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That result is two fingers up to some on here on 11:33 - Aug 22 by Chief
A lot of bluster, little substance, I'll give you the opportunity again:
What am I incorrect about?
You have about as much chance of getting an answer to that, as he has of getting one of his transfer fantasies correct.
People backed the manager to make some pragmatic changes to the system, he and the players did so, and it worked.
Massive thumbs up to those who backed the manager to do that. I guess the two fingers go up to those who told us it was full blown tiki taka or nothing and didn't think he could deliver a smart gameplan. They were wrong.
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 11:36 - Aug 22 by magicdaps10
Been banned though have you not, grown man banned from a forum 🤣🤣🤣
You have enough about you to be banned from a forum, tells people enough.... Grown man aswell.
😂
Yeah I got banned when I questioned the Trust when, unsurprisingly, the site was ran by those at the Trust. Chad along with others suffered the same fate.
The same views I hold today and have continued to state.... because I am a grown man and don't change my views because someone tries to silence me or, in some laughable cases, threaten me.
That's what grown men do you see, not troll football fans on a forum. How is that working out for you anyway?
Swansea Independent Poster of the Year 2021 and 2022.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 11:42 - Aug 22 by Dr_Parnassus
Yeah I got banned when I questioned the Trust when, unsurprisingly, the site was ran by those at the Trust. Chad along with others suffered the same fate.
The same views I hold today and have continued to state.... because I am a grown man and don't change my views because someone tries to silence me or, in some laughable cases, threaten me.
That's what grown men do you see, not troll football fans on a forum. How is that working out for you anyway?
Being banned is a trophy for some,an irrelevance for most. I was banned for obvious reasons.
We really do have to move forward ;some have not. Old usernames still called all sorts of filth .
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 11:48 - Aug 22 by Chief
This thread isn't about past bans or usernames or posts. This is just deflection.
Unfortunately the OP is seemingly incapable of substantiating their claims.
Chief, Chief, Chief.
This post was liked by 7 people plus myself, indicates that those people knew what the original post was about 😠I would invite anyone to just click on the likes and see who liked it and those who down arrowed AND that would give any sane person a clear indication on Wether this post had substance or not 🤫
As you bang on about with proof, if no one liked that post then it would be a clear indication that my original post was wrong and mis informed 🤔
So as I say and I have nothing to prove by answering your questions or backing it up.... Enough likes suggest that what I posted was correct.
Since your - 1 post, notice a few more have clicked on to push it +3 in liking my post to the rest of you.... In football terms I would be walking away with the 3 points and a +3 goal total.
Remember, atleast 8 people seen the posts that I refer to in my original post to go out of their way to up arrow the original post.... Either you don't have the memory to recall the posts, incapable of finding them or chose to pretend they don't exist but as I say... Let the arrows and names on the post open your eyes.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 16:50 - Aug 22 by magicdaps10
Chief, Chief, Chief.
This post was liked by 7 people plus myself, indicates that those people knew what the original post was about 😠I would invite anyone to just click on the likes and see who liked it and those who down arrowed AND that would give any sane person a clear indication on Wether this post had substance or not 🤫
As you bang on about with proof, if no one liked that post then it would be a clear indication that my original post was wrong and mis informed 🤔
So as I say and I have nothing to prove by answering your questions or backing it up.... Enough likes suggest that what I posted was correct.
Since your - 1 post, notice a few more have clicked on to push it +3 in liking my post to the rest of you.... In football terms I would be walking away with the 3 points and a +3 goal total.
Remember, atleast 8 people seen the posts that I refer to in my original post to go out of their way to up arrow the original post.... Either you don't have the memory to recall the posts, incapable of finding them or chose to pretend they don't exist but as I say... Let the arrows and names on the post open your eyes.
This thread is right up there, in being absolutely bonkers, it’s reaching legend status, crack on guys, been some fabulous bonkers threads on this forum in its various guises and lm adding this to the list🤣🤣🤣
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 18:11 - Aug 22 by max936
This thread is right up there, in being absolutely bonkers, it’s reaching legend status, crack on guys, been some fabulous bonkers threads on this forum in its various guises and lm adding this to the list🤣🤣🤣
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 16:50 - Aug 22 by magicdaps10
Chief, Chief, Chief.
