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Saints V Liverpool The Verdict
Saints V Liverpool The Verdict
Sunday, 17th Mar 2013 09:53

I said on Friday I had a sneaking suspicion that we would win this one and luckily I was proved right, sadly I didnt put my money where my mouth was at the bookies.

Saints desperately needed to win this one, a look at this mornings league table shows how much trouble we would be in if we had lost, although we would still have been four points ahead of Wigan, their two games in hand would be crucial, however there is no need to contemplate that further now as we won and we won well.

Selecting a man of the match would be difficult, it would be easier to list those that didnt put in a performance of that standard, in my mind though the players that really did put in that extra % were Jack Cork, Adam Lallana & Jay Rodriguez.

Cork ran the centre of the midfield and I stand by my claim a few weeks ago that he will be the next Saints player to win an England cap and this performance in front of Roy Hodgson will do those chances no harm, Adam Lallana who has already made one England squad will have again boosted his chances, he ran at the Liverpool defence and probed.

 A special mention for Jay Rodriguez, here is a player who is out of position, rather than as an out and out striker he has to do a lot of work out wide, but this performance really saw him start to come of age as a Saints player, his header down for the opener was sublime and straight out of the Rickie Lambert drawer and his goal and Saints third that killed off the game was again one that SL would have been proud of, he ran at the Liverpool defence and got his just rewards.

 Running at Liverpool was perhaps where we did for them, too many times this season we have had plenty of pretty build up play but its lacked that cutting edge, there were those that would have preferred to see Jason Puncheon in ahead of Rodriguez but it seems that MoPo has seen what I have felt with Puncheon, at times he can be effective but too many times there is no end product, with Rodriguez it seems that the manager is giving him confidence to run at the opposition and thats paying dividencds.

But it wasnt just the forward play that shone, defensively we were in general tight and when we were breached Artur Boruc was in superb form, it wasnt just the vital saves he made, but the way he commanded his area confidently, earlier in the season there would be a lot of those ball into our box causing us trouble, but oruc handles everything in a calm manner.

The two full backs were outstanding, Shaw still lacks a few things in his game, but those things will come in time and he is now starting to have the confidence to get forward, when he makes runs he is fast, he still lacks the final ball, but he can learn that as his confidence grows.

Overall though this was about a great team performance and the manager made the right substitution at the right time, taking off Ramirez who was inneffective and bringing on Davis whose running and tidying up took the sting out of Liverpool's initial second half bluster.

Only strange thing was our bench, for a side playing at home, having two central defenders on it was strange as was the fact that there no forwards on it, and finally the last substitution when Guly came on was one for the conspiracy theorists, now I have been a defender of Guly, but 3-1 up with 5 minutes left, surely Puncheon who has been a regualr or even Ward-Prowse who is a player who can keep the ball would have been a better bet.  

But thats only a minor aside, this was a great result that puts us over the 30 points barrier and leaves us with the finishing line in sight, one win and four draws should be enough or two wins and a single draw out of our final eight games, on paper it looks a simple task, but as we have seen in recent weeks although we have the basis of a good side, we are still short in some areas and we shouldnt count our chickens till they are hatched.   

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Ddobsy added 10:41 - Mar 17
I thought he brought Guly on for addition height at the end. Puncheon would have added great pace, but Liverpool are good from set pieces and we need to ensure we had a presence in the box. I agree Liverpool stopped Ramierez, but all our first half chances involved him in some way. They just picked him up better once they replaced Joe Allen.
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chalks82 added 11:05 - Mar 17
Fully agree with the above. Really annoyed though with the posts in the nationals, comments on Liverpool forums, pundits, as well as some of the disbelieving Saints fans that regularly post comments. I've watched 90 minutes of every Saints game since Poch took over and we could have got a result from any of them. Unfortunately there are too many people that only watch the highlights and don't realise how much Saints are dominating sides and playing entertaining football. Comments from Fergie, Martinez and others realise that they have played a very good side and even Houghton last week admitted his side were lucky to get a drawer, however is it a coincidence that all of these sides had an off day. Poch has inherited a group of players that he hasn't chosen and has playing to his style. I know that we will survive and can't wait to see what he can do when he can pick players in the transfer market that are suited to this style of play, quick, good feet and bags of energy.
Brilliant to be a Saints fan at the moment, every game is winnable but also has the element of danger in that we could concede, on the edge of my seat all through the games.
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SaintNick added 11:15 - Mar 17
I agree with Chalks, our problem though is that we are about 75% of where we need to be as a side, we still need two new centre backs, the ones we have are decent back ups but if we truly want to move forward we need to get in better quality.

