| Thames Water 10:20 - Jun 29 with 3874 views | britferry |
About to be taken back in to public ownership with it being £14 billion in debt.
Another 4 English water authorities struggling too.
Why Gas, Lecy & Water was ever sold off in the first place was just bonkers
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| Thames Water on 13:11 - Jun 29 with 3259 views | majorraglan |
The company is £14bn in debt, operational performance is terrible with leakage rates at their highest in 5 years, sewage is being pumped in to the rivers and sea at massive levels, in some areas customers have lost supplies and the desalination plant they built to increase water supplies doesn’t work.
Throw in to the mix its previous owners the Australian investment group Macquarie Australian plied Thames Water with £10.6bn of debt while its shareholders extracted nearly £3bn in dividends and paid corporation tax of just £100,000 as a result of the use of overseas companies and shell companies to avoid tax etc and the fact it’s been fined millions of pounds for breaching environmental standards I’d suggest privatisation had worked well - not!
The company should never have been allowed to get in to do much debt while having billions stripped out in dividends while operational performance was crumbling.
Between 1989 when the Government sold off the 10 main regional water suppliers and 2015 water bills rose by 40pc more than inflation and customers have been told to brace for rises of another 30pc over the coming years.
What we’ve seen is effectively a massive transfer of wealth from bill payers to investors, while the country’s Victorian water system leaks a scarcely believable 3bn litres of water every single day — enough to meet the needs of more than 20m people. Britain hasn’t built a new reservoir since 1989 despite the fact our population has increased by 17% or 10million from
57m to 67m during the same period. More than 85pc of English rivers don’t meet ecological standards because of sewage and other waste. Wales ain’t in great shape either.
If it goes under, then the tax payer and or customers of Thames Water will end up picking up the pieces and the debt !
Edit- there’s an article in todays Telegraph where Feargal Sharkey talks about the government getting involved and issuing a series of enforcement orders against the company which would remain in private ownership but would have to comply with orders mandated by the government. They talk about 10 years of pain, no dividends etc for the owners but the government would avoid the tax payer saddling all the debt. [Post edited 29 Jun 2023 13:16]
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| Thames Water on 13:28 - Jun 29 with 3243 views | onehunglow |
| Thames Water on 13:11 - Jun 29 by majorraglan |
The company is £14bn in debt, operational performance is terrible with leakage rates at their highest in 5 years, sewage is being pumped in to the rivers and sea at massive levels, in some areas customers have lost supplies and the desalination plant they built to increase water supplies doesn’t work.
Throw in to the mix its previous owners the Australian investment group Macquarie Australian plied Thames Water with £10.6bn of debt while its shareholders extracted nearly £3bn in dividends and paid corporation tax of just £100,000 as a result of the use of overseas companies and shell companies to avoid tax etc and the fact it’s been fined millions of pounds for breaching environmental standards I’d suggest privatisation had worked well - not!
The company should never have been allowed to get in to do much debt while having billions stripped out in dividends while operational performance was crumbling.
Between 1989 when the Government sold off the 10 main regional water suppliers and 2015 water bills rose by 40pc more than inflation and customers have been told to brace for rises of another 30pc over the coming years.
What we’ve seen is effectively a massive transfer of wealth from bill payers to investors, while the country’s Victorian water system leaks a scarcely believable 3bn litres of water every single day — enough to meet the needs of more than 20m people. Britain hasn’t built a new reservoir since 1989 despite the fact our population has increased by 17% or 10million from
57m to 67m during the same period. More than 85pc of English rivers don’t meet ecological standards because of sewage and other waste. Wales ain’t in great shape either.
If it goes under, then the tax payer and or customers of Thames Water will end up picking up the pieces and the debt !
Edit- there’s an article in todays Telegraph where Feargal Sharkey talks about the government getting involved and issuing a series of enforcement orders against the company which would remain in private ownership but would have to comply with orders mandated by the government. They talk about 10 years of pain, no dividends etc for the owners but the government would avoid the tax payer saddling all the debt. [Post edited 29 Jun 2023 13:16]
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Great posting Sir | |
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| Thames Water on 16:28 - Jun 29 with 3214 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Thames Water on 13:11 - Jun 29 by majorraglan |
The company is £14bn in debt, operational performance is terrible with leakage rates at their highest in 5 years, sewage is being pumped in to the rivers and sea at massive levels, in some areas customers have lost supplies and the desalination plant they built to increase water supplies doesn’t work.
