| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. 10:22 - Apr 30 with 3550 views | NOTRAC |
Assuming we can hang on to those we want in our present squad,is there a need for more than perhaps two new signings to move forward next year.
Our present squad was enlarged to cover the Europa Cup adventure, and I really believe our biggest problem this year was the necessity of having to use the squad rotation system
Now that we are back to a settled squad selection our results and performances have improved considerably.The main beneficiary has undoubtedly been Bony who has improved dramatically since Monk took over and has selected him from the start in just about every game.
If Michu can come back to match fitness and Taylor shows that he can cover for Rangel at right full back,I suggest the only positions that need new signings is goalkeeper and central defender to play alongside Ashley Williams.
If we go for quality rather than quantity in our signings I feel we could have a very successful season next year. |  |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:28 - Apr 30 with 2692 views | shandyjack |
I'd say 5 positions needed to add to the squad, GK, RB,CH,Winger and CF |  |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:38 - Apr 30 with 2665 views | airedale |
I thought that Laudrup's objective was to have 2 players for each position and therefore have a squad of between 22 and 25 players.
Is this still our objective, and if so how many do we already have and want to keep? |  | | |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:40 - Apr 30 with 2663 views | Drizzy |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:28 - Apr 30 by shandyjack |
I'd say 5 positions needed to add to the squad, GK, RB,CH,Winger and CF |
Spot on. I'd chuck in a CM too if de Guzman doesn't come back. |  |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:41 - Apr 30 with 2659 views | C_jack |
Why is everyone after Vorm's head? Nowhere near a bad enough season to warrant it and we'll be very lucky to get someone better. (No not David Marshall mun) |  |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:42 - Apr 30 with 2656 views | shandyjack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:38 - Apr 30 by airedale |
I thought that Laudrup's objective was to have 2 players for each position and therefore have a squad of between 22 and 25 players.
Is this still our objective, and if so how many do we already have and want to keep? |
from the first team
GK - Vorm, Tremmel
RB - Rangel, Tiendelli, Richards
LB - Davies Taylor
CH - Wiliams, Chico,Amat, Bartley
CM - Ki, Michu, Leon,Canas,Poz,Pablo,Shelvey
WM - Dyer, Routledge
CF - Bony
Out of Contract, Loans ending
Vazquez,Lamah,Ngog, Emnes,JDG,Lita | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:42 - Apr 30 with 2655 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:28 - Apr 30 by shandyjack |
I'd say 5 positions needed to add to the squad, GK, RB,CH,Winger and CF |
DM , RB and GK definitely top of the list. The Canas experiment didn't work so let's sell him back to a Spanish club or any continental club if he is a as bad an egg as has been made out to be.
For me this is our crucial decision and where the majority of our Wonga should be spent as it's critical to our style of play. I would love Behrami from Napoli but he's way out of our price range at €15 million. Would suit us down to the ground though.
RB - Matthew Lowton from Villa or Kyle Naughton from Spurs?
GK - God knows but there has to be a decent safe pair of hands out there . Cheeky bid for Cassilas?
Central defence - as long as no one leaves we're fine with Chico, Ash, Amat and Bartley .
One winger - snodgrass
Back up striker - Borini or Fletcher |  |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:44 - Apr 30 with 2653 views | Drizzy |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:41 - Apr 30 by C_jack |
Why is everyone after Vorm's head? Nowhere near a bad enough season to warrant it and we'll be very lucky to get someone better. (No not David Marshall mun) |
We're not after his head but he needs competition because he's been complacent and sloppy this season. We're not gonna throw £10m at David Marshall just bring in someone with a bit of experience (not some random German fella who turned up to training with a pair of gloves) to compete for the starting position and for insurance in case Vorm is injured. Tremmel is not good enough to do that. | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:47 - Apr 30 with 2641 views | Catullus |
I think we need both. The problem wasn't the rotation, but how and who was rotated. Some players were rested every other game while others played every week. Thus some players lost form and cohesiveness whilst others got tired and picked up injuries. And the squad wasn't really enlarged to deal with Europe, if anything it was a few players light.
I agree with Shandy that we need 5 players and they have to be the right quality. But we also have a few players who are deadweight. We can dispose of Lita, N'Gog, Tiendalli, Tremmel and Jazz Richards ( I don't think he'll make it) Vasquez will go back to his parent club. Ki, well that depends on whether JDG will stay but he could be sold or used as a makeweight in any deal. Of course Monk won't be on the playing staff any more so that frees up another spot.
