| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:20 - Jan 27 with 1325 views | Clinton |
It would be nice to have the ability to have those indented comments like they do on that forum. It makes it easier to follow the various points where you get a point being debated 'to and fro'. Related points can all be followed logically. |  |
| If you can fill the unforgiving minute.
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run,
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son! |
|  |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:26 - Jan 27 with 1310 views | blueytheblue |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:05 - Jan 27 by pencoedjack |
Banned for mentioning he went away with England |
Ah yes, the pepper spray.
Which reminds me; he was soooo insistent he was suing Panorama. I wonder what the outcome of that was? |  |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:28 - Jan 27 with 1307 views | pencoedjack |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:26 - Jan 27 by blueytheblue |
Ah yes, the pepper spray.
Which reminds me; he was soooo insistent he was suing Panorama. I wonder what the outcome of that was? |
I wonder ....
Think the evidence was quite conclusive |  | | |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:57 - Jan 27 with 1253 views | AJ101 |
No idea if any of the original post is true but there's a lot of rubbish about the implications ie that spending the money from the Bony sale on the stadium will increase the value of the directors shareholding that would only be the case if a prospective buyer thought the stadium was worth more than the money that was spent buying it.
If the stadium is bought at fair value then the value of the club should stay the same, the same would be the case if it was spent on players. If you spent £20m buying Emile Heskey that's going to reduce the value of the club if you spent it on Ronaldo it's going to increase it as their true values are obviously below and above that.
The same is the case for the Stadium if you manage to buy it for £10m that should increase the value of the club if you spend £100m to buy it it's going to decrease the value. Any increase in the value of the club would also apply to the shareholding of the supporters trust not just individual directors.
Basically it just sounds like a load of bull crap. |  | | |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 19:02 - Jan 27 with 1240 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:57 - Jan 27 by AJ101 |
No idea if any of the original post is true but there's a lot of rubbish about the implications ie that spending the money from the Bony sale on the stadium will increase the value of the directors shareholding that would only be the case if a prospective buyer thought the stadium was worth more than the money that was spent buying it.
If the stadium is bought at fair value then the value of the club should stay the same, the same would be the case if it was spent on players. If you spent £20m buying Emile Heskey that's going to reduce the value of the club if you spent it on Ronaldo it's going to increase it as their true values are obviously below and above that.
The same is the case for the Stadium if you manage to buy it for £10m that should increase the value of the club if you spend £100m to buy it it's going to decrease the value. Any increase in the value of the club would also apply to the shareholding of the supporters trust not just individual directors.
Basically it just sounds like a load of bull crap. |
Thats not strictly true.
Players aren't seen as assets as such. You cannot borrow money against a player for example. Buying the stadium will certainly increase the value of their shares, buying players wont.
The logic behind the post is entirely plausible. The minor details im not too sure about with regards to FFP |  |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 19:09 - Jan 27 with 1229 views | AJ101 |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 19:02 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
Thats not strictly true.
Players aren't seen as assets as such. You cannot borrow money against a player for example. Buying the stadium will certainly increase the value of their shares, buying players wont.
The logic behind the post is entirely plausible. The minor details im not too sure about with regards to FFP |
I never said you could borrow against a player (or anything about borrowing to be fair).
It obviously has an affect on the value of a club to a buyer though even though a players cost is amortised over the course of their contract (based on the transfer and wages) it has an effect on the value of the club to prospective buyers.
If Wrexham signed Messi tomorrow for a quid on a 5 year contract you're saying the value of the club would stay the same?!?!? | | | |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:01 - Jan 27 with 1165 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 19:09 - Jan 27 by AJ101 |
I never said you could borrow against a player (or anything about borrowing to be fair).
It obviously has an affect on the value of a club to a buyer though even though a players cost is amortised over the course of their contract (based on the transfer and wages) it has an effect on the value of the club to prospective buyers.
If Wrexham signed Messi tomorrow for a quid on a 5 year contract you're saying the value of the club would stay the same?!?!? |
No, but an investor would prefer to buy a club with an asset they can borrow against. It what makes a club more valuable.
No, if Wrexham signed Messi then their club would become more valuable as the business would boom. However if they spent a million quid on players (which is equivalent to us spending £20million) then the business would probably not fluctuate in value. If they spent that £1m on real estate however, then the business would increase in value to the value of that real estate. | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:10 - Jan 27 with 1155 views | morningstar |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:01 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
No, but an investor would prefer to buy a club with an asset they can borrow against. It what makes a club more valuable.
