| Travel to Wales 09:25 - Jun 6 with 6767 views | legoman |
I posted recently about visiting elderly parents in Swansea. Mrs L and I are wondering whether we could make a day visit from here in Bromley. We thought about driving down early, staying with parents for a few hours but in their garden, then driving back home.
It would be a long day but we're not sure when things are going to change. We know the Welsh government rules ask people to stay local, but what do you folks think? |  |
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| Travel to Wales on 19:22 - Jun 6 with 1324 views | exhmrc1 |
| Travel to Wales on 17:03 - Jun 6 by legoman |
Thanks for the responses all. Just to be absolutely clear, no-one in the Lego family intends flouting the rules either here in London or in Wales, not least because L junior is a virologist and so we probably have more info about this thing than many.
We will not travel until it is allowed and safe to do so, and I guess the responses I was hoping for would have contained some info about when folk think Wales might be in a position to allow cross border travel again. Apologies if I didn't clarify that point. We have taken a quick gander at the Welsh rules but couldn't immediately find what we were looking for.
We are fortunate that none of us in the Lego household has a need to use public transport to get to London for work, as I think that is a big risk, along with going to pubs bars and restaurants. It will be a long time before any of us relax our current behaviours regardless of the rules.
But I do think we need to keep things in proportion. Whilst social distancing should be observed and encouraged, remember that you need to be in close proximity with someone outside your household for more than 15 minutes. The chances of you catching Covid from merely passing someone on a country walk or from a cyclist shooting past is very very low. Keeping decent levels of personal hygiene is a mantra we should follow at all times, not just during a pandemic.
Don't have nightmares! |
One of the issues you would need to consider if you travelled here is it would be extremely unlikely that you will be allowed to see your mother. There has been a complete ban on visitors in all nursing and care homes in Wales. In hospitals a birthing partner can visit, one parent if it is a child in hospital and one relative if the patient is an end of life patient. No other visitors are allowed. My mate is in a care home and nobody can visit him except his sister. She rung me in March to tell me this and to advise others who go to see him.
As for when visitors will be allowed here that is anybody's guess. I suspect it is likely to be when the North Wales, Cardiff and all regions of England and Scotland reach the level most of South Wales is currently at. They are reviewing the lock down position again on 22 June but we dont know what will come of that.
Last weekend Dyfed Powys police turned around a 1000 holiday makers from England. |  | | |
| Travel to Wales on 19:55 - Jun 6 with 1300 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Travel to Wales on 19:17 - Jun 6 by londonlisa2001 |
People are allowed to travel to Cardiff for work. They are not allowed to travel from Swansea to Carmarthen to see family in a socially responsible way.
There is no justification for it. It is a complete nonsense. You can still stop people going to public places if that’s what you want but putting distance on seeing people is unnecessarily cruel and smacks of a small minded attitude where everyone lives within a few doors of each other.
How many lives is it costing? |
The basics are bleedin obvious.
The covid virus cannot travel on its own.
If people dont travel, it stops the spread of the virus. Its Lockdown.
If R rate is under 1 then lifting parts of lockdown can start.
But ....still less travel and less contacts is essential.
Work travel has been prioritised to help economy.
Its one step at a time.
If R rate is under 1 in 2 weeks time then further freedoms will be introduced.
Maybe family visits over 5 miles.
Its a measured and appropriately cautious approach.
Its also bleedin obvious. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Travel to Wales on 20:03 - Jun 6 with 1294 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Travel to Wales on 19:55 - Jun 6 by Kilkennyjack |
The basics are bleedin obvious.
The covid virus cannot travel on its own.
If people dont travel, it stops the spread of the virus. Its Lockdown.
If R rate is under 1 then lifting parts of lockdown can start.
But ....still less travel and less contacts is essential.
Work travel has been prioritised to help economy.
Its one step at a time.
If R rate is under 1 in 2 weeks time then further freedoms will be introduced.
Maybe family visits over 5 miles.
Its a measured and appropriately cautious approach.
Its also bleedin obvious. |
No they are not.
Traveling 5 miles or 20 miles to sit in a garden 2 metres from a family member carries the same virus transmission risk. Virtually zero. If they all know they haven’t met anyone else it’s completely zero.
They’ve lifted the shielding (without having met the criteria for doing so) and won’t let family members play tennis with each other.
It’s utter nonsense. If Drakeford had family living 10 miles from him that would have been the limit.
Same as the science changed the he day after Gething got caught having a picnic. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 20:08 - Jun 6 with 1290 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Travel to Wales on 20:03 - Jun 6 by londonlisa2001 |
No they are not.
Traveling 5 miles or 20 miles to sit in a garden 2 metres from a family member carries the same virus transmission risk. Virtually zero. If they all know they haven’t met anyone else it’s completely zero.