This post was liked by 7 people plus myself, indicates that those people knew what the original post was about 😠I would invite anyone to just click on the likes and see who liked it and those who down arrowed AND that would give any sane person a clear indication on Wether this post had substance or not 🤫
As you bang on about with proof, if no one liked that post then it would be a clear indication that my original post was wrong and mis informed 🤔
So as I say and I have nothing to prove by answering your questions or backing it up.... Enough likes suggest that what I posted was correct.
Since your - 1 post, notice a few more have clicked on to push it +3 in liking my post to the rest of you.... In football terms I would be walking away with the 3 points and a +3 goal total.
Remember, atleast 8 people seen the posts that I refer to in my original post to go out of their way to up arrow the original post.... Either you don't have the memory to recall the posts, incapable of finding them or chose to pretend they don't exist but as I say... Let the arrows and names on the post open your eyes.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 21:56 - Aug 20 by Chief
Well it's actually vindication to some like myself who wanted us to be a bit more pragmatic and not every pass had to be 6yrds all or nothing. We went long several times, mixed it up, we time wasted, we picked up cheap fouls.....
While also playing nice football.
However Bristol city were poor (although they could have easily scored 4). It was as if they hadn't bothered watching us& decided not to press much.
Tremendous 3 points especially with that makeshift defence.
A bit of reality and primer on Martin’s system, Chief, his tactical principles are built around possession and pressing, but that doesn’t mean he is wedded to a set number for possession percentage or that he will employ a high press all match, every match.
As a good manager, he is able to respond to the situation at hand and build his individual gameplan around what is in front of him. The performance against Bristol City was nearly identical as against Stoke, but they are a much better team and are set up to counter more. Bristol are a club that likes to play football, we were playing away without much of our preferred XI and, more than anything, our backline was a makeshift one that has maybe had one training session together, if any.
As a Guardiola acolyte, Martin has core tactical principles but is not rigid to the point of naivety and he will adjust accordingly. In other words, he knows when he needs to “mix it up” and when to dominate the ball. This did not begin with this match, this has been the case his whole career in management. His first season at MK Dons his team averaged only 58% possession and had five matches with 54% possession or less in his 20 games in charge. That’s one-fifth of the total matches with similar gameplans as we saw yesterday.
Last season, his first full season as manager, after actually having a pre-season and time to ingrain his system into his players, his teams began to dominate the ball more and reflect more of what we will begin to see as the season progresses. Even then, he still had six matches with less than 54% possession, including a game against Sunderland where the Dons only managed 36% possession. There are other clubs who like to keep the ball too, and there’s only one in the game.
Specifically, if you watch MK Dons under Martin, you will see the long balls over the top and the switching of play out wide to the wing-backs frequently. Those are fundamental aspects of the way his teams play, just as creating overloads and numerical superiority are, and that did not begin with this match. The key is that within his system, those are done at clear points throughout the match, such as after quick one-touch exchanges between the backline, midfield playmaker and opposite side wing-back. Positioning the wing-back who receives the ball high and hugging the touchline so that they can bring it down and advance the ball into dangerous areas at pace is just one vital component of Martin’s system.
We saw that more this game because of a few different reasons, namely having Laird pushed into the starting XI a little earlier than expected because of so many other defenders absent. As I said before we signed him, Laird added a new dimension to our play that has been missing in recent years. Naughton can’t get up and down quickly enough for that role and Latibeaudiere, while energentic, doesn’t have the skills on the ball to make it work.
But facts are, Martin didn’t just “realise the big picture”, he’s a quality professional football manager. This is his job and this is what he does. Sit back and enjoy the football on hand this year, it’ll be a lot better than the last two.
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That result is two fingers up to some on here on 18:58 - Aug 22 with 515 views
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 21:44 - Aug 20 by Dr_Winston
You're assuming that they care.
If the board is anti-Cooper, then they're pro-Cooper. If the board is pro-Martin, then they're anti-Martin. If the board says the sky is blue, they'll argue that it's grey. Whatever gets them off.
Precisely, Doc.
Some people like to argue black is white, night is day, up is down. Some people like to argue anything to appear right, some people are angry with their mundane existence in life. Often, those are the same people.
Personally, I would advise anyone who spends their time arguing endless pages on endless threads on a football forum just to appear right they should spend more time with their family and friends in real life. As my father once told me, “Son, time is of the essence, so don’t waste it on bullsh!t.” Or, as my wife says, “No hables mierda.”
Along those same lines, as Mino Raiola said recently: “My father said to me when I was a small boy that 50 percent of the people in your life will love you and 50 percent will hate you. So I am not here to be loved and liked by everybody. I am here to be loved by my family and by my players. And the rest, I don’t give a sh!t.”
