| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 18:56 - Sep 28 with 4221 views | QPRSteve |
Agreed, but not surprising. |  | |  |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 08:40 - Sep 29 with 3994 views | DWQPR |
Excuse me for being a tad naive but isn’t this a bit of a non-story? Given that Skybet are the league sponsor and assuming some of that money comes to the clubs wouldn’t Skybet make their money on gamblers losses? In the same way as when we were sponsored by the likes of Royal Panda we were paid money from their profits coming from gamblers profits, or going back 40 years took money from a major drinks manufacturer which was profits no doubt from some people who had a drink problem? | |
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| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:32 - Sep 29 with 3954 views | slmrstid |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 08:40 - Sep 29 by DWQPR |
Excuse me for being a tad naive but isn’t this a bit of a non-story? Given that Skybet are the league sponsor and assuming some of that money comes to the clubs wouldn’t Skybet make their money on gamblers losses? In the same way as when we were sponsored by the likes of Royal Panda we were paid money from their profits coming from gamblers profits, or going back 40 years took money from a major drinks manufacturer which was profits no doubt from some people who had a drink problem? |
I guess the difference here is this is a bit like a commission surely?
Yes with other gambling sponsorships we're having of course to pay for it the betting company is making profits - but its a straight-up commercial deal of £X per season not related to customer activities.
This reads to me like customers on SkyBet have on their profile who they support, and then clubs are getting a commission of a set percentage of all the money that customer loses with SkyBet. Which is a bit morally dubious at best.
There's two lads who sit behind me at QPR who spend the entire game betting on their phones, not just on the QPR game happening in front of them but other games everywhere else. They must spend an absolute fortune every match with the totals they talk about. Makes me cringe to be honest. Still if this is true and they're using SkyBet they're probably helping to subsidise our wage bill so... |  | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:42 - Sep 29 with 3941 views | Northernr |
We've been offered similar deals from bookies on here from time to time - run adverts in the match previews, anybody who signs up and loses we'll get a cut. Refused naturally.
Unfortunatrly the way Google ads work we do still get bookies ads on the top. |  | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:51 - Sep 29 with 3919 views | robith |
The affiliate model is widespread - be sceptical of any twitter tipster pushing sign up offers.
But also - we don't have safe gambling at all in this country cos the bookies will cut you off if you win. How can you have safe gambling if the industry is rigging it so they only get losers?
I landed a couple of touches with Skybet at Cheltenham 2020 and now the max they'll let me stake is 27p, but someone else will be allowed to throw thousands at rigged virtual poker.
The bookies' greed has ruined it for everyone and created a huge societal problem |  | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 11:25 - Sep 29 with 3803 views | NottsQPR |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:51 - Sep 29 by robith |
The affiliate model is widespread - be sceptical of any twitter tipster pushing sign up offers.
But also - we don't have safe gambling at all in this country cos the bookies will cut you off if you win. How can you have safe gambling if the industry is rigging it so they only get losers?
I landed a couple of touches with Skybet at Cheltenham 2020 and now the max they'll let me stake is 27p, but someone else will be allowed to throw thousands at rigged virtual poker.
The bookies' greed has ruined it for everyone and created a huge societal problem |
Any gambling company is paying for sponsorship out of their profits, which is basically the same thing. I struggle with the holier than thou aspect of the criticism of bookmaker sponsors, most people rave about our Guinness top which is open to all the same abuse.
Like most things, it's everything in moderation. I'm a very small stakes gambler, set a very strict budget and understand fully that 'tipsters' will share account opening deals for a cut of the profit. I totally understand that some may be tempted to chase losses/gamble more than they should, but there is genuinely so much awareness of this raised by the industry now compared to years ago. | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 12:37 - Sep 29 with 3703 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:32 - Sep 29 by slmrstid |
I guess the difference here is this is a bit like a commission surely?
Yes with other gambling sponsorships we're having of course to pay for it the betting company is making profits - but its a straight-up commercial deal of £X per season not related to customer activities.
This reads to me like customers on SkyBet have on their profile who they support, and then clubs are getting a commission of a set percentage of all the money that customer loses with SkyBet. Which is a bit morally dubious at best.
