| Incredible on 12:53 - Apr 9 with 1251 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Incredible on 21:10 - Apr 8 by controversial_jack |
No! Ukraine sent in troops, many neo nazi units to subdue the Russian separists. They got defeated twice. |
This post is about the Welsh Government.
Can you post your Russian stuff in the Russian Ukraine war post. |  |
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| Incredible on 13:18 - Apr 9 with 1234 views | Gwyn737 |
| Incredible on 19:42 - Apr 8 by Dr_Winston |
There is a difference between the Far Right and the Far Left.
The Far right are pariahs. Treated like the idiots they are and quite rightly so. People espousing their beliefs are roundly criticised and ignored.
The Far Left are not. They walk amongst us and until recently controlled one of our major political parties. Criticise their beliefs and you are smeared and condemned.
If a teacher publically stated that they were a Fascist they'd lose their job. If they stated that they were a Communist they would probably keep it and become a Union Rep. That's the difference. |
You make a valid point.
I wonder if it’s because most of us when we think about the far left and far right go straight to Stalin and Hitler as our points of reference? We beat Hitler and Stalin was ‘on our side’.
Hitler gets rightly vilified but does that give Stalin a bit of a pass in our eyes?
Plus the fact that most of us will have learnt about WW2 in school without having gone into too much detail on the Georgian thug.
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| Incredible on 14:34 - Apr 9 with 1208 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Incredible on 13:18 - Apr 9 by Gwyn737 |
You make a valid point.
I wonder if it’s because most of us when we think about the far left and far right go straight to Stalin and Hitler as our points of reference? We beat Hitler and Stalin was ‘on our side’.
Hitler gets rightly vilified but does that give Stalin a bit of a pass in our eyes?
Plus the fact that most of us will have learnt about WW2 in school without having gone into too much detail on the Georgian thug.
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Or the fact they were both considered to be left wing socialist when they signed their Pact and invaded Poland. | |
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| Incredible on 14:40 - Apr 9 with 1205 views | Gwyn737 |
| Incredible on 14:34 - Apr 9 by felixstowe_jack |
Or the fact they were both considered to be left wing socialist when they signed their Pact and invaded Poland. |
More grist to the mill of the extremes being both sides of the same coin. | | | |
| Incredible on 15:46 - Apr 9 with 1178 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Incredible on 14:40 - Apr 9 by Gwyn737 |
More grist to the mill of the extremes being both sides of the same coin. |
The extremes of either spectrum are very bad, Hitler very bad but for a while Stalin was our friend, a wolf in sheeps clothing though.
Both men very, very bad.
I suppose we can be grateful that today we complain about Trumps and Bojo's, Bidens and Corbyn's. Rather them than those two evil, violent people. | | | |
| Incredible on 17:20 - Apr 9 with 1145 views | controversial_jack |
| Incredible on 15:46 - Apr 9 by SullutaCreturned |
The extremes of either spectrum are very bad, Hitler very bad but for a while Stalin was our friend, a wolf in sheeps clothing though.
Both men very, very bad.
I suppose we can be grateful that today we complain about Trumps and Bojo's, Bidens and Corbyn's. Rather them than those two evil, violent people. |
Stalin, whatever his faults - and there were many, did more to defeat the NAZIs than anyone else. The red army defeated the Germans, and also pulverised the Japs in Manchuria | | | |
| Incredible on 18:00 - Apr 9 with 1136 views | Togg |
| Incredible on 17:20 - Apr 9 by controversial_jack |
Stalin, whatever his faults - and there were many, did more to defeat the NAZIs than anyone else. The red army defeated the Germans, and also pulverised the Japs in Manchuria |
Okay pulverised the Japs. Everything in war is disgusting, however the USA dropping two atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki might have just 'pulverised the Japs'. Hirohito was one evil bastard but he thought as did his people he was divine.
Serious question. Why are you such a Russian Fan Boy? | | | |
| Incredible on 18:46 - Apr 9 with 1117 views | controversial_jack |
| Incredible on 18:00 - Apr 9 by Togg |
Okay pulverised the Japs. Everything in war is disgusting, however the USA dropping two atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki might have just 'pulverised the Japs'. Hirohito was one evil bastard but he thought as did his people he was divine.
