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My personal opinion is both need replacing. Rangel I'm certain will progress to coaching, he is intelligent enough. He needs to step down as well. But Leon ? He has another season and we all know it.
Nolan sympathiser, clout expert, personal friend of Leigh Dineen, advocate and enforcer of porridge swallows.
The official inventor of the tit w@nk.
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 10:52 - May 22 by jack247
The defensive work of Routledge isn't a myth, some just can't see it unless it comes in the form of bone crunching sliding tackles. He has, however lost a bit of pace and has never been able to finish. Dyer is also deceptively good defensively. I'm glad people have finally cottoned on to Montero and Barrow. Blistering pace is not enough without a football brain.
It's a big assumption, but assuming we retain our current squad and keep to the same formation, there is no need for so many wingers. Narsingh is there to inject a bit of pace from the bench and get in behind defences playing high lines when needed. I'd say either of Dyer and Routledge along with him would be enough cover for a team that doesn't really play with wingers. Especially if Dan James is able to step up to squad player next season.
Agree.
I heard Brendan come up with a great phase that sums up Barrow "he's a runner not a footballer" think that sums Barrow up perfectly .
It's sad that after 7 seasons we've not improved on Routs and Dyer, ditto Britton,Rangel and Ash. Shambolic from the higher levels of the club and one of the main reasons we almost went down. Our club men still have a part to play, but it's gonna take some serious luck to improve on all those players in one season, it's why we should have been blooding improvements seasons ago .
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 17:08 - May 22 with 1156 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 15:46 - May 22 by 34dfgdf54
Montero has the tools to be a top quality winger, can beat anyone on his day. Under the guidance of Clement, a proper coach, you never know, last chance saloon though.
Cork I would say was a massive factor in our form unfortunately, our midfield was wide open and we were cut open for fun, the goals against tally backs up my argument. Poor in possession and poor in the challenge. Routledge offered very little going forward, and to this day, do not see what he actually did defensively? One player isn't to blame for our defensive frailties, but as many goals came from down his flank as the other as far as I saw. Also, when you are struggling to keep possession with 5 yard passes, which at times was happening with Routs (and others I know), then at this level, you get found out as we saw.
Don't know where to start here.
Pace isn't all the qualities needed to be a top quality winger. Being able to beat anyone on your day isn't either, if all opponents know that you're going to knock the ball past the fullback and run onto it. Surely you have noticed near enough every team he plays against just brings a centreback tight behind and they take the ball off him. He very rarely shows much will or ability to exploit that space either by cutting inside or playing a teammate in.
Watch Routledge off the ball. When we are in possession, he is making runs to either drag defenders out of position or for a through ball. When we are defending, he is making sure our fullback doesn't get exposed 2 on 1. I appreciate you may not be able to see that, but it is defending. Watch Montero off the ball, he doesn't do much.
Appreciate Routledge consistently let's himself down when shooting or playing a through ball. Montero isn't great at either.
Clearly neither are as effective as Ayew and neither should be starting. I'd pick Routledge ahead of Montero every time though.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 17:18 - May 22 with 1145 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 17:18 - May 22 by magicdaps10
For me, i would get rid of the both of them.
Time to move on and bring some fresh faces in. Neither command a first team start or even press for a first team start.
Have a feeling the club might push on for Mimoun Mahi.
Given our current formation, we are always going to want wingers as an option, but it's hardly a pressing need. I think we can afford to cut at least 2, possibly 3 including Narrow.
If we go back to playing with wingers we need to raise the bar anyway
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 17:48 - May 22 with 1115 views
Routledge's injury was a blessing in disguise (as was Cork's). I'd be tempted to keep Dyer, but only as a backup. When the best anyone can say about Routledge is that he has good defensive qualities, that tells you all you need to know. He gives the ball away for fun, can't shoot, can't tackle, has no left foot and the way he insists on crossing the ball from the left with the outside of his right foot drives me nuts. In case you're wondering, I'm not a fan. Need to get rid.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 17:58 - May 22 with 1087 views
Our philosophy these days is to try and win a set piece anywhere in the opponents half and hope Gylfi and Llorente can make something of it.
Sad but true. This is the crux of most of Resurrections arguments on here. They are both superb at it and I'm a massive fan of both of them. We don't play with quite the same verve we used to though.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 18:51 - May 22 with 1056 views
Our philosophy these days is to try and win a set piece anywhere in the opponents half and hope Gylfi and Llorente can make something of it.
I don't think it's our philosophy, it's more a case of devising a plan that capitalises on your best players' best attributes to drag your club out of a very deep hole. Look at what good players you've got, find that one is an excellent dead ball merchant and one is excellent in the air, get that combination working and the rest of the team supporting them and, hey presto, 26 points from 19 games and safety assured. Now, as for the philosophy, hopefully that will become apparent during the coming season or two.
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 07:26 - May 22 by Jackfath
Every time I hear barrows name I cringe. Not because of him but because of the east stands chant to try and get him on the pitch. Dear God, listen to yourselves.
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 17:08 - May 22 by jack247
Don't know where to start here.