There's two lads who sit behind me at QPR who spend the entire game betting on their phones, not just on the QPR game happening in front of them but other games everywhere else. They must spend an absolute fortune every match with the totals they talk about. Makes me cringe to be honest. Still if this is true and they're using SkyBet they're probably helping to subsidise our wage bill so... |
Sorry, that's nonsense, no where do you have to put which team you support to sign up for an account with a bookmaker.
Its just a profit share, as without the clubs there is no market.
Same as horseracing a percentage of what everyone 'loses' goes back to the racing industry - difference?
Its been stopped now anyway, but hey, takes our mind of the important issues for a bit I guess.
Oh, mentioned before, but in case anyone has missed it, Sky don't own SkyBet any more - they receive licence fee from Flutter for use of the logo/goodwill/customer base etc (Owners of Paddy power amongst others) who do own the company/brand now. | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 13:13 - Sep 29 with 3671 views | slmrstid |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 12:37 - Sep 29 by PinnerPaul |
Sorry, that's nonsense, no where do you have to put which team you support to sign up for an account with a bookmaker.
Its just a profit share, as without the clubs there is no market.
Same as horseracing a percentage of what everyone 'loses' goes back to the racing industry - difference?
Its been stopped now anyway, but hey, takes our mind of the important issues for a bit I guess.
Oh, mentioned before, but in case anyone has missed it, Sky don't own SkyBet any more - they receive licence fee from Flutter for use of the logo/goodwill/customer base etc (Owners of Paddy power amongst others) who do own the company/brand now. |
"Sorry, that's nonsense, no where do you have to put which team you support to sign up for an account with a bookmaker."
I don't know because I don't have a SkyBet, I did make it clear I was making a guesstimate.
Either way, the idea of clubs getting a profit share of something they are sponsored by is very dubious at best, and even if its stopped shouldn't protect them from criticism when gambling is so heavily promoted within the game and at every single ground. | | | |
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| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 13:14 - Sep 29 with 3666 views | Northernr |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 12:37 - Sep 29 by PinnerPaul |
Sorry, that's nonsense, no where do you have to put which team you support to sign up for an account with a bookmaker.
Its just a profit share, as without the clubs there is no market.
Same as horseracing a percentage of what everyone 'loses' goes back to the racing industry - difference?
Its been stopped now anyway, but hey, takes our mind of the important issues for a bit I guess.
Oh, mentioned before, but in case anyone has missed it, Sky don't own SkyBet any more - they receive licence fee from Flutter for use of the logo/goodwill/customer base etc (Owners of Paddy power amongst others) who do own the company/brand now. |
Not sure you're quite right here. I'm sure I've been asked what team I support when signing up before, and "where you heard about us...". And they're definitely able to track where you've come from to sign up, so if you click through from LFW (or the QPR official website) I/they would get a cut of the losses (or at least that's the offer we were given and turned down).
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 13:47 - Sep 29 with 3595 views | BrianMcCarthy |
I think a distinction here would be that - while I'm against both, it would be one thing to take a cut out of a bookie's overall revenue but quite another to take a cut out of the addict's actual losses. |  |
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| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 16:49 - Sep 29 with 3425 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 13:14 - Sep 29 by Northernr |
Not sure you're quite right here. I'm sure I've been asked what team I support when signing up before, and "where you heard about us...". And they're definitely able to track where you've come from to sign up, so if you click through from LFW (or the QPR official website) I/they would get a cut of the losses (or at least that's the offer we were given and turned down).
This post has been edited by an administrator |
OK 2 points - I have never been asked what team I support and 2 surely the split is based on revenue generated by that team's markets, not who bets on them?
Second most important point - if you put your £5 on us winning 3-2 and Dykes scoring a hat trick - surely its better that some of that £5 goes to the club, rather than all to the bookie?
Now although the relationship isn't quite the same as horseracing - no bookies/no horseracing and vice versa, surely its not wrong that the EFL/clubs get some profits generated by them - as I said above no football = no markets for the bookies.
OK, I lied, one more point - the reason bookies 'always win' is because they only have one loser in every race - usually the favourite - otherwise they win.
Makes sense really - correct score - they only pay out on one score, all the others are winners for them.
