| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables 01:23 - Aug 30 with 1177 views | Dr_Parnassus |
- We are rock bottom of the league in shots attempted.
- We are third from bottom of the league in shots conceded… 67 in 5 games.
- This despite being second in the league for most possession.
This shows that playing possession football and playing effective possession football are wildly different. One is something that anyone can do, the other is something only extremely technical sides can do.
Both areas are going to have to see some good improvements from here on in. Creating the least in the league whilst giving up that amount of opportunities every game is not going to end well.
5 more games I think, if there is no improvement then we need to start thinking about adapting and making it more fit for purpose. These trends simply cannot continue for too much longer unchecked and not addressed. |  |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 19:57 - Aug 30 with 982 views | GVJack |
RM has gone on record stating he believes in a brand of football and he thinks this is it. Whether we have the players to carry it out is another matter. I can't see him changing too much tactically, if we keep our head above water away from the relegation zone then this season will be used to give the youngsters some game time and gain experience (particularly at the back 3). Maybe a couple of add ons in January if the right players are available then cut the dead wood next summer and bring in the added quality we need (I we can) giving RM a full summer window and pre season.
If we're really struggling by January something will have to give, either a lot more incomings in the transfer or loan markets or RM will need to pull out a plan b out of the bag. Judging from his interviews to date though I suspect he believes that if plan 'A' doesnt work.... work harder to improve plan 'A' [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 20:15]
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:02 - Aug 30 with 963 views | A_Fans_Dad |
I think those stats pretty much sum up our abilities at the new "tactics".
It has to dramatically improve for us to get anywhere.
A reversal would be great. | | | |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:10 - Aug 30 with 950 views | magicdaps10 |
This where a new defender and striker will come in handy tomorrow and why we are after them. |  |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:12 - Aug 30 with 944 views | Chief |
It's clear to me that a lot of our fans are convincing themselves that what we've played this season so far is entertaining, rather than being organically entertained. |  |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:45 - Aug 30 with 905 views | vetchonian |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:12 - Aug 30 by Chief |
It's clear to me that a lot of our fans are convincing themselves that what we've played this season so far is entertaining, rather than being organically entertained. |
cant you see how radically different the football is?
What worries me is Martin has stated he is a one trick pony with only a plan A......funny how our previous manager was labelled by so many as the same and criticised him for the same yet somehow it is ok for Martin for be one....whilst also producing hapless performances....but then those same persons are happy being entertained....even though some switched off the game on Saturday and sought entertainment elsewhere....but its ok we are only 5 games in | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:59 - Aug 30 with 884 views | builthjack |
As i said when Russ was appointed, it will take 2 or 3 transfer windows to get in the players that he wants. These last few years we have been signing players who are clearly not footballers who can pass and move (properly).
Patience is needed. |  |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:07 - Aug 30 with 873 views | BillyChong |
Not sure how creating such a low amount of chances yet facing that amount of shots from the opposition can be classed as entertaining | | | |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:12 - Aug 30 with 869 views | vetchonian |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:07 - Aug 30 by BillyChong |
Not sure how creating such a low amount of chances yet facing that amount of shots from the opposition can be classed as entertaining |
yes but its not Cooperball so everyone is happy despite the stats indicating we are not better | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:17 - Aug 30 with 864 views | jackrmee |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:59 - Aug 30 by builthjack |
As i said when Russ was appointed, it will take 2 or 3 transfer windows to get in the players that he wants. These last few years we have been signing players who are clearly not footballers who can pass and move (properly).
Patience is needed. |
Amen!
We aren't even through one window yet.
Looks like there will be a lot of movement tomorrow, with a bit of bedding in time. Give the guy a break init. |  |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:23 - Aug 30 with 853 views | jackrmee |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:07 - Aug 30 by BillyChong |
Not sure how creating such a low amount of chances yet facing that amount of shots from the opposition can be classed as entertaining |
Who's been saying it's entertaining? | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:25 - Aug 30 with 851 views | Evs |
Season 2020/21 MK Dons. RM's first full season in charge.
Matches 1-10: W2, D3, L5 - 20th best in League 1.
Matches 11-46: W16, D8, L12 - 7th best in League 1.
Patience is needed. Extrapolating the performances and results of our initial games this season is probably not the best way of predicting our performances and results at the end of the season.
This is particularly relevant, I feel, due to the drastic change in style that RM is attempting to implement.
