| The Bury AGM on 21:04 - Nov 3 with 2699 views | R11BFC |
| The Bury AGM on 20:50 - Nov 3 by R17ALE |
How do R11. There is a very highly regarded journalist who makes it his life's mission to investigate finances of football clubs for the papers - possibly The Guardian. He's called David Conn!
If you want an expert to unravel the big ball of wool your club has become, you should get in touch with the appropriately named Conn, and he might investigate it for you for free.
You might think such a big fish wouldn't be interested in bury, but I happen to know he was educated at bury Grammar, so if I were you, I'd be getting in touch! |
How do Razz. As Didds says, he's been involved to a greater or lesser extent more or less from day (no pun intended) 1. |  |
| For God loved the world so much, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him, may not die, but have eternal life. John 3:16 |
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| The Bury AGM on 21:39 - Nov 3 with 2591 views | SuddenLad |
When this lot unravels it will be a best seller. Mr. Conn will be gainfully employed for a decade on the back of this. |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| The Bury AGM on 21:46 - Nov 3 with 2563 views | TVOS1907 |
| The Bury AGM on 21:39 - Nov 3 by SuddenLad |
When this lot unravels it will be a best seller. Mr. Conn will be gainfully employed for a decade on the back of this. |
And his name is most apposite. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| The Bury AGM on 21:59 - Nov 3 with 2530 views | RAFCBLUE |
The only think that could top these goings on is if Hughie Eaves is re-appointed as a director at the AGM.
This lot have done the footballing equivalent of cheating death three times in my lifetime and still they persist - crucually this time though the custodians of the club are not proper fans.
The shaking of buckets will not shape or solve this mess and once natures takes its course then it is a long way back as fans of Stockport County will testify.
It makes me count my blessings for the people we have had in charge of this club since Tommy Cannon; custodians of a club who know why it matters to live within your means. |  |
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| The Bury AGM on 22:01 - Nov 3 with 2519 views | PDIDDY |
| The Bury AGM on 21:39 - Nov 3 by SuddenLad |
When this lot unravels it will be a best seller. Mr. Conn will be gainfully employed for a decade on the back of this. |
He's been digging from day 1 as I said earlier, 18 months ago and he's got nothing to report, who knows? |  |
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| The Bury AGM on 22:12 - Nov 3 with 2487 views | RAFCBLUE |
What happened to the Goldstone Ground, Brighton should provide some clues as to a possible path of travel:
Two businessmen bought a cash strapped club in the lower divisions, a great FA Cup winner that had fallen on hard times.
Those two business were really after a valuable property asset - land on which to build a retail outlet.
The club owned the asset but sold it out to a holding company which agreed they could lease their ground, the a company that also promised pop concerts and media events.
The resulting lease was for £480,000 per year (in 1990's money) for a single year. When that year expired it was announced that the club would be leaving, the ground sold for redevelopment.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldstone_Ground | |
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| The Bury AGM on 22:15 - Nov 3 with 2470 views | PDIDDY |
| The Bury AGM on 22:12 - Nov 3 by RAFCBLUE |
What happened to the Goldstone Ground, Brighton should provide some clues as to a possible path of travel:
Two businessmen bought a cash strapped club in the lower divisions, a great FA Cup winner that had fallen on hard times.
Those two business were really after a valuable property asset - land on which to build a retail outlet.
The club owned the asset but sold it out to a holding company which agreed they could lease their ground, the a company that also promised pop concerts and media events.
The resulting lease was for £480,000 per year (in 1990's money) for a single year. When that year expired it was announced that the club would be leaving, the ground sold for redevelopment.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldstone_Ground |
Gigg lane as an area to live is no longer a place that you would choose to build houses, how much is the land actually worth? | |
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| The Bury AGM on 22:24 - Nov 3 with 2451 views | SuddenLad |
| The Bury AGM on 22:15 - Nov 3 by PDIDDY |
Gigg lane as an area to live is no longer a place that you would choose to build houses, how much is the land actually worth? |
What you should be asking, is what is it worth for a retail development. Morrisons, Sainsbury, Aldi, Lidl ??
That will be the market for buyers of prime land on a main road. | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| The Bury AGM on 22:24 - Nov 3 with 2451 views | Sheffdale |
| The Bury AGM on 20:56 - Nov 3 by Daley_Lama |
I went to Bury Grammar for 1 year, all remember was that I could have chips for every lunch of the year and my blazer had a green swan on it cos I was in Peter Kay house.
David Conn was absolutely fantastic with the Munto Fiasco, remember him well. |
Point of accuracy - Roger Kay house. Kay refounded BGS in the early 18th century. A house named after Peter Kay would have probably been more fun to be in though. |  | | |
| The Bury AGM on 22:29 - Nov 3 with 2438 views | TVOS1907 |
| The Bury AGM on 22:12 - Nov 3 by RAFCBLUE |
What happened to the Goldstone Ground, Brighton should provide some clues as to a possible path of travel:
Two businessmen bought a cash strapped club in the lower divisions, a great FA Cup winner that had fallen on hard times.