Serious question. Why are you such a Russian Fan Boy? |
The most plausible reason the Yanks dropped the bombs was, to get Japan to surrender to the Yanks before Russia. It was also a show of power towards Stalin as he held all the cards after the NAZIs were subdued. | | | |
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| Incredible on 19:14 - Apr 9 with 1113 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Incredible on 18:46 - Apr 9 by controversial_jack |
The most plausible reason the Yanks dropped the bombs was, to get Japan to surrender to the Yanks before Russia. It was also a show of power towards Stalin as he held all the cards after the NAZIs were subdued. |
The issue is reported to be that the Japanese were prepared to fight the Allies whatever the odds, this would mean unpalatable losses to the Americans, so they opted for the Atomic Bomb, one was not enough to deter the Japanese. |  |
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| Incredible on 19:16 - Apr 9 with 1112 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Incredible on 17:20 - Apr 9 by controversial_jack |
Stalin, whatever his faults - and there were many, did more to defeat the NAZIs than anyone else. The red army defeated the Germans, and also pulverised the Japs in Manchuria |
I think you'll find it was the Russian people who defeated Hitler's army. I might add they had plenty of help from us and the USA, many good people died on the arctic convoys ferrying materiel to Russia.
Stalin was an evil S.O.B who sent millions of his own people to their deaths, in one way or another. | | | |
| Incredible on 19:21 - Apr 9 with 1111 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Incredible on 15:46 - Apr 9 by SullutaCreturned |
The extremes of either spectrum are very bad, Hitler very bad but for a while Stalin was our friend, a wolf in sheeps clothing though.
Both men very, very bad.
I suppose we can be grateful that today we complain about Trumps and Bojo's, Bidens and Corbyn's. Rather them than those two evil, violent people. |
My grandfather, who served in Berlin at the end of WW2 always said the difference between Stalin and Hitler was that Hitler's actions were more transparent, Stalin pretended to be doing the right thing. | |
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| Incredible on 20:14 - Apr 9 with 1093 views | Togg |
| Incredible on 18:46 - Apr 9 by controversial_jack |
The most plausible reason the Yanks dropped the bombs was, to get Japan to surrender to the Yanks before Russia. It was also a show of power towards Stalin as he held all the cards after the NAZIs were subdued. |
What a load of absolute pony!  | | | |
| Incredible on 20:29 - Apr 9 with 1087 views | controversial_jack |
| Incredible on 19:14 - Apr 9 by JACKMANANDBOY |
The issue is reported to be that the Japanese were prepared to fight the Allies whatever the odds, this would mean unpalatable losses to the Americans, so they opted for the Atomic Bomb, one was not enough to deter the Japanese. |
That makes good story, but that's all it was. it was to get control of Japan before the red army did.
Japan was on it's knees by then and losing heavily to the red army.
Stalin held all the cards and Truman and Churhill knew this. | | | |
| Incredible on 15:45 - Apr 10 with 1030 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Incredible on 20:29 - Apr 9 by controversial_jack |
That makes good story, but that's all it was. it was to get control of Japan before the red army did.
Japan was on it's knees by then and losing heavily to the red army.
Stalin held all the cards and Truman and Churhill knew this. |
Accept you missed several key points.
The casualties the American had already undertaken capture several of the Japanese Islands.
The USSR did not declare war on Japan until 8th August 1945 which was 2 days after Hiroshima and the day before Nagasaki.
How could Japan loose heavily to the USSR when they were not at war.
Stalin did not declare war on Japan when Japan attacked Pearl Harbour in December 1941, even though Japan was allied with German. The simple reason for that the USSR was incapable of fighting on two fronts in December. L1941. The USSR had transfered all available troops in the far East of Russia to help stem the German Army.
Stalin agree to declare war on Japan at the Yalta conference in February 1945 but it took USSR until August 1945 for the USSR to transfer 1 million soldiers and their equipment from Germany to USSR Manchurian border. So Starlin declared war two days after Hiroshima and just the day before Nagasaki on the 9th of August. Japan surrendered on the 15th August.
Your Story about the Russian involvement in the defeat of Japan is both factually wrong and utter rubbish. | |
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| Incredible on 16:00 - Apr 10 with 1018 views | Dr_Winston |
It took the Allies the best part of a couple of years to build up the amphibious expertise/equipment required to launch the D-Day landings. The idea that the Soviets could have posed any sort of invasion threat to the Japanese Home Islands given that basically their entire war production was based on fighting Germany is ludicrous.
