| Utter fiasco 07:13 - May 21 with 11881 views | MattFinish |
So that’s the end of the season
You can blame Tonda and call for him to be sacked but what does that achieve for us. Getting rid of a clearly talented manager and motivator because the EFL have given us this unprecedented, disproportionate and highly controversial punishment.
More and more respected football commentators and pundits are saying this was hugely disproportionate and are shocked at the severity of the punishment
I don’t like Simon Jordan but generally he knows what he’s talking about. He said yesterday that this was ridiculous and disproportionate
So let’s look at this. We know what happened but why did the EFL come down so hard and massively out of proportion with the offence and any previous sanctions
The only thing I can think is that there was someone inside the EFL pushing for this and that points to Middlesbrough CEO and EFL board member Neil Bausor
If you look at this, it’s been engineered to allow Middlesbrough to get a second chance at getting to the playoff final, which shouldn’t have happened.
The EFL decided to allow two legs of football take place knowing the charge and that Boro had proof in the hope that Boro would win. They were beaten fair and square over two legs and were out. Then someone at the EFL decided the outcome of the game that they sanctioned to happen should be changed.
Sorry but those legs were played and Boro were knocked out. What the EFL had to look at now was the final and whether they’d allow Saints to play Hull. If the answer was no then Hull should have been promoted. Boro had been knocked out and had nothing more to do with proceedings. Where is the rule saying they could be reinstated.
The final should have been originally cancelled immediately and put back a week while this was resolved. It could have been played at a neutral ground like Old Trafford if Wembley wasn’t available
Instead the EFL have dragged this out and made it look like we were being reinstated by offering us additional tickets on the day of the first hearing just a couple of hours before the decision. This has led Hull to train to face us while all the time Boro have been preparing for Hull
So the whole thing seems to have been engineered to advantage Boro
Okay we can’t apparently appeal the decision, but we should check that’s the case, however there’s nothing to stop us asking for an enquiry into the severity of the punishment and the role played by Neil Bausor
Anyway I’ll sign off with Come on you Tigers [Post edited 21 May 7:21]
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| Utter fiasco on 11:49 - May 23 with 1457 views | dirk_doone |
| Utter fiasco on 11:44 - May 23 by kentsouthampton |
That and we will have zero sponsors. |
"WE" ?
Do you admit to other Pompey fans that you've switched o being a Saints fan now or do you try to keep it a secret?
Dishonesty, lying and cheating. Yes. that sums you up: a Pompey fan pretending he's a Saints fan, or have you really started supporting Saints now? [Post edited 23 May 11:50]
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| Utter fiasco on 11:49 - May 23 with 1455 views | kentsouthampton |
| Utter fiasco on 09:02 - May 21 by MattFinish |
Totally agree
I think the unjustifiably disproportionate EFL punishment is actually skewing people’s judgement of what has happened. The only previous precedent is the £200k fine Leeds got
I think give Tonda a fine, move on and get promoted next season
My worry is we sack a very good young manager and replace him with Jones/Seles/Still Mark 2 |
"The only previous precedent is the £200k fine Leeds got "
Rubbish, Canada got docked six points at the Olympics which ended their tournament for one spying offence and the management team got banned from football worldwide for a year. |  | | |
| Utter fiasco on 11:52 - May 23 with 1439 views | dirk_doone |
| Utter fiasco on 11:49 - May 23 by kentsouthampton |
"The only previous precedent is the £200k fine Leeds got "
Rubbish, Canada got docked six points at the Olympics which ended their tournament for one spying offence and the management team got banned from football worldwide for a year. |
As you're either a liar or a turncoat, why should we bother listening to you? [Post edited 23 May 11:53]
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| Utter fiasco on 12:44 - May 23 with 1378 views | Bridders2 |
| Utter fiasco on 20:29 - May 21 by HytheFerrytales |
You and Matt are relying on the word "if" to do all the heavy lifting in your arguments.
Where in the wide world of sports does a bloke keep his job when he has been accused of, and admitted to, cheating by breaking the rules of the governing body.
You are painting Eckert as a loveable rogue . That is a long way off the mark. Disproportionate or not, the ruling will take the club into a very bad place...we are all Saints through and through on here (I first went to the Dell in 1960) but the idea that Eckert can stay is a logic that has sadly passed over this old geezer's head. |
But not a problem for Bielsa. |  |
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| Utter fiasco on 12:56 - May 23 with 1359 views | SanMarco |
| Utter fiasco on 07:32 - May 21 by saint22 |
There is no way Tonda can stay, he sanctioned cheating more than once that’s not to be done
The punishment however is OTT
I have read in several place that if this was a manager led decision and players and club were unaware the expulsion is plenty and any further punishment should be Tondas to bear |
Why should we pay Tonda's salary for the year or more he serves his suspension? He has to go and will.
Given the extraordinary nature of the punishment someone in the Saints structure (Parsons maybe) also has to resign over the pathetic response to the crisis from the VERY START. Even given Tonda's stupid and cheating behaviour Saints expulsion wasn't inevitable from the start. A robust response (including legal) from the very start, even if it ultimately failed would have been better for the fans. Total honesty about what Tonda and co had actually done wouldalso have at least mitigated the shock of the verdict and taken the wind out of the EFL-Mbor axis sails. | | | |
| Utter fiasco on 13:08 - May 23 with 1348 views | HytheFerrytales |
| Utter fiasco on 12:44 - May 23 by Bridders2 |
But not a problem for Bielsa. |
Fair point but those were different times and circumstances..
