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Ben Gladwin.................. on 13:15 - Jan 18 by BazzaInTheLoft
Very snide Clive, and beneath you.
I think it's fair to criticise those who boo Gladwin without painting the whole fan base with the same brush, which is exactly what I did.
Unless your comment wasn't directed at me in which case I apologise.
[Post edited 18 Jan 2017 13:22]
Hmmm you seemed to be indicating we're worse than other teams for this, but I think it is the same everywhere. I just get the hump with the constant criticism of the fan base when it is no worse than other teams and a hell of a lot more loyal than most.
Besides how are the supporters supposed to perform well when they're being slagged off every week on here and all over social media. It's hardly going to help their performance is it?
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 13:34 - Jan 18 with 5432 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 13:25 - Jan 18 by Clive_Anderson
Hmmm you seemed to be indicating we're worse than other teams for this, but I think it is the same everywhere. I just get the hump with the constant criticism of the fan base when it is no worse than other teams and a hell of a lot more loyal than most.
Besides how are the supporters supposed to perform well when they're being slagged off every week on here and all over social media. It's hardly going to help their performance is it?
I wasnt saying we're worse than other fans. My point though was we have a unique ground where the players can hear every word. Onouhas spat with a fan. Charlie Austin calling out a fan. Just a theory. Holloway saying more than once that fans were getting to Gladwin hence getting loaned out. There's loads of examples. Wether it goes on at other clubs isn't our problem.
Occasional providers of half decent House music.
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 13:34 - Jan 18 with 5430 views
I feel for the guy. As others have said, our supporters haven't helped by jumping on his back as soon as he makes a mistake. the level of expectation on him is also unfair - he is a guy who accelerated through the lower ranks quickly... maybe he found his level, maybe he hasn't, but being played out of position really hasn't helped.
Lets not forget his transfer fee was really for Luongo, but added to Gladwin instead Swindon could pull a fast one on Spuds because of his sell on fee. We should appreciate him for that fact if nothing else!
Ben Gladwin.................. on 13:25 - Jan 18 by Clive_Anderson
Hmmm you seemed to be indicating we're worse than other teams for this, but I think it is the same everywhere. I just get the hump with the constant criticism of the fan base when it is no worse than other teams and a hell of a lot more loyal than most.
Besides how are the supporters supposed to perform well when they're being slagged off every week on here and all over social media. It's hardly going to help their performance is it?
Where did I say that?
For the record I don't think we are worse than anyone else, and was present at games like Reading where we expected a hiding. I can see the loyalty.
I'm yet to see anti supporter comments on here every week. Maybe one or two directed at that small section that like to abuse 24 year olds who are pretty doing the equivalent of an Championship apprenticeship. Most of the vitriol is directed at players and management I think.
Never once have I used the term 'all' when airing my criticism of QPR supporters. Can't stress that enough. I'm one myself after all.
Ben Gladwin.................. on 13:25 - Jan 18 by Clive_Anderson
Hmmm you seemed to be indicating we're worse than other teams for this, but I think it is the same everywhere. I just get the hump with the constant criticism of the fan base when it is no worse than other teams and a hell of a lot more loyal than most.
Besides how are the supporters supposed to perform well when they're being slagged off every week on here and all over social media. It's hardly going to help their performance is it?
Bravo Sir
The criticism of those that criticise is global 9 times out of 10 using "us" and "we".
We as a fanbase SHOULD be demanding. I also think (as I said above) we are a very knowledgable bunch and very supportive of those who deserve it.
Cheers
Cherish and enjoy life.... this ain't no dress rehearsal
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 15:25 - Jan 18 with 5288 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 13:25 - Jan 18 by Clive_Anderson
Hmmm you seemed to be indicating we're worse than other teams for this, but I think it is the same everywhere. I just get the hump with the constant criticism of the fan base when it is no worse than other teams and a hell of a lot more loyal than most.
Besides how are the supporters supposed to perform well when they're being slagged off every week on here and all over social media. It's hardly going to help their performance is it?
It is a difficult comparison to make between our supporters and that of another club, given that the vast majority of us only regularly attend QPR games. How are we to know how other clubs react?
