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"The battle for the next election and many more to come will be over the center ground more than anything else."
What a depressing thought.
A generation or more of bland career politicians arguing over nuance, afraid to put forward any opinions, policies or long term solutions for fear of upsetting the markets, the media or the mythical middle England voter. Instead they'll flip flop around to whatever the opinion poll du jour is for or against, use more neutral, meaningless phrases like "aspirant voters" instead of coming up with actual policies, apply short term sticking plasters to long term problems and allow the outcome of every election to be decided by an ever decreasing number of voters in a handful of marginal seats.
So,pretty much like we have today.
Say what you want about Jeremy Corbyn but at least he stands for something and will provide an opposition to the government and challenge the narrative that we have to have less public services, lower wages and a harsher benefits system otherwise we will end up worse than Greece.
At least it would give voters a real choice at the election rather than the choice of letting the Tories do what the Tories do again or letting Labour try to do what the Tories do but just a little bit slower and bit less harsh.
Ok, so Corbyn gets elected Labour leader. Views out of much with the general public despite the claims of the vocal minority - Milliband moved towards the left, rejected by the public.
Labour only became electable by the reforming work of Smith and Kinnock. Granted Blair was a bellend but at least he knew what dyed in the wool socialists seem unable to accept - their dogma has had it's day.
Ok, so Corbyn gets elected Labour leader. Views out of much with the general public despite the claims of the vocal minority - Milliband moved towards the left, rejected by the public.
Labour only became electable by the reforming work of Smith and Kinnock. Granted Blair was a bellend but at least he knew what dyed in the wool socialists seem unable to accept - their dogma has had it's day.
Ed Miliband wasn't rejected because of his politics. He was rejected because he was widely perceived as a nasal speaking, political nerd that was completely out of his depth. People didn't think he could be prime minister and it had all to do with his perception and appearance and very little to do with his politics.
I knocked doors for months before the election and the complaint that the Labour Party was too left wing literally never came up as an issue. It didn't come up with floating voters and it certainly didn't come up with what you'd describe as typical Labour voters. The only evidence that suggests he was is that misnomer of a nickname.
That doesn't mean that the party moving to the left is without electoral consequence. Ed had many problems but being too left leaning wasn't it.
Ed Miliband wasn't rejected because of his politics. He was rejected because he was widely perceived as a nasal speaking, political nerd that was completely out of his depth. People didn't think he could be prime minister and it had all to do with his perception and appearance and very little to do with his politics.
I knocked doors for months before the election and the complaint that the Labour Party was too left wing literally never came up as an issue. It didn't come up with floating voters and it certainly didn't come up with what you'd describe as typical Labour voters. The only evidence that suggests he was is that misnomer of a nickname.
That doesn't mean that the party moving to the left is without electoral consequence. Ed had many problems but being too left leaning wasn't it.
"Ed had many problems but being too left leaning wasn't it"
"Ed had many problems but being too left leaning wasn't it"
Exhibit A M'lud...
Am I the only one who thinks that this was the most complete display of collective retardedness from the British people. They might as well have got a photo of him sneezing and said "look what a c*ck he is"
Seriously I can't believe the British people fell for it.
Am I the only one who thinks that this was the most complete display of collective retardedness from the British people. They might as well have got a photo of him sneezing and said "look what a c*ck he is"
Seriously I can't believe the British people fell for it.
Well I thought it was a bit out of line - a man of Jewish descent eating bacon....
I'll get me coat.
On a serious note - him and Ed Balls in charge? No way, Jose!
Ed Miliband wasn't rejected because of his politics. He was rejected because he was widely perceived as a nasal speaking, political nerd that was completely out of his depth. People didn't think he could be prime minister and it had all to do with his perception and appearance and very little to do with his politics.
I knocked doors for months before the election and the complaint that the Labour Party was too left wing literally never came up as an issue. It didn't come up with floating voters and it certainly didn't come up with what you'd describe as typical Labour voters. The only evidence that suggests he was is that misnomer of a nickname.
