| Pubs 10:29 - Oct 16 with 10297 views | controversial_jack |
To be shut in Wales for a month from the 26th |  | | |  |
| Pubs on 14:38 - Oct 20 with 759 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 14:27 - Oct 20 by onehunglow |
If hospitals are full of covid then cancer treatments suffer.
Therefore ,cut the covid admissions |
Exactly and the only way to cut the covid admissions is to get the numbers at rock bottom like they were throughout July and early August in Wales before people decided they could open certain businesses and keep the virus under control. All the work done from March to the end of July to do that has now been undone. | | | |
| Pubs on 14:48 - Oct 20 with 750 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 14:38 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
Exactly and the only way to cut the covid admissions is to get the numbers at rock bottom like they were throughout July and early August in Wales before people decided they could open certain businesses and keep the virus under control. All the work done from March to the end of July to do that has now been undone. |
If the economy collapses who pays for the NHS? | | | |
| Pubs on 15:06 - Oct 20 with 745 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 14:23 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
No got it wrong the 2 key areas are pubs and borders. When schools opened in June the figures when down. When pubs opened out doors figures went down. When tourist attractions opened figures went down. When shops opened figures went down. Things that are safe to open you leave open. Things that cant have to close. You have wanted to keep open pubs, gyms and more especially our borders claiming the figures could be kept down. The fact is the virus has rocketed because of it. If we have this lock down it will hopefully reduce things for a while but if we do what you want in 2 months time we will be back in another lockdown. 2 and 1/2 months after the decisions were made that you wanted we are back in the same mess we were in March. There are 2 choices you close what needs to be kept closed and allow other things to continue or you do as Andy suggests and let it run its course with loads dying and people not able to get things like cancer and heart treatments because the NHS is overwhelmed. Your system hasnt worked, was never going to work and will cause the same problem again and again with constant lockdowns. |
It has been explained to you in very simple terms why the "opening" of borders has made very little difference, you can't grasp it so we'd better move on. Wales online say today that the strain of virus in Wales is that seen in NW England not Zante.
Then you say "Things that are safe to open, you leave open" I can complete agree with you. So why are shops closing? Why are car showrooms closing? Why are gyms closing? Why am I supposed to stay home? etc, etc.
I went to the Pump House for lunch a couple of weeks ago, it was very safe. See the article below - should Brains pubs close?
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/whats-on/food-drink-news/brains-pubs-coronavirus-l
Leaving it run its course isn't an option, but as of Saturday I'm reliably told there were four people in Morriston ICU with covid and about 20 on normal wards. The NHS isn't over run, but we have to make sure that doesn't happen.
We have to find a balance - we could have done that through enforcement of distancing. That is what we failed to do. | | | |
| Pubs on 15:59 - Oct 20 with 735 views | controversial_jack |
| Pubs on 15:06 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
It has been explained to you in very simple terms why the "opening" of borders has made very little difference, you can't grasp it so we'd better move on. Wales online say today that the strain of virus in Wales is that seen in NW England not Zante.
Then you say "Things that are safe to open, you leave open" I can complete agree with you. So why are shops closing? Why are car showrooms closing? Why are gyms closing? Why am I supposed to stay home? etc, etc.
I went to the Pump House for lunch a couple of weeks ago, it was very safe. See the article below - should Brains pubs close?
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/whats-on/food-drink-news/brains-pubs-coronavirus-l
Leaving it run its course isn't an option, but as of Saturday I'm reliably told there were four people in Morriston ICU with covid and about 20 on normal wards. The NHS isn't over run, but we have to make sure that doesn't happen.