In response to Chief's comment about being entertained, it's clear to me that a lot of fans accept that there will be pain (though I don't know how long they'll be willing to endure it) in the hope of a much brighter future. My hope is that RM's sticks to his guns resolutely.
Only time will tell. |  | | |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:31 - Aug 30 with 843 views | jackrmee |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:25 - Aug 30 by Evs |
Season 2020/21 MK Dons. RM's first full season in charge.
Matches 1-10: W2, D3, L5 - 20th best in League 1.
Matches 11-46: W16, D8, L12 - 7th best in League 1.
Patience is needed. Extrapolating the performances and results of our initial games this season is probably not the best way of predicting our performances and results at the end of the season.
This is particularly relevant, I feel, due to the drastic change in style that RM is attempting to implement.
In response to Chief's comment about being entertained, it's clear to me that a lot of fans accept that there will be pain (though I don't know how long they'll be willing to endure it) in the hope of a much brighter future. My hope is that RM's sticks to his guns resolutely.
Only time will tell. |
With you 100% mate. | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:50 - Aug 30 with 821 views | onehunglow |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:59 - Aug 30 by builthjack |
As i said when Russ was appointed, it will take 2 or 3 transfer windows to get in the players that he wants. These last few years we have been signing players who are clearly not footballers who can pass and move (properly).
Patience is needed. |
He could bring in players he wants and they prove to be duds.
2/3/4 windows or not.
If he fails,he walks and the club picks up the pieces.
How much "support" did Bobby B get. He might well have said the same as Russy.
Alternate view [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 21:51]
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:57 - Aug 30 with 813 views | magicdaps10 |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:50 - Aug 30 by onehunglow |
He could bring in players he wants and they prove to be duds.
2/3/4 windows or not.
If he fails,he walks and the club picks up the pieces.
How much "support" did Bobby B get. He might well have said the same as Russy.
Alternate view [Post edited 30 Aug 2021 21:51]
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He could bring in his own players and they could click.
Might take 2/3/4 Windows mind.
If he succeeds, bigger club comes in and club picks up the pieces.
He needs the support at this early stage, 5 games in... Not like its January and we need a turn around pronto.
Just an alternative view/opinion.
Take what you say OHG, opinions at this early stage... You could be correct but there again so could I but until it happens it's all guess work. | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:59 - Aug 30 with 803 views | onehunglow |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:57 - Aug 30 by magicdaps10 |
He could bring in his own players and they could click.
Might take 2/3/4 Windows mind.
If he succeeds, bigger club comes in and club picks up the pieces.
He needs the support at this early stage, 5 games in... Not like its January and we need a turn around pronto.
Just an alternative view/opinion.
Take what you say OHG, opinions at this early stage... You could be correct but there again so could I but until it happens it's all guess work. |
Might and could.
That is dead right ,Sir.
Yet,it's enough for Russy to get unfettered support.
I believe we are gullible,as fans and at Board level | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 22:05 - Aug 30 with 805 views | magicdaps10 |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 21:59 - Aug 30 by onehunglow |
Might and could.
That is dead right ,Sir.
Yet,it's enough for Russy to get unfettered support.
I believe we are gullible,as fans and at Board level |
At this stage and taking everything into account then yes he does need our support, time to get excited is not now.
We have had a good start the last 3 seasons and as important it is to start well, we need to learn how to deal with a poor start and take on board how early it is and understand how we want to go about things... Expecting it to happen over night is very naive and tommorow will have a big say on how things move on.
Tomorrow is in the boards hands, here is where my faith does drop a bit. | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 00:54 - Aug 31 with 755 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:12 - Aug 30 by Chief |
It's clear to me that a lot of our fans are convincing themselves that what we've played this season so far is entertaining, rather than being organically entertained. |
I agree, the match day thread from the Blackburn game was a bizarre read. I’m sure we gave the ball away 20 times on the edge of our box and one particular poster who seems to want to appear “entertained” more than most, even said “this could br special”. I and a few others were utterly dumbfounded.
I think because there was such a bizarrely and unnatural negative view of the last manager there is now an equal and opposite reaction to this one. It’s like a parallel universe at times. Just call it as you see it is my motto.
What I don’t understand is why people think the manager needs 2 years (?!) to put out a side capable of being competitive. 4 transfer windows is sheer stupidity, let’s be fair here. That’s more than the average total lifespan of our managers for the last quarter of a century.