We also need a couple of good wide players
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slynch added 11:15 - Mar 17
With football a bit thin on the ground this weekend Southampton supporters were treated to a training game against a team of referees from up North somewhere. They had fashioned their team colours on their favourite, team Saints, so had to wear their blacks for the game. Pochettino's dogs set about them in their normal way and the refs were soon being shown valuable lessons; with some of the younger members not able to make it the old stalwart Garrard, or someone was soon shown by Spiderman that if you want to score you have to run the length of the pitch and tap it in, not struggle to half way and blast it over the bar. On the wing their fastest player called Stowage, I think, was being out-strolled by Clyne; he only got through once when Clyne confused him with the linesman. Boruc (aka Loadsamoney) let them have some shooting practice at one point and they enjoyed that, but the day out was a little spoiled by their little centre forward who had a bit of a tantrum when he couldn't get the ball off Hooi and Cork.
At the other end Lambo and JRod gave them a showboat of goal scoring before everyone decided they all had had a good day in the rain and retired for a well earned hot shower. It was said that one of their players, Cootiswho(?), walked into the wrong dressing room, but it turned out that he had just walked into the wrong team.
Football continues to be a bit thin for the next to weeks so Cortese has arranged another training match against a scratch 11 from Harrods; I think they play in blue.
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ItchenNorth added 12:36 - Mar 17
Really hard to pick a MotM as right across the team we played superbly. I’d probably go for Clyne as he had Suarez in his pocket all game.
A good assessment of the game Nick but I felt somewhat only spoilt by your comment singling out Gaston Ramirez as ineffective! I was gobsmacked when Gaston was dragged off on 54mins as for the first 45 he was outstanding. Lively in and around the box, delivering quality balls in from wide when pulled outside (ball to JRod for the Snider set up for starters was brilliant !). His ball retention is top draw. Yes you can say the result vindicates the strategy but for me you don’t take off one of your best players after 54mins and invite teams on. Luckily Liverpool were not at the races and this didn’t materialize! Away from home maybe but not at home playing the way we were. Davies, as with all others that took to the field did a fantastic job yesterday but for me we should have kept Gaston on far longer as I believe the 3rd goal would have come far sooner if he was on the pitch. The tactic is right but for me the timing wrong

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geezershoong added 12:49 - Mar 17
I think Clyne deserved a mention, Liverpool are dangerous down the flanks but he didn't put a foot wrong all game. Luke Shaw's running at the 'Pool defence was also a delight to see.
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thegeneral added 12:56 - Mar 17
Very much agree with Chalks comments, when we turn over a big team the press will have you believe that Liverpool lost it rather than us winning it. They lost because we shut them down, hassled, harried and took their key players out the game. MOTD highlights didn't really show how we dominated for such long periods.
There is still some work to do on the players belief in themselves, the goal before half time definately shook us. I still maintain that none of our CB's are good enough, they are very lucky to have two superb players in front of them in Cork and Schniederlin. For me Cork is our player of the season.
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simmo400 added 13:32 - Mar 17
Well played clyne was MOTM easy. Rodregues reminds me of kevin davies when we first signed him.
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DJI added 13:53 - Mar 17
Spot on Nick, fully agree with everything you've said.

I've come to the conclusion that the reason why our new style beats top sides and not others is because top side are used to being the attacking dominant ones and not used to be attacked so dominantly. Whereas lesser sides are used to defending and relying on set pieces to get them a goal.