That doesn't mean that the party moving to the left is without electoral consequence. Ed had many problems but being too left leaning wasn't it.
Depends where you knocked on doors. Locally? Well Wales loves the left see, you vote for a half eaten Chicken Tikka Masala if it had a Labour rosette. Coz it's what their parents did, grandparents did etc.
Of course Red Ed was moving Labour to the left. That was the quid pro quo for the union vote that won him the job. It's a mistake only to believe he was rejected due to being a backstabbing dweeb with the personality of a Mr Bean clone missing the charisma DNA. It's that mistake which will feed into the next mistake, ie Corbyn getting elected Labour leader. When that fails Labourites will then want to go further left...
Smith and Kinnock laid the groundwork for Labour to be electable. They grasped the problem Labour had and still has.
Depends where you knocked on doors. Locally? Well Wales loves the left see, you vote for a half eaten Chicken Tikka Masala if it had a Labour rosette. Coz it's what their parents did, grandparents did etc.
Of course Red Ed was moving Labour to the left. That was the quid pro quo for the union vote that won him the job. It's a mistake only to believe he was rejected due to being a backstabbing dweeb with the personality of a Mr Bean clone missing the charisma DNA. It's that mistake which will feed into the next mistake, ie Corbyn getting elected Labour leader. When that fails Labourites will then want to go further left...
Smith and Kinnock laid the groundwork for Labour to be electable. They grasped the problem Labour had and still has.
Knocked doors in Gower, Swansea East, Vale of Glamorgan, Cardiff Central, Cardiff North, and did an evening in Broxtowe. Mainly in South Wales but only two of those seats finished as Labour so hardly in the echo chamber with the yellow dog democrats. I spoke to hundereds, probably thousands of different people from different demographics yetI didn't speak to a single person who had previously voted labour but was now voting Tory because the party was too left wing. Not one.
The suggestion that labour people always vote labour just because has never been more false in today's political landscape. The core vote went UKIP and Green. And of course all of those people perpetually voting Tory in the Home Counties are making fair, rounded and objective decisions that have absolutely nothing to do with family and local tradition...
The union vote did win him the election. However once elected he did very little to uphold his end of the bargain because of course the relationship between Ed and the Unions was completely rosy.
I can't think of an issue where the party was too left wing for Middle England. I genuinely would be interested to hear your suggestions on what issues you think we were too left wing on.
In a weird way I'm glad Ed Balls lost his seat. He was politically toxic & his last name is balls.
Nowt weird about that. The guy may have 'studied' at Harvard, but the guy is useless. Moved from post to post to keep him from being a trouble maker in the back benches.
Knocked doors in Gower, Swansea East, Vale of Glamorgan, Cardiff Central, Cardiff North, and did an evening in Broxtowe. Mainly in South Wales but only two of those seats finished as Labour so hardly in the echo chamber with the yellow dog democrats. I spoke to hundereds, probably thousands of different people from different demographics yetI didn't speak to a single person who had previously voted labour but was now voting Tory because the party was too left wing. Not one.
The suggestion that labour people always vote labour just because has never been more false in today's political landscape. The core vote went UKIP and Green. And of course all of those people perpetually voting Tory in the Home Counties are making fair, rounded and objective decisions that have absolutely nothing to do with family and local tradition...
The union vote did win him the election. However once elected he did very little to uphold his end of the bargain because of course the relationship between Ed and the Unions was completely rosy.
I can't think of an issue where the party was too left wing for Middle England. I genuinely would be interested to hear your suggestions on what issues you think we were too left wing on.
Biggest one for me was the topic of self employment. It's a growing area and one that I do. Not for tax evasion purposes as some lefties would claim but for the freedom of running my own business.
When PCG ( now I believe IPSE ) interviewed all the PM candidates asking for their comments on what they'd offer such businesses.
All the comments were in columns across a double page spread of the PCG magazine.
Except for one.
Red Ed had failed to respond, fitting in with his view that people were only self employed because employers were, well, b'stards.
