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Not for us, but for Bury. i was credit checking a potential customer and decided to nosey onto BFC's file and was (or maybe not) supprised to see a new CCJ for circa £22k lodged only Wednesday this week. looks like they are in need of a bumper crowd tomorrow to settle some bills
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tomorrow can't come quick enough on 19:49 - Nov 20 with 5800 views
tomorrow can't come quick enough on 20:08 - Nov 20 by 442Dale
On the YouTube video Day says they've sold "nearly a million pounds worth of players". Who? Break that down please.
Off various reports: Matty Foulds £225k Everton Leon Clarke £125k Sheff Utd Jack Ruddy £100k Wolves Emeka Obi £100k Liverpool Chris Hussey small fee mentioned (lets say 50k) Sheff Utd Danny Rose small fee mentioned (lets say 50k) Mansfield
Cant think of anyone else?
Its a BRILLIANT goal to cap a BRILLIANT start by Rochdale - Don Goodman 26/08/10
tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:54 - Nov 20 by dingdangblue
Off various reports: Matty Foulds £225k Everton Leon Clarke £125k Sheff Utd Jack Ruddy £100k Wolves Emeka Obi £100k Liverpool Chris Hussey small fee mentioned (lets say 50k) Sheff Utd Danny Rose small fee mentioned (lets say 50k) Mansfield
Cant think of anyone else?
Peter Clarke £300,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
Apologies for underestimation.
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tomorrow can't come quick enough on 04:34 - Nov 21 with 5372 views
tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:46 - Nov 21 by aleanddale
No!
Likes the sound of his own voice way to much for my liking.
Thinks he is the fookin manager.
#cockwomble
Agree with who ever said shut the fook up ... Pay your bills and live within your fookin means!!!
bury fans and Ryan Lowe on Radio Manc phone in tonight 6-7. Lets hope they bring up some genuine points like why are they losing so much money every week/month, taking on loan after loan, planning to leave Gigg lane to chase Championship football - at what cost?
Its a BRILLIANT goal to cap a BRILLIANT start by Rochdale - Don Goodman 26/08/10
This just off the bury board: Unfortunately, it started later than was originally scheduled, so the one I was going to ask that I picked about the stadium sponsorship situation, there simply wasn't time for. I should say it started late not because of any of the board but because a volunteer who has chosen to do the administration for any future Southern Shakers meetings/events was himself late.
All the questions asked and answers given were as follows by Day (I recorded the audio of the entire event on my smartphone); the first two are mine. Italics are my own inputs and comments on what was said:
Given the current Elite Player Performance Plan (EPPP) environment, what can the club realistically do to try to ensure that the academy continues to be viable in the future and that income is maximised from any U18 player sales?
"EPPP is massively important to any club. Bury are Cat 3. We put a certain amount of money into it but get a certain amount of funding back from the EFL and we have to do an education programme. Three years ago when we took over, the academy was run by the community trust. Part of the plan was to move all the academy elements back under full control of the club because when it was under the trust, we had absolutely no say in how it was run, which is bizarre for any club. There is a business model in having a pathway to the first team. It's a big passion of mine (for the club) to develop the players in the academy and I think in the three years we've been here, we've made huge strides in this area. Players now make the first team squad whereas before, it would normally only have been out of necessity. They're now competing to try to get that place.
With the players we've been able to sell on (Foulds, Ruddy and Obi). The reason why we sold Obi, which hasn't fully come out in the press yet (although some people might have seen snippets). He's got a thing to sort out with the Home Office with his visa as he's of Nigerian descent. Once that goes through, the boy's just signed a five year pro contract with Liverpool. We got a very good deal for it and pretty profitable for the football club. With the way we structure the deals now, we've actually made £1m since we've been here, which hasn't happened at Bury for many years. Not only that, but when these players start making appearances at their respective clubs, we get rewards for that as well and when they go out on loan and/or get sold on, we get rewards for those. So it's on an ongoing basis now where for 18 years, that hasn't happened at Bury. You've got other clubs who have made substantial profits from player development and sales. Most playing careers now don't last 18 years, so for that to not to have happened at the club in all that time meant that we really had to start from scratch.
We only retained Mark Litherland (current acting youth team manager) since we took over. We've brought new staff in right through all the way down to the U8s. We've got some real playing talents coming through. We've already turned three bids down for Joe Adams (15, right/left winger playing for the U18s) - he's an outstanding player. We've got a kid called Femi (unsure on the spelling and they're obviously not going to disclose his full name because of his age), who's 13 and playing for the U16s - he scored a hat-trick at the weekend. He can run the 100 metres in 11.3 secs. He's an exciting talent and again, we've turned down bids for him. Normally with EPPP, if you don't offer them scholarships, you are unprotected... so the big clubs come in and start pinching players from the lower league clubs and they only have to pay £12,000 pa on the length of time that they've been at the club, whereas we've protected ourselves by offering scholarships to these players, so it becomes an open transfer where we could be able to get in excess of six figures for them.