As for ItchenNorth's comment about the substitution of Ramirez; his ball retention is not top drawer as he got it nicked from him many times yesterday (and in other games) and he was not the only one making chances yesterday. At half time, Rodgers took off a light-weight Joe Allen and replaced him with Lucas to try and get a grip in midfield. At that point, the flair of Ramirez wasn't going to be effective as LFC started to get some of the ball. So quickly changing to Davis assured that we got control in the midfield once more as MP also moved his front men around to adapt to the change. After that, we held possession again and created many more chances with Jay Rod and Shaw driving them in particular. For me, a good, decisive change at the right time to ensure LFC didn't get back into the game and gives us a platform to score again.
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SaintinHolland added 14:53 - Mar 17
First post from me. Just wanted to say a big thanks for your time and effort with the site and postings Nick. Always enjoy your posts.
I felt especially compelled to post today as I felt Artur Boruc deserves a special mention. Given the situation earlier in the season I still cant help but feel extremely nervous any time there is any activity in and around our goal but yesterday Boruc was absolutely sublime. The man was pure superglue. He absorbed everything that entered his vicinity and commanded the area superbly.
Right now he's looking like a real class act. long may that continue. Of course yesterday we were superb right across the park but felt that Boruc deserved special praise as it seems in general (your post excluded Nick) that his contibution has gone largely unpraised.
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ItchenNorth added 14:53 - Mar 17
DJ; every player has the ball nicked from then in any game. Im not suggesting Ramirez was exempt for this at all or that he was the only one making things happen, but he was making things happen for us. I just think that after a great 45 making this change was way to early. You expect any team after scoring such a late 1st half goal to come at you in the opening stages of the 2nd, I just happen to think its more risky to invite teams on so early by changing what had been working fantastically well in the first. Bottom line is the change worked because we won but id argue that its wrong to say Ramirez was inneffective.
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davepid added 15:32 - Mar 17
We are in a dog fight.Have beenall season and we may yet get relegated. Ive been proud of the way weve played and the spirit shown all season (except for the Sunderland and QPR home games and WestBrom and Everton away). Im particularly pleased that our Div 1 survivors have made it in the premiership (Lambert,Llanana,Spiderman and Fonte) and that weve found another outstanding player in Shaw. Great time to be a Saints fan.
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SaintNick added 15:56 - Mar 17
Welcome SaintinHolland, your right about Boruc he gets everything, for the first time in a long long time I actually want corners to be inswinging because he comes and gets them.

PS what part of Holland are you in
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SaintinHolland added 16:25 - Mar 17
Cheers Nick. I live in Apeldoorn. It's quite central. Been living here just over 3 years now. Unfortunately getting over to see my beloved Saints is a bit expensive but I do get to watch them every week via a live stream. Sometimes the quality is a bit dodgy but as long as I get to see them I'm happy.
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ExiledSupporter added 16:32 - Mar 17
I agree with the sentiments above that rather than our better class opponents playing poorly/having off days there must be something about our pressure game that reduces them to a lower standard of passing and movement. Nevertheless it's rather difficult to explain how we forced Barry to put the ball into his own net under no pressure and Hart to make such a gross error in handling the ball or the Liverpool wall to become so porous in the face of Lambert's free kick?

But what do we make of the decision to start with Hooiveld in preference to Fonte which I can't imagine many of us would have predicted given Suarez's nimble feet and Jos's slow turn. Clearly Yoshida is in MP's mind the leading central defender (except at Norwich) and Forren must seem even less likely to play at the moment.

