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It is something of a perfect storm for development in London.
Taller blocks of flats have become extremely expensive to build and the new build flat sales market has almost completely collapsed post Grenfell. The building safety act introduced as a response to Grenfell has made it very tricky indeed to negotiate planning and construction with regard to any new builds other than low-density developments. The ones that are proceeding are probably housing association joint-ventures for social housing.
In addition developments like Battersea power station were funded by selling off plan with sizeable deposits to buyers for example typically in the Far East. That money could then be used to fund the building works at least in part. That came to an end with Brexit.
Overseas buyers using London for safe haven status have pretty much disappeared as a result of changes to non-dom tax status and tightening of immigration status.
I suspect 100m is indeed an ambitious figure for that site now.
Unless some rich benefactor buys us the ‘car giant’ site, and soon, I fear that at 61, I will never see Rangers in a new purpose built fit for use ground before I die.
Unless some rich benefactor buys us the ‘car giant’ site, and soon, I fear that at 61, I will never see Rangers in a new purpose built fit for use ground before I die.
This 61 year old feels the same .
"Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1."
It is something of a perfect storm for development in London.
Taller blocks of flats have become extremely expensive to build and the new build flat sales market has almost completely collapsed post Grenfell. The building safety act introduced as a response to Grenfell has made it very tricky indeed to negotiate planning and construction with regard to any new builds other than low-density developments. The ones that are proceeding are probably housing association joint-ventures for social housing.
In addition developments like Battersea power station were funded by selling off plan with sizeable deposits to buyers for example typically in the Far East. That money could then be used to fund the building works at least in part. That came to an end with Brexit.
Overseas buyers using London for safe haven status have pretty much disappeared as a result of changes to non-dom tax status and tightening of immigration status.
I suspect 100m is indeed an ambitious figure for that site now.
There's a long thread on Twitter (19 tweets) which broadly agrees with every point you made.
The one tweet that disagrees with you says that land values tend hold their value even when the property market is falling:
There's a long thread on Twitter (19 tweets) which broadly agrees with every point you made.
The one tweet that disagrees with you says that land values tend hold their value even when the property market is falling:
That doesn't make any sense, profit on property development is basically the sale price less the land price and other building costs. If the end sale price is expected to be lower, the land price has to fall to make it work for developers.
What that tweet seems to be describing is land that wouldn't be for sale at all unless values were booming.
That doesn't make any sense, profit on property development is basically the sale price less the land price and other building costs. If the end sale price is expected to be lower, the land price has to fall to make it work for developers.
What that tweet seems to be describing is land that wouldn't be for sale at all unless values were booming.
[Post edited 24 Apr 1:28]
The point is that land is a long term investment.
Three of the biggest land owners in this country are the Royal family, Church of England, and some of the Oxbridge colleges.
They're all in it for the long haul.
If market conditions aren't right they will sit on the land for decades if necessary because they are wealthy enough not to need to sell.
It's the developers who miss out, not the land owners.
It is something of a perfect storm for development in London.
Taller blocks of flats have become extremely expensive to build and the new build flat sales market has almost completely collapsed post Grenfell. The building safety act introduced as a response to Grenfell has made it very tricky indeed to negotiate planning and construction with regard to any new builds other than low-density developments. The ones that are proceeding are probably housing association joint-ventures for social housing.
In addition developments like Battersea power station were funded by selling off plan with sizeable deposits to buyers for example typically in the Far East. That money could then be used to fund the building works at least in part. That came to an end with Brexit.
Overseas buyers using London for safe haven status have pretty much disappeared as a result of changes to non-dom tax status and tightening of immigration status.
I suspect 100m is indeed an ambitious figure for that site now.
nothing is really being built in london right now , a few small developments but most of the large builders are keeping quiet , been in the game for 25 years and never seen london as bad as its been for the last 18 months
the cladding issue is making many run for cover and the gateway is adding months and months to building being approved some as afar back as a year to get the green light . so unlikley any large hosue builder will want to committ to anything for a while yet on a piece of lnd that large ina less than disirable place until hs have finshed there works
Been involved in these RE investment opportunities in my past professional career- now retired. I would be astonished if the club are not partnering with this initiative. Ruben will not get another opportunity in west London like this again and I’m sure his investment partners are all over this. Important to remember that it’s highly unlikely the club will comment any time soon given the highly confidential planning and financial details involved. We should perhaps look out for Ruben creating a new investment venture in amongst his other business interests.
As stated previously, that area does not include Car Giant - which was removed from the OPDC's plans by a judge several years ago.
yes i know , it does as somebody else said offer the club an chance to get involved in the surroudning area as a possible add on which would be madness at present in london , similar to arsenal who did it the correct way when they moved from higbury , and something we could / should have done with the diary crest site at white city which would likely have piad at least half of the cost of a new stadium in the best location any football club could ever want .
It's pretty straightforward... if we are not actively and aggressively pursuing either the Cargiant site or the wider environs of the Old Oak Redevelopment, it would mean our owners are NOT remotely interested in building a new ground.
I would hope that the silence is about commercial sensitivity and discretion but I wouldn't bet on it.
It's pretty straightforward... if we are not actively and aggressively pursuing either the Cargiant site or the wider environs of the Old Oak Redevelopment, it would mean our owners are NOT remotely interested in building a new ground.
I would hope that the silence is about commercial sensitivity and discretion but I wouldn't bet on it.
