| this might put a smile on our faces 11:34 - Aug 8 with 16488 views | wombat |
Rumour going round that the new ikea stadium near a bus stop in middx might have big problems allowing fans for the coming season (if we are allowed of course) as we all have been told its brand new made up of off cuts from the ikea cat from 2002 , what it seems it dosnt have is a safety cert , As i say this is a rumour but how funny would that be after the bitter dissapointment of them not showing up as wembley recenrtly nobody will be allowed to even enter the ikea stadium until they have one ,
think they have to stage 3/4 events leading to full capacity event before they are given a saftey cert and of course that cant happen in the present climate |  |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 17:24 - Aug 11 with 2210 views | BostonR |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 18:39 - Aug 10 by switchingcode |
Could be worse though you could have majority share holder of your club who’s airline company's auditors Earnest &young expressed doubts about it’s ability to continue as a going concern.Id be very concerned even though I’ve never worked in the airline industry.For your information the real estate part of the business is in the hands of the developer as far as Profit/loss goes doesn’t effect our club. |
I’m baffled by your last sentence. I assume you mean that Brentford have no stake in the development outside the stadium or on GP? |  | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 17:40 - Aug 11 with 2182 views | A40Bosh |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 17:24 - Aug 11 by BostonR |
I’m baffled by your last sentence. I assume you mean that Brentford have no stake in the development outside the stadium or on GP? |
I'm baffled that Brentford FC appear to be getting the blame on this thread for us having to abandon Warren Farm and that we should be laughing at them if they can't move in to their new home.
Have I missed something, because I thought if there was a link with Brentford it was not the club itself but a lone supporter (maybe two) that was behind the SWF campaign - was that even proven.
So now we have got a freehold on a sports ground that will be a hell of a lot easier to bring up to operational use than Warren Farm so we should be thanking them if anything.
What is it about Schadenfreude.
So their stadium announcer has a problem with us - who cares? |  |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 18:23 - Aug 11 with 2136 views | RangersDave |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 17:29 - Aug 10 by NewBee |
His son goes to games with him, if that counts for anything.
In any case, with Benham himself only being around 50, no-one need worry about any of that for another decade or two.
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I think history, even local, might show that owners can come and go, and not of their own volition. |  |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 20:43 - Aug 11 with 2044 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 17:24 - Aug 11 by BostonR |
I’m baffled by your last sentence. I assume you mean that Brentford have no stake in the development outside the stadium or on GP? |
BFC have sold GP - I think I saw that the final figure was £50m, though I could be wrong.
They will own the new stadium.
The developers will own the flats(they built them, after all) and hope to sell them for their own profit.
I think I'm right in saying that if the developers achieve top price for the flats, then there is a mechanism whereby BFC will get back a share of the excess accruing after the developers have got their own projected return.
In theory, BFC could have built and developed the site themselves, which would allowed them to pocket all of the profit themselves.
In theory.
But in practice, we're a football club not a property company, meaning it's far more likely we'd have done our conkers on the whole thing - and that's not counting Covid-19. |  | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 20:59 - Aug 11 with 2024 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 17:40 - Aug 11 by A40Bosh |
I'm baffled that Brentford FC appear to be getting the blame on this thread for us having to abandon Warren Farm and that we should be laughing at them if they can't move in to their new home.
Have I missed something, because I thought if there was a link with Brentford it was not the club itself but a lone supporter (maybe two) that was behind the SWF campaign - was that even proven.
So now we have got a freehold on a sports ground that will be a hell of a lot easier to bring up to operational use than Warren Farm so we should be thanking them if anything.
What is it about Schadenfreude.
So their stadium announcer has a problem with us - who cares? |
Well put.
The sum total of Bees' fans "involvement" in SWF may have been one or two individual campaigners, as you say, plus a handful(?) of signatures on an e-petition, for a laugh.
It tickled us for a bit that QPR fans were getting worked up at the thought we were putting one over you, when we hadn't done anything more than watched your struggles over Warren Farm with wry amusement.
But hey ho, you're happy with your new training ground, we're happy with ours, so let's all be happy, eh? | | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 21:03 - Aug 11 with 2021 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 18:23 - Aug 11 by RangersDave |
I think history, even local, might show that owners can come and go, and not of their own volition. |
Of course owners come and go.
So will we (fans), for that matter.
But the point is that whenever Matthew Benham does go, the club is likely to be in better shape than when he took over, much better.
Which is all any of us could hope for.
Will you be able to say the same when your owners eventually move on? | | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 00:58 - Aug 12 with 1945 views | DannyPaddox |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 00:39 - Aug 10 by NewBee |
"Afterthought"?
There was a triangular patch of ground between the 3 train tracks which a fan spotted was JUST big enough for a stadium.
That was the club's priority, nothing more, nothing less.
Thereafter, the developer bought adjoining land on which to build the flats etc, known as "enabling development". It was physically and legally impossible to extend the stadium onto that land.
