| chairman and wealth 14:11 - Dec 20 with 2802 views | electricblue |
In another topic having money or a wealthy backer..
Just take a look at Cardiff is that the type of person we would like to see at spotland a certain Mr Tan...
Ok he as an abundance of wealth etc who cares to me he is just another person who does not give a toss about the fans and football in general..
Malky Mackay got Cardiff into the prem and yet the names being banded about are no better..
I for one hate to see dale owned by this sort of person.....
Keep up the good work CD..... |  |
| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| chairman and wealth on 22:04 - Dec 21 with 2010 views | DiddyDave |
Well said sir,unfortunately the heirachy at the FA don`t seem to give a toss,that`s why so many clubs have gone to the wall in recent years. Why we can`t have the same rules as they have in Germany,I don`t know,but I must say I`m pleasantly surprised that the FA have asked for the fans` opinion in Hull being renamed. As you said,good on Mr Dunphy for keeping the club in the real world. |  | | |
| chairman and wealth on 22:22 - Dec 21 with 1995 views | R17ALE |
"that`s why so many clubs have gone to the wall in recent years"
Which clubs are you referring to? I'm guessing a list of at least 4. |  |
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| chairman and wealth on 02:10 - Dec 22 with 1922 views | DiddyDave |
You know what I mean,it`s all a technicality,they go into administration and all is forgiven as long as HM Taxes are paid. Hornets included. | | | |
| chairman and wealth on 11:40 - Dec 23 with 1736 views | electricblue |
I would like to see the FA and the FL grow a pair in 2014 and implement changes..
I would like to see more cash moving through leagues etc and into non league..
Also its about time that any club no matter how high n mighty they are if they fall into admin then its a drop into the conference....
I would also like to see more n more explayers move into refereeing and grass roots coaching aswell.. | |
| My all time favourite Dale player Mr Lyndon Symmonds |
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| chairman and wealth on 17:28 - Dec 23 with 1583 views | KenBoon |
I think ex-players would make terrible referees. As a fan I know what a foul is, I don't need to have "played the game". Players usually don't know the laws themselves.
As for Chairmen. What has the Cardiff City chairman done wrong? He's bankrolled their rise into the Premier League, changed the colour of their kit to the National colour and the crest. Welcome to the Premier League football, you're the Welsh franchise (Swansea are 'The Swans'). Don't like it? Go back into the Football League. I think the manager issue is inspired by what Southampton did last year. |  | | |
| chairman and wealth on 17:37 - Dec 23 with 1570 views | 442Dale |
| chairman and wealth on 17:28 - Dec 23 by KenBoon |
I think ex-players would make terrible referees. As a fan I know what a foul is, I don't need to have "played the game". Players usually don't know the laws themselves.
As for Chairmen. What has the Cardiff City chairman done wrong? He's bankrolled their rise into the Premier League, changed the colour of their kit to the National colour and the crest. Welcome to the Premier League football, you're the Welsh franchise (Swansea are 'The Swans'). Don't like it? Go back into the Football League. I think the manager issue is inspired by what Southampton did last year. |
Except Southampton believed Adkins had taken them as far as he could and identified a manager who could take them further on the field. This is one bloke making decisions about a game he knows very little about.
Changing a team's kit colour so drastically is wrong. Very wrong. And credit to all Cardiff fans who have continued to protest against it over the last year or so. The problem will be if Tan decides he's had enough, because what infrastructure is there to deal without his money? I'd guess there are a percentage of Cardiff fans who would prefer to see their club meandering along in the Football League wearing blue rather than witness this farce. |  |
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| chairman and wealth on 17:53 - Dec 23 with 1552 views | BFC |
A few months ago there was a thread on here about Dunphy on which I stated he comes across as a top geezer with the best interests of Rochdale AFC close to his heart.
Most, if not all, clubs at this level of football would be delighted to have him as Chairman. | | | |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 19:18 - Dec 23 with 1473 views | SuddenLad |
| chairman and wealth on 17:37 - Dec 23 by 442Dale |
Except Southampton believed Adkins had taken them as far as he could and identified a manager who could take them further on the field. This is one bloke making decisions about a game he knows very little about.
Changing a team's kit colour so drastically is wrong. Very wrong. And credit to all Cardiff fans who have continued to protest against it over the last year or so. The problem will be if Tan decides he's had enough, because what infrastructure is there to deal without his money? I'd guess there are a percentage of Cardiff fans who would prefer to see their club meandering along in the Football League wearing blue rather than witness this farce. |
The Chairman at Reading may soon be deciding that Adkins has outlived his position with them and taken the club as far as he can. [Post edited 24 Dec 2013 13:15]
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| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| chairman and wealth on 10:53 - Dec 24 with 1340 views | wmgunit |
Tan has made a right mess of the situation. As pointed out above, Southampton had a clear plan in mind, they got Adkins out quick and replaced him straight away. Many people thought it was unfair on Adkins, but the dismissal process was handled respectfully. Mackay has been treated badly and Tan looks weak for not delivering on his ridiculous ultimatum.