1
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 18:59 - Aug 22 with 513 views
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 18:53 - Aug 22 by Rock
A bit of reality and primer on Martin’s system, Chief, his tactical principles are built around possession and pressing, but that doesn’t mean he is wedded to a set number for possession percentage or that he will employ a high press all match, every match.
As a good manager, he is able to respond to the situation at hand and build his individual gameplan around what is in front of him. The performance against Bristol City was nearly identical as against Stoke, but they are a much better team and are set up to counter more. Bristol are a club that likes to play football, we were playing away without much of our preferred XI and, more than anything, our backline was a makeshift one that has maybe had one training session together, if any.
As a Guardiola acolyte, Martin has core tactical principles but is not rigid to the point of naivety and he will adjust accordingly. In other words, he knows when he needs to “mix it up” and when to dominate the ball. This did not begin with this match, this has been the case his whole career in management. His first season at MK Dons his team averaged only 58% possession and had five matches with 54% possession or less in his 20 games in charge. That’s one-fifth of the total matches with similar gameplans as we saw yesterday.
Last season, his first full season as manager, after actually having a pre-season and time to ingrain his system into his players, his teams began to dominate the ball more and reflect more of what we will begin to see as the season progresses. Even then, he still had six matches with less than 54% possession, including a game against Sunderland where the Dons only managed 36% possession. There are other clubs who like to keep the ball too, and there’s only one in the game.
Specifically, if you watch MK Dons under Martin, you will see the long balls over the top and the switching of play out wide to the wing-backs frequently. Those are fundamental aspects of the way his teams play, just as creating overloads and numerical superiority are, and that did not begin with this match. The key is that within his system, those are done at clear points throughout the match, such as after quick one-touch exchanges between the backline, midfield playmaker and opposite side wing-back. Positioning the wing-back who receives the ball high and hugging the touchline so that they can bring it down and advance the ball into dangerous areas at pace is just one vital component of Martin’s system.
We saw that more this game because of a few different reasons, namely having Laird pushed into the starting XI a little earlier than expected because of so many other defenders absent. As I said before we signed him, Laird added a new dimension to our play that has been missing in recent years. Naughton can’t get up and down quickly enough for that role and Latibeaudiere, while energentic, doesn’t have the skills on the ball to make it work.
But facts are, Martin didn’t just “realise the big picture”, he’s a quality professional football manager. This is his job and this is what he does. Sit back and enjoy the football on hand this year, it’ll be a lot better than the last two.
Well I'll have to disagree to some extent.
I've seen many mk Dons fans stating that there is no plan b with Martin. It's the total football death by passing or nothing.
And your well constructed post is also contradicted by Martin himself who has stated that the players took upon themselves to go more direct&take less risks at the back in this game (virtually against his orders) and were overall more pragmatic. This is also backed up by the heat maps and possession stats in this game compared to the previous ones.
But I accept your point that Stoke were a better team than Bristol C by some margin, we'll see how it pans out in future games, but from my own viewpoint I hope Martin doesn't reprimand his players too much because I think they took the correct course of action.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 11:09 - Aug 21 by Chief
Well I wouldn't say this was that. Because Martin's basically saying the players went against his wishes, but it produced a better result and overall performance than what we've had in other games.
It could develop into a development throughout experience if Martin doesn't go back to his initial plan and we stick to and build on what we did last night though!
Football is subjective, Chief. Your best performance is not mine or others, it is yours. There have been many positives to take from each game, and there are extenuating circumstances behind each of those.
For example, having Laird, Piröe and Paterson available and fit from the start for the first time together made us look a lot more threatening against Bristol, and Piröe has the quality to tuck away chances that have gone wanting in previous games. Much of that is down to Lowe and I don’t recall many, including yourself, advocating for our 14-goal scorer to be dropped. After all, he was one of the biggest influences behind all of our ‘success’ last season under Cooper, no?
As for Paterson, I do distinctly recall you as one of the few to criticise his signing, saying that he wasn’t “first team starter quality” and that you would “rather persist with Garrick etc.” Paterson was definitely a Martin-approved signing who he immediately slotted into his XI, and has been the only player capable of opening the defence up with a killer pass or dribble in the final third so far. Piröe and Laird can do that as we saw, but they have not been ready before this weekend. Having Walsh back and fit will really be the game-changer here, though.