As for the seating, the original plan was for 20k, the absolute max that could be squeezed in. However, a review indicated that incorporating 3k Premium seats in a 17.5k capacity would produce more revenue overall.
And seeing as how (a ) we only had crowds of 5-7k as recently as a decade ago; (b ) it's still a 45% increase on GP; (c ) neither configuration would produce enough revenue to make BFC financially viable in the Championship; and most crucially (d ) the owner has sunk c.£100m into the club already, then I don't know of a single reasonably-informed Bees fan who doesn't understand and accept the rationale behind this.
Above all, if not Lionel Road, then the only other option would have been to move away from Brentford completely, and not a single Bees fan, "real" or otherwise, would prefer that. |
... a triangular patch of ground between the 3 train tracks
...
In Berkshire you’ll find the Winnersh Triangle.
In Brentford, the Play-Off Losersh Traingle. |  | | |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 15:08 - Aug 12 with 1754 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 14:34 - Aug 12 by Match82 |
Ah well, at least we've seen the inside of the high rollers room once or twice |
I can understand your fondness for looking back.
Bees fans prefer to look forward these days. | | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 15:30 - Aug 12 with 1742 views | Match82 |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 15:08 - Aug 12 by NewBee |
I can understand your fondness for looking back.
Bees fans prefer to look forward these days. |
I get it, I wouldn't want to look back over the last 8 days or so either if I was you  |  | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 15:41 - Aug 12 with 1713 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 15:30 - Aug 12 by Match82 |
I get it, I wouldn't want to look back over the last 8 days or so either if I was you |
The Past is like a little village in the Cotswolds - very nice, but you don't want to live in it.
Whereas "Tomorrow Never Dies" (as a certain Mr. Bond would point out). | | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 16:55 - Aug 12 with 1665 views | Manti |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 14:07 - Aug 10 by NewBee |
I don't understand the ins-and-outs of the deal, but I think the broad answer to your question is "No".
Aiui, by proposing a new stadium as a "community asset" and also by consequently making GP available for housing, Benham obtained permission for the developers to build on the adjacent site when they would not normally have done so.
In return, the developers agreed to build the stadium for BFC (we're not a construction company) and hand it over before selling the flats and bulldozing GP etc.
And on the basis that developers aren't charities (understatement!), although they're building the stadium, BFC still have to pay for it themselves up front.
Thereafter, Benham might get some or all of his money back from the sale of the flats, but only AFTER the developers have received their projected profit margin first and only if the flats achieve top dollar prices.
(Had BFC not agreed to such an arrangement, the developers would simply have looked to some other site to build flats - it doesn't matter to them where. Whereas BFC had no such alternative)
So it all depends on the state of the property market over the next year or two, as you say.
Which probably means Benham will be carrying the thick end of the cost of the stadium. But he will have calculated the risks better than any of us, and he's both willing and able to sustain it. [Post edited 10 Aug 2020 14:10]
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You've got the out line of the deal a little wrong. Bees own Griffin Park. Bees bought all the land at Lionel Road including the land to build 900 flats. Bees got planning permission to build new ground and flats. Bees exchange land with planning to developer in exchange for new ground. On completion of new ground Bees transfer Griffin Park to developer. All the prices were hard coded into the contracts so Bees are protected from collapse in demand for the housing although we do still have a profit share in our favour if the flats get sold at a higher price than the contracts envisaged. This in turn is shared with LBH who have promised to upgrade our bus stop! The original idea was that the planning permission value, and the value of Griffin Park got us the new new ground free of any additional charge. The money Matthew Benham has put into the club was to fund football operations not the
stadium itself. Remember the original deal was put together by BeesUnited the fans trust before Mr B was involved. We had no real cash to finance the new stadium the value had to come from planning permission enabling works and the value of Griffin Park. [Post edited 12 Aug 2020 17:22]
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 19:23 - Aug 12 with 1584 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 16:55 - Aug 12 by Manti |
You've got the out line of the deal a little wrong. Bees own Griffin Park. Bees bought all the land at Lionel Road including the land to build 900 flats. Bees got planning permission to build new ground and flats. Bees exchange land with planning to developer in exchange for new ground. On completion of new ground Bees transfer Griffin Park to developer. All the prices were hard coded into the contracts so Bees are protected from collapse in demand for the housing although we do still have a profit share in our favour if the flats get sold at a higher price than the contracts envisaged. This in turn is shared with LBH who have promised to upgrade our bus stop! The original idea was that the planning permission value, and the value of Griffin Park got us the new new ground free of any additional charge. The money Matthew Benham has put into the club was to fund football operations not the
stadium itself. Remember the original deal was put together by BeesUnited the fans trust before Mr B was involved. We had no real cash to finance the new stadium the value had to come from planning permission enabling works and the value of Griffin Park. [Post edited 12 Aug 2020 17:22]
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Thank you for that superior explanation.
Re your comment:
"The original idea was that the planning permission value, and the value of Griffin Park got us the new new ground free of any additional charge."