Now if we get Michu fit, it'll almost be like a new signing for next season. Then we'll need at least one more striker, another centre half ( I believe Chico may leave) a winger, possibly two and a Keeper.
Given the players I would let go aren't first team material, if the players we fetched in are the necessary quality then we would have a slightly bigger first team squad with better quality throughout.
It all depends on who is our manager. If it's Monk, can he attract the players we need?
As always, just my opinion. You can bark but please don't bite!! | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:49 - Apr 30 with 2634 views | ItchySphincter |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:28 - Apr 30 by shandyjack |
I'd say 5 positions needed to add to the squad, GK, RB,CH,Winger and CF |
Depending on who we keep I would prioritise CM before GK or CF. Defensive type, long term understudy/replacement for Leon, no one in the current squad good enough. |  |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:04 - Apr 30 with 2600 views | C_jack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:44 - Apr 30 by Drizzy |
We're not after his head but he needs competition because he's been complacent and sloppy this season. We're not gonna throw £10m at David Marshall just bring in someone with a bit of experience (not some random German fella who turned up to training with a pair of gloves) to compete for the starting position and for insurance in case Vorm is injured. Tremmel is not good enough to do that. |
In the same boat then, any experienced keeper that comes in is likely to be heading towards the end of his career, and not truly going to challenge Vorm for his place, and will still have questions around them if they need to be called up.
I'd prefer a youngster myself, ideally I think Dai Cornell is more than capable of doing the job, but then you have to ask if his chance hadn't have already come, if he was. [Post edited 30 Apr 2014 11:05]
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:27 - Apr 30 with 2546 views | JackSomething |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:04 - Apr 30 by C_jack |
In the same boat then, any experienced keeper that comes in is likely to be heading towards the end of his career, and not truly going to challenge Vorm for his place, and will still have questions around them if they need to be called up.
I'd prefer a youngster myself, ideally I think Dai Cornell is more than capable of doing the job, but then you have to ask if his chance hadn't have already come, if he was. [Post edited 30 Apr 2014 11:05]
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Drizzy is bang on the money in his post and experience doesn't have to mean end of career.
I'm not suggesting we could or would sign any of these, but some quick examples:
David Marshall - 29 - 344 games
David Stockdale - 28 - 220 games
Maarten Stekelenburg - 31 - 347 games
Rene Adler - 29 - 236 games
Vorm is still a good keeper, but we need someone to challenge him and keep him on his toes. It shouldn't be impossible to find someone at a good age and a good price. Vorm himself only cost £1.5m! |  |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:50 - Apr 30 with 2497 views | C_jack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:27 - Apr 30 by JackSomething |
Drizzy is bang on the money in his post and experience doesn't have to mean end of career.
I'm not suggesting we could or would sign any of these, but some quick examples:
David Marshall - 29 - 344 games
David Stockdale - 28 - 220 games
Maarten Stekelenburg - 31 - 347 games
Rene Adler - 29 - 236 games
Vorm is still a good keeper, but we need someone to challenge him and keep him on his toes. It shouldn't be impossible to find someone at a good age and a good price. Vorm himself only cost £1.5m! |
Any keeper, with experience, who is willing to be a number 2, it is a a safe assumption that they are no longer a first team choice at any other club. Why would any keeper who is not coming to the end of their career not look for a guaranteed starting place? The only ones who fit the criteria are the Tremell types on the continent.
All those keepers you name command first team places, not background "challenging" spots. Breaking it down, in an ideal season, we are effectively looking for someone to sit on the bench for the whole season.
Younger keepers make better understudies, IMO. | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:59 - Apr 30 with 2461 views | Drizzy |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:50 - Apr 30 by C_jack |
Any keeper, with experience, who is willing to be a number 2, it is a a safe assumption that they are no longer a first team choice at any other club. Why would any keeper who is not coming to the end of their career not look for a guaranteed starting place? The only ones who fit the criteria are the Tremell types on the continent.
All those keepers you name command first team places, not background "challenging" spots. Breaking it down, in an ideal season, we are effectively looking for someone to sit on the bench for the whole season.
Younger keepers make better understudies, IMO. |
They can be young but still have experience playing fairly regular top level football. Dai Cornell's "experience" consists of 43 games played for a glittering array of clubs in St. Mirren, Hereford and Port Talbot. We need someone who we feel comfortable with should Vorm be injured. Most teams in this league have two good 'keepers, at times this season we've had none.
