| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? 18:38 - Jun 19 with 5523 views | trampie |
I keep reading over and over again by bloggers and commentators [before as well as after the General Election] that Plaid need to become a proper nationalist party that being a nicey nice party, being all things to all people, not offending anyone at all costs is not working, being middle of the road and reasonable is not the way forward they say.
Progressive radical policies, calling a spade a spade and not being afraid of the 'I' word is what lots are saying is what Plaid should be doing.
Plaid are old Labour lite and they don't push the immigration question [English immigrants not overseas], the independence question, the language question etc etc, lots of old Plaid voters are saying Plaid need to toughen up and not shy away and duck certain issues.
Next years Assembly elections might well see the end of the current leadership if things don't go well at the ballot box, leaving the way open for others that might have less social justice policies and more cultural policies.
Hardcore Welsh nationalists don't vote Plaid [virtually in every case from what I can see] as they don't see them as a nationalist party and in my view they would be 100% right in that regard [regardless of what opponents and the London media label Plaid as], the argument is that being middle of the road isn't getting them anywhere and they would be better off being more of a nationalist party supporting Welsh causes than being a nicey nicey party. [Post edited 20 Jun 2015 11:10]
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 15:58 - Jun 20 with 1180 views | trampie |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 15:25 - Jun 20 by londonlisa2001 |
I disagree with the anti English sentiments of Trampie but I would point out that people in England do like turning on a tap and have water come out.
The power stations find it pretty helpful to use water as well.
So actually it's quite a bit more than sport and tourism. |
No anti English sentiments from me, just calling a spade a spade about the demographics of Wales, freedom of speech and all that, some groups get very touchy, the Celts don't tend too they can give and take a joke but some other groups cant take a joke or a hint of criticism or even accept an observation that they don't like, but there you go. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:03 - Jun 20 with 1169 views | trampie |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 15:57 - Jun 20 by scottishjack |
There should just be a NHS Budget... Not a Welsh NHS, Scottish, English...It should just be the NHS!
And I'm sick of the political parties point scoring over the NHS as well, sorry to go a bit off topic here but the NHS should be above politics. |
Do people want to pay their taxes ?, do the English want to pay their taxes ?
What if the Welsh and Scots are prepared to pay more for their health service in taxes than the English ?, have we all then got to do what the English want due to weight of numbers ? | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:11 - Jun 20 with 1143 views | dgt73 |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:03 - Jun 20 by trampie |
Do people want to pay their taxes ?, do the English want to pay their taxes ?
What if the Welsh and Scots are prepared to pay more for their health service in taxes than the English ?, have we all then got to do what the English want due to weight of numbers ? |
As a Welshman the best thing i think people should do to help the NHS is for people not to smoke, not to drink to much, not to take drugs and exercise more - oh and i don't want to pay more tax..Fcuk that. |  |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:12 - Jun 20 with 1138 views | trampie |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 13:44 - Jun 20 by dgt73 |
A bit like the Southern Irish you mean with their quality of life compared to the UK......  ..deluded. |
The 'Where to be born index' for 2013 had Ireland #12 in the World and the UK #27 in the World. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:17 - Jun 20 with 1126 views | trampie |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:11 - Jun 20 by dgt73 |
As a Welshman the best thing i think people should do to help the NHS is for people not to smoke, not to drink to much, not to take drugs and exercise more - oh and i don't want to pay more tax..Fcuk that. |
There is a well used proverb that says 'you get what you pay for'. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:21 - Jun 20 with 1117 views | dgt73 |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:12 - Jun 20 by trampie |
The 'Where to be born index' for 2013 had Ireland #12 in the World and the UK #27 in the World. |
Yeah ok....that's why a huge amount of Southern Irish have Fcuked off to places like New Zealand, Australia and to the UK to find work...I was even talking to a crane driver from Dublin just a few weeks ago and his words were ' there's no work' back home. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:26 - Jun 20 with 1111 views | dgt73 |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:17 - Jun 20 by trampie |
There is a well used proverb that says 'you get what you pay for'. |
Yes and here's another proverb since you like them ' don't throw good money after bad'. Oh and here's another one for you - 'prevention is better than cure'. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:29 - Jun 20 with 1107 views | trampie |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:21 - Jun 20 by dgt73 |
Yeah ok....that's why a huge amount of Southern Irish have Fcuked off to places like New Zealand, Australia and to the UK to find work...I was even talking to a crane driver from Dublin just a few weeks ago and his words were ' there's no work' back home. |
I was talking to an English guy this morning who told me he was glad he was living in Wales and that England is fcuked. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 17:01 - Jun 20 with 1086 views | dgt73 |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 16:29 - Jun 20 by trampie |
I was talking to an English guy this morning who told me he was glad he was living in Wales and that England is fcuked. |
Was he old ????????  | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 17:19 - Jun 20 with 1068 views | trampie |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 17:01 - Jun 20 by dgt73 |
Was he old ???????? |
Yes. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 17:34 - Jun 20 with 1052 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 13:50 - Jun 20 by perchrockjack |
I seem to recall so many people being subjected to the Irish charm and then having a roof /driveway done followed by a trip to the ATM. Scum bastards.