No, if Wrexham signed Messi then their club would become more valuable as the business would boom. However if they spent a million quid on players (which is equivalent to us spending £20million) then the business would probably not fluctuate in value. If they spent that £1m on real estate however, then the business would increase in value to the value of that real estate. |
Surely that would be the case if we were a London or major city club, but Swansea? Ultimately a grounds value is only worth the land it is built on? Not much for American investors to borrow on there surely? Two or three million maybe? |  |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:14 - Jan 27 with 1147 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:10 - Jan 27 by morningstar |
Surely that would be the case if we were a London or major city club, but Swansea? Ultimately a grounds value is only worth the land it is built on? Not much for American investors to borrow on there surely? Two or three million maybe? |
The stadium is a business all unto its own and the value will reflect that. The contract with the ospreys for one. | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:18 - Jan 27 with 1143 views | Edmundo |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 17:25 - Jan 27 by perchrockjack |
bluery.
You re just hoping it goes all Peter Tong.
It wont
Comfort yourself on the fact your city is booming,house prices are rising and you have a vibrant metropolis.
Football wise ,son, you could well be feked |
Shopping at John Lewis is all that matters to Valley Bluebirds....doncha know 😂 |  |
| Swansea City-Officially the best football team in Wales-FACT |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:20 - Jan 27 with 1141 views | morningstar |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:14 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
The stadium is a business all unto its own and the value will reflect that. The contract with the ospreys for one. |
Yeah the contract with the Ospreys will be the deal clincher when it comes to borrowing millions of pounds in the clubs name. But when you were Roathie you told them on AAMB that the CCS was only worth the land it was built on? how does that work then? | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:22 - Jan 27 with 1129 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:20 - Jan 27 by morningstar |
Yeah the contract with the Ospreys will be the deal clincher when it comes to borrowing millions of pounds in the clubs name. But when you were Roathie you told them on AAMB that the CCS was only worth the land it was built on? how does that work then? |
You will absolutely be able to borrow millions on the back of owning the stadium. That is just a fact.
The CCS is just worth the ground it is built on. They don't have a leasing contract.
All out of your system now? | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:22 - Jan 27 with 1132 views | AJ101 |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:01 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
No, but an investor would prefer to buy a club with an asset they can borrow against. It what makes a club more valuable.
No, if Wrexham signed Messi then their club would become more valuable as the business would boom. However if they spent a million quid on players (which is equivalent to us spending £20million) then the business would probably not fluctuate in value. If they spent that £1m on real estate however, then the business would increase in value to the value of that real estate. |
No because the club would no longer have the £1m in the bank account, if the land is bought at fair market value that is. The business would only increase or decrease in value based on the value of the real estate that is bought compared to the purchase price paid.
If you manage to buy the stadium for less than its true value then yes the value of the club would increase by the difference but that post is basically saying that's a bad thing for Swansea FC which is ludicrous.
I think the whole borrowing against the stadium is blown out of whole proportion it's relatively small amounts compared to the revenue of a premier league club it's not Craven Cottage!
I'm guessing any sale would require the stadium to be available for use by the Ospreys which would prevent any change of use anyway so the value of the stadium for borrowing against would probably be based on the revenue streams it can generate as a stadium (and incidentals like conferences etc). | | | |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:28 - Jan 27 with 1115 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:22 - Jan 27 by AJ101 |
No because the club would no longer have the £1m in the bank account, if the land is bought at fair market value that is. The business would only increase or decrease in value based on the value of the real estate that is bought compared to the purchase price paid.
If you manage to buy the stadium for less than its true value then yes the value of the club would increase by the difference but that post is basically saying that's a bad thing for Swansea FC which is ludicrous.
I think the whole borrowing against the stadium is blown out of whole proportion it's relatively small amounts compared to the revenue of a premier league club it's not Craven Cottage!
I'm guessing any sale would require the stadium to be available for use by the Ospreys which would prevent any change of use anyway so the value of the stadium for borrowing against would probably be based on the revenue streams it can generate as a stadium (and incidentals like conferences etc). |
That money would never just be sat in the bank account. Money rarely gets sat in the bank account when it comes to football. Which is why there is so little profit in football. You either improve infrastructure or improve the paying squad. In order to increase the value of the business then the infrastructure is by far the only way to go.
Stadium owning is massive when it comes to investors. It generates its own revenue and can be borrowed against and helps a great deal in cash flow which is one of the biggest headaches in owning a football club.
I disagree about this buying for less than value. Your are basically transferring liquid asset into solid asset. | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:31 - Jan 27 with 1109 views | morningstar |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:22 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
You will absolutely be able to borrow millions on the back of owning the stadium. That is just a fact.
The CCS is just worth the ground it is built on. They don't have a leasing contract.
