| Tippy-Tappy 20:47 - Jun 10 with 4375 views | mikehunt |
Just pondering how we played last season. We grumbled about the passing across the back etc. I mentioned my neck had got sore because it was like watching tennis.
It culminated with Carlisle fans Oh-leying us. Didn't matter. We won.
But, our style of play seemed to change from that point - a bit less passing across our penalty area.
Where I am going with this is, this seemed to be the onset of our shakey defensive performances.
Or am I doing a James (sorry James) and overthinking things?
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| The worm of time turns not for the cuckoo of circumstance. |
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| Tippy-Tappy on 21:15 - Jun 10 with 4288 views | James1980 |
Were there any other variables especially confounding ones? |  |
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| Tippy-Tappy on 21:15 - Jun 10 with 4291 views | D_Alien |
No, you're not overthinking it. We became more direct in our play towards the end of the season; 442 has referenced it -the "Plan B"
Why it happened, or even if it was that intentional, i'm not sure but it got us over the line
Factors that came into it: other teams "finding us out" in the way that Hartlepool did at our "home" game at Accrington. Mani D was out for a while, therefore we had no real upfront outlet and it took him a while to get back up to speed when he returned, but when he did, the ball was played up to him much more frequently from the back. Didn't always work out but it did when it mattered
Another factor: our midfield legs had to take up a huge amount of work in getting us through the first two-thirds of the season. Then Gilmour got injured, so we had to adapt; also, how rarely East saw out a game towards the end
It doesn't really matter how and why now of course
[Post edited 10 Jun 21:32]
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| Tippy-Tappy on 21:33 - Jun 10 with 4225 views | 442Dale |
Good teams find different ways to win games. From Forest Green away to Southend at home (twice!), we were flexible in our tactics throughout. This was vital to winning promotion. The players knew they could adapt how they played even when as individuals or a collective they weren’t playing well. It’s a good point though that when we didn’t retain that control at the back it led to us looking not as solid, but the mentality didn’t change.
Having a club full of winners was the biggest achievement.
Looking at some comments, it seems Watson likes to play out from the back too. It also looks like he produces sides which then move forwards at pace when the chance arises. The club obviously were looking at someone who fits the preferred way of playing, which is why Watson was identified. I think he was easily the best choice available to build on what we have in place. |  |
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| Tippy-Tappy on 00:20 - Jun 11 with 3913 views | TalkingSutty |
| Tippy-Tappy on 21:15 - Jun 10 by D_Alien |
No, you're not overthinking it. We became more direct in our play towards the end of the season; 442 has referenced it -the "Plan B"
Why it happened, or even if it was that intentional, i'm not sure but it got us over the line
Factors that came into it: other teams "finding us out" in the way that Hartlepool did at our "home" game at Accrington. Mani D was out for a while, therefore we had no real upfront outlet and it took him a while to get back up to speed when he returned, but when he did, the ball was played up to him much more frequently from the back. Didn't always work out but it did when it mattered
Another factor: our midfield legs had to take up a huge amount of work in getting us through the first two-thirds of the season. Then Gilmour got injured, so we had to adapt; also, how rarely East saw out a game towards the end
It doesn't really matter how and why now of course
[Post edited 10 Jun 21:32]
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There was also a Plan C which we employed from the 90th minute onwards, the desperation plan. Forget playing out from the back and recycling the ball etc and just launch the ball into the box in a desperate attempt to create a chance and score a goal because our much vaunted 'style of play' hadn't worked against much inferior opposition in a lot of cases, Braintree etc. It was just as effective as plan A and B and reiterated what everybody who watches football knows, if you get the ball into the box at every opportunity you have a chance of scoring a goal. You don't always have to pass through the thirds and play pretty patterns and you don't always have to wait until the 90th minute to implement plan C.
We can get too fixated on tactics, it's what happens in both penalty boxes that matters. There's no point playing it out of defence and through midfield, stringing twenty passes together if you are only creating two or three chances a game and barely testing the goalkeeper. We scored two goals at Wembley by just going long ball, that also happened a lot near the end of the season but it wasn't part of the game plan, it was born out of desperation because everything else had failed..last chance saloon. Playing a certain style is fine but it doesn't take long for the oposition to suss you out.