Throw in to the mix its previous owners the Australian investment group Macquarie Australian plied Thames Water with £10.6bn of debt while its shareholders extracted nearly £3bn in dividends and paid corporation tax of just £100,000 as a result of the use of overseas companies and shell companies to avoid tax etc and the fact it’s been fined millions of pounds for breaching environmental standards I’d suggest privatisation had worked well - not!
The company should never have been allowed to get in to do much debt while having billions stripped out in dividends while operational performance was crumbling.
Between 1989 when the Government sold off the 10 main regional water suppliers and 2015 water bills rose by 40pc more than inflation and customers have been told to brace for rises of another 30pc over the coming years.
What we’ve seen is effectively a massive transfer of wealth from bill payers to investors, while the country’s Victorian water system leaks a scarcely believable 3bn litres of water every single day — enough to meet the needs of more than 20m people. Britain hasn’t built a new reservoir since 1989 despite the fact our population has increased by 17% or 10million from
57m to 67m during the same period. More than 85pc of English rivers don’t meet ecological standards because of sewage and other waste. Wales ain’t in great shape either.
If it goes under, then the tax payer and or customers of Thames Water will end up picking up the pieces and the debt !
Edit- there’s an article in todays Telegraph where Feargal Sharkey talks about the government getting involved and issuing a series of enforcement orders against the company which would remain in private ownership but would have to comply with orders mandated by the government. They talk about 10 years of pain, no dividends etc for the owners but the government would avoid the tax payer saddling all the debt. [Post edited 29 Jun 2023 13:16]
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That's a fantastic post and the last paragraph is absolutely what should happen. The current owners should be made to feel the pain.
All of our public utilities were sold off and have been used to milk the British people nd residents of money while ALL the service were allowed to run down into a poor state.
Water is leaking everywhere while people got rich.
Train lines were allowed to degrade while people got rich.
Gas and electricity sevices were allowed to degrade while people got rich
We were told privatisation would result in better service and lower prices and it was yet another lie by bullshitting politicians.
Everything we rely on has gotten more expensive while the service has gotten worse. That includes Council tax too.
We have been ripped off by epic proportions and it's time (long past time really) that something was done. | | | |
| Thames Water on 19:32 - Jun 29 with 3175 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Thames Water on 16:28 - Jun 29 by SullutaCreturned |
That's a fantastic post and the last paragraph is absolutely what should happen. The current owners should be made to feel the pain.
All of our public utilities were sold off and have been used to milk the British people nd residents of money while ALL the service were allowed to run down into a poor state.
Water is leaking everywhere while people got rich.
Train lines were allowed to degrade while people got rich.
Gas and electricity sevices were allowed to degrade while people got rich
We were told privatisation would result in better service and lower prices and it was yet another lie by bullshitting politicians.
Everything we rely on has gotten more expensive while the service has gotten worse. That includes Council tax too.
We have been ripped off by epic proportions and it's time (long past time really) that something was done. |
Correct.
For the cash, we lost many of the institutions which provided the fabric (and jobs) of life in the uk.
Renationalise it all tomorrow with zero compensation.
We are not in the middle of a cost of living crises, we are in the middle of a (Tory) robbery. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Thames Water on 19:48 - Jun 29 with 3151 views | Gwyn737 |
| Thames Water on 16:28 - Jun 29 by SullutaCreturned |
That's a fantastic post and the last paragraph is absolutely what should happen. The current owners should be made to feel the pain.
All of our public utilities were sold off and have been used to milk the British people nd residents of money while ALL the service were allowed to run down into a poor state.
Water is leaking everywhere while people got rich.
Train lines were allowed to degrade while people got rich.
Gas and electricity sevices were allowed to degrade while people got rich
We were told privatisation would result in better service and lower prices and it was yet another lie by bullshitting politicians.
