and there are tons of others on there as well reporting it.

You don't agree with it fine, but you should try responding by saying "In my opinion I don't think it's correct", similar to how you reply to people like ECB or Loh. Your opinion is worth no more than the next person, you'll do well to remember that.

Now, you can have the last word on it.

I want a mate like Flashberryjacks, who wears a Barnsley jersey with "Swans are my second team" on the back.
Poll: Would you support military action against Syria on what we know so far?

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Have the government failed? on 18:36 - May 6 with 328 viewsperplex

Have the government failed? on 18:43 - May 5 by Highjack

What? The Iraq war left millions dead, disfigured, injured or displaced! How can this possibly be worse?


You can not blame him for killing millions you header.
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Have the government failed? on 18:39 - May 6 with 323 viewscontroversial_jack

Have the government failed? on 18:25 - May 6 by Neath_Jack

Oh Lisa,you really should try and accept that you cannot be absolutely correct about every subject, all of the time.

London has done nothing different to anywhere else in the UK, some went early, most didn't same as down here. You had people sunbathing in parks after the lockdown too, same as some done down here.

Makes no difference what friends you have, or what they do for a living, it's anecdotal. The print media, social media, radio, tv, were all reporting on how crammed the tubes were, just before and after the lockdown.

I have not criticised anyone for using the tube, at any point anywhere on this board.

Why bring racism into this? The first link wasn't from the mail, and there are tons of others on there as well reporting it.

You don't agree with it fine, but you should try responding by saying "In my opinion I don't think it's correct", similar to how you reply to people like ECB or Loh. Your opinion is worth no more than the next person, you'll do well to remember that.

Now, you can have the last word on it.


Why has it taken you so long to see what she's like?
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Have the government failed? on 18:43 - May 6 with 320 viewslondonlisa2001

Have the government failed? on 18:25 - May 6 by Neath_Jack

Oh Lisa,you really should try and accept that you cannot be absolutely correct about every subject, all of the time.

London has done nothing different to anywhere else in the UK, some went early, most didn't same as down here. You had people sunbathing in parks after the lockdown too, same as some done down here.

Makes no difference what friends you have, or what they do for a living, it's anecdotal. The print media, social media, radio, tv, were all reporting on how crammed the tubes were, just before and after the lockdown.

I have not criticised anyone for using the tube, at any point anywhere on this board.

Why bring racism into this? The first link wasn't from the mail, and there are tons of others on there as well reporting it.

You don't agree with it fine, but you should try responding by saying "In my opinion I don't think it's correct", similar to how you reply to people like ECB or Loh. Your opinion is worth no more than the next person, you'll do well to remember that.

Now, you can have the last word on it.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUhVWM8WoAI2zkt?format=jpg&name=large
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Have the government failed? on 18:44 - May 6 with 317 viewslondonlisa2001

Have the government failed? on 18:39 - May 6 by controversial_jack

Why has it taken you so long to see what she's like?


Lol.
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Have the government failed? on 18:46 - May 6 with 309 viewsDarran

Have the government failed? on 18:25 - May 6 by Neath_Jack

Oh Lisa,you really should try and accept that you cannot be absolutely correct about every subject, all of the time.

London has done nothing different to anywhere else in the UK, some went early, most didn't same as down here. You had people sunbathing in parks after the lockdown too, same as some done down here.

Makes no difference what friends you have, or what they do for a living, it's anecdotal. The print media, social media, radio, tv, were all reporting on how crammed the tubes were, just before and after the lockdown.

I have not criticised anyone for using the tube, at any point anywhere on this board.

Why bring racism into this? The first link wasn't from the mail, and there are tons of others on there as well reporting it.

You don't agree with it fine, but you should try responding by saying "In my opinion I don't think it's correct", similar to how you reply to people like ECB or Loh. Your opinion is worth no more than the next person, you'll do well to remember that.

Now, you can have the last word on it.


lol

The first ever recipient of a Planet Swans Lifetime Achievement Award.
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Have the government failed? on 20:09 - May 6 with 250 viewsA_Fans_Dad

Have the government failed? on 18:43 - May 6 by londonlisa2001

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUhVWM8WoAI2zkt?format=jpg&name=large


Great stats, the only problem is they had reduced the rail rolling stock by just as much at rush hour.
When you have members of the government telling him to do something you know he is not doing his job in line with lockdown & social spacing principles.
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Have the government failed? on 20:24 - May 6 with 238 viewsmajorraglan

Have the government failed? on 09:11 - May 6 by felixstowe_jack

Belgium 8000 deaths with a population of 11,000,000 has the highest death rate in the world let alone Europe. Says all you need to know about the EU.


Belgium may have 8,000 deaths, but they count every case where Covid19 is suspect as being a factor in their stats, but we (along with Italy and Spain) only count deaths where a PHE or NHS Lab test result has provided a positive result for Covid19.

If you do a straight comparison of deaths in hospitals here and in Belgium up until the 29th of April, the death rate in Belgium is 295 per million and here its 328 per million. This shouldn’t be about Britain or the EU, it should be about people losing their lives and whether the Government are have done or are doing a good job. We need open, mature, enquiring attitudes not EU vs Britain rhetoric.

Edit, typo
[Post edited 6 May 21:46]
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Have the government failed? on 20:37 - May 6 with 219 viewsKilkennyjack

Have the government failed? on 17:53 - May 6 by chad

Not everyone would agree...

Accumulating evidence indicates that simply speaking can emit coronavirus-containing particles that waft through air for tens of meters, hover there, and possibly transmit SARS-CoV-2 to a person who inhales these virus-tainted aerosols.

“Based on the trend in the increase of [SARS-CoV-2] infections, and understanding the basic science of viral infection spread,” Australian and Chinese researchers write, “we strongly believe that the virus is likely to be spreading through the air”

They “plead that the international and national authorities acknowledge the reality that the virus spreads through air, and recommend that adequate control measures . . . be implemented to prevent further spread of the SARS-CoV-2 virus.”


Or to quote Ronan Keating...

You say it best, when you say nothing at all ;)


Read my post again Dumbo.

I was responding to a different point.

As Roy Keane might say... ‘feck off’ ...
[Post edited 6 May 20:38]

‘Beware of the risen people’ ........🍀🇮🇪 💚 Dim byd grêt am brydain 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿🇪🇺

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Have the government failed? on 20:40 - May 6 with 215 viewsDr_Winston

Have the government failed? on 20:24 - May 6 by majorraglan

Belgium may have 8,000 deaths, but they count every case where Covid19 is suspect as being a factor in their stats, but we (along with Italy and Spain) only count deaths where a PHE or NHS Lab test result has provided a positive result for Covid19.

If you do a straight comparison of deaths in hospitals here and in Belgium up until the 29th of April, the death rate in Belgium is 295 per million and here its 328 per million. This shouldn’t be about Britain or the EU, it should be about people losing their lives and whether the Government are have done or are doing a good job. We need open, mature, enquiring attitudes not EU vs Britain rhetoric.

Edit, typo
[Post edited 6 May 21:46]


We need people to stop comparing (and celebrating in the case of ghouls like Kilks) death rates.

Otherwise I couldn't agree more.

Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.

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