The ultimate aim is to get them in the first team but sometimes as we don't have an U23 squad, it's a big jump from the U18s to the first team, so that's why it's difficult for us to get them in and around the first team squad. However, we need to try because as we've seen recently with John Stones, Barnsley pocketed £8m from that transfer - I can't remember the last time Bury made £8m from a transfer, so it's a huge business plan. With Obi, he's only 15 at the moment but I went to see Liverpool in person because we had three other clubs interested in him and I wanted to make sure that him going there was right for Bury and the player himself. Liverpool thought they could just come in and buy him just like that because they're Liverpool. We got the price where we wanted it to be by negotiating for three to four weeks. Liverpool had to sell their club to me as to why it was the right decision for Obi to go there and how they were going to create a pathway for him to get to the first team. It's no good having lots of add-ons once he reaches the first team if they're never going to be realised, so for us as a business, that was a key decision (in why he went there).
We've got another kid called Will Ferry coming back to fitness. We had a bad from Chelsea and another club last season that was in excess of six figures but we turned them down. Will's a fantastic talent. If any of you have the chance to go watch the U18s, do so because there are some exciting talents in the squad. I'm really proud of what the academy has achieved under Ryan Kidd and he's a sought-after coach. In the summer, Ryan turned down two or three jobs from bigger clubs because he believes in the plan and vision of what we've set out to accomplish."
What level of consultation with fans will take place if/when a new stadium site has been identified and made public?
"An open, public consultation and that is a key element. We've made no secret (of our desire to move). Most other EFL clubs have better (stadium) facilities that we don't have at Gigg. We need to have a business that becomes operational 365 days of the year - we're not now, we're only operational 23 to 25 days. We need to improve that substantially. We will be going to the town hall with the consultations; we have our architects drawing plans up now and we will take feedback from not just Bury fans but also the Bury public because it's going to affect them as well when we move ground. We want them to come on board and become part of it because it's not just going to be about Bury FC. What we're actually trying to do is to create a leisure destination - somewhere people want to go and use throughout the course of the year, not just on a Saturday afternoon but throughout the week as well. For obvious reasons, we can't identify the area yet because we're still in discussion with the landowners to make sure that it's a viable project for us."
Do you still think Bury will be in the Championship at the end of the original five year target?
"Er... I hope so. I think if everybody said it was a guarantee, other chairmen would look at it. This is the fourth season; we have next season to achieve this goal. When I went to Portugal in pre-season, I was only there for three days due to business commitments. I spoke to Glenn Thomas whilst we were there and looking at the squad we'd recruited up until that point, 'we've got a real chance of top six this season.' I saw how the group were together and how they started the season - third in the league after six wins from six in September. We knew it was going to be a long and difficult season but we thought the squad was good enough to at least get us to be challenging for the top six. I still believe that now. I still believe we can make it. There are lots of games left - we're only in November now, so the aim is to get in the Championship; it's going to be difficult because (for example) Portsmouth have spent three seasons trying to get out of League Two. They have far better resources than we have and they still can't get out. The aim is still there though."
Is the HMRC situation getting more under control?
"It is. Just to give you a bit of background on it, every football club in the country has had problems with HMRC one way or another. They're starting to target sporting clubs in a big, big way. James Leary (Finance Director) was at a finance meeting the other day and they had HMRC in and they discussed things like the minimum wage and they're fining clubs (where they're found not to be paying staff NMW), they're looking at youth policies as well. It's a really difficult procedure that HMRC do and we want to try to get the club stable and on its own two feet and not be reliant on outside funds to come into the club to keep it going every month. You've just recently seen what's happened at Chesterfield - their chairman's (David Allen) walked away and I think four directors resigned on Friday as well. They're in a really difficult situation. Allen was putting lots of money into the club to pay the bills and they've got fantastic facilities.
For us, it will go to court on Monday (today). We're pretty confident that it will be dismissed again because we've paid the bill. The money was there, it was an error that was made and we've rectified that. The unfortunate thing is that there is no leeway with HMRC. We've never been 30 days late (paying). Any business-minded here, if you've got a company paying you £1.7m within 30 days, why would you want to shut that down...? I don't get it. I don't get it... and neither do my lawyers. It's been very difficult. Bradford Bulls have gone into administration and they've just blamed HMRC as to the reason why and their aggressive stance they've taken against sporting organisations. There are errors we have got to improve on and there's got to be better things that we can do but unfortunately, we don't know when these fans are going to turn up on a Saturday or a Tuesday night. We played AFC Wimbledon on a Tuesday night a few weeks ago and got 2,000 fans. We lost money on it. We played Southend the other Saturday and had 3,000. We lost money on it. It's actually better for us to play behind closed doors. We'd save money... so that's the difficulty we're up against at the moment because as a football club, we have to be able to put money into the football club. HMRC have put us in a difficult position and we have to get better at what we're doing. We'll continue (to get better), we'll continue to work hard and we want the club to become self-sustainable. That's partly why the ground move is happening because we need to get more income into the business."