Leeds were only charged on the Reg in place which was the pretty vague "good faith" one.
It wasn't a play off game (I don't think)
Bielsa and Leeds apologised immediately and Bielsa paid the fine out of his own pocket.
The Leeds Chair went to his opposite number at Derby, broke bread and apologised,
As for us...It was a massive game...our management were absolutely "deer in the headlights...no apologies were ,or have been, made to anyone. We just look like muppets.
Not surprising that the " Wiley W*nker" Gibson was given an open goal to give it to us right up the wazoo. | | | |
| Utter fiasco on 13:58 - May 23 with 1300 views | kentsouthampton |
| Utter fiasco on 11:49 - May 23 by dirk_doone |
"WE" ?
Do you admit to other Pompey fans that you've switched o being a Saints fan now or do you try to keep it a secret?
Dishonesty, lying and cheating. Yes. that sums you up: a Pompey fan pretending he's a Saints fan, or have you really started supporting Saints now? [Post edited 23 May 11:50]
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You really are a proper weirdo, are you stalking me now? | | | |
| Utter fiasco on 14:05 - May 23 with 1282 views | dirk_doone |
| Utter fiasco on 13:58 - May 23 by kentsouthampton |
You really are a proper weirdo, are you stalking me now? |
You are the weirdo, KentSouthampton, a Pompey fan pretending to be a Saints fan. and you are so delusional that you think people don't know that? | |
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| Utter fiasco on 15:59 - May 23 with 1181 views | kentsouthampton |
| Utter fiasco on 14:05 - May 23 by dirk_doone |
You are the weirdo, KentSouthampton, a Pompey fan pretending to be a Saints fan. and you are so delusional that you think people don't know that? |
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| Utter fiasco on 16:20 - May 23 with 1152 views | GasGiant |
| Utter fiasco on 11:41 - May 23 by kentsouthampton |
FWIW proportionality doesn't come in to it, there was no way they were going to let a club that blatantly cheated and then lied about it play in that final. |
Of course it comes into it FFS - not every misdemeanour is the same - you don't treat every incidence identically do you. Your proposition is like saying anyone who commits a crime must be treated the same; they are a criminal and therefore the punishment must always be the maximum. Really? You would sentence somebody to 20 years for shoplifting? And as I said in another post. Everybody cheats. Every single club in the League cheats. THey don't all get found out though. | | | |
| Utter fiasco on 16:42 - May 23 with 1090 views | kentsouthampton |
| Utter fiasco on 16:20 - May 23 by GasGiant |
Of course it comes into it FFS - not every misdemeanour is the same - you don't treat every incidence identically do you. Your proposition is like saying anyone who commits a crime must be treated the same; they are a criminal and therefore the punishment must always be the maximum. Really? You would sentence somebody to 20 years for shoplifting? And as I said in another post. Everybody cheats. Every single club in the League cheats. THey don't all get found out though. |
Ill take the bait, and forget the whataboutery, so what would you call proportional bearing in mind we were cheating to win 200 million potentially. | | | |
| Utter fiasco on 10:53 - May 25 with 951 views | City_boy |
Slightly off topic, but how did Saints get caught spying on Ipswich at Eastleigh or did Saints just admit to this one ? | | | |
| Utter fiasco on 10:55 - May 25 with 947 views | dirk_doone |
| Utter fiasco on 10:53 - May 25 by City_boy |
Slightly off topic, but how did Saints get caught spying on Ipswich at Eastleigh or did Saints just admit to this one ? |
Middlesbrough's spy at Southampton revealed a lot of information.
[Post edited 25 May 10:57]
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| Utter fiasco on 10:59 - May 25 with 935 views | Chesham_Saint |
| Utter fiasco on 16:42 - May 23 by kentsouthampton |
Ill take the bait, and forget the whataboutery, so what would you call proportional bearing in mind we were cheating to win 200 million potentially. |
Surely by that measure every club that cheats outside the Premier League is hoping that the advantage they get will ultimately get them to said league and the £200m prize?
In which event kill them all?! |  |
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| Utter fiasco on 11:02 - May 25 with 931 views | kernow |
| Utter fiasco on 16:42 - May 23 by kentsouthampton |
Ill take the bait, and forget the whataboutery, so what would you call proportional bearing in mind we were cheating to win 200 million potentially. |
I wonder if, on reflection, Gibbo wishes he’d done as his mate Simon Jordan suggested, and shook us down for 10%.
He obviously didn’t read The Art of the Deal. | | | |
| Utter fiasco on 17:01 - May 25 with 868 views | GasGiant |
| Utter fiasco on 16:42 - May 23 by kentsouthampton |
Ill take the bait, and forget the whataboutery, so what would you call proportional bearing in mind we were cheating to win 200 million potentially. |
For instance, you might say there is no difference between stealing £200m and just stealing £2.50 but using it to buy a lottery ticket that *could* win £200m. Shift the context and it means the Brinks Matt robbers are no better or worse than a bloke lifting a box of swan vestas from a One Stop, but the bloke nicking the matches gets 20 years, same as them. That's the first point. The second point is to what extent did that spying actually alter the outcome of the game. There has to be a difference between (for example) spiking a player's food to get him out of a game (active), and just watching him to see whether or not he is going to play anyway (passive). If you aren't going to have any nuance then you have to have a single arbitrary punishment no matter what degree of crime was committed. In some ways this might encourage miscreants to take the nuclear option knowing that their punishment if caught would always be the same anyway. "Let's just run him over on the way to training". That is Middlesbrough /EFL logic as a parable. | | | |
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