With all that said, I do think its Tan's prerogative to do what he wants with the football club he owns. Still, the slapdash amateurish management of the clubs coaching and recruitment staff over the last 6 months would infuriate me as a Cardiff fan. Changing the shirt though? Give over, it's just a colour at the end of the day. |  | | |
| chairman and wealth on 11:15 - Dec 24 with 1319 views | D_Alien |
| chairman and wealth on 10:53 - Dec 24 by wmgunit |
Tan has made a right mess of the situation. As pointed out above, Southampton had a clear plan in mind, they got Adkins out quick and replaced him straight away. Many people thought it was unfair on Adkins, but the dismissal process was handled respectfully. Mackay has been treated badly and Tan looks weak for not delivering on his ridiculous ultimatum.
With all that said, I do think its Tan's prerogative to do what he wants with the football club he owns. Still, the slapdash amateurish management of the clubs coaching and recruitment staff over the last 6 months would infuriate me as a Cardiff fan. Changing the shirt though? Give over, it's just a colour at the end of the day. |
If its just a colour, why change it in the first place?
(Yes, I know, markets and finance).
But goodwill? What's that worth? Obviously doesn't give a bluebird and once he realises he's out of his depth he'll pull the plug.
It also raises the question of ownership - what exactly does that constitute? Tan's bought the infrastructure and assets.Bought the Club though? In one very important sense, it's not his - or anyones - to buy.
Feel free to disagree. |  |
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| chairman and wealth on 11:52 - Dec 24 with 1286 views | 442Dale |
| chairman and wealth on 10:53 - Dec 24 by wmgunit |
Tan has made a right mess of the situation. As pointed out above, Southampton had a clear plan in mind, they got Adkins out quick and replaced him straight away. Many people thought it was unfair on Adkins, but the dismissal process was handled respectfully. Mackay has been treated badly and Tan looks weak for not delivering on his ridiculous ultimatum.
With all that said, I do think its Tan's prerogative to do what he wants with the football club he owns. Still, the slapdash amateurish management of the clubs coaching and recruitment staff over the last 6 months would infuriate me as a Cardiff fan. Changing the shirt though? Give over, it's just a colour at the end of the day. |
The colour is part of the identity. Some fans don't mind about kit colours as much as others, but as we've seen at Dale, get it wrong and you'll affect the people who are expected to buy those shirts. That then affects income, which affects budgets, which affects the team/manager/chairman & owners.  Even if there are some supporters who wouldn't care, they would be affected if the team on the pitch wasn't invested in due to a reduced budget as a vital revenue stream in shirt sales dries up.
If we started wearing red next season, there would be a predictable and justified negative reaction. | |
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| chairman and wealth on 12:03 - Dec 24 with 1273 views | TVOS1907 |
| chairman and wealth on 11:52 - Dec 24 by 442Dale |
The colour is part of the identity. Some fans don't mind about kit colours as much as others, but as we've seen at Dale, get it wrong and you'll affect the people who are expected to buy those shirts. That then affects income, which affects budgets, which affects the team/manager/chairman & owners.  Even if there are some supporters who wouldn't care, they would be affected if the team on the pitch wasn't invested in due to a reduced budget as a vital revenue stream in shirt sales dries up.
If we started wearing red next season, there would be a predictable and justified negative reaction. |
We wouldn't have any problems at Hartlepool and Bristol Rovers! |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| chairman and wealth on 12:51 - Dec 24 with 1227 views | wmgunit |
| chairman and wealth on 11:15 - Dec 24 by D_Alien |
If its just a colour, why change it in the first place?
(Yes, I know, markets and finance).
But goodwill? What's that worth? Obviously doesn't give a bluebird and once he realises he's out of his depth he'll pull the plug.
It also raises the question of ownership - what exactly does that constitute? Tan's bought the infrastructure and assets.Bought the Club though? In one very important sense, it's not his - or anyones - to buy.
Feel free to disagree. |
Interesting points about ownership. My understanding is that, in the simplest form, the owner owns the clubs assets and liabilities; contracts, debt, physical property, intellectual property (the brand) etc. With these he is entitled to do as he wishes within the law and rules of the FA. Of course, this doesn't include any right to a clubs fans and their money. As such, a sensible owner acts in the best interest and consults the fans when it is practical to do so. Their is no obligation for the owner to do so however. Just as fans are under no obligation to part with their cash for tickets and merchandise etc.