The fact we got a win away to Bristol while having slightly less of the ball doesn’t make it different than the previous games, however, and certainly doesn’t “vindicate” anyone for previously and unjustly criticising our manager, while pining away for our predecessor as you and others have. If you look at the underlying data you will clearly see that it was a continuation of the previous games and Martin was right to be slightly upset with how cheaply we gave away possession towards the end of the match, as it nearly cost us the win. More cojones and patience going forward would’ve resulted in another goal for us and Lowe, in particular, squandered some good play in dangerous positions.
Facts are the only person deserving of any vindication is Martin, and I know he is not the kind of guy to go looking for it or have any desire or need for it. As previously said, sit back and enjoy the football this year, it will be much better than the last two.
0
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:23 - Aug 22 with 481 views
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:06 - Aug 21 by AndyCole
.
Comically childish, divisive thread. What type of person (and subsequent divisive persons) choose to create and post on such a thread immediately after a cleverly pragmatic, hard worked win ?
Martin has shown he can bounce back after poor, schoolboy mistakes and play a progressive blend of practical, stoic defence along with proper players in proper positions further forward. Ain't rocket science is it.
And it ain't a million miles from where his predecessor ended up resorting. With the crucial difference of a proper CF and Patterson.
Not having players that aren't good enough - Cabango and Dhanda was step 1, as pointed out by the more astute. The back 3 was far more suited to Martinball, and did so in a sensible way.
Let's hope Martin now gets the final pieces of his jigsaw to kick on. Something his predecessor was denied. .
.
Cooper got everything he wanted and more, Andrew. In his own words. It’s a shame he picked the wrong players, but he definitely got the ones he asked for.
Cooper on Jordan Morris -
"Jordan's similar to Jamal's profile. We are playing with wide strikers at the moment who are threatening the backline from different angles and Jordan can do that.
"I know he does that, albeit in a slightly different formation, for the US national team. We are going to be asking him to do something similar to that."
Cooper on Conor Hourihane -
“They wouldn’t be in the reckoning if they weren’t the right footballer. It’s doubly important to bring in the right characters. It’s not just good players, it’s the right players. Conor Hourihane, everyone knows he’s a really good player but he’s the right person to bring in, he’s the right character.”
Cooper on strikers -
“I think any of the boys not in the starting line-up or not in the squad, they are always fighting,” said Cooper.
“It’s the same for the boys in the team and the squad, they are fighting to stay in there.
“It’s not just in the forward positions, where we have signed Jordan, we have a number of good players that, if they are not starting in one game, are more than capable of starting and being involved in the next one.
"You just look at the weekend with Wayne Routledge and Liam Cullen played, and we also have Andre (Ayew) and Jamal (Lowe) in addition to Jordan.
“We have options, and I think that is healthy, especially with this schedule as you are probably going to need more than the normal-sized core of players.
“The more strength in depth we can have the better, competition for places is a good thing and we feel we have that in a number of positions.”
0
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:39 - Aug 22 with 467 views
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 18:42 - Aug 22 by Chief
But you still can't tell me how I'm wrong?
Chief, not a case of proving anything to you.... The numbers are up on the arrows so plenty know the score to the OP.
You jumped on the thread so it's more a case for you to prove I am wrong rather than myself to prove it to you....... I refer you to the OP and the up arrows who were understanding of the post that started this thread.
To ask for my answer proves nothing, you want the answers because you can't remember or are unable to find what you request to see or want to see it.
To ask for the answers just proves your ignorance to the OP that enough people could grasp and up arrowed or in turn it just points to your stubborn persona.
As I say, you jumped on the thread so it's down to you to prove that I am incorrect AND not for me to answer to you because you claim that I am wrong BUT yet you don't even know the posts/posters the original post relates to......you are just assuming!
Now up to 9 up arrows plus myself.... 10 people who now are on board with the OP.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:11 - Aug 22 by Rock
Football is subjective, Chief. Your best performance is not mine or others, it is yours. There have been many positives to take from each game, and there are extenuating circumstances behind each of those.
For example, having Laird, Piröe and Paterson available and fit from the start for the first time together made us look a lot more threatening against Bristol, and Piröe has the quality to tuck away chances that have gone wanting in previous games. Much of that is down to Lowe and I don’t recall many, including yourself, advocating for our 14-goal scorer to be dropped. After all, he was one of the biggest influences behind all of our ‘success’ last season under Cooper, no?
