| Beggars 11:30 - Apr 26 with 9234 views | johann28 |
Is it just me or is there a distinct rise in the number of beggars in/around town - particularly around the railway stations and on the tube? In my day (I'm talking 70s/80s) it was bad enough but the vast majority seemed to be pretty genial old soaks whereas now there seems to be large numbers of young people (dependent on drugs?) who you'd think could do much better things with their lives. Why is this happening? And are there any solutions? |  | | |  |
| Beggars on 16:23 - Apr 26 with 2095 views | Sharpy36 |
| Beggars on 14:22 - Apr 26 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Whatever mate.
Gammons be gammoning. |
Is that what you`re telling potential voters on their doorsteps should they have a different opinion to yourself ? |  |
| 'You didn't know that was wrong, but now you do. If you do it again, I'll know you are doing it on purpose.' |
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| Beggars on 16:29 - Apr 26 with 2076 views | BklynRanger |
There are lots of reasons obviously - some of it's structural, some of it's individual circumstances, a sad proportion of it is a whole spectrum of 'bad behaviour' from some of the people described earlier to professional lowlife fraudster kunts.
The problem is those examples of people immediately pissing it up the wall or making a livelihood out of it stick around in the public consciousness. 95% of us are knackered and sick of working all the hours - moreso than ever it seems - so we have very very limited patience for people who seem to be on the take, for whatever reason - even things that they may or may not be able to control like sitting outside Iceland getting pissed up on booze. I'd love to do that on a nice sunny day if I had a cushion but it's frowned upon and my coworkers would walk past and judge me - but HE'S doing it right now and on top of it he wants me to pay for it! The cheek of it all etc.
Basically begging is a product of our times in all sorts of ways and our responses to it are also a product of these times. If that makes any sense - possibly not, I could murder a drink :) [Post edited 26 Apr 2019 16:34]
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| Beggars on 16:29 - Apr 26 with 2075 views | Northernr |
| Beggars on 16:13 - Apr 26 by paulparker |
It’s gonna be a long, long pre season on here |
I just had exactly the same terrifying thought. |  | | |
| Beggars on 16:48 - Apr 26 with 2016 views | johann28 |
| Beggars on 13:40 - Apr 26 by eghamranger |
They go where the people are.. tourists mainly.
In Windsor last year there were loads in the days before and after the royal wedding. In the evening they all went to a house in Dedworth.
There is also a bloke on the train... Waterloo to reading line who asks for 80 p.
Does it in every carriage and people give him a pound coin. I suppose 80p sounds more convincing than a pound.... I just smile at him and say “ you asked me last night “ |
Yeah have come across the '80p guy' as I call him - on the Egham-Feltham stretch regular as clockwork; suspect that's all he does. One of these days I'll have a chat with him. Or would I regret this? | | | |
| Beggars on 16:50 - Apr 26 with 2011 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Why you should give money directly and unconditionally to homeless people
Who are you to judge what they do with that cash?
BY MATT BROOMFIELD
Don’t just buy them a sandwich from Pret. They’re not four. They have the right to spend their money as they choose — and it is their money, once given. Don’t just give to people performing, singing, or accompanied by a cute dog. Buskers deserve a wage too, of course. But homeless people are not your dancing monkey and they shouldn’t have to perform to earn your pity.
Don’t second-guess whether people are “really” homeless. Those who think begging is a shortcut to easy money should try humiliating themselves daily in front of thousands of total strangers who won’t even look at them or acknowledge their existence. It is gruelling, soul-destroying work. If people are desperate enough to beg, they need it.
Don’t just give to people who ask you directly, but to the guy with his head in his hands and a Styrofoam cup on the ground in front of him. Give to the woman who’s blind drunk. Give to the guy with meth-rotted teeth. Give to the spice addict who can’t look you in the eye.
Many street beggars are addicts, yes. Do addicts not deserve food? Wouldn’t you want to drink if you were in their position? Don’t you get drunk every weekend to cope with work stress anyway? Who are you to tell them what to do with their bodies?
As the founder of User Voice, a charity led and staffed by former homeless addicts, says: “If your money funds the final hit, accept that the person would rather be dead. If your act of kindness makes him wake up the next morning and decide to change his life, that’s nice but not your business either.”
Of course, it is true that your drinking habit and theirs are fundamentally different. Addiction is rooted in material circumstance — alcohol is the obvious example, but think how many skiing accidents end in courses of opiates far stronger than anything you’d find on the street without any long-term compulsion developing. It can only be tackled by raising people out of poverty, and a brute-force severing of cash flow is not going to starve people into seeking help from authorities they know will not, or cannot, help them.
Yet this abject morality, which says we must push people to rock bottom before we are able to help them, is seized on by austerity governments always greedy to do less. In fact, studies show begging emerges in the “middle-late stages” of homelessness, once people have already exhausted other options. The rock bottom has already been reached.