Those two business were really after a valuable property asset - land on which to build a retail outlet.
The club owned the asset but sold it out to a holding company which agreed they could lease their ground, the a company that also promised pop concerts and media events.
The resulting lease was for £480,000 per year (in 1990's money) for a single year. When that year expired it was announced that the club would be leaving, the ground sold for redevelopment.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldstone_Ground |
Brighton have never won the FA Cup. 
But, remember that Brighton saga very well, in particular the night they came to Spotland and their fans climbed off the Willbutts Lane terrace and walked round to Sandy Lane to shake hands with the Dale fans supporting them in their plight.
It's all come right for them in the end, though, with the shiny new Amex Stadium, even if they have to sign Barnsley's cast-offs. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| The Bury AGM on 22:38 - Nov 3 with 2420 views | RAFCBLUE |
| The Bury AGM on 22:15 - Nov 3 by PDIDDY |
Gigg lane as an area to live is no longer a place that you would choose to build houses, how much is the land actually worth? |
It's worth whatever someone is happy to pay for it and for the seller to decide that price offered gives them a financial return that they are happy to accept.
But ask the question the other way around:
What financial return would the investors who saved bury fc in May 2013 accept given the time and resources committed to date?
If I bought something for £1 plus its debt and could leave the debts behind, providing I could separate the asset out first I make a significant profit and leave the debts behind with it.
Basic fix and flip investment strategy. | |
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| The Bury AGM on 22:50 - Nov 3 with 2387 views | RAFCBLUE |
| The Bury AGM on 22:29 - Nov 3 by TVOS1907 |
Brighton have never won the FA Cup.
But, remember that Brighton saga very well, in particular the night they came to Spotland and their fans climbed off the Willbutts Lane terrace and walked round to Sandy Lane to shake hands with the Dale fans supporting them in their plight.
It's all come right for them in the end, though, with the shiny new Amex Stadium, even if they have to sign Barnsley's cast-offs. |
Good spot.
Thing is, if the Brighton Belotti/Archer thing happened now in 2014, there would be no way back. For every Brighton story there has been a horrible mess behind, subsequent to that I can think of Doncaster, Chester, Halifax and Darlington where dubious dealings have led to the demise of ground asset from club and a subsequent issue.
I don't think Brighton actually ever went into administration either which was the best admission that all they wanted was the land and once they had that they left it to fans to pick up the mess.
Didn't we win 3-0 that night? | |
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| The Bury AGM on 22:57 - Nov 3 with 2373 views | robbowood |
| The Bury AGM on 20:08 - Nov 3 by R11BFC |
Accounts for May 2013/14 (the key ones) havent been completed despite being told they'd be ready for Sept. Surprise surprise! There is also nothing on the agenda about discussing finances/strategic planning. Surprise surprise again!!
They're looking to dispense with formal AGMs...
We will be looking to vote against that resolution.
Wouldnt surprise me at all if it's called off at the last minute. |
Unless you are filing your company’s first accounts the time normally allowed for delivering the accounts to Companies House is 9 months after the date to which the accounts are made up for private companies
The May 2012/13 accounts (assuming year end 31 May 2013) should have been submited by the end of February 2014 - but has there been an AGM since then for the Bury shareholders to look at
If the year end date is 31 May then the May 2013/14 accounts should be submited by the end of February 2015 and this is most likely the period when all the "loans" and all the "other dealings" by the current board have taken place
If so it would seem the shareholders have little chance of being told where all the 'recent' money is coming from (and at what % interest and on what assets are being used to secure the loans) at this weeks AGM
They will have to wait until the next AGM to find out what the current financial situation is at this present time | | | |
| The Bury AGM on 22:58 - Nov 3 with 2372 views | Pale_Dale |
| The Bury AGM on 22:24 - Nov 3 by SuddenLad |
What you should be asking, is what is it worth for a retail development. Morrisons, Sainsbury, Aldi, Lidl ??
That will be the market for buyers of prime land on a main road. |
The land owned by Bury FC does not reach the main road. Nursing home and Starkies Wood means that no retail development on Gigg would be viable. As for homes, there's enough unsold on lower Gigg so its hardly a highly sought after area. | | | |
| The Bury AGM on 22:58 - Nov 3 with 2372 views | TVOS1907 |
| The Bury AGM on 22:50 - Nov 3 by RAFCBLUE |
Good spot.