What we can compare however is the reaction between our old experiences of the crowd at Loftus Road, juxtaposed to more recent occasions. In my opinion the vitriol from the crowd, the booing and abuse, has become more noticeable and prominent. One can speculate about the reasons for this: the emergence of twitter giving these fvckwits a platform the most significant IMO, and possibly a new wave of supporter used to our recent extravagance in the transfer market another one. I just find the negativity so tiresome. I sit 2 rows infront of some arsehole who spends 90 minutes slagging off the whole team. It is irksome. We booed Karl Henry onto the pitch FFS. It is so stupid it is unreal. This is how we treat our own players. Our young players. Our investments. Surely we want them to suceed? I digress. I never remembered it being this bad when I used to come. We seemed a whole lot more united and supportive pre-Premiershte than we do now.
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 15:30 - Jan 18 with 5260 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 15:25 - Jan 18 by RBlock
It is a difficult comparison to make between our supporters and that of another club, given that the vast majority of us only regularly attend QPR games. How are we to know how other clubs react?
What we can compare however is the reaction between our old experiences of the crowd at Loftus Road, juxtaposed to more recent occasions. In my opinion the vitriol from the crowd, the booing and abuse, has become more noticeable and prominent. One can speculate about the reasons for this: the emergence of twitter giving these fvckwits a platform the most significant IMO, and possibly a new wave of supporter used to our recent extravagance in the transfer market another one. I just find the negativity so tiresome. I sit 2 rows infront of some arsehole who spends 90 minutes slagging off the whole team. It is irksome. We booed Karl Henry onto the pitch FFS. It is so stupid it is unreal. This is how we treat our own players. Our young players. Our investments. Surely we want them to suceed? I digress. I never remembered it being this bad when I used to come. We seemed a whole lot more united and supportive pre-Premiershte than we do now.
My own recollections is that it became far more noticeable after the Briatore takeover and has deteriorated since. The only reason I can think of is that with the money came a sense of entitlement, ie we're paying more money and the owners are rich, so we should be more successful.
Of course it's still a minority doing it, but it is becoming more widespread, and as in your experience, it only takes one person's constant sniping to pss off a whole section of seating.
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 15:47 - Jan 18 with 5227 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 15:25 - Jan 18 by RBlock
It is a difficult comparison to make between our supporters and that of another club, given that the vast majority of us only regularly attend QPR games. How are we to know how other clubs react?
What we can compare however is the reaction between our old experiences of the crowd at Loftus Road, juxtaposed to more recent occasions. In my opinion the vitriol from the crowd, the booing and abuse, has become more noticeable and prominent. One can speculate about the reasons for this: the emergence of twitter giving these fvckwits a platform the most significant IMO, and possibly a new wave of supporter used to our recent extravagance in the transfer market another one. I just find the negativity so tiresome. I sit 2 rows infront of some arsehole who spends 90 minutes slagging off the whole team. It is irksome. We booed Karl Henry onto the pitch FFS. It is so stupid it is unreal. This is how we treat our own players. Our young players. Our investments. Surely we want them to suceed? I digress. I never remembered it being this bad when I used to come. We seemed a whole lot more united and supportive pre-Premiershte than we do now.
Not sure if when you say pre 'premiershite' you mean our recent spell or pre 1992.
There are many possible reasons including all those already mentioned but I believe a major reason is the Sky money. The talent that has arrived at the 'top clubs' has meant we have become used to watching a very high level of skill and organisation.
The fallout is that many think they are tactical experts and when a player is not up to the level they see on the box some believe he is 'shite' and the manager is an idiot for picking him, not selecting the crowd favourite and getting the formation all wrong. This with lowering standards of decency and normal behaviour in society in general means for a sizeable minority criticism descends into angry and sometimes obscene abuse.
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:16 - Jan 18 with 5137 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 15:25 - Jan 18 by RBlock
It is a difficult comparison to make between our supporters and that of another club, given that the vast majority of us only regularly attend QPR games. How are we to know how other clubs react?
What we can compare however is the reaction between our old experiences of the crowd at Loftus Road, juxtaposed to more recent occasions. In my opinion the vitriol from the crowd, the booing and abuse, has become more noticeable and prominent. One can speculate about the reasons for this: the emergence of twitter giving these fvckwits a platform the most significant IMO, and possibly a new wave of supporter used to our recent extravagance in the transfer market another one. I just find the negativity so tiresome. I sit 2 rows infront of some arsehole who spends 90 minutes slagging off the whole team. It is irksome. We booed Karl Henry onto the pitch FFS. It is so stupid it is unreal. This is how we treat our own players. Our young players. Our investments. Surely we want them to suceed? I digress. I never remembered it being this bad when I used to come. We seemed a whole lot more united and supportive pre-Premiershte than we do now.