Everything we rely on has gotten more expensive while the service has gotten worse. That includes Council tax too.
We have been ripped off by epic proportions and it's time (long past time really) that something was done. |
When the tories are finally kicked out, the letter left by the chancellor will read “There’s no money left and we’ve broken everything”. | | | |
| Thames Water on 21:38 - Jun 29 with 3131 views | Ohyeah |
Sorry no sympathy they only have themselves to blame the Thames Water/London & South East area continually voted in Thatcher into power to the detriment of the rest of the country out of their pure greed and selfishness and a Im alright Jack , loadsamoney attitude...
These lot should remember "You reap what you sow" and "what goes around comes around"..... | | | |
| Thames Water on 21:43 - Jun 29 with 3128 views | Gwyn737 |
| Thames Water on 21:38 - Jun 29 by Ohyeah |
Sorry no sympathy they only have themselves to blame the Thames Water/London & South East area continually voted in Thatcher into power to the detriment of the rest of the country out of their pure greed and selfishness and a Im alright Jack , loadsamoney attitude...
These lot should remember "You reap what you sow" and "what goes around comes around"..... |
If someone voted for Thatcher the youngest you could now be is 54.
There are millions in that part of the uk who in no way accountable for the mess we’re in now. | | | |
| Thames Water on 09:26 - Jun 30 with 3058 views | controversial_jack |
| Thames Water on 21:43 - Jun 29 by Gwyn737 |
If someone voted for Thatcher the youngest you could now be is 54.
There are millions in that part of the uk who in no way accountable for the mess we’re in now. |
It's not just Thatcher though. The Conservatives believe in privatisation, it's basically their reason for existing, to look after investors and the affluent and to hell with the poor | | | |
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| Thames Water on 10:07 - Jun 30 with 3048 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Thames Water on 21:43 - Jun 29 by Gwyn737 |
If someone voted for Thatcher the youngest you could now be is 54.
There are millions in that part of the uk who in no way accountable for the mess we’re in now. |
Clearly you are too young to remember how badly run all the public owned companies were run when the under the control of governments | |
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| Thames Water on 11:03 - Jun 30 with 3037 views | johnlangy |
| Thames Water on 13:11 - Jun 29 by majorraglan |
The company is £14bn in debt, operational performance is terrible with leakage rates at their highest in 5 years, sewage is being pumped in to the rivers and sea at massive levels, in some areas customers have lost supplies and the desalination plant they built to increase water supplies doesn’t work.
Throw in to the mix its previous owners the Australian investment group Macquarie Australian plied Thames Water with £10.6bn of debt while its shareholders extracted nearly £3bn in dividends and paid corporation tax of just £100,000 as a result of the use of overseas companies and shell companies to avoid tax etc and the fact it’s been fined millions of pounds for breaching environmental standards I’d suggest privatisation had worked well - not!
The company should never have been allowed to get in to do much debt while having billions stripped out in dividends while operational performance was crumbling.
Between 1989 when the Government sold off the 10 main regional water suppliers and 2015 water bills rose by 40pc more than inflation and customers have been told to brace for rises of another 30pc over the coming years.
What we’ve seen is effectively a massive transfer of wealth from bill payers to investors, while the country’s Victorian water system leaks a scarcely believable 3bn litres of water every single day — enough to meet the needs of more than 20m people. Britain hasn’t built a new reservoir since 1989 despite the fact our population has increased by 17% or 10million from
57m to 67m during the same period. More than 85pc of English rivers don’t meet ecological standards because of sewage and other waste. Wales ain’t in great shape either.
If it goes under, then the tax payer and or customers of Thames Water will end up picking up the pieces and the debt !
Edit- there’s an article in todays Telegraph where Feargal Sharkey talks about the government getting involved and issuing a series of enforcement orders against the company which would remain in private ownership but would have to comply with orders mandated by the government. They talk about 10 years of pain, no dividends etc for the owners but the government would avoid the tax payer saddling all the debt. [Post edited 29 Jun 2023 13:16]
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Very good post major.
Actually, when Feargal Sharkey was on breakfast TV Wednesday he mentioned what you've alluded to in your last para as one course of action.
