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It was touched on by a poster who replied to Clive's match report on the home page. Could racism be a factor in the non stop and over the top abuse Chris Ramsey is getting? Hey just putting it out there guys( I know that will go down well on Disco's irritation thread) Don't shoot the messenger etc etc...
Copy and pasted from another thread. Nothing to do with Racism and the suggestion it is, is frankly desperate. No one has ever talked about Race other than Ramsey and Ferdinand
Atmosphere is bad because:
a) Expectations are high b) Crowd has never bought into Ramsey who it seems was brought into manage relegation and did so removing any flair or "foreign" players from the team and playing pump it long to Bobby. When Vargas is scoring at the Copa America, Zarate doing well at West Ham, yet neither could get in a terrible QPR team c) We've not played well once under Ramsey at home (that I can remember), majority of the crowd have turned, I dont know about anyone else but if I think of the nearest 20 people around me they've all turned. d) Getting thrashed 4-0 against a poor Fulham side in the Championship, it was not just the loss but the way we lost. Not many managers would come back from that e) Some very strange subs f) The total unwillingness to alter the system regardless of situation g) Perception that Ramsey got the job because he was Ferdinands mate not because he was the most qualified candidate
When you put all those things together that is why you've got a toxic atmosphere
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 14:39 - Oct 26 with 7475 views
I've often thought this, but kept my council as I'm not sure I can explain it properly. But basically racism in Britain has moved past ostentatious displays and is more insidious: often as subconscious, societal or inherited biases. Certainly I look at the reactions relative to some of out other recent managers and it does strike me as disproportionate. Would certainly be an interesting psychological study.
Please note, I'm not saying that if you're anti Ramsey you're racist, more that we all are in some way? Am I making sense? Who knows. Probably not.
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 14:40 - Oct 26 with 7470 views
No, with the exception of the tiny minority that you'd get in any society
However, there was a chap near me on Saturday who said he was 'worried' that Ramsey would play the race card when (not if) he was sacked, as if it was a given. But to be fair he talks a right load of bollocks about everything and everyone so he is an equal opportunities arsehole.
I've seen people on here complaining that Ramsey and Ferdinand are sorting a black jobs-for-the-boys scheme, so I'm sure there are some cretins who are using the current mood as their excuse. But, no, I don't think it's the real reason. I think the real reason people are abusing CR is that they're too stupid to realise the club is a sorry sack of sh*t, run by a bunch of clueless morons, and there's not a lot a first team coach can do about that in a few short months.
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:06 - Oct 26 with 7351 views
So not only QPR fans being told not to bother to turn up if they won't mindlessly support Ramsey no matter what - they are now also being tarred as racist!?
I agree entirely with Baz_qpr's post and it sums up my feelings on the matter.
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:10 - Oct 26 with 7332 views
Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:06 - Oct 26 by adhoc_qpr
So not only QPR fans being told not to bother to turn up if they won't mindlessly support Ramsey no matter what - they are now also being tarred as racist!?
I agree entirely with Baz_qpr's post and it sums up my feelings on the matter.
Big Elephant in the room.. on 14:38 - Oct 26 by baz_qpr
Copy and pasted from another thread. Nothing to do with Racism and the suggestion it is, is frankly desperate. No one has ever talked about Race other than Ramsey and Ferdinand
Atmosphere is bad because:
a) Expectations are high b) Crowd has never bought into Ramsey who it seems was brought into manage relegation and did so removing any flair or "foreign" players from the team and playing pump it long to Bobby. When Vargas is scoring at the Copa America, Zarate doing well at West Ham, yet neither could get in a terrible QPR team c) We've not played well once under Ramsey at home (that I can remember), majority of the crowd have turned, I dont know about anyone else but if I think of the nearest 20 people around me they've all turned. d) Getting thrashed 4-0 against a poor Fulham side in the Championship, it was not just the loss but the way we lost. Not many managers would come back from that e) Some very strange subs f) The total unwillingness to alter the system regardless of situation g) Perception that Ramsey got the job because he was Ferdinands mate not because he was the most qualified candidate
When you put all those things together that is why you've got a toxic atmosphere
Have to disagree with point D especially seeing how well they are doing now. Looking back on previous managers they last couple loved getting tonked by that lot. I remember hughes doing OK after the 6-0 hammering even though that was much worse than how we played against Fulham this time.