Biggest one for me was the topic of self employment. It's a growing area and one that I do. Not for tax evasion purposes as some lefties would claim but for the freedom of running my own business.
When PCG ( now I believe IPSE ) interviewed all the PM candidates asking for their comments on what they'd offer such businesses.
All the comments were in columns across a double page spread of the PCG magazine.
Except for one.
Red Ed had failed to respond, fitting in with his view that people were only self employed because employers were, well, b'stards.
Why would you automatically assume that 'lefties' would claim it's for tax evasion purposes? Are they (we) all bitter, jealous creatures who begrudge anyone success? I'm hoping to get a sideline doing wedding videos off the ground at some point when I have time to get a website sorted and look into self promotion, SEO etc. I'd love to have the freedom of being self employed at some point in the future.
Tax evasion by corporations is a different beast IMHO.
I've never heard of PCG or IPSE either so just Googled it out of curiosity and after a (very) quick search came across these posts in their site.
Why would you automatically assume that 'lefties' would claim it's for tax evasion purposes? Are they (we) all bitter, jealous creatures who begrudge anyone success? I'm hoping to get a sideline doing wedding videos off the ground at some point when I have time to get a website sorted and look into self promotion, SEO etc. I'd love to have the freedom of being self employed at some point in the future.
Tax evasion by corporations is a different beast IMHO.
I've never heard of PCG or IPSE either so just Googled it out of curiosity and after a (very) quick search came across these posts in their site.
I'm no Labour voter, ergo no fan of 'Red Ed' either - I just don't get where you're coming from with your last sentence
I'd say pledging equal rights whilst being the only party leader to deliberately snub an opportunity to put forward their case to the self employed is an interesting scenario.
There was at times a schizophrenic approach by Labour to the self-employed.
Notional things like pensions and maternity pay are all very well and good for the self-employed, reality is it's for the self employed to fund. If run as a limited company, then set up a pension scheme and contribute to that. Ditto maternity pay.
After all, if Labour expected end clients to fund those directly, then it's a case of disguised employment - something Labour seemed to get a stiffy over. Hence the ineffective and widely laughed at IR35 legislation. Those of us running legitimate businesses as businesses have never had a problem.
Granted certain sectors ( looking at you, construction ) took the urine big time...
Ok, so Corbyn gets elected Labour leader. Views out of much with the general public despite the claims of the vocal minority - Milliband moved towards the left, rejected by the public.
Labour only became electable by the reforming work of Smith and Kinnock. Granted Blair was a bellend but at least he knew what dyed in the wool socialists seem unable to accept - their dogma has had it's day.
"Milliband moved Labour left, rejected by the public." - You are oversimplifying what happened at the last election just a smidge there.
If the Labour vote went en masse to the Tories you would maybe have a point but it didn't, in fact the Tory vote hardly moved and Labour's vote increased slightly - hardly an overwhelming rejection of Labour's shift to the left.
Labour's vote went to the SNP, UKIP, the Greens, to a lesser extent Plaid and the minority left parties or they just stayed at home. The SNP and Greens outflanked Labour on the left, UKIP were seen as the anti-politics party, in touch with ordinary people and outside of the Westminster bubble and those who stayed at home are disillusioned with the whole process because there are no differences between the 2 main parties.
Labour need to win these voters back before they can even think about courting the people who voted Tory at the last election , they are hardly going to come flocking back if Liz Kendall is the leader are they?
Labour probably won't win the next election but if they can unify the left behind the party and boost the membership numbers we will have a better base to build on as well as proving an effective opposition in this Parliament. Jeremy Corbyn is the only candidate I trust to be able to do that.
If man evolved from monkeys why do we still have monkeys?
Degsy Hatton is now back in the LABOUR party having made enough money flogging large property in Cyprus, so Jez will be truly leading a body of people interesting in the working class/ordinary people
Degsy Hatton is now back in the LABOUR party having made enough money flogging large property in Cyprus, so Jez will be truly leading a body of people interesting in the working class/ordinary people
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