What's your opinion on regional divisions?
"I don't like the idea. I think you see the argument where people say that if you have north and south leagues, you get more local derbies and bigger crowds. When we were in League Two, Accrington brought 136 fans to us. The week after, Portsmouth brought 2,500. Plymouth 900. The biggest local away support was Carlisle with 700. It differs a lot. There are big clubs in each division travelling around the country and the teams deserve to be on merit in the leagues that they're in. I can see why they've done it with the National League North and South but for professional football, it needs to stay national. The Whole Game Solution got kicked on the head last week because they were possibly looking at regionalisation as well. For me, I prefer travelling up and down the country to watch the games and I enjoy doing that."
Is it beneficial financially to Bury if fans buy their tickets from Bury rather than the opposition team?
"Yes, we get a commission if you buy away tickets through Bury FC. It's something that a lot of other clubs do as well. We get a percentage of the ticket. It's just getting the numbers to make a significant difference."
Original questioner then says fans get charged for postage.
"Probably so. We could organise a way of getting tickets down from the club to (exiled) away supporters and hand them out to everyone."
Segues into saying that this could be one of the ways to keep the Southern Shakers Fan Club going whilst benefitting the club financially.
Is Carrington sustainable?
"This is the question I get asked the most. Carrington is the envy of every other EFL club. From my position, it's the best business decision I've ever made at Bury. Carrington is something where (in the past,) we have a cost wherever we go to train. Before we took it on, we had a cost of going to different venues, especially if Lower Gigg wasn't usable due to poor weather conditions. Everything had a substantial cost (maintenance at Lower Gigg, food, pitch hire) and we had to work around other clubs' training schedules like Bolton and Manchester United. The players were getting phone calls at 10:30 or 11:00 at night to find out where they were training the next day. They were also training on different surfaces and were picking up injuries by being on the different pitch types all the time, so it was difficult for us. Getting Carrington was key to us as we now had/have a base - Premier League standard facilities. Rehabilitation rooms, ice baths, on-site gym and six pitches. It's a huge benefit for our academy. Our youth team play their home games there on Saturdays and lower ages on Sundays. We also have the opportunity to have an indoor 'dome' there as well, so when there's bad weather, a dome can be erected, which then the first team can use. We can hire it out to get income back in.
We have linked up with a company called Inspire Sport. They have an office they rent from us at Carrington. They're getting kids in for soccer schools here. We're going to put on our own soccer schools too for our own fans and the community at the training ground as well. Carrington has been a godsend to us, particularly with the amount of other clubs that have approached me to share with us or regretted not taking the opportunity. The players we have recently signed wouldn't have come if we weren't at Carrington, that's the biggest thing. Leon Clarke would not have signed for Bury if he had to travel to three or four different venues every week, nor James Vaughan. It's an instrumental tool for the kids as well; it's a case of them saying 'how do I sign for this football club?' because that's where they'd be working Monday to Friday every week."
What made you change your mind given your public support for David Flitcroft last Monday to then sack him on Wednesday?
I think this has been extensively covered elsewhere, both on this thread and in the YouTube/Shakers Player interview but if anyone really wants the transcript, I'll add it to this thread.
If we're still looking to build a 15,000-20,000 capacity stadium, how are we going to fill it given the low crowds at Gigg Lane?
"It's statistically proven that when a club moves to a new stadium, they normally see on average a 38% increase in their attendances. A lot of people in the Bury Metropolitan Borough (BMB) area want to see the new stadium, see the new facilities. I remember when I used to watch Huddersfield Town at Leeds Road. They used to get 3,000-odd on a Saturday. Last time, they got 20,000 against Sheffield Wednesday. The Kirklees MB area is similar in population to Bury MB (200,000 to 184,000 - Official stats would suggest Kirklees MB has more than double the population of Bury MB, but I digress). Kirklees has a lot of Leeds and Bradford supporters in it as well. I understand that Bury's catchment area has fans from a lot of other clubs in it but what we're going to try to do is attract them to our football club. That's why we've launched the 'Team Shakers' brand. It's something I've worked on for 12 months, targetting 4-11 year olds because they're the next generation of supporters. Our age demographics at the moment unfortunately are over 65s. We need to try to drive that down, as we much as we appreciate their support. We need to get younger fans in. The Team Shakers brand has been very well received. We've got big corporate sponsors wanting to work with us on that. It's not just being a member of Team Shakers but also linking with other businesses to get discounted tickets at the Chill Factor and the skydiving place, for example. We've got to go into every school in the borough. That is the absolute key. You'll see a lot more through social media - first team players going out there, going to the schools to attract kids to support Bury. That's where we want to try to get to. There's a lot of work we've got to do to get there.