As for Paterson, I do distinctly recall you as one of the few to criticise his signing, saying that he wasn’t “first team starter quality” and that you would “rather persist with Garrick etc.” Paterson was definitely a Martin-approved signing who he immediately slotted into his XI, and has been the only player capable of opening the defence up with a killer pass or dribble in the final third so far. Piröe and Laird can do that as we saw, but they have not been ready before this weekend. Having Walsh back and fit will really be the game-changer here, though.
The fact we got a win away to Bristol while having slightly less of the ball doesn’t make it different than the previous games, however, and certainly doesn’t “vindicate” anyone for previously and unjustly criticising our manager, while pining away for our predecessor as you and others have. If you look at the underlying data you will clearly see that it was a continuation of the previous games and Martin was right to be slightly upset with how cheaply we gave away possession towards the end of the match, as it nearly cost us the win. More cojones and patience going forward would’ve resulted in another goal for us and Lowe, in particular, squandered some good play in dangerous positions.
Facts are the only person deserving of any vindication is Martin, and I know he is not the kind of guy to go looking for it or have any desire or need for it. As previously said, sit back and enjoy the football this year, it will be much better than the last two.
Yes agreed, many negatives too also
Well yes, however as far as we are aware Piroe was also available for selection v blackburn, but wasn't chosen by Martin. Well I'm not Lowe's biggest fan, but given the choice I wouldn't play him anywhere other than out wide, but considering he scored as many as he did last season I don't think including him is worthy of criticism considering the alternatives, although in hindsight Piroe v blackburn would have been great.
Yea Paterson's done ok. Certainly preferable to Dhanda. It was reported on here that he was more of a nice to have opportunity that arose rather a specific Martin choice, but he's picked him so far play, he's impressed me. However, do you honestly think he's the answer for our attacking midfield berth going forward? Surely he's a decent depth adder cheap stop gap until we can bring a more pacy and dynamic player?
Got to disagree with your last two paragraphs entirely. Cooper's gone. There's no point harking back to him. I merely said that I wished we were more solid at the back and were able to take less risks. Martin himself alluded to the fact that thats exactly what we did as a team in this game (widely accepted on here, pundits, Martin himself). So why wouldn't people who suggested that prior to this game feel vindicated? And as I've stated several times, I thoroughly enjoyed the game Friday. Thought the balance was just right& while we had some hairy moments, that's understandable with the injuries& unfamiliarity. So I'm fully behind Martin, he's showing me he's learning already.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:23 - Aug 22 by Rock
Cooper got everything he wanted and more, Andrew. In his own words. It’s a shame he picked the wrong players, but he definitely got the ones he asked for.
Cooper on Jordan Morris -
"Jordan's similar to Jamal's profile. We are playing with wide strikers at the moment who are threatening the backline from different angles and Jordan can do that.
"I know he does that, albeit in a slightly different formation, for the US national team. We are going to be asking him to do something similar to that."
Cooper on Conor Hourihane -
“They wouldn’t be in the reckoning if they weren’t the right footballer. It’s doubly important to bring in the right characters. It’s not just good players, it’s the right players. Conor Hourihane, everyone knows he’s a really good player but he’s the right person to bring in, he’s the right character.”
Cooper on strikers -
“I think any of the boys not in the starting line-up or not in the squad, they are always fighting,” said Cooper.
“It’s the same for the boys in the team and the squad, they are fighting to stay in there.
“It’s not just in the forward positions, where we have signed Jordan, we have a number of good players that, if they are not starting in one game, are more than capable of starting and being involved in the next one.
"You just look at the weekend with Wayne Routledge and Liam Cullen played, and we also have Andre (Ayew) and Jamal (Lowe) in addition to Jordan.
“We have options, and I think that is healthy, especially with this schedule as you are probably going to need more than the normal-sized core of players.
“The more strength in depth we can have the better, competition for places is a good thing and we feel we have that in a number of positions.”
I will stand by this statement.
To have selected Hourihane as he did shames out club and every player we have ever had that sweat for the club. A disgusting excuse for a pro who has been outed.Hence his anonymity of late.
A player fully allowing and expecting his team mates to do basic hard work for him whilst picking up far more money for doing so.
Cooper did this and whatever good he might have done,hi selction of Hoolie damns him utterly.
My opinion and no animal were injured in the making of this post
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:39 - Aug 22 by magicdaps10
Chief, not a case of proving anything to you.... The numbers are up on the arrows so plenty know the score to the OP.