We have to find a balance - we could have done that through enforcement of distancing. That is what we failed to do. |
Not totally correct. There are about 20 on just one ward, and the other is full. Morriston is also seeing a staff shortage. Nurses , care assistants going sick for whatever reasons.There is a lack of experienced nurses too , with mainly agency nurses staffing the wards on nights | | | |
| Pubs on 16:05 - Oct 20 with 733 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 15:59 - Oct 20 by controversial_jack |
Not totally correct. There are about 20 on just one ward, and the other is full. Morriston is also seeing a staff shortage. Nurses , care assistants going sick for whatever reasons.There is a lack of experienced nurses too , with mainly agency nurses staffing the wards on nights |
I was told by an ICU anaesthetist that there were 4 on ITU and he thought about 20 on a ward. He did say that there were just 2 porters for the entire hospital at one point on Saturday apparently 4 had covid the rest isolating. | | | |
| Pubs on 16:33 - Oct 20 with 720 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 15:06 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
It has been explained to you in very simple terms why the "opening" of borders has made very little difference, you can't grasp it so we'd better move on. Wales online say today that the strain of virus in Wales is that seen in NW England not Zante.
Then you say "Things that are safe to open, you leave open" I can complete agree with you. So why are shops closing? Why are car showrooms closing? Why are gyms closing? Why am I supposed to stay home? etc, etc.
I went to the Pump House for lunch a couple of weeks ago, it was very safe. See the article below - should Brains pubs close?
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/whats-on/food-drink-news/brains-pubs-coronavirus-l
Leaving it run its course isn't an option, but as of Saturday I'm reliably told there were four people in Morriston ICU with covid and about 20 on normal wards. The NHS isn't over run, but we have to make sure that doesn't happen.
We have to find a balance - we could have done that through enforcement of distancing. That is what we failed to do. |
Nobody has been able to find the balance anywhere. Not Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland, England, France, Spain, Italy, Belgium, Netherlands. All these places opened borders and it spread. Germany closed its borders and has 1/5 of our deaths and some of the far eastern countries have fractions of our figures for deaths for the same reasons. If we want to control it we have to learn lessons and stop it being brought here. It is the only way to control it. The evidence is clear.
When the UK borders were closed the figures went down. It was Johnson having air borders that was the catalyst for our current problems. More people bringing it it meant more cases being spread in pubs and private homes and ultimately more cases in the student community to spread in HMOs and Halls of Residence. By the time we discovered somewhere like Zante had cases the virus had already spread here and started the spike. It wasnt just Zante. There were other places as well. Initially France, Spain, Italy, Belgium, Portugal and many others were on the list and then withdrawn when it was found there was a high level of cases but too late to stop cases being brought here.
We really need to learn from places in Asia and Australasia so we dont end up in further lockdowns. It is no good saying we have to control and let more cases come here. That will just lead to where we are now. | | | |
| Pubs on 16:43 - Oct 20 with 717 views | controversial_jack |
| Pubs on 16:05 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
I was told by an ICU anaesthetist that there were 4 on ITU and he thought about 20 on a ward. He did say that there were just 2 porters for the entire hospital at one point on Saturday apparently 4 had covid the rest isolating. |
I have no idea about ICU, but there's more than one ward. | | | |
| Pubs on 16:47 - Oct 20 with 716 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 16:33 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
Nobody has been able to find the balance anywhere. Not Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland, England, France, Spain, Italy, Belgium, Netherlands. All these places opened borders and it spread. Germany closed its borders and has 1/5 of our deaths and some of the far eastern countries have fractions of our figures for deaths for the same reasons. If we want to control it we have to learn lessons and stop it being brought here. It is the only way to control it. The evidence is clear.
When the UK borders were closed the figures went down. It was Johnson having air borders that was the catalyst for our current problems. More people bringing it it meant more cases being spread in pubs and private homes and ultimately more cases in the student community to spread in HMOs and Halls of Residence. By the time we discovered somewhere like Zante had cases the virus had already spread here and started the spike. It wasnt just Zante. There were other places as well. Initially France, Spain, Italy, Belgium, Portugal and many others were on the list and then withdrawn when it was found there was a high level of cases but too late to stop cases being brought here.
We really need to learn from places in Asia and Australasia so we dont end up in further lockdowns. It is no good saying we have to control and let more cases come here. That will just lead to where we are now. |
That is completely wrong. It's been here since March it didn't disappear and come back from Zante. Germany controlled it better through test and trace but they had more freedom to travel than us over the summer.