This is a good post which I agree with. I don't see how we improve as a support base if we just blindly go along with the "we're QPR so we're brilliant innit" because there have clearly been times recently when we haven't been brilliant.
We have barracked our manager for his substitutions in a game we won 3-0 so badly that the opposition manager came down the touchline and tap him on the shoulder in solidarity.
We have chanted "off off off" when the referee was booking one of our own players.
We have booed our own players onto the pitch when they come on as a sub - more than one occasion, more than one player.
Neil Warnock and Ian Holloway have now both said they are letting players go (Leigertwood, Gladwin) because the crowd at QPR are making it impossible for them to play.
We have booed our team during a match they weren't losing with 20 minutes still left to play (Blackburn H).
To be honest, I don't give a flying fck if other clubs do the same, we shouldn't be doing sht like this, nor should we be accepting it from ourselves. We need to be better than this. It's difficult enough for QPR to win football games, we should be giving them every possible advantage to do so rather than making it more difficult. And whichever way you slice it, all the above behaviour makes it more difficult for QPR to win games.
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:26 - Jan 18 with 2483 views
And as for the reasons for it, some already suggested some not
- ticket prices. It's expensive to go to all football, particularly QPR. Our crowd changed for good that Iain Dowie game v Barnsley the first day after Flavio had doubled all the prices. We feel we're entitled to better because our prices are in line with much bigger and better clubs.
- Some recent success. We all expect the Warnock season, or even the Redknapp season again. We seem to forget that the Warnock season was a completely out of the blue one off at the end of 16 years of sht, and the Redknapp season cost us £80m in wages and £20m on players - and was still very dull for long stretches. QPR are now what they've been for the vast majority of the last 30 years.
- Social media. As said, gives that dickhead who sits behind you the same platform as everybody else. Uprisings against players and managers seem to grow much faster as a result. Three months ago I think there were one or two posters on here thought Onuoha was sht, now he's the worst player who's ever played for us, and that's all Facebook, Twitter etc mobilising extreme views.
- Computer games. The amount of people who seem to think that Fifa or Football Manager is how it really works, and because they got QPR promoted they know about training or formations and can barrack managers or players accordingly, is really depressing. You, I, we, have no fcking idea how to put on a basic training session, set up a professional team, cope with the set up of an opposing team. Even a fcking knob like Paul Hart could drink us under the table. Supporters aren't idiots, and I hate that "I'm a football person so I know and you're not so you don't" Steve Claridge attitude, but we need to be realistic.
- Our board. It has tried to solve every problem with 1 manager change and 6 signings so often we now expect it and demand it when it doesn't happen. The fact it doesn't work has occurred to nobody.
- Media coverage. The sport as a whole is much more about instant results. Four games without a win is a crisis now when it barely even registered 20 years ago.
- Disposable society - Not working, get rid. Clothes, furniture, electronics, football managers, football players. Except the latter two are humans.
- Player wages. It's made them feel like fair game. If Gladwin was on £250 a week nobody would say anything, but we all know he's not. There are some very mediocre footballers getting very rich currently, lots of them at QPR in recent years, and its bred real anger and resentment. Some of that is deserved - Bosingwa, Barton, SWP etc stole a living here. But that's not the case for everybody.
This post has been edited by an administrator
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:31 - Jan 18 with 2472 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:26 - Jan 18 by Northernr
And as for the reasons for it, some already suggested some not
- ticket prices. It's expensive to go to all football, particularly QPR. Our crowd changed for good that Iain Dowie game v Barnsley the first day after Flavio had doubled all the prices. We feel we're entitled to better because our prices are in line with much bigger and better clubs.
- Some recent success. We all expect the Warnock season, or even the Redknapp season again. We seem to forget that the Warnock season was a completely out of the blue one off at the end of 16 years of sht, and the Redknapp season cost us £80m in wages and £20m on players - and was still very dull for long stretches. QPR are now what they've been for the vast majority of the last 30 years.
- Social media. As said, gives that dickhead who sits behind you the same platform as everybody else. Uprisings against players and managers seem to grow much faster as a result. Three months ago I think there were one or two posters on here thought Onuoha was sht, now he's the worst player who's ever played for us, and that's all Facebook, Twitter etc mobilising extreme views.