Why don't we just apply your logic to every position? Let's get a cheap back-up to Bony because, ideally, they won't be playing anyway. | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 12:24 - Apr 30 with 2397 views | airedale |
The back-up goalie, in addition to being a sub for the main guy in the event of injury or sickness, is also required to play in the cup games imo. | | | |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 12:47 - Apr 30 with 2358 views | sully49 |
The overwhelming problem is how much money will the board, I mean Huw Jenkins, allocate? Everyone has contributed to this subject brilliantly, however, I think we need to be realistic, we just wont get the required money.
I hope whoever comes in as manager can negotiate a figure for transfers. |  |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 12:52 - Apr 30 with 2341 views | shandyjack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 12:47 - Apr 30 by sully49 |
The overwhelming problem is how much money will the board, I mean Huw Jenkins, allocate? Everyone has contributed to this subject brilliantly, however, I think we need to be realistic, we just wont get the required money.
I hope whoever comes in as manager can negotiate a figure for transfers. |
i sould imagine at the oment around 15-20m would be set aside, with anysales being added onto the amount. i.e 5m for selling Ki would offset 5m for JDG(Theoretically) leaving us still with 15-20m | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 12:58 - Apr 30 with 2321 views | premierjack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:42 - Apr 30 by Brynmill_Jack |
DM , RB and GK definitely top of the list. The Canas experiment didn't work so let's sell him back to a Spanish club or any continental club if he is a as bad an egg as has been made out to be.
For me this is our crucial decision and where the majority of our Wonga should be spent as it's critical to our style of play. I would love Behrami from Napoli but he's way out of our price range at €15 million. Would suit us down to the ground though.
RB - Matthew Lowton from Villa or Kyle Naughton from Spurs?
GK - God knows but there has to be a decent safe pair of hands out there . Cheeky bid for Cassilas?
Central defence - as long as no one leaves we're fine with Chico, Ash, Amat and Bartley .
One winger - snodgrass
Back up striker - Borini or Fletcher |
Lowton? Jesus...... I'd rather play tindelli that's him!
Kyle naughton is good - doubt spurs will let him go tho!
Snodgrass is ok but not better than what we already have... I would expect to aim higher.
Borini, another fan obsessed and blinded by borini in the championship.... Rubbish goal scoring record in prem - we need better than him!
Fletcher .... I would agree on this of he wasn't injured all the time | | | |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 13:02 - Apr 30 with 2300 views | shandyjack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 12:58 - Apr 30 by premierjack |
Lowton? Jesus...... I'd rather play tindelli that's him!
Kyle naughton is good - doubt spurs will let him go tho!
Snodgrass is ok but not better than what we already have... I would expect to aim higher.
Borini, another fan obsessed and blinded by borini in the championship.... Rubbish goal scoring record in prem - we need better than him!
Fletcher .... I would agree on this of he wasn't injured all the time |
agree with you on Lowton and Naughton but completly disagree with you on Snodgrass and Borini.
Snodgrass - Not better that what we have but is on a par and being left fotted offers a different option to either getting own the bi-line on the left and wipping in a good cross or coming in from the right ala WR on the left and getting a shot in. Also a good set piece taker.
Borini - He has been playing some great stuff down Sunderland this season and if available for loan or 7m and less i would snap Liverpools hands off. Could also play out wide if needed | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 13:18 - Apr 30 with 2263 views | somersetsimon |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 13:02 - Apr 30 by shandyjack |
agree with you on Lowton and Naughton but completly disagree with you on Snodgrass and Borini.
Snodgrass - Not better that what we have but is on a par and being left fotted offers a different option to either getting own the bi-line on the left and wipping in a good cross or coming in from the right ala WR on the left and getting a shot in. Also a good set piece taker.
Borini - He has been playing some great stuff down Sunderland this season and if available for loan or 7m and less i would snap Liverpools hands off. Could also play out wide if needed |
I don't have a problem with taking Snodgrass even though might only be "ok but not better than what we already have". Having a third player at the level of Routledge and Dyer, especially a genuine left-footer, would be worth it. It's unlikely that we'll be spending more than maybe £5M-£7M on any single player this summer, so we need to be realistic.
If we accept that Borini and Fletcher are the players we want, would they come here to play back up to Bony? Also, they'll probably stay where they are if Sunderland stay up. I think our best option would be a youngster on loan from one of the big clubs. I've had enough of unknown, untested foreign loan strikers! |  | | |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 13:24 - Apr 30 with 2244 views | somersetsimon |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 10:44 - Apr 30 by Drizzy |
We're not after his head but he needs competition because he's been complacent and sloppy this season. We're not gonna throw £10m at David Marshall just bring in someone with a bit of experience (not some random German fella who turned up to training with a pair of gloves) to compete for the starting position and for insurance in case Vorm is injured. Tremmel is not good enough to do that. |
Finding a good reserve goalie is always going to be difficult. Tremmel played well last season when he had a good run of games after Vorm got injured. It's almost impossible for a goalie to come in and play as well as your first choice when he only plays maybe 5 or 6 times a season.