Greater fan ownership is an interesting concept. Fans put a lot of time and money into their clubs. They want to feel like they have a stake and say what happens at the club. We've seen plenty of sensible suggestions on club marketing on this board over the years. However, I am not entirely convinced that fans would be any less fallible than traditional 'owners' in their decision making. What is to be said for fan ownership is that at least fans would be able to take greater responsibility for the direction of the club, good or bad.
As far as shirt colours go, if it's just a colour then why not change it? That's why I think it's an irrelevance. It only provokes a negative response from fans and a chain reaction to sales, profits and then recruitment because fans are irrationally attached to a single colour. I didn't particularly like the design of the Dale shirts this year, bit neither was I outraged as some seem to be when the club shirt isn't just so. In an ideal world the shirt is designed in a consultative way with fans. I just find anything particularly offensive about an owner deciding to do something different with the property they own. It might be an odd decision to do so, but it shouldn't be of any actual consequence.
Conversely, if the owner made a decision that was of actual consequence, say decisions that youth development would be scrapped and all the money saved spent on purely signing players from other clubs, then I can see why people would actually be annoyed. | | | |
| chairman and wealth on 13:30 - Dec 24 with 1193 views | 442Dale |
| chairman and wealth on 12:51 - Dec 24 by wmgunit |
Interesting points about ownership. My understanding is that, in the simplest form, the owner owns the clubs assets and liabilities; contracts, debt, physical property, intellectual property (the brand) etc. With these he is entitled to do as he wishes within the law and rules of the FA. Of course, this doesn't include any right to a clubs fans and their money. As such, a sensible owner acts in the best interest and consults the fans when it is practical to do so. Their is no obligation for the owner to do so however. Just as fans are under no obligation to part with their cash for tickets and merchandise etc.
Greater fan ownership is an interesting concept. Fans put a lot of time and money into their clubs. They want to feel like they have a stake and say what happens at the club. We've seen plenty of sensible suggestions on club marketing on this board over the years. However, I am not entirely convinced that fans would be any less fallible than traditional 'owners' in their decision making. What is to be said for fan ownership is that at least fans would be able to take greater responsibility for the direction of the club, good or bad.
As far as shirt colours go, if it's just a colour then why not change it? That's why I think it's an irrelevance. It only provokes a negative response from fans and a chain reaction to sales, profits and then recruitment because fans are irrationally attached to a single colour. I didn't particularly like the design of the Dale shirts this year, bit neither was I outraged as some seem to be when the club shirt isn't just so. In an ideal world the shirt is designed in a consultative way with fans. I just find anything particularly offensive about an owner deciding to do something different with the property they own. It might be an odd decision to do so, but it shouldn't be of any actual consequence.
Conversely, if the owner made a decision that was of actual consequence, say decisions that youth development would be scrapped and all the money saved spent on purely signing players from other clubs, then I can see why people would actually be annoyed. |
But changing the colour or a poor design is of consequence because some fans protested/didn't buy it (as in our case, when, as you say we got it wrong this season) Why is it irrational?
Is it irrational if the fans in the Sandy protest should they be told their terrace is being given to away fans? Of course not. It doesn't affect me, but I can see why they'd be annoyed and protest.
A shirt isn't a colour or a design, it's an identity. Not all fans may think so, but they should realise the importance of it to a club even if they don't particularly care. Especially at Dale when the income from selling shirts can run into the tens of thousands... surely that's of consequence to cash-flow? [Post edited 24 Dec 2013 13:35]
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| chairman and wealth on 14:32 - Dec 24 with 1145 views | TVOS1907 |
| chairman and wealth on 13:30 - Dec 24 by 442Dale |
But changing the colour or a poor design is of consequence because some fans protested/didn't buy it (as in our case, when, as you say we got it wrong this season) Why is it irrational?
Is it irrational if the fans in the Sandy protest should they be told their terrace is being given to away fans? Of course not. It doesn't affect me, but I can see why they'd be annoyed and protest.
A shirt isn't a colour or a design, it's an identity. Not all fans may think so, but they should realise the importance of it to a club even if they don't particularly care. Especially at Dale when the income from selling shirts can run into the tens of thousands... surely that's of consequence to cash-flow? [Post edited 24 Dec 2013 13:35]
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Spot on.