Its not quite that simple in reality, due to weight of money placed on favourites. certainly in horseracing the favourite winning will usually be a loser for the bookies, 2nd fave, break even, any other result they win. In their accounts, they will, naturally, mention a weekend or two where the top 6 on the PL have all won - those weekends the bookies certainly do lose, like when more favourites than not win at Cheltenham - but those occasions are rare.
I'm sure in a 10 'runner' market we would all take having 8 or 9 picks rather than one - hence the profitability of the industry. | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 16:51 - Sep 29 with 3418 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 13:13 - Sep 29 by slmrstid |
"Sorry, that's nonsense, no where do you have to put which team you support to sign up for an account with a bookmaker."
I don't know because I don't have a SkyBet, I did make it clear I was making a guesstimate.
Either way, the idea of clubs getting a profit share of something they are sponsored by is very dubious at best, and even if its stopped shouldn't protect them from criticism when gambling is so heavily promoted within the game and at every single ground. |
Not being aggy, but why is it 'dubious'? | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 16:55 - Sep 29 with 3403 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 13:47 - Sep 29 by BrianMcCarthy |
I think a distinction here would be that - while I'm against both, it would be one thing to take a cut out of a bookie's overall revenue but quite another to take a cut out of the addict's actual losses. |
Sorry Brian, but how do you know how much/if any profit that would go to the club comes from an 'addict' as opposed to someone 'normal' (Don't laugh) like me? 
As someone said above, its no different to sponsorship - totally disagree that's 'wrong', but respect those who do - just don't see how this is more 'wrong' - in fact thinking about it, its more 'OK' to me!
If you're against the bookies, surely you want more money from them, not less? | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 17:22 - Sep 29 with 3351 views | swisscottage |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:51 - Sep 29 by robith |
The affiliate model is widespread - be sceptical of any twitter tipster pushing sign up offers.
But also - we don't have safe gambling at all in this country cos the bookies will cut you off if you win. How can you have safe gambling if the industry is rigging it so they only get losers?
I landed a couple of touches with Skybet at Cheltenham 2020 and now the max they'll let me stake is 27p, but someone else will be allowed to throw thousands at rigged virtual poker.
The bookies' greed has ruined it for everyone and created a huge societal problem |
Similar.
I can only bet on Betfair, all my accounts were either closed or restricted to pennies.
Even the shop bookies in my area limit my bets to the point I stopped bothering.
They aren't bookmakers, they are purely accountants managing markets with margins.
Any sign someone knows what they're doing they shut you down and won't even take your money on their book, even it it would help balance it.
Massively cut my margin to the point, I couldn't justify the time spent on it financially as it was always supplemental to my day job, so I just gave up horseracing entirely...and there's plenty more 'enthusiasts' like me who just stopped, Given I used to turn over close to 250k a year an add that to others I know who have stopped that's a stack of levy not going to horseracing any more, | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 17:59 - Sep 29 with 3305 views | HAYESBOY |
'Second most important point - if you put your £5 on us winning 3-2 and Dykes scoring a hat trick - surely its better that some of that £5 goes to the club, rather than all to the bookie?'
Think I would feel guilty and hope the person who placed the bet is getting help.  |  |
| Smells like a trout farm in here |
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| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 19:13 - Sep 29 with 3230 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 16:55 - Sep 29 by PinnerPaul |
Sorry Brian, but how do you know how much/if any profit that would go to the club comes from an 'addict' as opposed to someone 'normal' (Don't laugh) like me?
As someone said above, its no different to sponsorship - totally disagree that's 'wrong', but respect those who do - just don't see how this is more 'wrong' - in fact thinking about it, its more 'OK' to me!
If you're against the bookies, surely you want more money from them, not less? |
I know we think differently on this, Paul. I'll have a think about what you said, genuinely will. I suppose my worry is that addicts, some addicts, always get hurt. And if that's an unavoidable by-product of promoting gambling, and it seems to me that it is, then that's not something I'd be comfortable with. | |
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| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 20:38 - Sep 29 with 3176 views | DavieQPR |
We do have a stand named after one of the biggest gamblers of his time. |  | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 08:36 - Sep 30 with 3062 views | slmrstid |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 16:51 - Sep 29 by PinnerPaul |
Not being aggy, but why is it 'dubious'? |
I just find it dubious because gambling is plastered over every football league ground, we have Jeff Stelling on the big screen at every game telling us about how many SkyBet customers know their limits to fill X Sixfields, Y Lofts, Z Deepdales etc, the club social media feeds promote their betting partners at least once a week it seems to me, so the idea they are therefore pushing their fans to be gambling on them because they will make a cut out of it...personally I find it morally dubious at best. Others may be OK with it, down to opinions ultimately. | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:16 - Sep 30 with 3030 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 17:22 - Sep 29 by swisscottage |
Similar.