I guess part of the problem is that the "senior" reserve goalie doesn't even play in reserve games any more, so they never get the match practice. | | | |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 14:01 - Apr 30 with 2180 views | C_jack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:59 - Apr 30 by Drizzy |
They can be young but still have experience playing fairly regular top level football. Dai Cornell's "experience" consists of 43 games played for a glittering array of clubs in St. Mirren, Hereford and Port Talbot. We need someone who we feel comfortable with should Vorm be injured. Most teams in this league have two good 'keepers, at times this season we've had none.
Why don't we just apply your logic to every position? Let's get a cheap back-up to Bony because, ideally, they won't be playing anyway. |
We don't because it would be silly when we're discussing the specialised position of the GK, but you already know that.
Incredibly difficult to find an optimum balance between two quality keepers, it usually comes between having experience but also age (Cech, 31 - Schwarzer, 40) or having little experience, but more desire (Howard 35 - Robles 23) at Everton, and also (Boruc 34 - Gazzaniga 23) at Southampton. | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 14:19 - Apr 30 with 2157 views | JackSomething |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 11:50 - Apr 30 by C_jack |
Any keeper, with experience, who is willing to be a number 2, it is a a safe assumption that they are no longer a first team choice at any other club. Why would any keeper who is not coming to the end of their career not look for a guaranteed starting place? The only ones who fit the criteria are the Tremell types on the continent.
All those keepers you name command first team places, not background "challenging" spots. Breaking it down, in an ideal season, we are effectively looking for someone to sit on the bench for the whole season.
Younger keepers make better understudies, IMO. |
Drizzy has already responded to this better than I will, but regardless:
Who says we'd sign somebody to be a number 2? I would hope we'd sign somebody capable of pushing Vorm for the first-team spot.
Interesting that you say all keepers named command first team places, when Stekelenburg and Stockdale play for the same team! Stockdale has come in, first because of injury, but then because Stekelenburg was out of form.
That's the kind of 2 options I'd like to see here, two keepers capable of being first choice and pushing each other. If Fulham can do it, we should be able to. | |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 14:48 - Apr 30 with 2092 views | C_jack |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 14:19 - Apr 30 by JackSomething |
Drizzy has already responded to this better than I will, but regardless:
Who says we'd sign somebody to be a number 2? I would hope we'd sign somebody capable of pushing Vorm for the first-team spot.
Interesting that you say all keepers named command first team places, when Stekelenburg and Stockdale play for the same team! Stockdale has come in, first because of injury, but then because Stekelenburg was out of form.
That's the kind of 2 options I'd like to see here, two keepers capable of being first choice and pushing each other. If Fulham can do it, we should be able to. |
Again, I ask the plausibility of signing somebody that is here purely to 'push' and 'challenge' Vorm, which is a lovely idea in principle, but not realistic. If Vorm is not good enough for his place, then he will be replaced.
IMO, GK are either number one, or number two. You can't have your cake and eat it, to borrow the cliche. They are not as easily transferable as outfield players.
Fulham have hardly been the beacon of stability this season, so I'll take your comparison with a pinch of salt. That whole team was on dire form, and then inevitably the manager who signed MS is out the door, not to mention the preceding one as well. He's on his arse now but I'm confident he'll be commanding a starting spot next season, at Fulham or elsewhere. | |
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| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 14:53 - Apr 30 with 2083 views | Drizzy |
| Quality rather than quantity needed in signings for next year. on 14:01 - Apr 30 by C_jack |
We don't because it would be silly when we're discussing the specialised position of the GK, but you already know that.
Incredibly difficult to find an optimum balance between two quality keepers, it usually comes between having experience but also age (Cech, 31 - Schwarzer, 40) or having little experience, but more desire (Howard 35 - Robles 23) at Everton, and also (Boruc 34 - Gazzaniga 23) at Southampton. |
Joel has made 22 La Liga/Premier League appearances. A keeper like him would be fine. Absolutely worlds apart from Dai Cornell.
Like I said, nobody is calling for Vorm's head but we need another goalkeeper this summer. When I say experience, it doesn't have to mean a 38 year old 'keeper like Schwarzer, just any 'keeper that's played a run of games in top-level football. In fact I'd prefer someone younger to develop behind Vorm. Tremmel is 35 years old and not very good. He shouldn't be here next season. | |
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