Pace isn't all the qualities needed to be a top quality winger. Being able to beat anyone on your day isn't either, if all opponents know that you're going to knock the ball past the fullback and run onto it. Surely you have noticed near enough every team he plays against just brings a centreback tight behind and they take the ball off him. He very rarely shows much will or ability to exploit that space either by cutting inside or playing a teammate in.
Watch Routledge off the ball. When we are in possession, he is making runs to either drag defenders out of position or for a through ball. When we are defending, he is making sure our fullback doesn't get exposed 2 on 1. I appreciate you may not be able to see that, but it is defending. Watch Montero off the ball, he doesn't do much.
Appreciate Routledge consistently let's himself down when shooting or playing a through ball. Montero isn't great at either.
Clearly neither are as effective as Ayew and neither should be starting. I'd pick Routledge ahead of Montero every time though.
I may not be able to see that? Do you genuinely believe you're some sort of footballing oracle? When Routledge was on the wing, he did nothing, our midfield was all over the place, our defence was a shambles, we conceded goals from everywhere including our fair share down Routledge's flank, there was even an article after the United game criticising Routledge for his positional play during the game.
I'm not saying Montero is some sort of Gareth Bale in the making, but I think he's worth keeping for another season, Paul Clement has a brilliant coaching pedigree, so if he can't get Jeff going, then it's time for him to go.
I try to take you seriously when you go on about "watch him off the ball", you was on here the other week saying how good Cork was positionally, really? F*ck my eyes. The simple fact is since your wonder boys who you've defended to the hilt got the axe, our form improved ten fold... but I appreciate you may not be able to see that.
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Change in fortunes on 21:21 - May 22 with 988 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 19:50 - May 21 by ZZoric
Much more than adequate - they both have our philosophy ingrained
Alongside Leon, this is a priceless commodity to be shared amongst the ranks
With 3 games of season left we were 2 points behind hull with a slightly better goal difference. We ended up 7 points clear of relegation places and 18 goals better off than hull.it just proves until it's mathematically impossible to survive there's always hope
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 21:29 - May 22 with 976 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 21:13 - May 22 by 34dfgdf54
I may not be able to see that? Do you genuinely believe you're some sort of footballing oracle? When Routledge was on the wing, he did nothing, our midfield was all over the place, our defence was a shambles, we conceded goals from everywhere including our fair share down Routledge's flank, there was even an article after the United game criticising Routledge for his positional play during the game.
I'm not saying Montero is some sort of Gareth Bale in the making, but I think he's worth keeping for another season, Paul Clement has a brilliant coaching pedigree, so if he can't get Jeff going, then it's time for him to go.
I try to take you seriously when you go on about "watch him off the ball", you was on here the other week saying how good Cork was positionally, really? F*ck my eyes. The simple fact is since your wonder boys who you've defended to the hilt got the axe, our form improved ten fold... but I appreciate you may not be able to see that.
Not at all, my football knowledge is pretty average, but I genuinely believe you really struggle to understand what you are watching. It's pretty telling that you have been asked if you watch games on a laptop earlier on this thread.
Wonder boys who I have defended to the hilt? I've said all season, as well as last that Routledge deserves to be a team until someone better comes along. That has now happened and I'm glad Ayew has replaced him. Montero was never better, neither was Barrow. Seems Clement agrees with me even if you don't.
As for Cork, I've never commented on him much, as he is an unspectacular steady Eddie type player, the type that football luddites will always point the finger at first. The other week I thought he was getting unfair stick and defended him. Don't try to make out I've been championing him all season, you've picked up on one or two posts saying he was one of our better players during our initial good run under Clement.
I'm not a big stat fan, but have a look at Dav's post re each players points per game average.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 22:13 - May 22 with 950 views
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 22:21 - May 22 with 936 views
No longer a fan of routledge and think it's time for him and or dyer to go.
Would like to see clement giving 532 a go as starting option next year - Olsen and naughton can play wing back and (cough) terry would fit in perfectly as anchor between Ff and Mawson
If we do that, then motero and narsigh (with James as backup) would make more than adequate plan b options.
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 21:29 - May 22 by jack247
Not at all, my football knowledge is pretty average, but I genuinely believe you really struggle to understand what you are watching. It's pretty telling that you have been asked if you watch games on a laptop earlier on this thread.
Wonder boys who I have defended to the hilt? I've said all season, as well as last that Routledge deserves to be a team until someone better comes along. That has now happened and I'm glad Ayew has replaced him. Montero was never better, neither was Barrow. Seems Clement agrees with me even if you don't.
As for Cork, I've never commented on him much, as he is an unspectacular steady Eddie type player, the type that football luddites will always point the finger at first. The other week I thought he was getting unfair stick and defended him. Don't try to make out I've been championing him all season, you've picked up on one or two posts saying he was one of our better players during our initial good run under Clement.
I'm not a big stat fan, but have a look at Dav's post re each players points per game average.
I understand what I'm watching, granted I was wrong about Barrow, I'll take that one on the chin no problem. Struggled to make at impact at both Championship clubs he's been at, it's a shame he has never progressed.