The contributing factor as far as I can see is down to a lot of individuals seeing Ramsey as Sir Les' friend, and if it weren't for Tim turning us down he would never have got the job. Take the friendship away and what do you have?? Only one of the most (on paper) qualified coaches in England today. With a reputation for seeing talent at a young age. A very nice man that doesn't come across as ruthless and substitutions (when actually made) that seem devoid of changing a game and showing he has a plan b.
The fact that he comes across as a very nice man means truck all. One of my old best friends came across as the most lovely blokes you'll ever meet. It turned out he was beating up his Mrs. (why did I make that comparison) it shows that no one knows what goes on behind closed doors. This man has managed to coach at some pretty high levels and you honestly believe he's had no media training??
The substitutions have seemed to me ridiculous, like for like most of the time and doesn't change the game at all. However, since it has been mentioned these stupid pointless subs have been done to our new recruits. Looking back it actually does seem that he, at times, has been looking after these players. Bedding them in.
After the Fulham game I would have chucked him out but that is me as a qpr supporter that has seen his team lose to a close rival who I believed we were better than. I got swept up in the fairytale of qpr being a big fish in a little pond. Bloody hell after 30 years of supporting qpr I have never found myself to be so arrogant.
But that's what had happened I have felt when Austin, Philips and fer stayed we would piss the league. We have no right to do so. This is a tough league the best league in the world for exciting anyone can beat anyone football.
We have a good squad not a great squad. One that actually can push for playoffs maybe but this is a brand new squad pretty much. We need to give this guy more time. We need to show the squad more respect we should be singing from start to finish on a Saturday and Tuesday nights.
I remember going to football and not having a good time was coming home with my voice still. I'm lucky if I have a little tickle in my throat nowadays. Anytime I stand up and sing or even sing I'm told shut up, sit down its crazy we should be rocking Loftus Road making it a fortress. Not having a go at out manager because we want a Jurgon Klopp or a Nigel bloody Person.
Supporting qpr was always about supporting our team OUR TEAM!! Now it's more like a chore and quite frankly that's down to the fans. We pay our money to support out team not berate them FFS!!
So in answer to OP question no its not bloody racism it's a bunch of spoilt brats who forgot what supporting Qpr is all about. SUPPORTING OUT BLOODY TEAM!! Rant over
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:26 - Oct 26 with 7257 views
Whenever I see Ramsey , for reasons i cannot decipher , the sweeping strings of the epic theme tune to 'Kung fu' and Caine holding the Hot cauldron between his forearms comes To mind.
Perhaps its symbolic in nature, what with chris walking the earth for many, many years (2 score year and twelve grasshopper).. on a eponymous journey of self discovery , incorporating shaolin monk proverbs into his half time team talks , and playing the lute with a 6 year old jodie foster, to emerge from his chrysalis , a former under 10's year coach first Mon, to Championship Manager 6th Dan.
Ramsey : if I love others and they do not love me, I shall feel great pain. Master Po: That is what you risk, as QPR Manager Grasshopper: Not Racism but great pain, or great joy.And for fu cks sake dont sign oscar gobern.
keep walking the earth Ramsey. The path to enlightenment lies at the swindon Brunel shopping center and the dojo of santa's grotto, where your balsa wood carvings of panda's will fill the hooded lonsdale wearing chavs on your lap who want a Tracy island with much joy ,my son.
[Post edited 26 Oct 2015 15:46]
"...The monkey is never dead, Dealer. The monkey never dies. When you kick him off, he just hides in a corner, waiting his turn."
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:28 - Oct 26 with 7254 views
for some people race without doubt the issue and have heard a few things at the ground oN Saturday and in the pub which i thought was disgusting but I think for the vast majority and everyone on here from what I've read it's football reasons why he has been getting stick
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:29 - Oct 26 with 7247 views
Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:15 - Oct 26 by adhoc_qpr
"Could racism be a factor in the non stop and over the top abuse Chris Ramsey is getting? "
Isn't that exactly what you're saying here though and in it's own thread rather than one of the other Ramsey threads to give it more prominence?
I actually think the tone on the board is worse after this win that it was after previous losses and last week's draw...