You jumped on the thread so it's more a case for you to prove I am wrong rather than myself to prove it to you....... I refer you to the OP and the up arrows who were understanding of the post that started this thread.
To ask for my answer proves nothing, you want the answers because you can't remember or are unable to find what you request to see or want to see it.
To ask for the answers just proves your ignorance to the OP that enough people could grasp and up arrowed or in turn it just points to your stubborn persona.
As I say, you jumped on the thread so it's down to you to prove that I am incorrect AND not for me to answer to you because you claim that I am wrong BUT yet you don't even know the posts/posters the original post relates to......you are just assuming!
Now up to 9 up arrows plus myself.... 10 people who now are on board with the OP.
10!!
I've stated very clearly why your thread is poor. You even agreed with what I said. Then strangely later said you disagreed.
Then later you explicitly stated I was 'wrong'.
Leave numbers/ arrows/ other posters being banned previously aside.
You still cannot tell me how I'm actually wrong can you? You said I was yourself, so why aren't you able to say how?
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:23 - Aug 22 by Rock
Cooper got everything he wanted and more, Andrew. In his own words. It’s a shame he picked the wrong players, but he definitely got the ones he asked for.
Cooper on Jordan Morris -
"Jordan's similar to Jamal's profile. We are playing with wide strikers at the moment who are threatening the backline from different angles and Jordan can do that.
"I know he does that, albeit in a slightly different formation, for the US national team. We are going to be asking him to do something similar to that."
Cooper on Conor Hourihane -
“They wouldn’t be in the reckoning if they weren’t the right footballer. It’s doubly important to bring in the right characters. It’s not just good players, it’s the right players. Conor Hourihane, everyone knows he’s a really good player but he’s the right person to bring in, he’s the right character.”
Cooper on strikers -
“I think any of the boys not in the starting line-up or not in the squad, they are always fighting,” said Cooper.
“It’s the same for the boys in the team and the squad, they are fighting to stay in there.
“It’s not just in the forward positions, where we have signed Jordan, we have a number of good players that, if they are not starting in one game, are more than capable of starting and being involved in the next one.
"You just look at the weekend with Wayne Routledge and Liam Cullen played, and we also have Andre (Ayew) and Jamal (Lowe) in addition to Jordan.
“We have options, and I think that is healthy, especially with this schedule as you are probably going to need more than the normal-sized core of players.
“The more strength in depth we can have the better, competition for places is a good thing and we feel we have that in a number of positions.”
Being fair on this one, those quotes were for the press rather than what was being said behind closed doors.
Issue with Cooper since January is that Cooper wanted more than what the board were able or willing to pay..... Coopers objectives have always been his profile, how things will effect him and ultimately jumped whilst at the top of the wave in his Swansea career. We must not fail to remember he walked with 12 months of his contract remaining and he done that because that wave was ultimately going to be coming back down with certain players leaving coupled with finances dropping and in doing so was not willing to back his abilities under harder circumstances.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 19:47 - Aug 22 by Chief
Yes agreed, many negatives too also
Well yes, however as far as we are aware Piroe was also available for selection v blackburn, but wasn't chosen by Martin. Well I'm not Lowe's biggest fan, but given the choice I wouldn't play him anywhere other than out wide, but considering he scored as many as he did last season I don't think including him is worthy of criticism considering the alternatives, although in hindsight Piroe v blackburn would have been great.
Yea Paterson's done ok. Certainly preferable to Dhanda. It was reported on here that he was more of a nice to have opportunity that arose rather a specific Martin choice, but he's picked him so far play, he's impressed me. However, do you honestly think he's the answer for our attacking midfield berth going forward? Surely he's a decent depth adder cheap stop gap until we can bring a more pacy and dynamic player?
Got to disagree with your last two paragraphs entirely. Cooper's gone. There's no point harking back to him. I merely said that I wished we were more solid at the back and were able to take less risks. Martin himself alluded to the fact that thats exactly what we did as a team in this game (widely accepted on here, pundits, Martin himself). So why wouldn't people who suggested that prior to this game feel vindicated? And as I've stated several times, I thoroughly enjoyed the game Friday. Thought the balance was just right& while we had some hairy moments, that's understandable with the injuries& unfamiliarity. So I'm fully behind Martin, he's showing me he's learning already.