Also recall lot of girls coming over for abortions .
I m not keen on the southern Irish. Charming on outside but often consumed with bitterness/jealousy and is no conincidnece in the fifties it was "no blacks and Irish". WaS WRONG but shows how distrusted the Irish were/are |
this post is clearly racist - and you continue to embarrass yourself. I pity you. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 18:57 - Jun 20 with 1017 views | perchrockjack |
Kill Jenny.
You re a cracker.
Racist?
Read the English oldie crap from trample.
The Irish have been giving succour to murderers of British people for decades. It's why many aren't that keen on possibly the biggest bullshitters on the planet.
English people have renovated shells of cottages ,breathed life into them and used local tradesmen, yet they should stay in England.
Save your pity for the likes of the parry family whose kid was blown along along Warrington high street and the families of those freedom fighting heroes blew up .
At least youre honest. No attempt to appear intelligent and tolerant. |  |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 19:05 - Jun 20 with 1011 views | exiledclaseboy |
Nationalism, of all types and creeds, is inherently racist. This thread proves that beyond all doubt. Ugly. |  |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 19:10 - Jun 20 with 1004 views | perchrockjack |
Hard to disagree Andrew.
I admit I'm a racist.
Most people are.
They prefer their own.
Not me though.
Cooking hate the Welsh"lol | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 19:11 - Jun 20 with 1003 views | trampie |
Brit Nats form of nationalism is particularly nasty, the Empire and all that, not nice. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 20:32 - Jun 20 with 961 views | trampie |
Only 30 odd % of over 65's in Conwy was born in Wales, with virtually a quarter of the population being over 65.
Only 40 odd % of over 65's in Denbighshire was born in Wales, with over a fifth of the population over 65.
Barely just over half the population of the over 65's in Anglesey, Ceredigion, Powys, Flintshire, Monmouthshire and Pembrokeshire was born in Wales.
There are 5 wards clustered together in South West Gwynedd where approximately a huge 30% of the population are over 65 with approximately only just over 30% of that huge population of pensioners actually been born in Wales.
People [often in England] say the Welsh nhs is terrible, but they don't say about all the old people that have retired to Wales from England that the Welsh nhs have to look after though do they and with no extra payment to the Welsh nhs either.
It also effects non retirement areas in Wales as the Welsh nhs has a set budget. [Post edited 20 Jun 2015 21:00]
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 09:35 - Jun 21 with 908 views | perchrockjack |
...and before these English moved into south west Gwynedd, villages were full of empty small shops, houses boarded up and no vibrancy at all. NOW THE English HAVE spent time and money revitalising them often using local labour thus giving indigenous locals a living out of it.
Its also the case these English Flock to Abersoch, Pwllelli, Aberdaron, Morfa Nefyn where they spend money and keep alive local shops that would otherwise be CLOSED through lack of business. Factor in Llyn Brenig and the likes of Plas y Brenin and you ll see places made for tourism which again gives people a living.
TRUST ME, Caernarfon, Bangor, Pwlleli, Rhosneigr, without English money, would be deader than dead .It would lose most of the community services too through no people to use them.
Quite why English people bother going there ,with attitudes like trampie and his paddy pooch is beyond me. Jesus, my own daughter is off there so but Ive told her to fill her car up before, take her own sandwiches, drink, playthings and be complelely self sufficient rather than giving anything to to anyone like trampie and there are plenty. Try visiting Blaenae Ffestiniog OR Bethesda in January. and get the feel of a dead village | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 09:50 - Jun 21 with 898 views | Dr_Winston |
I went through Blaenau Ffestiniog on a rainy autumn day once. I'm amazed the local suicide rate isn't above 50%. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 10:04 - Jun 21 with 891 views | dgt73 |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 09:35 - Jun 21 by perchrockjack |
...and before these English moved into south west Gwynedd, villages were full of empty small shops, houses boarded up and no vibrancy at all. NOW THE English HAVE spent time and money revitalising them often using local labour thus giving indigenous locals a living out of it.
Its also the case these English Flock to Abersoch, Pwllelli, Aberdaron, Morfa Nefyn where they spend money and keep alive local shops that would otherwise be CLOSED through lack of business. Factor in Llyn Brenig and the likes of Plas y Brenin and you ll see places made for tourism which again gives people a living.
TRUST ME, Caernarfon, Bangor, Pwlleli, Rhosneigr, without English money, would be deader than dead .It would lose most of the community services too through no people to use them.