I was going to post a thread with the exact same title when Ramsey hopefully was doing well and it was looking back . At the Fulham game I saw and heard abuse of Ramsey that was completely disproprtionate for even that poor performance
I asked my son who is 20 whether he thought there was more to it and he didnt think so but on Sat my brother said he thought that it was a factor He felt that although we like to think its fading away its there just under the surface . I would like to emphasise that I do not think ANY poster on this board is anti Ramsey in that way .Its not a cheap pro Ramsey shot believe me
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:29 - Oct 26 with 7245 views
Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:15 - Oct 26 by adhoc_qpr
"Could racism be a factor in the non stop and over the top abuse Chris Ramsey is getting? "
Isn't that exactly what you're saying here though and in it's own thread rather than one of the other Ramsey threads to give it more prominence?
I actually think the tone on the board is worse after this win that it was after previous losses and last week's draw...
Isn't that exactly what you're saying here though and in it's own thread rather than one of the other Ramsey threads to give it more prominence?
No.
I made a thread about a point raised on this board ( not by Ramsey or LF). Who the f'ck are you to say I shouldn't ask the question? A lot of people chose to answer .Some with a simple NO and some with lengthier answers. You chose to get all upset about it .Your problem mate not mine.
Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:15 - Oct 26 by adhoc_qpr
"Could racism be a factor in the non stop and over the top abuse Chris Ramsey is getting? "
Isn't that exactly what you're saying here though and in it's own thread rather than one of the other Ramsey threads to give it more prominence?
I actually think the tone on the board is worse after this win that it was after previous losses and last week's draw...
The reason there is very little racism at LR and this board and amongst QPR fans in general is that we discuss it in the open. Try asking some of these questions in the cesspit down the road.
Strong and stable my arse.
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:53 - Oct 26 with 7104 views
It's an interesting thread but no. I would say that most people want Ramsey to be even more successful because it would make him a great role model for younger black people to come through. I don't think people here are racist or want him to do badly. We don't.
There certainly isn't a racist culture at the club and that's one of the many reasons, apart from liking to live in insanity, why I support this club. It doesn't see colour, it just sees talent.
Where CR cops it has nothing to do with his colour or the fact that he's obviously a very decent bloke. Where he cops it is with bizarre in game decisions, as Neil said on another thread. If he made decisions in games that people went, okay, yes, probably a good move, he wouldn't get anywhere near as much cop as he does. It's the real area that he needs to get right for himself and I hope NW will help him do that.
I doubt it's an overriding factor in this case, but there are definitely some blips of racism that I guess you can't eradicate in a crowd 15k deep. Maybe in a few isolated cases these align with displeasure towards Ramsey. Back in 2014 prior to that grim away loss to Charlton I was sat behind a group of QPR supporters on the train discussing African players and their alleged cerebral shortcomings. One guy at Chelsea last season sitting near me shamelessly stood up and fired off a rendition of the Drogba-Aids tune. A couple of comments on the Korean visitors back in the brief Park era. Nothing so sinister as to be directly threatening to anyone, and so far I've not refrained from bringing any of my mates of all creeds and colours to LR, but you raise an eyebrow nonetheless.
I assume this post was in part influenced by the Twitter shenanigans that have played out yesterday and today? I once thought it was a good idea to follow as many QPR fans as possible on Twitter. I knocked that idea on the head when the vitriol and bollox became too much. Some of it you can partially write-off as childish nonsense, but there are grown men who clearly get off on mixing playground level antics with taboos/pretty harsh views that my grandad would've shared (except on Churchill, who he thought was a knt). Interestingly enough very few of them seemed to actually live in West London, and you wonder how much time they spend here outside of match days.
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Big Elephant in the room.. on 16:02 - Oct 26 with 7071 views
Big Elephant in the room.. on 15:29 - Oct 26 by Pommyhoop
Isn't that exactly what you're saying here though and in it's own thread rather than one of the other Ramsey threads to give it more prominence?
No.
I made a thread about a point raised on this board ( not by Ramsey or LF). Who the f'ck are you to say I shouldn't ask the question? A lot of people chose to answer .Some with a simple NO and some with lengthier answers. You chose to get all upset about it .Your problem mate not mine.
You're right - you have every right to raise this thread and a message board is all about different opinions. I'll get back in my box!
Mine is that it's a big leap of logic to say the manager is getting booed, it must be because he's black rather than due to his performance - but other's have said it in far more detail than i can manage.
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