A style of play that maximises your chance of invading your opponents penalty box and keeping the ball out of yours is the best one. Playing pretty patterns right up to the penalty area and then failing to put the ball in the box or test the keeper is a pointless exercise, it means nothing. In fact it's less effective than going route one i think. Three games are a good example, Hartlepool away, their keeper didn't have a save to make.York at home, we had our first shot on target when we scored in the 95th minute and BW at Wembley when we created only two or three chances througout the 120 minutes. Those late goals papered over a lot of cracks i think and saved a big inquest, the defining tactic in the end was to go long and put the ball in the mixer, without that we would have pulled up short again last season. So a bit more emphasis on creating more chances and getting the ball forward a bit quicker would be good to see. Giving the opposition defenders time to set themselves while we mess about with the ball on the halfway line passing it between ourselves is something i can never understand, what's the point of it apart from giving everybody a breather? [Post edited 11 Jun 8:55]
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| Tippy-Tappy on 09:03 - Jun 11 with 3507 views | isitme |
Teams will always have a 'core philosophy' in how they play. Klopp's Liverpool with gegenpressing, Barrow ball, Crazy Gang Wimbledon etc. The best teams can adapt to exploit weaknesses in the opposition, the game sitution and so on. One of the best examples I have seen of this was a game when Hill was in charge and we just hit long diagonal balls to the strikers who were positioned in open play on each of the full backs. It worked a treat and we won comfortably. As others have alluded to we scored a number of goals late in games when we flooded the box and benefit from the carnage it created.
I would query the original posters point about possession football being the onset of our shakey defensive performances. For most of the season we were defensively excellent. Arguably mental fatigue/pressure and a less possesion based approach saw us conceed more goals towards the end of the season.
It will be interesting to see what change Watson brings to our style of football. It will probably depend on what players he brings in. Again, successful managers adapt to suit the players at their disposal. We cannot play counter attacking football as we do not currently have pacey forwards to exploit transitions in play. [Post edited 11 Jun 9:51]
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| Tippy-Tappy on 09:41 - Jun 11 with 3396 views | TalkingSutty |
| Tippy-Tappy on 09:03 - Jun 11 by isitme |
Teams will always have a 'core philosophy' in how they play. Klopp's Liverpool with gegenpressing, Barrow ball, Crazy Gang Wimbledon etc. The best teams can adapt to exploit weaknesses in the opposition, the game sitution and so on. One of the best examples I have seen of this was a game when Hill was in charge and we just hit long diagonal balls to the strikers who were positioned in open play on each of the full backs. It worked a treat and we won comfortably. As others have alluded to we scored a number of goals late in games when we flooded the box and benefit from the carnage it created.
I would query the original posters point about possession football being the onset of our shakey defensive performances. For most of the season we were defensively excellent. Arguably mental fatigue/pressure and a less possesion based approach saw us conceed more goals towards the end of the season.
It will be interesting to see what change Watson brings to our style of football. It will probably depend on what players he brings in. Again, successful managers adapt to suit the players at their disposal. We cannot play counter attacking football as we do not currently have pacey forwards to exploit transitions in play. [Post edited 11 Jun 9:51]
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I think that lack of pace in the final third wiĺl be addressed over the next couple of months. Looking forward to seeing a much more balanced and potent forward line than last season. | | | |
| Tippy-Tappy on 09:57 - Jun 11 with 3358 views | EllDale |
As has been mentioned before we lost a lot of potential pace when Moss came into the team in place of the likes of Allarakhia.
We need wingbacks who can zip to the line and deliver. Hannant may be the answer. | | | |
| Tippy-Tappy on 11:19 - Jun 11 with 3146 views | Dale92 |
| Tippy-Tappy on 09:57 - Jun 11 by EllDale |
As has been mentioned before we lost a lot of potential pace when Moss came into the team in place of the likes of Allarakhia.
We need wingbacks who can zip to the line and deliver. Hannant may be the answer. |
I believe and I may be wrong, but doesn’t the new manager play a 433? If we does we need a lb, a rb as Tobi may not be the guy for a 4 as well at least 3 wingers then you add the goalkeeper situation in to. I’m not Rodney’s biggest fan but he may do well in this new system floating on the left but we are crying out for pace, even an Odoh like player would help with that. Midfield picks itself with east gilmour and Francis, it’s a strong possession based midfield. |  |
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| Tippy-Tappy on 14:14 - Jun 11 with 2762 views | EllDale |
Apparently he’s quite adaptable.
South Shields were predominantly 4-2-3-1 in shape but at MK Dons, Carlisle and Gateshead a 3-4-2-1 formation was favoured at times.
Francis and Hannant were in that Gateshead team.
As an aside, has anyone else heard the name Oliver Bainbridge mentioned?
Versatile defender who can play either right or left back and who was on loan at South Shields from Sunderland last season. | | | |
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