Thing is, if the Brighton Belotti/Archer thing happened now in 2014, there would be no way back. For every Brighton story there has been a horrible mess behind, subsequent to that I can think of Doncaster, Chester, Halifax and Darlington where dubious dealings have led to the demise of ground asset from club and a subsequent issue.
I don't think Brighton actually ever went into administration either which was the best admission that all they wanted was the land and once they had that they left it to fans to pick up the mess.
Didn't we win 3-0 that night? |
Yep, Whitehall (2) and Robbie Painter with the goals.
We have a very good record against them at Spotland. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| The Bury AGM on 23:07 - Nov 3 with 2343 views | macro |
| The Bury AGM on 22:58 - Nov 3 by Pale_Dale |
The land owned by Bury FC does not reach the main road. Nursing home and Starkies Wood means that no retail development on Gigg would be viable. As for homes, there's enough unsold on lower Gigg so its hardly a highly sought after area. |
It doesn't mean it isn't valuable real estate though. Even you pale must see that the way the business affairs seem to be carried out is highly suspicious. There's too many different clubs which have suffered at the hands of rogue traders. |  | | |
| The Bury AGM on 23:13 - Nov 3 with 2322 views | R11BFC |
| The Bury AGM on 22:57 - Nov 3 by robbowood |
Unless you are filing your company’s first accounts the time normally allowed for delivering the accounts to Companies House is 9 months after the date to which the accounts are made up for private companies
The May 2012/13 accounts (assuming year end 31 May 2013) should have been submited by the end of February 2014 - but has there been an AGM since then for the Bury shareholders to look at
If the year end date is 31 May then the May 2013/14 accounts should be submited by the end of February 2015 and this is most likely the period when all the "loans" and all the "other dealings" by the current board have taken place
If so it would seem the shareholders have little chance of being told where all the 'recent' money is coming from (and at what % interest and on what assets are being used to secure the loans) at this weeks AGM
They will have to wait until the next AGM to find out what the current financial situation is at this present time |
Agreed. Thing is though, earlier on this year we were told the accounts for May 2012/13 had been finalised and an AGM could take place but that it made sense to hang on and hold 2 AGMs together in Sept when the May 2013/14 accounts would be completed. Yeah right!
It was of course delayed and then eventually we were informed it would be held in Nov. Yet the agenda doesnt even include discussing the 2012/13 accounts (not that it really matters now) let alone the 2013/14 accounts. Just resolutions/ratifications for changes in the Memorandum and Articles of Association and a so called historic share issue.
I've asked if finances, etc. will be discussed, with the answer "no but a further shareholders meeting will be held in January to discuss." Yeah right!! | |
| For God loved the world so much, that He gave His only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him, may not die, but have eternal life. John 3:16 |
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| The Bury AGM on 23:14 - Nov 3 with 2321 views | 100notout |
| The Bury AGM on 22:57 - Nov 3 by robbowood |
Unless you are filing your company’s first accounts the time normally allowed for delivering the accounts to Companies House is 9 months after the date to which the accounts are made up for private companies
The May 2012/13 accounts (assuming year end 31 May 2013) should have been submited by the end of February 2014 - but has there been an AGM since then for the Bury shareholders to look at
If the year end date is 31 May then the May 2013/14 accounts should be submited by the end of February 2015 and this is most likely the period when all the "loans" and all the "other dealings" by the current board have taken place
If so it would seem the shareholders have little chance of being told where all the 'recent' money is coming from (and at what % interest and on what assets are being used to secure the loans) at this weeks AGM
They will have to wait until the next AGM to find out what the current financial situation is at this present time |
The accounts to May 14 or Jun 14 whenever the year end is, wont be available yet but the loans (up to £1m when I last looked) and interest rates 7.5% per month (!!!!!!!) are from shell companies - this is publicly available information.
What the fans should be asking at the AGM is just how can the club afford to pay interest of £900k a year (£75k x 12) let alone repay any of the actual debt? | |
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| The Bury AGM on 08:22 - Nov 4 with 2166 views | fermin |
| The Bury AGM on 22:50 - Nov 3 by RAFCBLUE |
Good spot.
Thing is, if the Brighton Belotti/Archer thing happened now in 2014, there would be no way back. For every Brighton story there has been a horrible mess behind, subsequent to that I can think of Doncaster, Chester, Halifax and Darlington where dubious dealings have led to the demise of ground asset from club and a subsequent issue.
I don't think Brighton actually ever went into administration either which was the best admission that all they wanted was the land and once they had that they left it to fans to pick up the mess.
Didn't we win 3-0 that night? |
Not Chester unless you are thinking of Sealand Road and I can't remember the story behind that. Chester fans were lucky that the lease on the Deva stadium was held by the council and Vaughan couldn't get his hands on it. If he had the reformed Chester would probably have been playing in Nantwich (or somewhere) trying to find somewhere else in Chester to build a ground ie like Darlington are.