How has the original plan worked out? I think that during the long-drawn out process, GP's value has turned out to be greater than originally envisaged.
But is it not also the case that the cost to BFC of buying the land and gaining PP also turned out a lot more protracted and expensive than expected - professional fees etc.
Also with the original developer (Taylor Woodrow?) having pulled out, the new developer will have demanded stricter terms?
Then there's the prospect of a profit-share from the flats achieving high prices. May we assume that with the present state of the economy etc, that that is now much less likely to accrue? And with it, LBH's provision of a monorail/bus stop interchange etc? (With the best will in the world, I can't see LBH coming up with much help, if any)
It would be fantastic if BFC moved into the new stadium free of net cost; but am I being unduly pessimistic in fearing that that probably won't now happen? | | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 19:42 - Aug 12 with 1575 views | enfieldargh |
good for you now buzz off |  |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 20:10 - Aug 12 with 1533 views | bakerloo8 |
Erm, has this turned into a Brentford forum? |  | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 21:18 - Aug 12 with 1475 views | CliveWilsonSaid |
@NewBee
"Then there's the prospect of a profit-share from the flats achieving high prices. May we assume that with the present state of the economy etc, that that is now much less likely to accrue? And with it, LBH's provision of a monorail/bus stop interchange etc? (With the best will in the world, I can't see LBH coming up with much help, if any)"
Bus stop interchange you say?  |  |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 22:08 - Aug 12 with 1414 views | wombat |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 21:18 - Aug 12 by CliveWilsonSaid |
@NewBee
"Then there's the prospect of a profit-share from the flats achieving high prices. May we assume that with the present state of the economy etc, that that is now much less likely to accrue? And with it, LBH's provision of a monorail/bus stop interchange etc? (With the best will in the world, I can't see LBH coming up with much help, if any)"
Bus stop interchange you say? |
That’s if they do decide to build the flats at Griffin park ? Lots of London developers have shelved major house building for the foreseeable as in there own words who can afford to buy them so no point building them yet , Gp could stay empty for a while yet that’s for sure | |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 22:56 - Aug 12 with 1360 views | hamptonhillhoop |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 20:10 - Aug 12 by bakerloo8 |
Erm, has this turned into a Brentford forum? |
It seems as though it has. I for one am finding it fascinating to find out the financial background to Brentford's new stadium. No, really |  | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 23:01 - Aug 12 with 1350 views | Manti |
That only effects the super profit share not the underlying contrajct which I said had hard coded costs and prices. The only real problem encountered from the BFC side was the 2/3 year delay in starting the project due to the bastard owners of Capital Court who forced us to go down the compulsory purchase route to get the last plot of land required. I believe, not sure though, we offered them more than the final CPU was set at. [Post edited 12 Aug 2020 23:06]
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 23:02 - Aug 12 with 1346 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 20:10 - Aug 12 by bakerloo8 |
Erm, has this turned into a Brentford forum? |
Dunno.
Ask Wombat? | | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 23:04 - Aug 12 with 1346 views | Manti |
Oh and as for no test events. The limited capacity games we restart the new season with will become the test events. So sorry Chaps we will be in Lionel Road for next season. See you there if the bloody virus let's us let in away supporters - or home for that matter! [Post edited 12 Aug 2020 23:07]
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 23:09 - Aug 12 with 1336 views | NewBee |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 22:08 - Aug 12 by wombat |
That’s if they do decide to build the flats at Griffin park ? Lots of London developers have shelved major house building for the foreseeable as in there own words who can afford to buy them so no point building them yet , Gp could stay empty for a while yet that’s for sure |
Who do you mean by "they"?
Aiui, BFC have sold GP. Whether the purchaser goes ahead and builds is not the club's concern. Besides which Developers often "land bank" property, expecting to build at a future date when the market looks most favourable.
In any case, LBH specified that GP is to be developed as family homes, not flats, such homes being in short supply locally. | | | |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 23:23 - Aug 12 with 1324 views | Northolt_Rs |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 20:59 - Aug 11 by NewBee |
Well put.
The sum total of Bees' fans "involvement" in SWF may have been one or two individual campaigners, as you say, plus a handful(?) of signatures on an e-petition, for a laugh.
It tickled us for a bit that QPR fans were getting worked up at the thought we were putting one over you, when we hadn't done anything more than watched your struggles over Warren Farm with wry amusement.
But hey ho, you're happy with your new training ground, we're happy with ours, so let's all be happy, eh? |
On the subject of wry amusement that play off final was hilarious!!! Made my summer! COYRs!!!!!! |  |
| Scooters, Tunes, Trainers and QPR. |
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| this might put a smile on our faces on 23:27 - Aug 12 with 1312 views | Manti |
| this might put a smile on our faces on 23:23 - Aug 12 by Northolt_Rs |
On the subject of wry amusement that play off final was hilarious!!! Made my summer! COYRs!!!!!! |
Nice. We were having a grown up conversation. | | | |
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