They’ve lifted the shielding (without having met the criteria for doing so) and won’t let family members play tennis with each other.
It’s utter nonsense. If Drakeford had family living 10 miles from him that would have been the limit.
Same as the science changed the he day after Gething got caught having a picnic. |
Its about containment.
In your model than people can travel to rural west wales and spread the disease to areas without the health care provision to cope.
Stay at home, stay local, is all about reducing the spread. Its containment.
Thats the science.
Less travel means less risk of spread of the disease. Simples. | |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Travel to Wales on 20:23 - Jun 6 with 1282 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Travel to Wales on 20:08 - Jun 6 by Kilkennyjack |
Its about containment.
In your model than people can travel to rural west wales and spread the disease to areas without the health care provision to cope.
Stay at home, stay local, is all about reducing the spread. Its containment.
Thats the science.
Less travel means less risk of spread of the disease. Simples. |
No, it’s not.
If people travel to family and sit in their garden and follow the guidance it cannot spread the disease any more than going somewhere that’s 5 miles away. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 20:55 - Jun 6 with 1267 views | exhmrc1 |
How many would sit in their garden and how many would follow the rules. Many wont. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 21:49 - Jun 6 with 1248 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Travel to Wales on 20:23 - Jun 6 by londonlisa2001 |
No, it’s not.
If people travel to family and sit in their garden and follow the guidance it cannot spread the disease any more than going somewhere that’s 5 miles away. |
Ok - so now i have learned that people who are maybe carrying covid19 across large areas, think Dom, actually offer no more risk of spreading the virus than people who pop next door for a cuppa in the garden.
Rightio .. 🤷â€â™‚ï¸ | |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Travel to Wales on 21:56 - Jun 6 with 1245 views | controversial_jack |
| Travel to Wales on 20:08 - Jun 6 by Kilkennyjack |
Its about containment.
In your model than people can travel to rural west wales and spread the disease to areas without the health care provision to cope.
Stay at home, stay local, is all about reducing the spread. Its containment.
Thats the science.
Less travel means less risk of spread of the disease. Simples. |
You are correct. Give people an inch and they will take a mile. Boundaries have to be set somewhere | | | |
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| Travel to Wales on 21:56 - Jun 6 with 1245 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Travel to Wales on 20:55 - Jun 6 by exhmrc1 |
How many would sit in their garden and how many would follow the rules. Many wont. |
The ones that won’t won’t stick to 5 miles either mun. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 21:58 - Jun 6 with 1242 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Travel to Wales on 21:49 - Jun 6 by Kilkennyjack |
Ok - so now i have learned that people who are maybe carrying covid19 across large areas, think Dom, actually offer no more risk of spreading the virus than people who pop next door for a cuppa in the garden.
Rightio .. 🤷â€â™‚ï¸ |
Are you genuinely that stupid?
I’m not talking about 2 very different moments in time. Lockdown in March was not the same as lockdown in June. Which is why you can go and play golf and meet up with other people. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 22:36 - Jun 6 with 1223 views | dickythorpe |
| Travel to Wales on 21:58 - Jun 6 by londonlisa2001 |
Are you genuinely that stupid?
I’m not talking about 2 very different moments in time. Lockdown in March was not the same as lockdown in June. Which is why you can go and play golf and meet up with other people. |
How long before we return to the March version of lockdown?
Schools that reopened will close again before end of term. |  | | |
| Travel to Wales on 22:42 - Jun 6 with 1219 views | Dr_Winston |
| Travel to Wales on 22:36 - Jun 6 by dickythorpe |
How long before we return to the March version of lockdown?
Schools that reopened will close again before end of term. |
Maybe. Maybe not.
Not much evidence either way to suggest a Second Wave is imminent or not. |  |
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| Travel to Wales on 08:42 - Jun 24 with 1070 views | pencoedjack |
Seems the opposite will be happening en mass with caravan's, campers, travelling to England as they are opening sites.
Will the English police stop Welsh people travelling to English camp sites helping boost the UK economy? |  | | |
| Travel to Wales on 09:15 - Jun 24 with 1028 views | squarebear |
| Travel to Wales on 22:42 - Jun 6 by Dr_Winston |
Maybe. Maybe not.
Not much evidence either way to suggest a Second Wave is imminent or not. |
Putting to one side that we don't have a very effective tracing system, I disagree.
The UK are purportedly identifying over 4000 new cases a day. And that's with a lot of lockdown still going on. Imagine what will happen to that figure when the dafties (God bless 'em) are sitting in cinemas etc. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 09:45 - Jun 24 with 999 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Travel to Wales on 20:08 - Jun 6 by Kilkennyjack |
Its about containment.
In your model than people can travel to rural west wales and spread the disease to areas without the health care provision to cope.