Can someone help me resolve this conundrum?
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slynch added 17:34 - Mar 17
Conundrum:
I think: that you may think, and certainly others do think - that Hooi is a worser player than he is. He is judged from some early season play, ogs etc, These were as a result of poor central midfield cover alllowing shots to rain-in that he was left with no alternative but to lunge at and also covering the inadequacies and absenteeism of certain players around him. The new manager has, from their own mouths, taught the midfield a new positional guile to compliment their previously misguided but commendable, over enthusiasm. This and the promotion of better players to the back line has allowed Hooi to concentrate on his real role and is easily as good if not better than Fonte and Yosh. Yosh has abilities that he and Fonte do not have and vice versa so choosing 2 out of the 3 is going to have some random elements to it. Hooi might not be as quick to turn as Yosh but his long legs have a long range! Furthermore, his ariel ability is much superior than Yosh and set-pieces don't have the dread that they do when he's not playing and he's quite good up the other end as well!
Having seen Forren play he seems more of a sub to Spiderman or Cork at the mo than cover at the back. Time will tell.
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saintnathan added 13:06 - Mar 18
FAO: SaintinHolland. Just felt compelled to say that Apeldoorn is one of my favourite places in the whole world! I used go there a lot with animal care students. We used to stay at the Youth Hostel there (De Grote Beer?). Visited Apenheul of course, which is fabulous. Lovely town, lovely people, beautiful surrounding forest, fantastic cake shops! - one in particular did this custard, creamy, banana thing! I'm very envious that you live there....

....Oh yeah ..... fabulous destruction of Liverpool. Well done boys!
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SaintJez added 17:11 - Mar 18
A famous win for Saints! Liverpool may not quite be the team of old but any time you outclass them, it's an occassion to be savoured. Well done boys. 3 thoroughly deserved points and any pundit that says Liverpool were poor is missing the point. Saints were simply better in every position.

The international break now arrives at any interesting time. Almost the entire Chelsea squad will be sent far and wide representing their various countries whereas Saints, largely overlooked on the international stage, will have most of the squad together for 2 weeks rest, training and preparation for the big challenges that lie ahead - starting with Chelsea in 2 weeks time. It's still a massive ask to get anything out of that game but we should go in full of confidence, rested and ready to give our all.

The future's bright..
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big_buddaH added 03:06 - Mar 19
I agree, it was a great win (down to Saints playing well, not Liverpool having a bad day), and a good time to be a Saints fan.

Since MP has come in, I think we can win any game, and I think this is a message he gives to the players. And yes, the good teams seem to suffer playing against our style. However, on the other hand we can also lose games to anyone, as missed chances and defensive errors take there toll. Definitely edge of the seat stuff, but we are playing better than many of the teams around us.

While Puncheon has played well at times, he is also ineffectual at others. He doesn't have enough pace to go down the wing, and only takes the ball towards goal when he receives it in plenty of space. The rest of the time he meanders inside going across the field, or relies on Clyne overlapping. I believe MP has curbed Clyne's attacking, as early in the season we played with both full backs too far forward, exposing our central defenders who are too slow. Shaw gets to do most of the attacking now, as he is probably better than Clyne (who may be the better defender). Also, J-Rod is more direct, and now gets some time in the middle as Lambert plays out wide for periods of the game. This has worked out well. J-Rod bought to be an eventual replacement for RL, and yet never gets to play in that position (and playing poorly on the wing). Now with some time in a more central role, he is playing better and getting goals.

Not sure I agree with Nick on the need for 2 CBs and 2 widemen. The trouble with wingers is they can often be game winners, but most of the time they can be passengers. You have to pick very carefully. As far as the CBs go, yes we could do better. But the NA style exposed them too much, and all of them looked very poor early in the season. Now, all of them look good for most of the time, but equally, all are prone to making mistakes - gratefully less than before. What we need is one CB who is dominant in the air, and one who is good at reading the game and is very fast. Do we have that combination in the 4 currently at the club? How much would 2 Premier League class CBs cost? We spent 3.5M on one who can't get in the first team!!! Dawson was quoted at 8M, and Samba cost 12M. Hopefully Forren will be the solution, but something is wrong there for him not to get a look-in after 2 months.

One area where we need vast improvement is delivery from corners and free-kicks. Fox is probably the best, but having the left back taking corners on the right leaves the defence exposed to a fast break.

MP said the other day that 11 players were going to be absent during the international break, can't for the life of me think who they would be (U-21s and fringe players?), but I think it should be beneficial to springing a surprise on Chelski.

Sorry about the long post, but nice to discuss football topics in this section wih serious supporters, and leave the adolescent drivel to the forum.
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