Can you imagine Celtic playing in blue or the likes of Villa and West Ham ditching their claret and blue? | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| chairman and wealth on 15:33 - Dec 24 with 1094 views | wmgunit |
| chairman and wealth on 13:30 - Dec 24 by 442Dale |
But changing the colour or a poor design is of consequence because some fans protested/didn't buy it (as in our case, when, as you say we got it wrong this season) Why is it irrational?
Is it irrational if the fans in the Sandy protest should they be told their terrace is being given to away fans? Of course not. It doesn't affect me, but I can see why they'd be annoyed and protest.
A shirt isn't a colour or a design, it's an identity. Not all fans may think so, but they should realise the importance of it to a club even if they don't particularly care. Especially at Dale when the income from selling shirts can run into the tens of thousands... surely that's of consequence to cash-flow? [Post edited 24 Dec 2013 13:35]
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It's only of consequence because fans choose for it to be. There is no value to be gained from playing in red over playing in blue or vice versa. The only reason fans want the colour/crest to stay one way is because of history ('that's the way it has always been'). A lot about supporting a football club is irrational. I accept that. I accept that the colour represents an identity. But this identity is purely a construct. It's for nobody to say that people are wrong to want a clubs colours to stay the same, but such a position can't be demonstrated to be rational.
[Post edited 24 Dec 2013 16:44]
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| chairman and wealth on 15:42 - Dec 24 with 1080 views | 442Dale |
| chairman and wealth on 15:33 - Dec 24 by wmgunit |
It's only of consequence because fans choose for it to be. There is no value to be gained from playing in red over playing in blue or vice versa. The only reason fans want the colour/crest to stay one way is because of history ('that's the way it has always been'). A lot about supporting a football club is irrational. I accept that. I accept that the colour represents an identity. But this identity is purely a construct. It's for nobody to say that people are wrong to want a clubs colours to stay the same, but such a position can't be demonstrated to be rational.
[Post edited 24 Dec 2013 16:44]
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And nor can keeping Coronation Street set up here when they could tell the same stories in the East End of London. | |
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| chairman and wealth on 16:27 - Dec 24 with 1036 views | wmgunit |
| chairman and wealth on 15:42 - Dec 24 by 442Dale |
And nor can keeping Coronation Street set up here when they could tell the same stories in the East End of London. |
Nah, I'd be outraged if that happened. | | | |
| chairman and wealth on 16:41 - Dec 24 with 1022 views | 442Dale |
| chairman and wealth on 16:27 - Dec 24 by wmgunit |
Nah, I'd be outraged if that happened. |
Me too... if Rita had a purple coat. | |
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| chairman and wealth on 16:47 - Dec 24 with 1011 views | wmgunit |
| chairman and wealth on 16:41 - Dec 24 by 442Dale |
Me too... if Rita had a purple coat. |
So long as the accent doesn't change.... | | | |
| chairman and wealth on 17:36 - Dec 24 with 949 views | D_Alien |
| chairman and wealth on 16:47 - Dec 24 by wmgunit |
So long as the accent doesn't change.... |
They should bring a black actress in to play Rita.
That'd demonstrate how little colour * matters.
*Warning: politically incorrect term | |
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| chairman and wealth on 17:46 - Dec 24 with 927 views | wmgunit |
| chairman and wealth on 17:36 - Dec 24 by D_Alien |
They should bring a black actress in to play Rita.
That'd demonstrate how little colour * matters.
*Warning: politically incorrect term |
Yeah, because race is just a construct too. | | | |
| chairman and wealth on 18:50 - Dec 24 with 882 views | NotEyreClue |
Welsh teams shouldn't be playing in the English Leagues anyway so we musn't worry too much about it..
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| The modern pioneer of mealy mouthed bollocks. |
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| chairman and wealth on 19:06 - Dec 24 with 868 views | windowsbug |
Are we forgetting the Dave Sutton era when we played in white. |  | | |
| chairman and wealth on 19:25 - Dec 24 with 845 views | 442Dale |
| chairman and wealth on 19:06 - Dec 24 by windowsbug |
Are we forgetting the Dave Sutton era when we played in white. |
Not at all. We wore it for less than 6 months. A white kit that was introduced because the commercial department had received positive feedback when it was the previous season's third kit (93-94 when we wore all green away). The white shirt being used at home received criticism at the time - in the fanzine and at a fans forum. By mid-season we had reverted back to wearing blue.Â
Saying that, Dale do have a history of wearing white, but similar attempts to revive it in the 80s didn't go down so well either.Â
Of course, we have actually "changed" our colours to blue, black and white in recent years. But that move was done well and only added a colour to the club's identity rather than removing it. And it succeeded it making us unique in this country, not that we do enough to capitalise on it. But that's a whole new discussion.... [Post edited 24 Dec 2013 19:26]
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