Quite why English people bother going there ,with attitudes like trampie and his paddy pooch is beyond me. Jesus, my own daughter is off there so but Ive told her to fill her car up before, take her own sandwiches, drink, playthings and be complelely self sufficient rather than giving anything to to anyone like trampie and there are plenty. Try visiting Blaenae Ffestiniog OR Bethesda in January. and get the feel of a dead village |
I agree with you, but let trampie crack on....the more people like him are given the oxygen of publicity....the more your average Welsh person will think they are crazy. | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 10:52 - Jun 21 with 879 views | perchrockjack |
In the late 70s Winston, I was a Sales Manager for an Industrial Clothing company and one of our clients was the Slate Quarry /Museum in BF. To get stock in for the summer season, I went our there to check the buyers were happy etc and often stayed in Porthmadoc, which, on a summer day, is pleasant and busy.
In winter, stuck with just the indigenous people, it was mind blowingly boring beyond description and if that s Welsh culture they can stuff it.
Welsh people DO know their history TRAMPY which is why many eshew it out of embarrassment .You really do reinforce the old stereotypes of Wales, ie, backward, small minded. parochial, sentimental. Wales has to move forward . Cardiff has moved fast to become a modern metropolis one which VISITORS and new denizens will feel comfortable in. Swansea, at its best , has great people and as a rule not over sentimental ;just a shame a council hasn't harnessed its energy to take its place as a major city but it might happen. It wont if attitudes likes yours prevail but thankfully they don't.
History is fine but it doesn't feed people unless its York Chester or Stratford.
Visitors want to feel welcome and not in awe of any language issues.
As long as someone is a good citizen, truly Im not arsed if they speak Welsh or not. It is utterly irrelevant but it does deflect from what are the serious issues facing Wales ,ie, greater prosperity . | |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 11:33 - Jun 21 with 876 views | Cottsy |
I was with a colleague of mine last week who's based in North Wales and he was telling me how up there they consider Liverpool to be the capital of Wales and how difficult it is to get from the north to Cardiff, around 4.5 hours on the train compared with 2.5 to London.
The North/South divide in this country is huge and without major investment in infrastructure its unlikely to change any time soon. This is Plaid's main problem, there isn't a single national 'identity' for them to build the party around like the Scots have - what works for them in their heartlands won't work in the Valleys and vice versa.
The 2016 elections have the potential to be a disaster for Plaid: UKIP are likely to get a few members on the regional lists; the Tory vote is looking strong although the EU referendum may affect that; the Labour vote is likely to hold up in the constituencies and with a real possibility of Jeremy Corbyn being elected as leader of the party then some of the disaffected 'Old Labour' voters may return as Labour go back to being a party of principal if not power.
Its not surprising that the members want to go back to the drawing board really. |  |
| If man evolved from monkeys why do we still have monkeys? |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 11:46 - Jun 21 with 863 views | jackonicko |
This thread appears to be really bad news for my black Irish wolfhound, if I want to bring him on holiday to Wales this summer. |  | | |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 12:26 - Jun 21 with 844 views | Lohengrin |
| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 11:46 - Jun 21 by jackonicko |
This thread appears to be really bad news for my black Irish wolfhound, if I want to bring him on holiday to Wales this summer. |
The Corgis will 'ave 'im!  |  |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Plaid need to drop being a nicey nice party ? on 12:35 - Jun 21 with 842 views | perchrockjack |
Cotts.
Ive been doing the 175 miles from north west Wirral for 39 years and its not got any quicker in all that time. No road improvement apart from the Wrexham by pass and over the Dee Valley.
Its a pain in the arse
The road from the spiritual capital of Wales-CAERNARFON- A470 is basically a two lane death trap in many places and utterly useless for business.
No direct rail links, no air link so its not hard to see why Liverpool is the "capital". It is actually but WAS the place for shopping but now many go to Ellesmere Port (Cheshire Oaks) . Direct expressway all the way.
Merseyside and North Wales are heavily linked with many scousers of north Wales extraction and plenty going the other way. No problems either way. Many north Walians work in Airbus (Chester ) really and many commute from Deeside to Liverpool now its regenerated. During the recent Three Queens event, I heard Welsh spoken on the prom in New Brighton and a huge Liverpool /Welsh flag. Apparently TRAMPIE and his ilk see this as a threat to Welsh culture and the language. Well it aint.
You can also rip up the language issue too as many moving into nw wales actually learn Welsh- so as not to be ostracised- however they often are regardless as they re English and south Walians too get stick for speaking (to them)bastardised Welsh.
I d argue the north wales expressway is a bigger lifeline business business wise than the M4, CERTAINLY for holiday business.
Its why Wales can never ever be independent as its structurally fragmented as well as socially divided. Its why plaid supporters including lovely Leanne are deluded.
I ll add for LISA, I love the land of my birth and don't want it destroyed or brought into disrepute by language fascists or simple nutters | |
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