The conclusions you come to are baffling. | | | |
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| Pubs on 17:02 - Oct 20 with 706 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 16:47 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
That is completely wrong. It's been here since March it didn't disappear and come back from Zante. Germany controlled it better through test and trace but they had more freedom to travel than us over the summer.
The conclusions you come to are baffling. |
Today there are over 1100 cases in Wales and 21000 in the UK. We cannot just trying to do what has led to this. 8 cases a day to 1100 speaks for itself and it follows opening borders and pubs. Look at the USA it is the same problem there. 8 cases a day or an average of 15 a day speaks for itself. Something was done right before and something wrong since. 8 cases 12 August 34 2 weeks later quadrapled. 165 2 weeks later doubled 389 another 2 weeks over doubled. 725 a fortnight later almost doubled and it goes back to people returning from abroad allied to the opening of pubs.
We wouldnt be in this position had we not acted in that way and businesses now wouldnt be closed for 17 days. | | | |
| Pubs on 17:29 - Oct 20 with 700 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 17:02 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
Today there are over 1100 cases in Wales and 21000 in the UK. We cannot just trying to do what has led to this. 8 cases a day to 1100 speaks for itself and it follows opening borders and pubs. Look at the USA it is the same problem there. 8 cases a day or an average of 15 a day speaks for itself. Something was done right before and something wrong since. 8 cases 12 August 34 2 weeks later quadrapled. 165 2 weeks later doubled 389 another 2 weeks over doubled. 725 a fortnight later almost doubled and it goes back to people returning from abroad allied to the opening of pubs.
We wouldnt be in this position had we not acted in that way and businesses now wouldnt be closed for 17 days. |
It also follows gyms and shops opening. Pubs had an impact and a handful of people caught it on holiday..the biggest player is students coming back to uni, the failure of test and trace and no enforcement. | | | |
| Pubs on 18:11 - Oct 20 with 684 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 17:29 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
It also follows gyms and shops opening. Pubs had an impact and a handful of people caught it on holiday..the biggest player is students coming back to uni, the failure of test and trace and no enforcement. |
Shops opened in late June. Figures continued to go down. Clearly shops werent a problem. Same with pubs and restaurants opening outdoors. Similar position with hairdressers. Started increasing late August a couple of weeks after pubs opened indoors and gyms opened and when people started returning from holidays. Continued ever since. Fact is that it had increased from 8 to 234 by the time students came back for freshers week and 362 by the time most others came back. It wasnt mainly students although it has undoubtedly had an impact. If the figures had been kept low then the impact of student would have been far less. Increase well over 15 times before students came back roughly 4 or 5 times since. | | | |
| Pubs on 18:44 - Oct 20 with 675 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 18:11 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
Shops opened in late June. Figures continued to go down. Clearly shops werent a problem. Same with pubs and restaurants opening outdoors. Similar position with hairdressers. Started increasing late August a couple of weeks after pubs opened indoors and gyms opened and when people started returning from holidays. Continued ever since. Fact is that it had increased from 8 to 234 by the time students came back for freshers week and 362 by the time most others came back. It wasnt mainly students although it has undoubtedly had an impact. If the figures had been kept low then the impact of student would have been far less. Increase well over 15 times before students came back roughly 4 or 5 times since. |
Not having that sorry. There is a clear rise from about the second week of September, probably a result of the Bank Holiday and eat out to help out. Enforcement should have taken care of that.
By far the steepest increase is during the third week of September. Which is usually when uni's start their term, often with students especially post grads arriving before that time.
Anyway I've had enough of this.
We need to get a balance between the virus and people's livelihoods. WG are letting us down miserably by taking the easy way out and a lockdown . Let's get rid of Drakeford in May. | | | |
| Pubs on 20:38 - Oct 20 with 662 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 18:44 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
Not having that sorry. There is a clear rise from about the second week of September, probably a result of the Bank Holiday and eat out to help out. Enforcement should have taken care of that.
By far the steepest increase is during the third week of September. Which is usually when uni's start their term, often with students especially post grads arriving before that time.
Anyway I've had enough of this.