All out of your system now? |
I don't know what you mean by getting anything out of my system? If the CCS is only worth the ground it is built on, why would the Liberty be worth anymore whether you have a lease or freehold of the land itself? I would just like to know how the Liberty stadium would be worth so much more for borrowing potential? | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:33 - Jan 27 with 1088 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:31 - Jan 27 by morningstar |
I don't know what you mean by getting anything out of my system? If the CCS is only worth the ground it is built on, why would the Liberty be worth anymore whether you have a lease or freehold of the land itself? I would just like to know how the Liberty stadium would be worth so much more for borrowing potential? |
Its not worth an awful lot more, where have I said it is?
You can borrow millions off the back of either not to mention net naming rights. | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:35 - Jan 27 with 1076 views | libertine |
What the Cardiff poster has said is totally possible and totally legal, sometimes people forget that we are looking at the club from a fans point whereas the owners are looking at it from a financial point of view. There is nothing wrong with them doing that, its business. We support someone's business, those guys put a lot of money into the club and took a big gamble, they do the business for themselves not for us we are not life long friends or relatives of theirs they want our support/money and that's Ok so do Maccy Dees or M&S. if you were annoyed with either of them you'd stop shopping there.
That's not to say they have no emotional ties to the club, it would be difficult not to, but be realistic,
what would anyone else do if they had a chance to cah out at a massive profit? |  | | |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:44 - Jan 27 with 1052 views | morningstar |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:33 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
Its not worth an awful lot more, where have I said it is?
You can borrow millions off the back of either not to mention net naming rights. |
You haven't given specific amounts I agree, but you've implied our stadium (if owned) could be worth millions by new owners for borrowing purposes when quite simply it isn't. Now then, if the club is sold too new investors without there being naming rights then that is a different kettle of fish being a premier league club. Thats the crux of it!  | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:46 - Jan 27 with 1040 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:44 - Jan 27 by morningstar |
You haven't given specific amounts I agree, but you've implied our stadium (if owned) could be worth millions by new owners for borrowing purposes when quite simply it isn't. Now then, if the club is sold too new investors without there being naming rights then that is a different kettle of fish being a premier league club. Thats the crux of it! |
Well then we disagree entirely. You could easily raise millions against the stadium, not even in question for me. The earning potential from having your own stadium increases the value of your football club majorly as your FFP threshold increases. | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:58 - Jan 27 with 1023 views | morningstar |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:46 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
Well then we disagree entirely. You could easily raise millions against the stadium, not even in question for me. The earning potential from having your own stadium increases the value of your football club majorly as your FFP threshold increases. |
We don't entirely disagree, so I disagree! The earning potential from a stadium is irrelevant if it isn't realised once the money has been borrowed. What would the lenders do in case of default? Repossess and put a few pop concerts on to get their money back? As I said, selling the club to investors without naming rights is where the money is! it's 100% net profit for any investor, but increases the value of the shares for the current shareholders! | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 21:01 - Jan 27 with 1011 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 20:58 - Jan 27 by morningstar |
We don't entirely disagree, so I disagree! The earning potential from a stadium is irrelevant if it isn't realised once the money has been borrowed. What would the lenders do in case of default? Repossess and put a few pop concerts on to get their money back? As I said, selling the club to investors without naming rights is where the money is! it's 100% net profit for any investor, but increases the value of the shares for the current shareholders! |
Its not irrelevant at all, it is not related to borrowing they were separate points to factors that will increase the value to a business. Trust me, i own two. | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 21:41 - Jan 27 with 962 views | morningstar |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 21:01 - Jan 27 by Parlay |
Its not irrelevant at all, it is not related to borrowing they were separate points to factors that will increase the value to a business. Trust me, i own two. |
You own two stadiums?  | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 21:43 - Jan 27 with 953 views | Parlay |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 21:41 - Jan 27 by morningstar |
You own two stadiums? |
No. | |
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 21:45 - Jan 27 with 947 views | VetchitBack |
I can't be bothered to read what Cardiff fans think of us on a Cardiff forum but I doubt it's as bad as some of the stuff on here and a lot of the stuff on the other forum. |  |
| The orthodox are always orthodox, regardless of the orthodoxy.
|
| |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 22:10 - Jan 27 with 914 views | 1462jack |
| You're in deep doo-doo on 18:05 - Jan 27 by pencoedjack |
Banned for mentioning he went away with England |
Ah not just me then well not banned from that board but the casuals one he had set up there were a few of my posts removed , after cutting him to shreds about meetings in the past and the folklore he was posting , I mentioned his escapades with England and my post was promptly removed , strange that ain't it , it's not like no one knows about it the idiot |  | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