As explained on another thread in detail, Martin chose the bedding-in route with Piröe and it has absolutely been the right call so far. He deserves vindication there, gutsy call, and him and Piröe looked the best of friends when he was taken off after working his cojones off against Bristol. His fitness is still not yet fully up to it, but he is getting there and we are already reaping the rewards for the route Martin has taken with him. 3 goals in 4 games says it all really, and the fact he has been able to slowly work himself into shape, acclimate to English football gradually and get his confidence up working against some tired legs is a masterclass in man-management. Phenomenal talent, but he needed time and patience and Martin has given him that. Piröe clearly wants to impress, and Martin deserves a lot of credit for that.
As for Paterson, he has been the brightest spark that we have had in the final third so far, and that is down to not having players fit and available, and a transition in the playing squad that is a result of Cooper’s loan boys leaving us high and dry after two seasons. The cupboard is a bit bare in attack directly because of the players Cooper chose to bring in on loan. Martin has had scraps to work with so far in comparison with his predecessor and has still had us looking a proper footballing team. Paterson has been key to that, he is a very good player to have in our squad for this division. If we bring in a dynamite No 10 like Callum O’Hare, I’d have him rotate in when necessary, but if not he is well deserving of a place in our XI, as evidence shows.
As for the gameplan you can check the other thread where I explained in detail. Simply, the players played to Martin’s gameplan and got a goal and lead, then continued to stick to the gameplan until nerves and anxiety crept in and they began to clear it a bit more and lose possession. Having cojones and sticking to the script a bit more would have more than likely led to another goal, as Bristol were there for the taking, and that is what Martin was referring to after the game. The players did not create their own gameplan with a different style that won us the match, as you are alluding to.
Martin is where he is because of many reasons, but mostly he is an intelligent manager with an excellent system and tactical ideas. True up-and-comer in the game and we are lucky to have him, especially after your man Cooper left us when the going got too tough for him. John Eustace, of all people, turned us down. Be glad we have a bright young manager who is taking up places, and try and cut out the constant “second-guessing” every little decision that doesn’t go his or your way. Good football on hand this season, try and enjoy that.
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That result is two fingers up to some on here on 23:58 - Aug 22 with 381 views
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 23:41 - Aug 22 by Rock
As explained on another thread in detail, Martin chose the bedding-in route with Piröe and it has absolutely been the right call so far. He deserves vindication there, gutsy call, and him and Piröe looked the best of friends when he was taken off after working his cojones off against Bristol. His fitness is still not yet fully up to it, but he is getting there and we are already reaping the rewards for the route Martin has taken with him. 3 goals in 4 games says it all really, and the fact he has been able to slowly work himself into shape, acclimate to English football gradually and get his confidence up working against some tired legs is a masterclass in man-management. Phenomenal talent, but he needed time and patience and Martin has given him that. Piröe clearly wants to impress, and Martin deserves a lot of credit for that.
As for Paterson, he has been the brightest spark that we have had in the final third so far, and that is down to not having players fit and available, and a transition in the playing squad that is a result of Cooper’s loan boys leaving us high and dry after two seasons. The cupboard is a bit bare in attack directly because of the players Cooper chose to bring in on loan. Martin has had scraps to work with so far in comparison with his predecessor and has still had us looking a proper footballing team. Paterson has been key to that, he is a very good player to have in our squad for this division. If we bring in a dynamite No 10 like Callum O’Hare, I’d have him rotate in when necessary, but if not he is well deserving of a place in our XI, as evidence shows.
As for the gameplan you can check the other thread where I explained in detail. Simply, the players played to Martin’s gameplan and got a goal and lead, then continued to stick to the gameplan until nerves and anxiety crept in and they began to clear it a bit more and lose possession. Having cojones and sticking to the script a bit more would have more than likely led to another goal, as Bristol were there for the taking, and that is what Martin was referring to after the game. The players did not create their own gameplan with a different style that won us the match, as you are alluding to.
Martin is where he is because of many reasons, but mostly he is an intelligent manager with an excellent system and tactical ideas. True up-and-comer in the game and we are lucky to have him, especially after your man Cooper left us when the going got too tough for him. John Eustace, of all people, turned us down. Be glad we have a bright young manager who is taking up places, and try and cut out the constant “second-guessing” every little decision that doesn’t go his or your way. Good football on hand this season, try and enjoy that.
Has it been right? Had he played at Ewood who's to say he wouldn't have had an impact? He played a few days later in the cup so did he really need that 'bedding in period'. It was so short it was pointless. But credit to Martin for realising his mistake. I'd say it was also a mistake not to start him v Stoke too.