By targetting Championship football, we need to have a stadium that size. Newcastle took 6,500 to Preston. Newcastle are taking 8,000 to Leeds today. Leeds took 8,300 to Blackburn. Wolves took 8,300 to MK Dons (last season). So with all due respect, I've got to target away fans to get the extra revenue because that's where the income is on a matchday, as much as we're thankful to the season ticket holders and supporters coming through, that's where we're going. We played Bolton the other week and we had to restrict them to 3,100 tickets because of the facilities and what the police were saying. Because it's a funnel entrance into Gigg, it's very difficult to get the policing and stewarding right. If you've got a brand new stadium, you can cordon them off and disperse the away fans to a completely different section and that would actually cut down on the policing bills. So we take a lot of advice by coming to different grounds, how the policing could work, where the cost savings could be made as well. The 'average' Championship clubs in the regional area - Blackburn, Sheffield Wednesday, Huddersfield, Leeds... they'll all bring huge numbers to Bury and that's where we've got to target. One of those games would potentially be the equivalent of seven to eight matches at Gigg in League One currently. It's not just about Bury fans turning up. We've looked at the bigger picture time and time again."
What are your highest and lowest points as chairman so far?
"I'll start with the lowest point, which was the drive to see David Flitcroft on Wednesday, with him knowing that his contract was probably going to be terminated. The hardest decision I've made as I respect him highly. It's been a very tough week for us. I went in to see the players on Thursday to explain why I'd made the decision. I also said to the players that 'you've got a responsibility as well. There are a lot of you in this room that get paid very well, a professional contract playing football that all of us (staff and fans) would dream of having, so I want you all to have a long, hard look at yourselves because have you done enough? Have you worked hard enough? Have you put enough in? Have you given everything you possibly could?' I want players at this club who are proud to wear the shirt. If they're not proud to wear the shirt, I said to them on Thursday that if they can leave now. There's the door there, you can get out of Carrington now. Thankfully, none of them got up as we'd all be playing against AFC Wimbledon today. That commitment is what I want. I want that passion. That's what I want from the players. I said to them that I've given them everything. They get treated like a Championship club now, that's how we prepare. They travelled down on Friday and stayed in a hotel overnight. They're going back on the train tonight because they're preparing for the game against Sheffield United on Tuesday. 'I've given you everything, I need something back and I want that performance from you (against AFC Wimbledon).'
A lot of players are sad about the decision on Wednesday, there are players that might be happy... but we've all got to galvanise as one now and push on because there's still a long way to go this season. Thursday was also a very difficult day when David Flitcroft came in to see the staff and all the players as well, so it was like a bereavement unfortunately, as daft as it sounds.
The highest point was Tranmere away to gain promotion and winning the game in the way that we did. It was incredible. The experience of having that is something I want to experience again. My dad isn't able to travel to long distance away games like today. He watched me play home and away during my playing career and he came to the Tranmere game. He turned round and there were tears in his eyes. He was just so proud of what we achieved to get us out of that league and that meant the world to him by doing that. I want to be able to give him that again by getting to the Championship. Every day I go to work, I want him to proud of me. He's the proudest dad in the world and he tells me all the time and I want to make him proud again."
After that, there was a rallying cry from Stewart Day for the fans to really get behind the players, Brass and Kidd at the match.
[Post edited 21 Nov 2016 16:24]
Its a BRILLIANT goal to cap a BRILLIANT start by Rochdale - Don Goodman 26/08/10
Is it beneficial financially to Bury if fans buy their tickets from Bury rather than the opposition team?
"Yes, we get a commission if you buy away tickets through Bury FC. It's something that a lot of other clubs do as well. We get a percentage of the ticket. It's just getting the numbers to make a significant difference."
'Normally with EPPP, if you don't offer them scholarships, you are unprotected... so the big clubs come in and start pinching players from the lower league clubs and they only have to pay £12,000 pa on the length of time that they've been at the club, whereas we've protected ourselves by offering scholarships to these players, so it becomes an open transfer where we could be able to get in excess of six figures for them. '
square with what was said further up the thread (I think) about what you get for young players. Do we do the same (assuming it's true)?
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tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:28 - Nov 21 with 4531 views
tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:01 - Nov 21 by dingdangblue
bury fans and Ryan Lowe on Radio Manc phone in tonight 6-7. Lets hope they bring up some genuine points like why are they losing so much money every week/month, taking on loan after loan, planning to leave Gigg lane to chase Championship football - at what cost?
Funny that Ryan lowe appearing like magic as soon as there was a sniff of the manager's job at Bury.
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tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:32 - Nov 21 with 4515 views
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