Montero I personally won't write off yet, I think Clement can get the best out of him. We will soon see.
If not agreeing with you regarding Routledges defensive play makes me a "Luddite" then so be it. Proofs in the pudding though.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 22:42 - May 22 with 902 views
<< Wayne Routledge is also in a completely ineffective defensive position, as he doesn't block off a passing angle, nor does he closely mark their left full back. There's no pressure on the United player in possession - Carrick, or Pogba either. >>
That little snippet from one game pretty much sums up Routledge and his defensive skill set in one paragraph. Whoever wrote that must have been watching on a faulty laptop like myself.
[Post edited 22 May 2017 22:43]
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 22:45 - May 22 with 896 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 22:32 - May 22 by 34dfgdf54
I understand what I'm watching, granted I was wrong about Barrow, I'll take that one on the chin no problem. Struggled to make at impact at both Championship clubs he's been at, it's a shame he has never progressed.
Montero I personally won't write off yet, I think Clement can get the best out of him. We will soon see.
If not agreeing with you regarding Routledges defensive play makes me a "Luddite" then so be it. Proofs in the pudding though.
That comment related to Cork and the people who default to 'Cork had a mare' every time we lose or play badly, but don't seem to notice when he does well. Same goes for Naughton and Fernandez, as well as Routledge.
If Clement can get a tune out of Montero he will be a superb manager. None of our managers since Monk have seen him as much more than an afterthought. Impact sub I'd have agreed with, but not now we have Narsingh.
I genuinely don't know what you see in him, but if he stays, I hope he (eventually) proves me wrong like Ayew did.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 23:03 - May 22 with 869 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 22:45 - May 22 by jack247
That comment related to Cork and the people who default to 'Cork had a mare' every time we lose or play badly, but don't seem to notice when he does well. Same goes for Naughton and Fernandez, as well as Routledge.
If Clement can get a tune out of Montero he will be a superb manager. None of our managers since Monk have seen him as much more than an afterthought. Impact sub I'd have agreed with, but not now we have Narsingh.
I genuinely don't know what you see in him, but if he stays, I hope he (eventually) proves me wrong like Ayew did.
Naughtons looked a better player with Ayew in front of him, weird really as he was well protected... but there we go.
No issues with Fernandez with me, a bit rash, but if he performed like he did against United for example every game, he wouldn't be playing for us.
As for Cork, I'm sorry, he seems a lovely lad and popular around the camp, but nowhere near good enough.
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 23:15 - May 22 with 857 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 22:45 - May 22 by jack247
That comment related to Cork and the people who default to 'Cork had a mare' every time we lose or play badly, but don't seem to notice when he does well. Same goes for Naughton and Fernandez, as well as Routledge.
If Clement can get a tune out of Montero he will be a superb manager. None of our managers since Monk have seen him as much more than an afterthought. Impact sub I'd have agreed with, but not now we have Narsingh.
I genuinely don't know what you see in him, but if he stays, I hope he (eventually) proves me wrong like Ayew did.
"None of our managers since Monk have seen him as much more than an afterthought."
You mean the footballing legends that are Guidolin and Bradley?
If that ginger egomaniac can get him to play, let's see what a proper coach can do with him next season.
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 23:15 - May 22 by EasternJack
"None of our managers since Monk have seen him as much more than an afterthought."
You mean the footballing legends that are Guidolin and Bradley?
If that ginger egomaniac can get him to play, let's see what a proper coach can do with him next season.
He couldn't. Monk could only get him to play until teams worked out how to stop him. It didn't last long.
That will be the the Guidolin that tidied up Monks mess and guided us to a comfortable mid table finish. I take your point on Bradley, nowhere near PL standard, but let's not pretend the average planetswans poster is better equipped to judge a footballer (although most can see through Montero).
I was including Clement in that comment. SWe have seen what a proper coach does with him this season, either leave him out or have him on the bench to do the job Narsingh did on Sunday.s
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 07:40 - May 23 with 749 views
Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 17:18 - May 22 by magicdaps10
For me, i would get rid of the both of them.
Time to move on and bring some fresh faces in. Neither command a first team start or even press for a first team start.
Have a feeling the club might push on for Mimoun Mahi.
All I know about the guy are his stats and his YouTube highlights, but based on that I'll pass on Mahi. Seems a nice player for the Eredivisie, but I don't think his speed of thought or action is quick enough for English football.
Haven't seen him in a match and I could be wrong, but I think he'll also struggle to match the physicality of the PL. A lot of his goals were dependent on him overpowering smaller or slower defenders, and the Dutch league is notoriously a bit soft. I predict he'll struggle mightily if he made the move.
If we're looking at young wingers playing in semi-obscurity in Europe, I'd be looking at the two below, particularly Rashica. The kid is a phenomenal young talent, and he's gonna leave for a bargain price this summer. Could and should be us. Any thoughts, Magic Daps (or anyone else)?
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Routledge and Dyer - over ? on 11:18 - May 23 with 712 views
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.
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