Eighty per cent of homeless people in the UK experienced no support or advice the last time they were moved on by police or council workers. When the government claims that most people begging on the street are refusing better help, what they mean is the help on offer is not adequate.
Homeless people need free, state-provided housing and fully-funded psychological care. What they get is £538m annual cuts to mental health services and austerity measures driving them into arrears with private landlords and on to the street.
The average life expectancy of a homeless man in London is 47. For women, it is 43. This is lower than the general life expectancy of any nation on the planet. These lives will be improved by systemic, not loose, change.
In the absence of an adequate government response, charitable giving and hostels remain lifesavers to many thousands of people. But big homelessness charities are already receiving millions yearly, while those deemed impossible to help die outside. When I speak to rough sleepers, it is local communities, squatters and grassroots organisations like the London-wide Streets Kitchen which they credit with keeping them alive.
“There is no need to beg on the streets in 2017,” leading London homelessness charity Thames Reach claims. “Hostel rent is covered through Housing Benefit [and] it is an urban myth that if you have no address, you cannot claim benefits.”
The charity, which is primarily funded by the government, makes no mention of the many gatekeeping barriers vulnerable people must cross to secure benefits and a stable hostel place.
Most damningly, they do not mention the fact that the foreign nationals who make up over half of London’s rough-sleeping population cannot claim benefits to access the hostel network at all. Rather, Thames Reach and other top charities shop homeless foreigners to the Home Office to be deported.
It is those same government-funded charities that push the narrative that “kindness kills” as they tout for your donations. Do not believe them. Apathy and austerity kill. Your kindness saves lives. |  | | |
| Beggars on 16:51 - Apr 26 with 2009 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
Paul Parker is right.
This subject is a bit close to my heart as my sister who committed suicide last year in August was in a situation where she was homeless for a while despite the best efforts of my Mum, Dad, and local government and charities etc.
Going to let you guys get on with it for a while. Enjoy the self righteous free period! [Post edited 26 Apr 2019 16:55]
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| Beggars on 16:51 - Apr 26 with 2011 views | johann28 |
| Beggars on 16:29 - Apr 26 by Northernr |
I just had exactly the same terrifying thought. |
Sorry :( It was a genuine question/concern, and if I think of my team I start to cry. | | | |
| Beggars on 18:49 - Apr 26 with 1859 views | nix |
| Beggars on 16:51 - Apr 26 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Paul Parker is right.
This subject is a bit close to my heart as my sister who committed suicide last year in August was in a situation where she was homeless for a while despite the best efforts of my Mum, Dad, and local government and charities etc.
Going to let you guys get on with it for a while. Enjoy the self righteous free period! [Post edited 26 Apr 2019 16:55]
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Really sorry to hear that Bazz.
It's why I'm passionate about mental health provision which is ridiculously underfunded and unfit for purpose. |  | | |
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| Beggars on 21:43 - Apr 26 with 1776 views | BklynRanger |
Sorry Bazza, that's really awful, and far beyond any of my tongue in cheek 'modern life' observations. Sincere condolences man. | | | |
| Beggars on 01:17 - Apr 27 with 1704 views | LazyFan |
I was in Brum a few months back, the train station is like Kings Cross of old.
Beggars and Drug Dealers and homeless everywhere. I assume at night the ladies come out in force.
The truth is Thatchers Britain never went away and was carried on by her Demon disciple Blair. 4+m unemployed, 16.5% interest rates, poll tax, mass strikes, housing crash, multiple riots, racist courts and police, not in the EU, pedo rings, .... the good old days!
Expect them to return again as 10+ years of austerity has solved everything right?
Spending isn't the answer either, our govt which we should as the people micro-manage with an iron fist needs to be on OUR remit and take a complete and utter day to day full control (not just silent ownership like RBS) of major industries for the country. No more liberal capitalism dressed up as a nice version of squeezing the have nots (which is most of us these days).
Hard choices as a result of the hard-up being made to take ever more never-ending hardships.
If you do not like that, hopefully, we shall at least Remain and then Chuka, Vince and you can do one and beggar off to France, where Macron is waiting to welcome you with open arms. Of course, they have seen it up close now and even the French don't like mini-Blair.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz |  |
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| Beggars on 09:59 - Apr 27 with 1591 views | Northolt_Rs |
| Beggars on 13:47 - Apr 26 by DavieQPR |
The beggars around Enfield are all females of East European extraction who are dropped off by minibus in the mornings. These fakes spoil it for the genuine needy. If in doubt only buy the Big Issue they tend to be the legit ones. |
I’m married to a female of East European extraction - where can I sign her up for this gig? |  |
| Scooters, Tunes, Trainers and QPR. |
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| Beggars on 10:08 - Apr 27 with 1581 views | johncharles |
The Evening Standard hits another new low.