They only declared war because they had committed to at Yalta, the war was basically over anyway and because they wanted to claim the rest of Sakhalin Island, which they already controlled the Northern half of. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Incredible on 16:06 - Apr 10 with 1015 views | controversial_jack |
| Incredible on 15:45 - Apr 10 by felixstowe_jack |
Accept you missed several key points.
The casualties the American had already undertaken capture several of the Japanese Islands.
The USSR did not declare war on Japan until 8th August 1945 which was 2 days after Hiroshima and the day before Nagasaki.
How could Japan loose heavily to the USSR when they were not at war.
Stalin did not declare war on Japan when Japan attacked Pearl Harbour in December 1941, even though Japan was allied with German. The simple reason for that the USSR was incapable of fighting on two fronts in December. L1941. The USSR had transfered all available troops in the far East of Russia to help stem the German Army.
Stalin agree to declare war on Japan at the Yalta conference in February 1945 but it took USSR until August 1945 for the USSR to transfer 1 million soldiers and their equipment from Germany to USSR Manchurian border. So Starlin declared war two days after Hiroshima and just the day before Nagasaki on the 9th of August. Japan surrendered on the 15th August.
Your Story about the Russian involvement in the defeat of Japan is both factually wrong and utter rubbish. |
The Soviets’ Manchurian Campaign, August Storm, destroyed the last vestige of Japanese military power outside Japan, and put the final nail in the coffin of those Japanese militarists who, even after suffering two atomic attacks, intended to continue the war to the death.
It's all on here.It's a bit of a read, but it will give you an understanding of what happened
https://warfarehistorynetwork. | | | |
| Incredible on 17:11 - Apr 10 with 1007 views | Togg |
| Incredible on 15:45 - Apr 10 by felixstowe_jack |
Accept you missed several key points.
The casualties the American had already undertaken capture several of the Japanese Islands.
The USSR did not declare war on Japan until 8th August 1945 which was 2 days after Hiroshima and the day before Nagasaki.
How could Japan loose heavily to the USSR when they were not at war.
Stalin did not declare war on Japan when Japan attacked Pearl Harbour in December 1941, even though Japan was allied with German. The simple reason for that the USSR was incapable of fighting on two fronts in December. L1941. The USSR had transfered all available troops in the far East of Russia to help stem the German Army.
Stalin agree to declare war on Japan at the Yalta conference in February 1945 but it took USSR until August 1945 for the USSR to transfer 1 million soldiers and their equipment from Germany to USSR Manchurian border. So Starlin declared war two days after Hiroshima and just the day before Nagasaki on the 9th of August. Japan surrendered on the 15th August.
Your Story about the Russian involvement in the defeat of Japan is both factually wrong and utter rubbish. |
He read it all in the History section of the Morning Star | | | |
| Incredible on 18:47 - Apr 10 with 990 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Incredible on 16:06 - Apr 10 by controversial_jack |
The Soviets’ Manchurian Campaign, August Storm, destroyed the last vestige of Japanese military power outside Japan, and put the final nail in the coffin of those Japanese militarists who, even after suffering two atomic attacks, intended to continue the war to the death.
It's all on here.It's a bit of a read, but it will give you an understanding of what happened
https://warfarehistorynetwork. |
Correct the Article states that Stalin moved his declaration of war from 15th August as Hiroshima was bombed on 8th August. The only reason he did that was so that he could declare war on Japan before it actually surrendered. | |
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| Incredible on 19:00 - Apr 10 with 984 views | controversial_jack |
| Incredible on 18:47 - Apr 10 by felixstowe_jack |
Correct the Article states that Stalin moved his declaration of war from 15th August as Hiroshima was bombed on 8th August. The only reason he did that was so that he could declare war on Japan before it actually surrendered. |
As i stated earlier, it was also a statement or warning to Stalin that the US had this super weapon. Stalin held all the cards up until then
The dropping of the bomb had been planned for a long time. Stalin would have known they had one, but there wasn't anything he could do about it. It didn't prevent Russis declaring war though.
This is all speculation of course, as only a few ppl knew the reasons. However, it's the most likely scenario | | | |
| Incredible on 22:33 - Apr 10 with 929 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Incredible on 20:29 - Apr 9 by controversial_jack |
That makes good story, but that's all it was. it was to get control of Japan before the red army did.