I can only bet on Betfair, all my accounts were either closed or restricted to pennies.
Even the shop bookies in my area limit my bets to the point I stopped bothering.
They aren't bookmakers, they are purely accountants managing markets with margins.
Any sign someone knows what they're doing they shut you down and won't even take your money on their book, even it it would help balance it.
Massively cut my margin to the point, I couldn't justify the time spent on it financially as it was always supplemental to my day job, so I just gave up horseracing entirely...and there's plenty more 'enthusiasts' like me who just stopped, Given I used to turn over close to 250k a year an add that to others I know who have stopped that's a stack of levy not going to horseracing any more, |
TBF £250K is a pretty hefty turnover, bound to be flagged if you're making even a modest % profit on that sort of turnover. | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:19 - Sep 30 with 3014 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 19:13 - Sep 29 by BrianMcCarthy |
I know we think differently on this, Paul. I'll have a think about what you said, genuinely will. I suppose my worry is that addicts, some addicts, always get hurt. And if that's an unavoidable by-product of promoting gambling, and it seems to me that it is, then that's not something I'd be comfortable with. |
Nothing wrong with opposing views Brian.
Get your point, but then shouldn't the same feelings apply when adding to the drinks industry profits, when you have a drink - plenty more alcohol addicts than gambling ones surely?
As someone said above, warnings plastered all over all gambling advertising/sites/shops - far more than pubs etc | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:22 - Sep 30 with 3003 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 08:36 - Sep 30 by slmrstid |
I just find it dubious because gambling is plastered over every football league ground, we have Jeff Stelling on the big screen at every game telling us about how many SkyBet customers know their limits to fill X Sixfields, Y Lofts, Z Deepdales etc, the club social media feeds promote their betting partners at least once a week it seems to me, so the idea they are therefore pushing their fans to be gambling on them because they will make a cut out of it...personally I find it morally dubious at best. Others may be OK with it, down to opinions ultimately. |
Fair enough, but surely the SkyBet ads are part of the sponsorship deal with the EFL, not a unilateral decision by any club to boost its own coffers? | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:46 - Sep 30 with 2984 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 17:59 - Sep 29 by HAYESBOY |
'Second most important point - if you put your £5 on us winning 3-2 and Dykes scoring a hat trick - surely its better that some of that £5 goes to the club, rather than all to the bookie?'
Think I would feel guilty and hope the person who placed the bet is getting help. |
"Guilty" and "help" after a £5 bet ?- think its safe to say we're on opposite sides of the fence on this one! | | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 00:14 - Oct 1 with 2907 views | HAYESBOY |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:46 - Sep 30 by PinnerPaul |
"Guilty" and "help" after a £5 bet ?- think its safe to say we're on opposite sides of the fence on this one! |
More about the poor person deluded to think that Dykes will get a hattrick. They need help. | |
| Smells like a trout farm in here |
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| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 01:30 - Oct 1 with 2875 views | LythamR |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 09:16 - Sep 30 by PinnerPaul |
TBF £250K is a pretty hefty turnover, bound to be flagged if you're making even a modest % profit on that sort of turnover. |
Restricting selective accounts is wrong though, if they are offering a game it should be open to all within reason after all they make the book
Imagine Bristol CIty turning round to us tomorrow and saying we cant play Willock and Chair together because we win too often when they both play |  | | |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 11:24 - Oct 1 with 2758 views | PinnerPaul |
| Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet on 00:14 - Oct 1 by HAYESBOY |
More about the poor person deluded to think that Dykes will get a hattrick. They need help. |
It was ironic as was yours, no doubt. Have to put this in the "Agree to disagree" pile I think. | | | |
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