- Computer games. The amount of people who seem to think that Fifa or Football Manager is how it really works, and because they got QPR promoted they know about training or formations and can barrack managers or players accordingly, is really depressing. You, I, we, have no fcking idea how to put on a basic training session, set up a professional team, cope with the set up of an opposing team. Even a fcking knob like Paul Hart could drink us under the table. Supporters aren't idiots, and I hate that "I'm a football person so I know and you're not so you don't" Steve Claridge attitude, but we need to be realistic.
- Our board. It has tried to solve every problem with 1 manager change and 6 signings so often we now expect it and demand it when it doesn't happen. The fact it doesn't work has occurred to nobody.
- Media coverage. The sport as a whole is much more about instant results. Four games without a win is a crisis now when it barely even registered 20 years ago.
- Disposable society - Not working, get rid. Clothes, furniture, electronics, football managers, football players. Except the latter two are humans.
- Player wages. It's made them feel like fair game. If Gladwin was on £250 a week nobody would say anything, but we all know he's not. There are some very mediocre footballers getting very rich currently, lots of them at QPR in recent years, and its bred real anger and resentment. Some of that is deserved - Bosingwa, Barton, SWP etc stole a living here. But that's not the case for everybody.
This post has been edited by an administrator
Let it out fella...
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:41 - Jan 18 with 2442 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:16 - Jan 18 by Northernr
This is a good post which I agree with. I don't see how we improve as a support base if we just blindly go along with the "we're QPR so we're brilliant innit" because there have clearly been times recently when we haven't been brilliant.
We have barracked our manager for his substitutions in a game we won 3-0 so badly that the opposition manager came down the touchline and tap him on the shoulder in solidarity.
We have chanted "off off off" when the referee was booking one of our own players.
We have booed our own players onto the pitch when they come on as a sub - more than one occasion, more than one player.
Neil Warnock and Ian Holloway have now both said they are letting players go (Leigertwood, Gladwin) because the crowd at QPR are making it impossible for them to play.
We have booed our team during a match they weren't losing with 20 minutes still left to play (Blackburn H).
To be honest, I don't give a flying fck if other clubs do the same, we shouldn't be doing sht like this, nor should we be accepting it from ourselves. We need to be better than this. It's difficult enough for QPR to win football games, we should be giving them every possible advantage to do so rather than making it more difficult. And whichever way you slice it, all the above behaviour makes it more difficult for QPR to win games.
Come on Clive, wasn't aware who you were back in the day but does Chris Choo Choo Barker ring any bells?
Doesn't make it right but we've all pitched in at some time or other, it's an emotional sport. Its the mixture of anger and joy that makes this game what it is.
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:49 - Jan 18 with 2427 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:45 - Jan 18 by stevec
Come on Clive, wasn't aware who you were back in the day but does Chris Choo Choo Barker ring any bells?
Doesn't make it right but we've all pitched in at some time or other, it's an emotional sport. Its the mixture of anger and joy that makes this game what it is.
Yeh Barker was awful but I don't remember him getting the level of abuse Henry does. Rehman did maybe, from that team.
Turning it back further I remember a time when the most horrific abuse at our ground went the way of players on other teams - Sinton, Adams etc. Now the stand out incidents in my mind (Terry apart) are when we've done it to our own players. Maybe that is the same everywhere, and again I suspect it comes back to the ticket prices and wages point.
But, again, the most relevant point for me is that it's hard enough for QPR to win games and we should do everything we can to help them do that. Barracking our own players doesn't help in any way.
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Ben Gladwin.................. on 21:54 - Jan 18 with 2353 views
Ben Gladwin.................. on 20:49 - Jan 18 by Northernr
Yeh Barker was awful but I don't remember him getting the level of abuse Henry does. Rehman did maybe, from that team.
Turning it back further I remember a time when the most horrific abuse at our ground went the way of players on other teams - Sinton, Adams etc. Now the stand out incidents in my mind (Terry apart) are when we've done it to our own players. Maybe that is the same everywhere, and again I suspect it comes back to the ticket prices and wages point.
But, again, the most relevant point for me is that it's hard enough for QPR to win games and we should do everything we can to help them do that. Barracking our own players doesn't help in any way.
One of the few players I recall that managed to turn it round from being the main scapegoat and boo boy to cult figure/hero was Paul Furlong. The abuse he was getting when we lost 4-0 to Cardiff and then Vauxhall Motors was horrendous...
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