After the way Fernandes shouted from the rooftops 12 years ago which really put the back up of the owners of Cargiant I suspect the best way forward is to be quiet in the extreme until a deal is signed and sealed. Would make so much sense to go for the site as it would without doubt increase the revenue of the club hugely and ultimately if Ruben wanted to sell them business values are done on asset values and revenue. He’d more than get his money back.
When Millwall lost in the playoffs I suddenly lost all interest in them as I found the remaining teams to be incredibly boring.
I realised afterwards it's because the teams left in all play in almost identical featureless modern "bowl" type stadiums. It's like trying to get excited about watching people in an out of town shopping centre. It's as if these teams could be completely interchangeable.
If we do ever get a new stadium (not holding my breath) it needs to avoid that shite.
When Millwall lost in the playoffs I suddenly lost all interest in them as I found the remaining teams to be incredibly boring.
I realised afterwards it's because the teams left in all play in almost identical featureless modern "bowl" type stadiums. It's like trying to get excited about watching people in an out of town shopping centre. It's as if these teams could be completely interchangeable.
If we do ever get a new stadium (not holding my breath) it needs to avoid that shite.
I don't mind Brentfords as it goes.
I agree about any new stadium. One of the reasons that so many have gone for bowl-type stadia is because they can, to all intents, pick the design off the shelf. Saying that, there are a number of European grounds that have been rebuilt and could be used as a template. I hope we are looking at the CG and Old Oak areas, as I don't think we'll get a better chance of a new ground for another 20 years.
[Post edited 15 May 13:27]
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky
It's pretty straightforward... if we are not actively and aggressively pursuing either the Cargiant site or the wider environs of the Old Oak Redevelopment, it would mean our owners are NOT remotely interested in building a new ground.
I would hope that the silence is about commercial sensitivity and discretion but I wouldn't bet on it.
Your last sentence is on the money. It would be foolish and irresponsible to comment on any QPR involvement at this time.
nothing is really being built in london right now , a few small developments but most of the large builders are keeping quiet , been in the game for 25 years and never seen london as bad as its been for the last 18 months
the cladding issue is making many run for cover and the gateway is adding months and months to building being approved some as afar back as a year to get the green light . so unlikley any large hosue builder will want to committ to anything for a while yet on a piece of lnd that large ina less than disirable place until hs have finshed there works
Nothing is being built right now? I need to go to Specsavers because I could have sworn that in the past few years I've seen the following spring up:
Large scale development across East Acton Large scale development across North Acton Total redevelopment of South Acton estate Flats opposite Acton Main line station Redevelopment of BBC TV centre Imperial buildings Numerous developments along the Uxbridge Road in Ealing Broadway As least 4 tower blocks between Uxbridge Road West Ealing and Waitrose Big development on the old Guinness site in Park Royal Blocks of flats on the old B&Q site by Alperton station Huge development on Greenford Quay (the old GSK/Hovis site) New development opposite Perivale Tesco New development on the Uxbridge Road by West Ealing park New development opposite Gypsy Corner New development beside the A40 McDonalds High rise on Hanger Lane gyratory Huge development on the road behind the Ace cafe all the way to Alperton High rise tower blocks behind Acton police station Old Oak development
And that's off the top of my head in my little corner of West London. Now I don't doubt that it's getting more difficult to develop in London (for a number of reasons) but that clearly hasn't stopped some developers.
I wouldn't be surprised to see a Data Centre REIT grab it as long as the local Cadent gas mains can support the high pressure supply to something like an SOFC power solution.
That £100m prices tag looks like it needs some negotiation to me. As the article referred to in the OP hints at (“The value of the land has yo-yoed in the company accounts over previous years but in its latest set a £98.8m value had been placed on the site.”). It’s possible it is worth that when there is more genuine active development at OOC but right now, at that valuation, it would be a gamble.
Nothing is being built right now? I need to go to Specsavers because I could have sworn that in the past few years I've seen the following spring up:
Large scale development across East Acton Large scale development across North Acton Total redevelopment of South Acton estate Flats opposite Acton Main line station Redevelopment of BBC TV centre Imperial buildings Numerous developments along the Uxbridge Road in Ealing Broadway As least 4 tower blocks between Uxbridge Road West Ealing and Waitrose Big development on the old Guinness site in Park Royal Blocks of flats on the old B&Q site by Alperton station Huge development on Greenford Quay (the old GSK/Hovis site) New development opposite Perivale Tesco New development on the Uxbridge Road by West Ealing park New development opposite Gypsy Corner New development beside the A40 McDonalds High rise on Hanger Lane gyratory Huge development on the road behind the Ace cafe all the way to Alperton High rise tower blocks behind Acton police station Old Oak development
And that's off the top of my head in my little corner of West London. Now I don't doubt that it's getting more difficult to develop in London (for a number of reasons) but that clearly hasn't stopped some developers.
trust me from the side of one of the people who supply the very people who build these very developments NOTHING of scale is being build right now in london , odd site yes but of the scale its beenn london is dead , for example we havw guys who have worked for us solid reliable guys for 18 years in some cases never out of work doing food deliveries with sainsburys to psy some bills these guys are tops of the tree for driving cranes , our phone havent stopped with guys desperate for work every days of the week , major crane companies are layin people off weekly due to the lack of work out there, housebuilding is on its knees with the gov gateway and lack of money out there. which due to trump is showing signs of getting worse in the coming months
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