Homeless man ate my hamster |  |
| Strong and stable my arse. |
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| Beggars on 10:36 - Apr 27 with 1562 views | Rangersw12 |
| Beggars on 14:41 - Apr 26 by BuckR |
Jesus Christ
Cant even get a sensible reply [Post edited 26 Apr 2019 14:43]
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Don't worry mate he's a self loathing troll
Majority of what he says is to get a reaction |  | | |
| Beggars on 10:38 - Apr 27 with 1560 views | johann28 |
Mmm ... thanks for the responses - much food for thought here. Leaving aside the 'fake'/'real' issue, the problem does seem to multi-faceted and quite intractable as everyone has a different reason for being on the streets. If anyone has any links to serious academic/journalistic articles that attempt to make some sense of it all please send me the link. Links to charities also welcome. | | | |
| Beggars on 10:42 - Apr 27 with 1550 views | Rangersw12 |
Loads more homeless around where I live than there was 10 years ago . A lot of them congregate in tents in the underpasses.
Shocking in 2019 that people still have to resort to living on the streets. Haven't a clue what can be done about it other than building more shelters so these people are out of the elements | | | |
| Beggars on 10:53 - Apr 27 with 1544 views | smegma |
| Beggars on 16:08 - Apr 26 by Lblock |
I predict this to be a 4 or 5 pager...... sure racism will be crow barred in somewhere along the line.
Homelessness has been bandied around - surely that's different to begging? The two do not go hand in hand or be a consequence of each other in my book.
Makes me cringe the holier than tho attitude some take to these subjects - if you suggest that beggars are an issue that effect your day to day life, your safety worries and are symptomatic of crime in your area then you are, of course, in the eyes of some here, a right wing uncaring racist fascist who is anti-society and selfish.
It's a big red hand to your concerns, worries or quite right observation that drugs, Romanian crime gangs, traffickers and petty criminals are responsible for 90% of the street begging issue.
I only have sympathy with one type of street beggar and that's any that are ex-forces. Those lads and lasses are treated appallingly once they leave the service and have virtually zero civvie cross over support network.
As for the rest......... no comment.
Now if you're homeless you may fit into any number of different circumstances and I'd say the majority of those classified as homeless don't revert to street begging. To generalise those would be the most broadest of brushes and totally wrong.
As for giving to a street beggar and not caring that they will then use that money to call a dealer into that area and serve them up is unbelievable. Crass stupidity to not appreciate where those ripples in that pond lead to and the detrimental effect to ALL involved.
And having broken my vow not to comment on political, social or economical threads I will leave it at that and turn the music up. |
Wot about FFP ?? | | | |
| Beggars on 11:04 - Apr 27 with 1533 views | smegma |
| Beggars on 01:17 - Apr 27 by LazyFan |
I was in Brum a few months back, the train station is like Kings Cross of old.
Beggars and Drug Dealers and homeless everywhere. I assume at night the ladies come out in force.
The truth is Thatchers Britain never went away and was carried on by her Demon disciple Blair. 4+m unemployed, 16.5% interest rates, poll tax, mass strikes, housing crash, multiple riots, racist courts and police, not in the EU, pedo rings, .... the good old days!
Expect them to return again as 10+ years of austerity has solved everything right?
Spending isn't the answer either, our govt which we should as the people micro-manage with an iron fist needs to be on OUR remit and take a complete and utter day to day full control (not just silent ownership like RBS) of major industries for the country. No more liberal capitalism dressed up as a nice version of squeezing the have nots (which is most of us these days).
Hard choices as a result of the hard-up being made to take ever more never-ending hardships.
If you do not like that, hopefully, we shall at least Remain and then Chuka, Vince and you can do one and beggar off to France, where Macron is waiting to welcome you with open arms. Of course, they have seen it up close now and even the French don't like mini-Blair.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz |
Sounds just like Leicester these days. When England played a friendly there last year, I was amazed at the amount of homeless youngsters in the area by the train station, most of whom seemed to be addicts of one sort or another. My cab driver informed me that the local Pakistani drug dealers started by giving crack and heroin to kids for free. Once addicted they started charging them for the gear. To pay for it the addicts would need to beg, steal or borrow to pay off debts and get their next fix. Most of the time they would steal, end up being nicked, sometimes jailed and a vicious cycle was created. My cab driver informed me his Pakistani community disassociate themselves from their fellow countrymen but mud sticks unfortunately. This is creating some tension in the city. | | | |
| Beggars on 11:18 - Apr 27 with 1514 views | Dorse |
| Beggars on 16:13 - Apr 26 by paulparker |
It’s gonna be a long, long pre season on here |
'Toughest Pre-Season Ever'
 |  |
| 'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!' |
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| Beggars on 11:26 - Apr 27 with 1502 views | TW_R |
| Beggars on 16:29 - Apr 26 by Northernr |
I just had exactly the same terrifying thought. |
The scary thing is we haven’t finished the season yet. We are actually in pre-pre-season! |  | | |
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