Japan was on it's knees by then and losing heavily to the red army.
Stalin held all the cards and Truman and Churhill knew this. |
What, the USA had nuclear weapons but Stalin held all the cards?
Japan wasnt losing heavily to the red army, Moscow declared war on Japan on the 8th August 1945, 2 days after Hiroshima, the day before Nagasaki. It pur estra pressure on the japs yes but it was a very late intervention.
Even then, Stalin didn't do it from the kindness of his heart, he had massive ambitins in East Asia and he was given guatantees from the allies before he joined in against Japan.
At the February 1945 Yalta Conference, Stalin agreed that the Soviet Union would enter the war against Japan three months after Germany’s surrender. The Yalta declaration gave Moscow back southern Sakhalin, which Japan had seized during the Russo-Japanese War in 1904-05, as well as the Kurile Island chain to which Russia had renounced its claim in 1875. Mongolia was also to be recognized as an independent state (it was already a Soviet client), and Soviet interests in the naval base at the Chinese port of Port Arthur (Dalian) and the Manchurian railway that it had controlled before 1905 were to be respected.
Stalin declined to sign the treaty of San Francisco, the formal ending of the war in the Pacific
All that is from the link below.
https://nationalinterest.org/b | | | |
| Incredible on 23:42 - Apr 10 with 916 views | controversial_jack |
| Incredible on 22:33 - Apr 10 by SullutaCreturned |
What, the USA had nuclear weapons but Stalin held all the cards?
Japan wasnt losing heavily to the red army, Moscow declared war on Japan on the 8th August 1945, 2 days after Hiroshima, the day before Nagasaki. It pur estra pressure on the japs yes but it was a very late intervention.
Even then, Stalin didn't do it from the kindness of his heart, he had massive ambitins in East Asia and he was given guatantees from the allies before he joined in against Japan.
At the February 1945 Yalta Conference, Stalin agreed that the Soviet Union would enter the war against Japan three months after Germany’s surrender. The Yalta declaration gave Moscow back southern Sakhalin, which Japan had seized during the Russo-Japanese War in 1904-05, as well as the Kurile Island chain to which Russia had renounced its claim in 1875. Mongolia was also to be recognized as an independent state (it was already a Soviet client), and Soviet interests in the naval base at the Chinese port of Port Arthur (Dalian) and the Manchurian railway that it had controlled before 1905 were to be respected.
Stalin declined to sign the treaty of San Francisco, the formal ending of the war in the Pacific
All that is from the link below.
https://nationalinterest.org/b |
Here are links from the Encyclopedia Britannica and also from CND. This basic knowledge, and I have no idea why it hasn't filtered down to certain posters on here
https://www.britannica.com/que
https://cnduk.org/why-the-atom | | | |
| Incredible on 13:19 - Apr 11 with 875 views | felixstowe_jack |
I would not expect the CND to agree dropping a Nuclear bomb ended the war with Japan. The fact they unconditionally surrendered within days of it being dropped proves otherwise.
Can you stick to the posting about the topic of Wales in this forum and keep your Russian properganda for the Ukraine invasion Post. | |
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| Incredible on 14:22 - Apr 11 with 857 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
This thread has gone on a massive tangent. |  |
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| Incredible on 15:00 - Apr 11 with 839 views | onehunglow |
| Incredible on 13:19 - Apr 11 by felixstowe_jack |
I would not expect the CND to agree dropping a Nuclear bomb ended the war with Japan. The fact they unconditionally surrendered within days of it being dropped proves otherwise.
Can you stick to the posting about the topic of Wales in this forum and keep your Russian properganda for the Ukraine invasion Post. |
If CND ,now basically the Green Party ,had their way, there would be no war and mankind would simply love one another unconditionally | |
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| Incredible on 15:54 - Apr 11 with 832 views | controversial_jack |
| Incredible on 13:19 - Apr 11 by felixstowe_jack |
I would not expect the CND to agree dropping a Nuclear bomb ended the war with Japan. The fact they unconditionally surrendered within days of it being dropped proves otherwise.
Can you stick to the posting about the topic of Wales in this forum and keep your Russian properganda for the Ukraine invasion Post. |
Don't reply then, simple | | | |
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