But he also said there's another option. Just let the company go bankrupt. Then the government can just pick up the company for £1 from the receivers.
I can't believe it's as simple as that but he gave the impression that it is. | | | |
| Thames Water on 11:19 - Jun 30 with 3022 views | controversial_jack |
| Thames Water on 10:07 - Jun 30 by felixstowe_jack |
Clearly you are too young to remember how badly run all the public owned companies were run when the under the control of governments |
Was that when trains ran on time, busses plentiful, utility bills low, a well funded NHS, plenty of doctors, council houses with low rents. Yes, things were really badly run then
I'm not surprised she doesn't want nationalisation on her salary
https://uk.yahoo.com/finance/news/secret-email-severn-trent-boss-070627641.html [Post edited 30 Jun 2023 11:23]
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| Thames Water on 11:25 - Jun 30 with 3023 views | Gwyn737 |
| Thames Water on 10:07 - Jun 30 by felixstowe_jack |
Clearly you are too young to remember how badly run all the public owned companies were run when the under the control of governments |
Maybe. My formative adult years were 1995 to 2005 which I think we'll all look back on as a pretty good time so perhaps my glasses are rose tinted.
Do you think privatisation has gone well? | | | |
| Thames Water on 12:08 - Jun 30 with 3014 views | majorraglan |
| Thames Water on 10:07 - Jun 30 by felixstowe_jack |
Clearly you are too young to remember how badly run all the public owned companies were run when the under the control of governments |
There were examples of poorly run services, but the late 60s and early to mid 70s were only 30 odd years after WW2 and the country was still recovering from the war, it’s now 80 years since the end of WW2 and we’ve still got poorly run utilities now.
Water rates were a lot cheaper back then than they are now, water bills for example have gone up by 40% plus inflation and we’re still getting a poor service, look at the mess the water companies are in. National Grid is another example, it’s making billions in profits but renewable energy projects can’t get connections for years and years.
There is no reason why a utility cannot be run by the State and provide a good service, it just needs good management who are given a set of objectives and told to achieve them with no political interference. Prices should be realistic as should wages. | | | |
| Thames Water on 15:48 - Jun 30 with 2987 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Thames Water on 12:08 - Jun 30 by majorraglan |
There were examples of poorly run services, but the late 60s and early to mid 70s were only 30 odd years after WW2 and the country was still recovering from the war, it’s now 80 years since the end of WW2 and we’ve still got poorly run utilities now.
Water rates were a lot cheaper back then than they are now, water bills for example have gone up by 40% plus inflation and we’re still getting a poor service, look at the mess the water companies are in. National Grid is another example, it’s making billions in profits but renewable energy projects can’t get connections for years and years.
There is no reason why a utility cannot be run by the State and provide a good service, it just needs good management who are given a set of objectives and told to achieve them with no political interference. Prices should be realistic as should wages. |
Exactly, as has been said before on here, the unions do not have the same powers now as then. Renationalised companies could be run on much better lines.
Privatsation has given us the worst of both worlds (and the opposite of what we were promised) in much higher prices for much worse services.
And we are told that despite wholesale prices coming down we will continue to pay higher prices. it's a rip off. | | | |
| Thames Water on 08:19 - Jul 1 with 2916 views | PawelAbbott |
The dividends that have been taken from Thames Water have been so large that they coukd have funded all of the new sewerage system that London needs from what has been taken.
It's now part owned by the Chinese and Saudi government investment funds. Any bail out will come entirely from UK tax payers, as they have barely paid any tax, and go to those foreign governments who have already raked in millions | | | |
| Thames Water on 09:56 - Jul 1 with 2891 views | controversial_jack |
| Thames Water on 08:19 - Jul 1 by PawelAbbott |
The dividends that have been taken from Thames Water have been so large that they coukd have funded all of the new sewerage system that London needs from what has been taken.
It's now part owned by the Chinese and Saudi government investment funds. Any bail out will come entirely from UK tax payers, as they have barely paid any tax, and go to those foreign governments who have already raked in millions |
Thatcher wanted it out of state control, but it's owned by the Chinese and Saudi govts. How ironic | | | |
| Thames Water on 10:11 - Jul 1 with 2896 views | britferry |
So how does Welsh water work then? They're tag line is "not for profit".
got this off google:
Welsh Water is owned by Glas Cymru a single purpose company with no shareholders and is run solely for the benefit of customers.