We need to get a balance between the virus and people's livelihoods. WG are letting us down miserably by taking the easy way out and a lockdown . Let's get rid of Drakeford in May. |
The 3rd week of September wouldnt be down students. Freshers week started 21 Sept and given the length of time it is taking for tests these would have been for the week before. For example of the tests recorded today 15 are from 12 October and 23 from 13th.
Most students dont return until freshers week or the weekend after just before term. Post grads will have been there throughout the summer as they dont get normal holidays.
It might also be worth looking at the maps on the Public Health Wales twitter account. In the 21 days from 27 September to 17 October there were 82 positive cases for Skewen and Jersey Marine which covers the Bay Campus, 44 for Sketty 65 for Uplands 32 for Central Swansea and 43 for St Thomas covering all student areas 266 for 3 weeks compared to a total 1511 for the whole of Swansea Bay Health Board. [Post edited 20 Oct 2020 20:58]
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| Pubs on 21:48 - Oct 20 with 638 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 20:38 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
The 3rd week of September wouldnt be down students. Freshers week started 21 Sept and given the length of time it is taking for tests these would have been for the week before. For example of the tests recorded today 15 are from 12 October and 23 from 13th.
Most students dont return until freshers week or the weekend after just before term. Post grads will have been there throughout the summer as they dont get normal holidays.
It might also be worth looking at the maps on the Public Health Wales twitter account. In the 21 days from 27 September to 17 October there were 82 positive cases for Skewen and Jersey Marine which covers the Bay Campus, 44 for Sketty 65 for Uplands 32 for Central Swansea and 43 for St Thomas covering all student areas 266 for 3 weeks compared to a total 1511 for the whole of Swansea Bay Health Board. [Post edited 20 Oct 2020 20:58]
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When did you return to university? | | | |
| Pubs on 22:09 - Oct 20 with 626 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 21:48 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
When did you return to university? |
What does that have to do with figures. It is clear only about 1/4 of the figures relate to student areas. Students dont generally live in Neath, Port Talbot or the Neath Swansea and Afan Valleys so you have been proven wrong in your assumptions. The increase is far more general than just students continuing what started in August with people returning from holidays and spreading it through pubs and visiting each others houses. Similarly many of the local authorities are not affected as they dont have university students staying there. | | | |
| Pubs on 22:24 - Oct 20 with 620 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 22:09 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
What does that have to do with figures. It is clear only about 1/4 of the figures relate to student areas. Students dont generally live in Neath, Port Talbot or the Neath Swansea and Afan Valleys so you have been proven wrong in your assumptions. The increase is far more general than just students continuing what started in August with people returning from holidays and spreading it through pubs and visiting each others houses. Similarly many of the local authorities are not affected as they dont have university students staying there. |
Contrary to your earlier statement Morriston Hospital has released this today.
Across the hospital, 39 patients and 28 members of staff have now tested positive.
Cwmtawe have released a press statement that one of their year 11 students have contacted it.
There were 28 and 30 cases in Clydach and Mawr and Pontardawe areas. | | | |
| Pubs on 07:22 - Oct 21 with 583 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 22:09 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
What does that have to do with figures. It is clear only about 1/4 of the figures relate to student areas. Students dont generally live in Neath, Port Talbot or the Neath Swansea and Afan Valleys so you have been proven wrong in your assumptions. The increase is far more general than just students continuing what started in August with people returning from holidays and spreading it through pubs and visiting each others houses. Similarly many of the local authorities are not affected as they dont have university students staying there. |
So a quarter of the cases are amongst about 8% of the population? | | | |
| Pubs on 07:22 - Oct 21 with 582 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 22:24 - Oct 20 by exhmrc1 |
Contrary to your earlier statement Morriston Hospital has released this today.
Across the hospital, 39 patients and 28 members of staff have now tested positive.
Cwmtawe have released a press statement that one of their year 11 students have contacted it.
There were 28 and 30 cases in Clydach and Mawr and Pontardawe areas. |
Eh? | | | |
| Pubs on 09:46 - Oct 21 with 550 views | felixstowe_jack |
Can anyone tell me the science for the lockdown in Ceridigeon and Pembrokeshire? Ceridigeon has the second lowest infection rate in the UK after Scilly Isles and pembrokeshire is in the lowest 20 areas in the UK.