Well you have to say that's not just Cooper's policy, that was a club policy to rely on loans. Winter himself alluded to that. Morris, Arriola, Hourihane... All players that can play in attacking roles, do you think they were Cooper loans?
Yes as I said, Patterson is proving to be a decent stop gap until we get some real ambitious reinforcements in the attacking midfield role in. A point you seem to agree with.
Yes, so the players decided to deviate from Martin's style and contributed to us winning the game. You state it like we in are in dispute over that assesment for some reason. Well I'm not going to try and predict we'd have scored more if we'd played the way Martin would have wanted to. The second half we looked pretty tired, so I think the players did exactly the right thing. We got 3 points with a makeshift side - there's no need to hypothetically recreate the match. Be happy with the outcome.
'my man' Cooper. You seem to mention him more than I do by the way. But he was paid off remember....
Ironic that - you yourself have second guessed what would have happened had the players gone with Martin's wishes.
Sorry to disappoint you, but this is a football forum. I'm not one for blind faith, I'll give credit where it's warranted, I'll also criticise constructively where it's appropriate too.
That result is two fingers up to some on here on 23:58 - Aug 22 by Chief
Has it been right? Had he played at Ewood who's to say he wouldn't have had an impact? He played a few days later in the cup so did he really need that 'bedding in period'. It was so short it was pointless. But credit to Martin for realising his mistake. I'd say it was also a mistake not to start him v Stoke too.
Well you have to say that's not just Cooper's policy, that was a club policy to rely on loans. Winter himself alluded to that. Morris, Arriola, Hourihane... All players that can play in attacking roles, do you think they were Cooper loans?
Yes as I said, Patterson is proving to be a decent stop gap until we get some real ambitious reinforcements in the attacking midfield role in. A point you seem to agree with.
Yes, so the players decided to deviate from Martin's style and contributed to us winning the game. You state it like we in are in dispute over that assesment for some reason. Well I'm not going to try and predict we'd have scored more if we'd played the way Martin would have wanted to. The second half we looked pretty tired, so I think the players did exactly the right thing. We got 3 points with a makeshift side - there's no need to hypothetically recreate the match. Be happy with the outcome.
'my man' Cooper. You seem to mention him more than I do by the way. But he was paid off remember....
Ironic that - you yourself have second guessed what would have happened had the players gone with Martin's wishes.
Sorry to disappoint you, but this is a football forum. I'm not one for blind faith, I'll give credit where it's warranted, I'll also criticise constructively where it's appropriate too.
[Post edited 23 Aug 2021 0:09]
Not going to go back and forth all night, Chief, I would imagine you are intelligent enough to understand what I am saying.
But I’ll make it as clear as I can. The bedding-in period wasn’t one game it has been the whole start to the season. Throwing Piröe into the fire against Blackburn would not have been a good decision, much better to start him against “Reading’s youth team” like you say. He got a goal and played very well, and his confidence has risen as he has been able to come on slowly and get accustomed to English football, and get his match fitness up.
There was no mistake there, we lost against Blackburn and that happens. Cullen played well and nearly got us into the lead after 15 minutes but for a smart save by Kaminski. The tactics were good, we came up against a better team that has several years playing together under a good manager. Not starting Piröe against Stoke was a mistake, and Martin quickly identified that and rectified it. I don’t think that cost us the match, Stoke were and are currently the better team and we lost on set pieces.
As for the loans, as Cooper himself stated Morris and Hourihane were absolutely supported by him, he was very happy to get them in. Contrast his quotes with what he said about Arriola and that is very clear. Recruitment in modern football doesn’t come down to just one person, no, but Cooper was very happy to have them. More than anything, Cooper wanted to play with his u17 boys and win now over everything else, an unsustainable strategy for our club that has clearly backfired for us after not achieving promotion. He then walked away when the going got too tough and he failed to get his big move, leaving us in a mess that Martin has thankfully put in the right direction.
As for Martin’s tactics I have stated reality. You can disagree with what I have said and that’s fine with me. One man’s trash is another man’s treasure. I want us to dominate the ball more, work triangles, one-twos, create overloads and exploit pockets of space in the middle and final third. If you want clearances and low blocks, that’s your prerogative. You are not going to enjoy the rest of the season, then, as Martin’s system is built around these. I would suggest criticising more constructively going forward, less criticising our manager and club just for the sake of it as you have been, like with Paterson and Piröe.
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