Is Welsh Water a government company?
a private company with no shareholders, financed in the capital markets, with no government support; and. all financial surpluses are used for the benefit of its customers. | |
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| Thames Water on 16:58 - Jul 1 with 2861 views | blackswan |
| Thames Water on 10:11 - Jul 1 by britferry |
So how does Welsh water work then? They're tag line is "not for profit".
got this off google:
Welsh Water is owned by Glas Cymru a single purpose company with no shareholders and is run solely for the benefit of customers.
Is Welsh Water a government company?
a private company with no shareholders, financed in the capital markets, with no government support; and. all financial surpluses are used for the benefit of its customers. |
Surprisingly we pay more than most other areas in
The UK given that water shortage isn't an issue here | | | |
| Thames Water on 17:06 - Jul 1 with 2856 views | onehunglow |
| Thames Water on 10:11 - Jul 1 by britferry |
So how does Welsh water work then? They're tag line is "not for profit".
got this off google:
Welsh Water is owned by Glas Cymru a single purpose company with no shareholders and is run solely for the benefit of customers.
Is Welsh Water a government company?
a private company with no shareholders, financed in the capital markets, with no government support; and. all financial surpluses are used for the benefit of its customers. |
The waterways of Wales are the most polluted in GB | |
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| Thames Water on 21:12 - Jul 1 with 2830 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Thames Water on 17:06 - Jul 1 by onehunglow |
The waterways of Wales are the most polluted in GB |
they're not the MOST polluted but they are quite bad. | | | |
| Thames Water on 21:26 - Jul 1 with 2820 views | SullutaCreturned |
Surprise surprise,
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66074484
Lord Howard denies the privatisation was a failure, anything to do with himself being in charge of it? yet another Welsh born tory happy to see Wales suffer.
In purely capitalist terms, speaking as a customer, when services are much worse even though prices are much higher then it is a failure to everyone, obviously apart from those who got rich off the back of it. | | | |
| Thames Water on 14:09 - Jul 2 with 2766 views | builthjack |
| Thames Water on 17:06 - Jul 1 by onehunglow |
The waterways of Wales are the most polluted in GB |
There are more chicken sheds in Powys than in the whole of the UK.
No wonder the rivers are polluted. |  |
| Swansea Indepenent Poster Of The Year 2021. Dr P / Mart66 / Roathie / Parlay / E20/ Duffle was 2nd, but he is deluded and thinks in his little twisted brain that he won. Poor sod. We let him win this year, as he has cried for a whole year. His 14 usernames, bless his cotton socks.
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| Thames Water on 00:01 - Jul 3 with 2732 views | controversial_jack |
| Thames Water on 14:09 - Jul 2 by builthjack |
There are more chicken sheds in Powys than in the whole of the UK.
No wonder the rivers are polluted. |
Yes, the waters are fowl. | | | |
| Thames Water on 08:55 - Jul 3 with 2688 views | Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
Imagine a company that has twenty odd million guaranteed customers who have absolutely no choice but to buy your product to stay alive losing that amount of money.
We’re not talking Woolworths here or a company that has a hundred competitors that are offering the same service.
This loss is criminal. |  |
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| Thames Water on 09:26 - Jul 12 with 2599 views | britferry |
I spoke too soon about Welsh Water, its just been downgraded to 2 stars, the 2nd downgrade in a row over its sewage pollution
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-66173170
Wales' largest water company has been downgraded for the second year running after a rise in pollution incidents.
Welsh Water caused 91 sewage pollution incidents in 2022, five of which were classed as "having a high or significant impact".
Natural Resources Wales (NRW) reduced the company's rating of three stars to two stars, meaning it "requires improvement".
Welsh Water said its "performance is not where we want it to be".
A year ago the firm was downgraded from a industry leading four-star rating, to a "good company" rating of three star, following NRW's environmental performance report for 2021. | |
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