Why is Drakeford punishing these two areas? | |
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| Pubs on 09:54 - Oct 21 with 548 views | Scotia |
| Pubs on 09:46 - Oct 21 by felixstowe_jack |
Can anyone tell me the science for the lockdown in Ceridigeon and Pembrokeshire? Ceridigeon has the second lowest infection rate in the UK after Scilly Isles and pembrokeshire is in the lowest 20 areas in the UK.
Why is Drakeford punishing these two areas? |
They've got small hospitals apparently. | | | |
| Pubs on 10:05 - Oct 21 with 546 views | exhmrc1 |
| Pubs on 07:22 - Oct 21 by Scotia |
Eh? |
The fact that is spreading more than just students can be seen in the number of schools closing years. Cwmtawe yesterday. Maesydderwen a couple of weeks ago. Places like Bishopston and Olchfa in Swansea. The figures for the Swansea Valley areas are last 3 weeks including the jump in the 3rd week in September which wasn't down to students. Morriston Hospital's statement shows the effect it is having there.
As far as students are concerned it mainly influences the figures in Swansea, Neath Port Talbot, Cardiff, Rhondda Cynon Taff, Ceredigion and Gwynedd which house the university campuses in Wales. Places like Blaenau Gwent, Conwy and Denbighshire are largely unaffected by this. Cardiff has over 40,000 students, RCT and Swansea over 20,000. The other universities are much smaller. | | | |
| Pubs on 10:23 - Oct 21 with 538 views | Catullus |
| Pubs on 14:48 - Oct 20 by Scotia |
If the economy collapses who pays for the NHS? |
Taking it further, if the economy collapses and tax reciepts go down the Swanee, who pays back what they've already borrowed.
It's a no win situation which is why getting the balance right between opening up and keeping case down is so important.
All the jobs lost means an increase in welfare payments too. The economy will bounce back but the worse it gets the longer it takes.
We need to have a long term plan and not see saw back and forth. A plan that allows as many businesses as viable to stay open but will still enforce distancing, masks, hand washing, self isolation and will heavily punish any who don't comply. | |
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| Pubs on 10:30 - Oct 21 with 534 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Pubs on 10:23 - Oct 21 by Catullus |
Taking it further, if the economy collapses and tax reciepts go down the Swanee, who pays back what they've already borrowed.
It's a no win situation which is why getting the balance right between opening up and keeping case down is so important.
All the jobs lost means an increase in welfare payments too. The economy will bounce back but the worse it gets the longer it takes.
We need to have a long term plan and not see saw back and forth. A plan that allows as many businesses as viable to stay open but will still enforce distancing, masks, hand washing, self isolation and will heavily punish any who don't comply. |
Well, don't expect anything like that from any UK MPs, they seem incapable of sensible long term planning.
But they are very good at stupid money wasting long term planning and knee jerk reactions. | | | |
| Pubs on 10:36 - Oct 21 with 533 views | onehunglow |
Maybe we should have woken up to the fact this virus is not like anything other.
We have Piers Corbyn saying we are safe,mask wearing isnt necessary ,distancing too. People -some-support this theory.
We are where we are because of this refusal to accept our lives ,as we knew them ,are over.
This is the result of complacency and selfishness along with rank herd stupidity.
And Pubs are seen as "important". That itself shows what a mess we are in. | |
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| Pubs on 10:44 - Oct 21 with 532 views | Catullus |
| Pubs on 10:36 - Oct 21 by onehunglow |
Maybe we should have woken up to the fact this virus is not like anything other.
We have Piers Corbyn saying we are safe,mask wearing isnt necessary ,distancing too. People -some-support this theory.
We are where we are because of this refusal to accept our lives ,as we knew them ,are over.
This is the result of complacency and selfishness along with rank herd stupidity.
And Pubs are seen as "important". That itself shows what a mess we are in. |
"Herd stupidity"  That is my new favourite phrase, never a truer word spoken/written/posted.
Herd immunity hasn't happened but herd stupidity happened a long while back. | |
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