It’s likely Martin will have moved on in 4 transfer windows for a variety of reasons, be them positive, negative or indifferent.
I will keep saying it. He may well need time to perfect the style, but certainly not to show it’s the correct style. We should be competitive very quickly.
None of our previous managers in the last 20 years has needed 2 years to show we can compete… or 2 months for that matter.
This myth is being created intentionally, knowing it’s completely unrealistic but shielding them from potentially having to face harsh realities for a long long time.
Put it this way. He will be gone by Xmas/Jan if there is no improvement soon. The owners are not going to accept anything close to a relegation scrap as they showed with Bob Bradley despite him being “their man”. [Post edited 31 Aug 2021 3:57]
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:06 - Aug 31 with 680 views | nantywatcher |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 00:54 - Aug 31 by Dr_Parnassus |
I agree, the match day thread from the Blackburn game was a bizarre read. I’m sure we gave the ball away 20 times on the edge of our box and one particular poster who seems to want to appear “entertained” more than most, even said “this could br special”. I and a few others were utterly dumbfounded.
I think because there was such a bizarrely and unnatural negative view of the last manager there is now an equal and opposite reaction to this one. It’s like a parallel universe at times. Just call it as you see it is my motto.
What I don’t understand is why people think the manager needs 2 years (?!) to put out a side capable of being competitive. 4 transfer windows is sheer stupidity, let’s be fair here. That’s more than the average total lifespan of our managers for the last quarter of a century.
It’s likely Martin will have moved on in 4 transfer windows for a variety of reasons, be them positive, negative or indifferent.
I will keep saying it. He may well need time to perfect the style, but certainly not to show it’s the correct style. We should be competitive very quickly.
None of our previous managers in the last 20 years has needed 2 years to show we can compete… or 2 months for that matter.
This myth is being created intentionally, knowing it’s completely unrealistic but shielding them from potentially having to face harsh realities for a long long time.
Put it this way. He will be gone by Xmas/Jan if there is no improvement soon. The owners are not going to accept anything close to a relegation scrap as they showed with Bob Bradley despite him being “their man”. [Post edited 31 Aug 2021 3:57]
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Down arrowed by mistake. RM might well be the perfect manager for us, but up to now he has done nothing whatsoever to impress me, other than being superb at 'talking the talk.' Top manager in that respect. | | | |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:13 - Aug 31 with 675 views | jack247 |
He’s got a big problem bringing the ball out from the back. The passing between Benda and the back three is fine, I think he’s pretty much got that where it needs to be.
Where it breaks down is the transition into midfield. It goes to Grimes, Fulton, Downes, but they are too close to the back three, have no proactive options, players pressing them and they are only 10 yards from the centre backs. It invariably goes back and we end up passing it around the back 3 more than we need to.
This obviously has an impact on things like shots attempted and possession in the attacking third. We’ve either got to make the wingbacks passing options by dropping them back, or bring in a midfielder capable of turning and carrying the ball forward from there, even in risky areas.
Until we sort this, the wingbacks, more attacking central midfielder and front pair aren’t going to see as much of the ball as we’d like and when they do get it, teams will usually have numbers back. | | | |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:18 - Aug 31 with 671 views | jack247 |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 20:45 - Aug 30 by vetchonian |
cant you see how radically different the football is?
What worries me is Martin has stated he is a one trick pony with only a plan A......funny how our previous manager was labelled by so many as the same and criticised him for the same yet somehow it is ok for Martin for be one....whilst also producing hapless performances....but then those same persons are happy being entertained....even though some switched off the game on Saturday and sought entertainment elsewhere....but its ok we are only 5 games in |
I think you’re assuming ‘radical’ means better in this context?
It doesn’t, it just means the football is completely different to the last two seasons. Surely that’s evident to anyone, whatever their views on Cooper or Martin. | | | |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:45 - Aug 31 with 647 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:13 - Aug 31 by jack247 |
He’s got a big problem bringing the ball out from the back. The passing between Benda and the back three is fine, I think he’s pretty much got that where it needs to be.
Where it breaks down is the transition into midfield. It goes to Grimes, Fulton, Downes, but they are too close to the back three, have no proactive options, players pressing them and they are only 10 yards from the centre backs. It invariably goes back and we end up passing it around the back 3 more than we need to.