Another example would be Wimbledon. Plough Lane had a sporting use only covenant on it but Sam Hammam 'persuaded' the council to release it to him and sold it to developers for his own profit - this was only discovered several years later after Wimbledon fans cornered Hammam. It took a while but the site is now a housing estate. The rest of the story is well known, of course.
There are lots of examples in non-league though I can't remember the details. Cambridge City and HInckley perhaps. Hereford could be another depending on how things go there. |  | | |
| The Bury AGM on 09:50 - Nov 4 with 2092 views | KenBoon |
Someone on the Gigg Lane forum posted this, in reply to someone being worried that if the fans pushed too hard, their saviours might leave.
I've got a plan B in case things go amiss, Bishopbasher and the incumbents play the "we're taking our ball home" card.
Me and three mates are going to fork out a few quid, say about £1500 apiece. We'll buy a few shares in Bury FC and announce we have taken over. I'll be the new chairman and they can be board members.
Then we will borrow huge amounts of cash using the hallowed ground as security. Then we'll try and get a few non-entities, an Indian takeaway, a firm providing bouncers to C list celebs, a skip hire company and a chap who rents out a one-bed holiday let in Cleckhuddersfax, to become our partners and Bob's your auntie. Everything will be hunky dory.
Far fetched?
You bet it is.
http://www.gigglane.com/showthread.php/24023-How-many-people-will-be-going-to-th
That appears to be accurate as to what is happening, which makes it even more astonishing that some Supporters don't want to ask questions. |  | | |
| The Bury AGM on 10:03 - Nov 4 with 2064 views | SuddenLad |
| The Bury AGM on 09:50 - Nov 4 by KenBoon |
Someone on the Gigg Lane forum posted this, in reply to someone being worried that if the fans pushed too hard, their saviours might leave.
I've got a plan B in case things go amiss, Bishopbasher and the incumbents play the "we're taking our ball home" card.
Me and three mates are going to fork out a few quid, say about £1500 apiece. We'll buy a few shares in Bury FC and announce we have taken over. I'll be the new chairman and they can be board members.
Then we will borrow huge amounts of cash using the hallowed ground as security. Then we'll try and get a few non-entities, an Indian takeaway, a firm providing bouncers to C list celebs, a skip hire company and a chap who rents out a one-bed holiday let in Cleckhuddersfax, to become our partners and Bob's your auntie. Everything will be hunky dory.
Far fetched?
You bet it is.
http://www.gigglane.com/showthread.php/24023-How-many-people-will-be-going-to-th
That appears to be accurate as to what is happening, which makes it even more astonishing that some Supporters don't want to ask questions. |
Probably the best summary of what has happened at Giggle Lane. Unbelievable. | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| The Bury AGM on 16:59 - Nov 4 with 1823 views | ColDale |
I still can't work out if Day is a muppet or a puppet.
If there's no money man, then the business plan is flawed beyond belief. It's almost as if there is a naivety that a couple of promotions will lead to a financial promised land where the excessive outlay at this stage will make it all worthwhile, without realising that they will only increasingly become a have not, the higher up they go. I reckon that even if the miracle happened and we went up this year (which it won't), we'd still be paying League 2 wages and not the top end either.
If there was a money man behind it, you'd have to wonder why the front man brought in had no footballing experience whatsoever. A fresh perspective can be beneficial in an industry renowned for sticking with the tried and tested, but surely no one would entrust such money to a complete novice. And if it was a money man, you'd have to question the legalities of the loans. Top and bottom of the money man theory is that it would have been close to impossible to hide the identity of who is behind this, and to do so little over what is over a year now to placate any financial fears at a club that has gone close to bankruptcy twice in just over ten years would just be piss poor PR. Such issues would not be allowed to build up.
Worst case scenario is being ripped off. Both Chesterfield and Notts County were ripped off whilst the football on the pitch was the best in years. It keeps your Shaker Ryans happy because Saturday afternoon is all that matters. The loans would suggest there's not been a penny put in, and failure to repay puts the ground into the hands of a third party. It would be easy to establish the loans and live off the interest until every penny is bled from the club and then simply collect the ground.
Said over a year ago that ultimately the club will be give back to the fans via FB, with the stadium retained by ether the current board or whoever is behind the loans. Still not seen anything to change my mind in this. |  | | |
| The Bury AGM on 17:05 - Nov 4 with 1793 views | judd |
The 3 directors own c. 5000 of the 3 million issued shares.
Their tack is possibly to threaten to walk away if they do not get their own way.
#foreverburied |  |
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| The Bury AGM on 17:09 - Nov 4 with 1774 views | ColDale |
like I said, if everything was open and above board, surely things would have been sorted a long time ago. Seems like a nice little pat on the head and massaging the egos is enough to placate people. | | | |
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