Stay at home, stay local, is all about reducing the spread. Its containment.
Thats the science.
Less travel means less risk of spread of the disease. Simples. |
So it is okay for a football team and associated backroom staff to travel from Swansea to Middlesbrough crossing the welsh border and a team from Leeds travelling to Cardiff again crossing the border.
But it not okay for a guy from bromley to visit his relatives.
Why do Drakeford dicktats only apply to some people and not everybody? | |
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| Travel to Wales on 09:47 - Jun 24 with 998 views | raynor94 |
| Travel to Wales on 08:42 - Jun 24 by pencoedjack |
Seems the opposite will be happening en mass with caravan's, campers, travelling to England as they are opening sites.
Will the English police stop Welsh people travelling to English camp sites helping boost the UK economy? |
I'll certainly be going over the border to a hotel in England from the 4th of July, and pick up some cheap booze while I'm there  |  |
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| Travel to Wales on 09:52 - Jun 24 with 990 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Travel to Wales on 09:15 - Jun 24 by squarebear |
Putting to one side that we don't have a very effective tracing system, I disagree.
The UK are purportedly identifying over 4000 new cases a day. And that's with a lot of lockdown still going on. Imagine what will happen to that figure when the dafties (God bless 'em) are sitting in cinemas etc. |
874 new cases in UK yesterday not your 4000 cases.
98 new cases in Wales . 12% of UK cases from 5% of UK population. | |
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| Travel to Wales on 11:07 - Jun 24 with 974 views | exhmrc1 |
| Travel to Wales on 09:52 - Jun 24 by felixstowe_jack |
874 new cases in UK yesterday not your 4000 cases.
98 new cases in Wales . 12% of UK cases from 5% of UK population. |
Most of these are coming from 2 new outbreaks in meat processing plants in North Wales. Look at the full facts not the headline figures. Swansea has not had a single new case for a week. Neath Port Talbot averages 1 a day over the last week. Powys has had 1 case a day for the last 3 days after 9 days without a case. It borders Wrexham where 1 of the outbreaks is.
Over the last week the following has happened
Welsh overall cases 53, 48, 31, 25, 100, 71 and 98.
North wales cases 31, 25, 14, 14, 66, 43 and 55.
Yesterday Monmouthshire, Newport and Torfaen had no cases along with Ceredigion, Pembrokeshire and Swansea. Powys, Carmarthenshire and Bridgend had 1 each and Neath Port Talbot 2. 10 local authorities in Mid, South and West Wales had 5 cases between them. Blaenau Gwent, Caerphilly and Merthyr Tydfil had 3 each. There were14 cases in the bulk of South and Mid Wales. It was up slightly in Cardiff, Vale of Glamorgan and the Rhondda Cynon Taff..
As can be seen over 50% nearly every day have come in North Wales and these are largley attributed to the 2 outbreaks in factories in Llangefni and Wrexham | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 11:25 - Jun 24 with 967 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Travel to Wales on 11:07 - Jun 24 by exhmrc1 |
Most of these are coming from 2 new outbreaks in meat processing plants in North Wales. Look at the full facts not the headline figures. Swansea has not had a single new case for a week. Neath Port Talbot averages 1 a day over the last week. Powys has had 1 case a day for the last 3 days after 9 days without a case. It borders Wrexham where 1 of the outbreaks is.
Over the last week the following has happened
Welsh overall cases 53, 48, 31, 25, 100, 71 and 98.
North wales cases 31, 25, 14, 14, 66, 43 and 55.
Yesterday Monmouthshire, Newport and Torfaen had no cases along with Ceredigion, Pembrokeshire and Swansea. Powys, Carmarthenshire and Bridgend had 1 each and Neath Port Talbot 2. 10 local authorities in Mid, South and West Wales had 5 cases between them. Blaenau Gwent, Caerphilly and Merthyr Tydfil had 3 each. There were14 cases in the bulk of South and Mid Wales. It was up slightly in Cardiff, Vale of Glamorgan and the Rhondda Cynon Taff..