This obviously has an impact on things like shots attempted and possession in the attacking third. We’ve either got to make the wingbacks passing options by dropping them back, or bring in a midfielder capable of turning and carrying the ball forward from there, even in risky areas.
Until we sort this, the wingbacks, more attacking central midfielder and front pair aren’t going to see as much of the ball as we’d like and when they do get it, teams will usually have numbers back. |
I was saying that in week 1.
Its the transition players that are key to this way of playing and I am not sure we even have one, let alone the 4 or 5 you need.
It's relatively easy to knock the ball around in a straight line parallel to the goals, it becomes difficult when you have to turn those passes into attacks.
Britton, Allen, Rangel, Williams, Dyer, Sinclair, Dobbie/Pratley and Borini were all good transition players the last time we tried this style at this level, capable of playing the ball between the lines and turning possession into pin point attacks.
We are just stuck with the ball without those transition players, until we then invariably lose it. Which is why our possession rate is extremely high yet we can barely muster a handful of shots per game yet our goal is peppered by the opposition. | |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:57 - Aug 31 with 640 views | jack247 |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:45 - Aug 31 by Dr_Parnassus |
I was saying that in week 1.
Its the transition players that are key to this way of playing and I am not sure we even have one, let alone the 4 or 5 you need.
It's relatively easy to knock the ball around in a straight line parallel to the goals, it becomes difficult when you have to turn those passes into attacks.
Britton, Allen, Rangel, Williams, Dyer, Sinclair, Dobbie/Pratley and Borini were all good transition players the last time we tried this style at this level, capable of playing the ball between the lines and turning possession into pin point attacks.
We are just stuck with the ball without those transition players, until we then invariably lose it. Which is why our possession rate is extremely high yet we can barely muster a handful of shots per game yet our goal is peppered by the opposition. |
Yes, I completely agree.
Though it’s compounded by the fact the wingbacks are level with the support striker. If you put an extra centre back, no matter how good he was on the ball, in with Williams and Monk, but then took Rangel and Taylor/Davies out of the equation for the first ball, I’m sure those players would struggle.
If he can sort the second part of the transition (midfielder who receives the ball from the back to wingbacks or creative midfielder) out, then we are going to have possession in dangerous areas with width and numbers. If he can’t, then we’re just going to have more of what we’ve seen so far. | | | |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 09:44 - Aug 31 with 606 views | AndyCole |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 08:57 - Aug 31 by jack247 |
Yes, I completely agree.
Though it’s compounded by the fact the wingbacks are level with the support striker. If you put an extra centre back, no matter how good he was on the ball, in with Williams and Monk, but then took Rangel and Taylor/Davies out of the equation for the first ball, I’m sure those players would struggle.
If he can sort the second part of the transition (midfielder who receives the ball from the back to wingbacks or creative midfielder) out, then we are going to have possession in dangerous areas with width and numbers. If he can’t, then we’re just going to have more of what we’ve seen so far. |
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This is basic, beginner level football principles. And something Grimes and Fulton have been doing in their sleep for years. Grimes, phase 1 from keeper, CBs; and/or longer thru to Fulton who played close to Ayew for phase 2. Plenty of go-forward.
The WBs clearly need to stop listening to RM and also offer an out-ball further back. This is all too obvious for even the passive follower. It's hardly rocket science nor revolutionary football.
Yet our players seem lost, and chose to take it upon themselves to play winning football vs Bristol.
Something's not right. In the transition, the transition from a clever, pragmatic winning brand to a mishmash of styles which is regressing.
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| Pro free speech and alternative opinions -
Anti gang-bullying and poor modding thereof -
Will always make a stand against those who consistently choose to turn a blind eye |
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| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 09:46 - Aug 31 with 602 views | jackrmee |
| Shots attempted and shots conceded league tables on 09:44 - Aug 31 by AndyCole |
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This is basic, beginner level football principles. And something Grimes and Fulton have been doing in their sleep for years. Grimes, phase 1 from keeper, CBs; and/or longer thru to Fulton who played close to Ayew for phase 2. Plenty of go-forward.
The WBs clearly need to stop listening to RM and also offer an out-ball further back. This is all too obvious for even the passive follower. It's hardly rocket science nor revolutionary football.
Yet our players seem lost, and chose to take it upon themselves to play winning football vs Bristol.
Something's not right. In the transition, the transition from a clever, pragmatic winning brand to a mishmash of styles which is regressing.
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So your advice to the players would be to stop listening to the manager  | |
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