As can be seen over 50% nearly every day have come in North Wales and these are largley attributed to the 2 outbreaks in factories in Llangefni and Wrexham |
And your point is? | |
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| Travel to Wales on 11:32 - Jun 24 with 956 views | exhmrc1 |
Wales cases
Updated 24 Jun at 11:19 local
Confirmed
15,295
+98
Deaths
1,483
+5
United Kingdom cases
Updated 24 Jun at 11:19 local
Confirmed
306,210
+921
Deaths
42,927
+280
As can be seen from the above there were 5 deaths in Wales in the 24 hour period to yesterday and 280 in the UK. The equivalent UK figure to Wales 5 deaths is 110. That is .more than double the Welsh rate Based on the total Welsh cases of 1483 the UK would have 32626. There are over 10000 more deaths in the UK than would have been expected using the Welsh rate | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 11:59 - Jun 24 with 938 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Travel to Wales on 11:32 - Jun 24 by exhmrc1 |
Wales cases
Updated 24 Jun at 11:19 local
Confirmed
15,295
+98
Deaths
1,483
+5
United Kingdom cases
Updated 24 Jun at 11:19 local
Confirmed
306,210
+921
Deaths
42,927
+280
As can be seen from the above there were 5 deaths in Wales in the 24 hour period to yesterday and 280 in the UK. The equivalent UK figure to Wales 5 deaths is 110. That is .more than double the Welsh rate Based on the total Welsh cases of 1483 the UK would have 32626. There are over 10000 more deaths in the UK than would have been expected using the Welsh rate |
Thanks for confirm my data as you say if England had followed wales there should have been over 2000 new case instead of 981. Wales new cases are twice the English rate. | |
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| Travel to Wales on 12:12 - Jun 24 with 924 views | exhmrc1 |
| Travel to Wales on 11:59 - Jun 24 by felixstowe_jack |
Thanks for confirm my data as you say if England had followed wales there should have been over 2000 new case instead of 981. Wales new cases are twice the English rate. |
Much as you dont want to see it the 2 instances in North Wales is causing problems in North Wales at the moment and is likely to over the next week and makes the Welsh figures look bad when that isnt the case. 14 new cases in 13 authorities in South Wales speaks for itself.
Even in North Wales Denbighshire, Gwynedd and Flintshire only showed 12 new cases between.
Perhaps you would like to explain why the UK deaths are nearly a third higher proportionately than Wales generally and based on the UK death rates yesterday Wales would have had 13 deaths not 5. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 12:14 - Jun 24 with 922 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Travel to Wales on 11:32 - Jun 24 by exhmrc1 |
Wales cases
Updated 24 Jun at 11:19 local
Confirmed
15,295
+98
Deaths
1,483
+5
United Kingdom cases
Updated 24 Jun at 11:19 local
Confirmed
306,210
+921
Deaths
42,927
+280
As can be seen from the above there were 5 deaths in Wales in the 24 hour period to yesterday and 280 in the UK. The equivalent UK figure to Wales 5 deaths is 110. That is .more than double the Welsh rate Based on the total Welsh cases of 1483 the UK would have 32626. There are over 10000 more deaths in the UK than would have been expected using the Welsh rate |
There were 171 deaths reported yesterday for the UK. There were 874 new cases.
Your figure of 280 includes historical revisions to death numbers for April and May. Those revisions included revisions to deaths in Wales.
8 of the worst 10 areas for corona virus infections per 100,000 people are in Wales. The policies only affect infection numbers not outcomes of those infections.
As at yesterday, Wales has had a total of 15,295 infections. England has had 159,328 (note that both figures will be vastly understated, there’s no reason to assume the understatement % varies).
On population size, England, to match Wales’ infection rates should be at 275k.
Your latest habit of saying Wales is great apart from (list areas where there are infections) is ridiculous. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 12:20 - Jun 24 with 917 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Travel to Wales on 12:12 - Jun 24 by exhmrc1 |
Much as you dont want to see it the 2 instances in North Wales is causing problems in North Wales at the moment and is likely to over the next week and makes the Welsh figures look bad when that isnt the case. 14 new cases in 13 authorities in South Wales speaks for itself.
Even in North Wales Denbighshire, Gwynedd and Flintshire only showed 12 new cases between.
Perhaps you would like to explain why the UK deaths are nearly a third higher proportionately than Wales generally and based on the UK death rates yesterday Wales would have had 13 deaths not 5. |
England only looks bad when you include the areas where it’s bad as well...
UK death rates are higher overall than in Wales due to the vastly different outcomes in people of different ethnicities.
The percentage of the population in Wales from a BAME background is far lower than it is in England. It’s 5.9% overall in Wales and over 40% in London. Of course London will have a higher death rate. The bit that the governments can control is infection rate. Which is worse in Wales. | | | |
| Travel to Wales on 12:29 - Jun 24 with 911 views | exhmrc1 |
| Travel to Wales on 12:20 - Jun 24 by londonlisa2001 |
England only looks bad when you include the areas where it’s bad as well...
UK death rates are higher overall than in Wales due to the vastly different outcomes in people of different ethnicities.
The percentage of the population in Wales from a BAME background is far lower than it is in England. It’s 5.9% overall in Wales and over 40% in London. Of course London will have a higher death rate. The bit that the governments can control is infection rate. Which is worse in Wales. |
The ethnicity isnt a third of people throughout England. Large areas like the West Country and the North East have very few ethnic people. Also Wales has more people expected to have more deaths due to the higher number of people with medical issues. | | | |
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